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1 • No AI-based OS (by Tixouney on 2025-02-10 01:34:56 GMT from France)
Beyond the pro/con AI debate, I object that AI (as any other heavy tool) should ever be integrated at OS level.
I don't use AI at all, I'm not against it (mostly because the AI domain is very broad), it can surely be useful for many application (like video and photo editing, and development) but it should be implemented per application, using an optional package, as much as possible.
On course, I'm talking about *nix, because some big OSes have already plagued users with beta tools (aka AI), and it's much too late to hope anything good from them again ;)
2 • Would you welcome new AI tools into your distribution? (by WYSIWYG on 2025-02-10 01:51:40 GMT from United States)
If I wanted AI in my OS, then I'd just use Windows 11, because, in addition to all the spyware, it actually just werks OOTB as advertized, and has saner users and devs.
3 • AI tools (by grraf on 2025-02-10 02:10:48 GMT from Romania)
No thanks, if I wanted spyware and autonomous decision making done behind my back i would have been on W11.
The moment I see AI integrated into my daily driver distro is the moment i'm switching to another one...
4 • Did you mean Learning Module? (by Tim on 2025-02-10 02:16:53 GMT from Australia)
There's currently no such thing as AI (unless you mean artificial insemination) they are learning modules?
I might consider installing such a tool on my server at some point but as an application not something intrinsic to the OS.
As it is I've seen Copilot foisted on some Windows 10 PC's I look after and have promptly removed it.
LMs have their place. I use kagi.com for search and it provides it but doesn't force me to when all I want is to do a search.
5 • AI BS! (by oldfart on 2025-02-10 02:58:10 GMT from United States)
I'm right there with @3... Want nothing to do with AI. Half the fun is figuring things out for yourself. Thanks anyway.
6 • AI is a solution looking for a problem (by An invisible friend on 2025-02-10 03:49:38 GMT from Chile)
AI is a tool. For a new tool to be valuable it should do a designated task better, more efficiently or in a simpler way than previous tools. Most ai implementations I've seen so far are way more resource hungry, produce worse results, are more complicated or don't have a designated purpose.
7 • Eh Aye? (by Friar Tux on 2025-02-10 04:18:25 GMT from Canada)
Sorry, folks. I'm actually on the other side of this discussion. I have been waiting for A.I. to be integrated into an OS. Not as a personal assistant - like Siri or Alexa - though that might be nice as the user facing UI, maybe. What I'm waiting for is for an A.I. that will write letters to Gramma for me, in MY style. One that can do up my shopping list and order it to be delivered. One that I can tell/ask/command verbally, similar to Siri or Alexa, but one with the ability to ask intelligent questions if it needs details - "Friar, you wanted to order lintels. Did you want the tiny orange ones or the bigger brown ones? Oh, and do you want sparkling water, or mineral water?" I want an A.I. that I can ask something like, "Did Jesse, on DW, ever review Gentoo OS, and what did he think about it?"
I have always dreamt of a scenario where I pick an avatar from a host of options and can mix and match any possible voice. This avatar would be the UI to interact with me. Over time the avatar learns how I do things/how I like things. It can anticipate those. It can make suggestions. It can have my tax return prepared beforehand and remind me that it filed them at the proper time. This and much more. I know we're still have a long way to go, but hey, I can dream.
I have even, already picked out a name and personality if I even run across a web browser with an intelligent A.I. incorporated right in. I would call it Nettie, and "she" would look and sound like the young heroine from the cartoon movie "Brave".
8 • AI Tools in OS (by user on 2025-02-10 04:43:45 GMT from Bulgaria)
Yes, I would like them to be integrared into the distro. I played with the new UOS AI 2.0 Deepin 2025 preview two weeks ago and I'm impressed. Definately will install Deepin 25 in parallel to my other OSes upon release.
9 • Dual boot and swap (by Penguinx86 on 2025-02-10 04:49:09 GMT from United States)
I have dual booted and shared the swap partition lots of times. It worked just fine. The only time I had problems dual booting was with Fedora. I couldn’t get Fedora to dual boot with anything.
10 • swapoff before shutdown (by Much Derper on 2025-02-10 05:34:58 GMT from United States)
Fun fact I've discovered myself not too long ago - apparently, swapoff can be quite slow, even on a very fast device. The reason for that is kernel has to traverse all page tables for all processes for each page from swap device that it discards, apparently. So if the trusted/untrusted OS dualboot situation is permanent, perhaps a better solution would be to simply set up a LUKS container for the trusted OS. Or at least not swap on disk, but use something like zram instead.
11 • A.I. aka LLMs (by Vè on 2025-02-10 06:00:01 GMT from United States)
I don't think it should be there by default. But who am I to tell you how or what you can use your computer for. If A.I. is available in the package manager I'm ok with that. Shoot, I might even try it out of curiosity. Just please don't integrate it by default.
12 • dumb devices, clever people (by arfiticient immulator on 2025-02-10 06:20:02 GMT from New Zealand)
I like my devices dumb, and my people clever, NOT the other way around.
The big danger at the moment, is Windows, Apple and Google have already integrated Ai, so some "intelmigent" under-25 "devs" at certain core points in the Linux world may be tempted with "I want to play too."
Two that immediately come to mind are Canonical's Ubuntu folks - they slept with Amazon and other "deals of the day" in the past. The major one is the infamous anti-talents at Gnome.
And you folks still fight over systemd ... wait till you fight over Ai in the Linux distros.
13 • @12 (by user on 2025-02-10 06:58:50 GMT from Bulgaria)
"And you folks still fight over systemd ... wait till you fight over Ai in the Linux distros."
Don't you see it as I am? AI is the only possible intelligent FIX and MANAGEMENT for the manual systemd and ever growing MESS. Just wait and see, you'll be begging for an integrated AI soon. :D
14 • @7, @12, (by Limpid Lizard on 2025-02-10 07:05:04 GMT from United States)
@7, "I want an A.I. that I can ask something like, "Did Jesse, on DW, ever review Gentoo OS, and what did he think about it?" Some of what you wish is available. I have Edge browser with Copilot on my daily use distros. I asked: 'when did distrowatch review gentoo?' Answer: 'Distrowatch reviewed Gentoo Linux on August 22, 2016. They reviewed the "Choice Edition" of Gentoo Linux live DVD1. Are you a fan of Gentoo, or just curious about its history?' 'Just curious. Can you access the review?' 'I can't provide the full review verbatim due to copyright restrictions, but I can give you a brief summary! They highlighted Gentoo's flexibility and customization options, noting that it's ideal for users who want complete control over their Linux systems2. The review mentioned that while the installation process can be complex, the rewards of customization and optimization are worth it for experienced user' The conversation can proceed from there.
@12, "Windows, Apple and Google have already integrated Ai" Can't speak for Apple, but on my Windows and Android devices, use of the available AI is optional, thus not "integrated."
15 • AI (by picamanic on 2025-02-10 07:19:47 GMT from United Kingdom)
The only use of AI that I have made is the experimental AI Chat option in the duckduckgo.com search engine, for specific hard questions. Even then, getting to an answer can be like extractiing teeth! Incomplete or wrong answers are easily spotted, and get "apologies" from the AI Chat prgrams. The crunch will come when the monetise AI search.
16 • AI (by Essetee on 2025-02-10 07:55:21 GMT from Belgium)
I use LM-Studio for my AI. Don't need an AI tool in my distro. If you want AI, it's not difficult to get one.
17 • @4 Did you mean Learning Module? (by DaveT on 2025-02-10 08:27:21 GMT from United Kingdom)
What he said.
In my day they were called "Expert Systems". There might be something you could call AI hiding in various labs, I don't think what we can use is anywhere close to what they are working on.
18 • AI (by PeteB on 2025-02-10 09:14:47 GMT from United Kingdom)
AI NO thanks.
Aurora No thanks. 6.5Gb for a distro wow.
I thought that 3.1Gb for my Lubuntu ( totally de- snapped) was big enough
19 • encrypted swap made easy (by Freddy on 2025-02-10 09:16:04 GMT from Denmark)
For encrypted swap space I recommend making a labeled file system as anchor point and use a random password at every boot. The boot process will not demand entering a password, and shut down does not demand swapoff.
run as root:
SWAPDEV=the partition yu want to use as swap, e.g. /dev/sda2
cp --archive --update=none /etc/fstab /etc/fstab.ORIG
swapoff $SWAPDEV
# FORCE Create a 1 MiB filesystem with label for encrypted swap
mkfs.ext2 -F -L cryptswap $SWAPDEV 1M
# remove old swap and put encrypted swap in /etc/fstab
sed -e 's/.* swap .*/#&/' /etc/fstab > /etc/fstab.NY
echo "
/dev/mapper/swap none swap defaults 0 0
" >> /etc/fstab.NY
echo "
#
swap LABEL=cryptswap /dev/urandom swap,offset=2048,cipher=aes-xts-plain64,size=512
# The offset is 2048 sectors of 512 bytes, thus 1 MiB.
# The encrypted swap will not affect the filesystem LABEL/UUID, and data alignment works out as well.
" >> /etc/crypttab
cp /etc/fstab.NY /etc/fstab
20 • Gentoo (by Jesse on 2025-02-10 11:17:48 GMT from Canada)
@14: "Some of what you wish is available. I have Edge browser with Copilot on my daily use distros. I asked: 'when did distrowatch review gentoo?' Answer: 'Distrowatch reviewed Gentoo Linux on August 22, 2016. They reviewed the "Choice Edition" of Gentoo Linux live DVD1"
I think "Some" is the key word here. The Copilot bot gave you an answer, but it wasn't really complete. It found a review of Gentoo from 2016, but skipped over two others published here, one from 2023.
That isn't bad, but it isn't great. A quick web search or visiting our Gentoo page would have been just as fast and given more complete results.
21 • I do not want AI models in my OS (by Zed on 2025-02-10 11:58:45 GMT from Italy)
I don't even think AI can exist.
22 • AI integration in a distro, (by Hank on 2025-02-10 12:08:04 GMT from Germany)
No thanks to AI integration in a system.
Presently I use an older Desktop system with an unlocked I5 and 8GB RAM, it is more than powerful enough for my OS, antiX, a system installed configured and managed using my near 75 year old non AI brain. No fatpacks no lumbering gloomy gnome, no pottering madness. I want to keep thinks understandable dependable and lightweight.
Minimum for reasonably integrated AI integration is 32GB RAM and at least a newer gen I7.
A secondary reason for all the hype seems to be not only including spyware but selling new computers too. A further negative effect, huge increase in power consumption.
23 • 20 • Gentoo (by Limpid Lizard on 2025-02-10 12:13:28 GMT from United States)
@20, "It found a review of Gentoo from 2016, but skipped over two others published here, one from 2023. A quick web search or visiting our Gentoo page would have been just as fast . . ." A not-so-quick web search with DuckDuckGo, Google and Yahoo trying different queries did not yield any DW reviews, only user reviews and the Gentoo DW page. The Gentoo page lists the 2016 review by Joshua Allen Holm, and a quick take in 2023 below Serpent OS and Security Onion. Nothing else. So yes, Copilot does not contain the whole web. Nor do the search engines for that matter. ChatGPT does better: "what was the last distrowatch review of gentoo"
"The most recent review of Gentoo Linux on DistroWatch was published on November 25, 2023. This review provides an in-depth analysis of Gentoo's features, performance, and suitability for various user needs.Gentoo is a source-based distribution known for its flexibility and performance optimization. It allows users to compile software specifically for their hardware, offering a high degree of customization. However, this approach can be time-consuming and may not be ideal for users seeking a quick setup.
The DistroWatch review highlights Gentoo's extensive documentation and active community support, which are valuable resources for both new and experienced users. The review also discusses the distribution's rolling release model, ensuring users have access to the latest software versions. For a comprehensive understanding of Gentoo's current state and its suitability for your needs, you can read the full review on DistroWatch.
24 • AI is privacy nightmare most of the time (by Explorer09 on 2025-02-10 12:35:59 GMT from Taiwan)
I was expecting that a good Linux distro should come with privacy by default, and no unwanted apps or bloat. As my title says, AI is privacy nightmare most of the time. That's the first concern. The waste of disk and memory resources would the the second one.
I know there are companies pushing AI for "faster work" or something, but the bottom line is, it should be OPTIONAL. People who don't want it should be able to remove it.
25 • @20, @24, Gentoo review and ChatGPT (by Limpid Lizard on 2025-02-10 12:38:13 GMT from United States)
"The most recent review of Gentoo Linux on Distrowatch was published on November 25, 2023" Noting that there was no November 25 2023 review as far as I know. The DW weekly was on November 27. So, as the saying goes: Don't believe everything you read on the internet, including ChatGPT.
26 • DW reviews (by anticapitalista on 2025-02-10 12:39:07 GMT from Greece)
On the topic of DW reviews or lack of.
Ask your favourite AI - 'when did distrowatch review antiX?'
27 • Gentoo reviews (by Jesse on 2025-02-10 13:15:17 GMT from Canada)
@23: "ChatGPT does better: "what was the last distrowatch review of gentoo? The most recent review of Gentoo Linux on DistroWatch was published on November 25, 2023. This review provides an in-depth analysis of Gentoo's...."
How is that better? It's a complete lie. There was no issue of DistroWatch on Nov 25, 2023. There was one on the 20th of Nov that year and one on the 27th. Neither contained a review of Gentoo. ChatGPT completely made that up, lying to you. How is misinformation and making up a fake review better?
28 • @27, Gentoo fake reviews (by Limpid Lizard on 2025-02-10 13:22:41 GMT from United States)
See my post @25
29 • AI (by dragonmouth on 2025-02-10 13:40:05 GMT from United States)
IF I want AI crammed down my throat, I can go back to using W11 (hell is going to freeze over first).
For those who insist that they cannot live without AI, it should be available in the distro repositories to be installed like any other package (by choice!). It should not be forced on the users like Snaps or systemd.
The problem with AI is that, like any other intelligence, it is always "learning". To learn, it has to hoover up any and all data it can get its "hands" on. I, for one. am not willing to surrender that data.
30 • about AI tools (by AIman on 2025-02-10 13:46:49 GMT from Moldova)
There is a nice distro focused on AI:
MakuluLinux
it is pretty interesting tools and it is useful because it has all the tools under a single roof, I know that there are things like chatgpt & google
but the ability to do AI automation with a single click is cool:
- for example if you want to write an audio translation for some one from your language to let's say Italian(or any other language) it has a tool for that.
- If you wanna do some illustration for some project, it has a tool for that too
- also the developers are AI fanatics, so that besides it's own AI tools, they package some oss llms into a nice app, depending on your needs (coding, writing, journalism, marketing)
- and they package 1-click apps for 10+ commerciall llms like chatgpt, mistral, google, ms, and that new chinese distro
you can think about makulu is that it is new rebekablackOS demo OS but which focuses on AI instead of wayland.
I voted yes, cause using apps instead of tabs in firefox is faster
31 • AI tools (by Tuxedoar on 2025-02-10 15:47:59 GMT from Argentina)
Hi. As long as any AI tool is published under a GPL compatible license and is offered in a distro as an opt-in conponent, I wouldn't have a problem with such an offering. I'm far from being a fan of AI, but I'm always in favor of any new tool that enlarges the FOSS ecosystem offering and its usage not being enforced in any way on you. I mean, you should always be able to decide whether to have that component installed on your system or not.
Have a nice week.
Cheers.
32 • AI (by Trinidad Cruz on 2025-02-10 16:13:55 GMT from United States)
Coding assistance can be handy, especially after hours of working at night. No other purpose appeals to me.
TC
33 • That AI stuff. (by because, reasons on 2025-02-10 18:23:21 GMT from New Zealand)
as Jessie (@27) mentioned, they can and do LIE .
If using for coding, and I have used ChatGPT, it really pays to check the output, sometimes its "perfect", other times it's crap.
It does need to be fact checked.
34 • Serpent OS (by Mr. Plaid on 2025-02-10 18:44:46 GMT from United States)
Serpent OS booted just fine for me off of a usb stick on a jailbroken HP Chromebook. It's a pretty simple Gnome desktop with a minimal set of basic apps installed including Firefox 133.0.3. The software center only connects to Flathub, but that's fine with me. I've been using it for 20 minutes now but not really putting it through the paces. So far there's nothing about the Alpha release that seems different from other operating systems, nor is there anything special about it popping out right away but this is running on a live boot. Right now it's a simple and clean OS but that's all. I'd still like to see what they do with it down the line.
35 • AI (by Good Lung on 2025-02-10 21:25:23 GMT from Germany)
AI as it is today is not resource efficient enough, Deepseek is an advancement.
Well you can absolutely run the low resource models, yet they are not so "smart" to be truly helpful they usually need to be trained to specific tasks. To be able to run a good general model locally you need a GPU with +- 16GB of VRAM.
Using online based AI is a vulnerability in itself since the prompt can be reviewed by a human. This isn't a problem for people who use it for business though, but a limitation nonetheless since AI really show the value with personalized personal information to help the user specifically.
In my amateur opinion, in the future this will not be a problem and AI probably will be so optional as the internet is today, since it already solving problems that we don't know the answer to. The question is of it has a limit or it is exponential as it is seen with tech advancements.
About Serpent OS and privacy oriented systems, would be nice if they would make or integrate a application based firewall that is more user friendly like opensnitch, I've briefly read about one called Subgraph OS that has something alike.
36 • AI distros do cometh (by Kruger on 2025-02-10 23:24:24 GMT from Australia)
Redhat may be thinking about AI integration.
Meanwhile Gnoppix has already done it in their latest release....
"Does Gnoppix Linux already integrate AI features? As one of the world's first Linux distributions to do so, we proudly integrated ChatGPT into Gnoppix Linux at launch on November 30th, 2022."
"We've transitioned to open-source AI, which is generally more privacy-friendly than commercial AI because it offers greater control over how your data is used.
Unleash your full potential with Copilot, your innovative AI companion that seamlessly integrates into your daily workflow. Streamline your work and unlock new possibilities by leveraging the power of AI."
Who asked for this monstrosity out of the box? Why not have it as an opt-in option during install or at least as a separate download option?
37 • 33 • That AI stuff. (by Limpid Lizard on 2025-02-11 00:54:35 GMT from United States)
"they can and do LIE" Lying is a human trait, and it involves purposeful deception. Those things aren't intelligent enough, if at all. They do give wrong information, as do regular searches and well-meaning people. For example, Jesse (@20) said there were two other reviews of Gentoo. I could find only one. He was not lying, just mistaken (or maybe I am). I believe the word they use when chat AIs invent things is 'hallucinating".
38 • Information (by Jesse on 2025-02-11 01:50:49 GMT from Canada)
@37: ""they can and do LIE" Lying is a human trait"
You've never had animals as pets, have you? Animals lie too, it's not just humans. Computers may be programmed by humans, but they definitely lie.
"Jesse said there were two other reviews of Gentoo. I could find only one. He was not lying, just mistaken (or maybe I am)."
They're linked on the Gentoo information page here on DistroWatch. https://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=gentoo
39 • @38 • Information (by Limpid Lizard on 2025-02-11 03:07:18 GMT from United States)
@38, "You've never had animals as pets, have you?" I have had and have pets. There's a cat sitting next to me at the moment and a dog with my wife in another room. No pets have ever lied to me. Anthropomorphism is ascribing human characteristics to nonhuman things. @20, "It found a review of Gentoo from 2016, but skipped over two others published here, one from 2023." There is only one review of Gentoo other than the one picked up by Copilot, not two others as you said. You were mistaken.
https://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=gentoo
40 • AI (by Kruger on 2025-02-11 05:09:59 GMT from Australia)
Gentoo review or not by chatgpt.....
You are missing the point Jesse was making which is ChatGPT fabricates details and lies about everything makinmg up complete nonsense.
If you want to believe ChatGPT that's your choice.
It's also your choice to jump off a cliff. Nobody will stop you.
41 • systemd-less Fedora (by illumos on 2025-02-11 10:09:13 GMT from Japan)
Debian without systemd has MX, Devuan, antiX, etc.
Arch without systemd has Artix, Obarun, etc.
Why is there no project to develop Fedora without systemd?
42 • MAKULU LINDOZ (by Muthu Kathiravan on 2025-02-11 11:33:54 GMT from India)
I appreciate Makulu Linux which is based on DEBIAN also integrates a lot of AI Tools in its Latest Feb Month Version,. Please Check Makulu Linux If you have time
43 • systemd-free Fedora [guess] (by picamanic on 2025-02-11 12:12:38 GMT from United Kingdom)
Fedora is weird because it was presented as a testing ground for the commercial Redhat Linux. However, the former uses the DNF package manager, where as the latter uses RPMs. The closest match that distrowatch search could come up with was PC Linux OS, which lists "RPM (APT)" as package manager, but it is confusing [Jesse?].
44 • Gentoo reviews (by Jesse on 2025-02-11 12:31:04 GMT from Canada)
@39: "There is only one review of Gentoo other than the one picked up by Copilot, not two others as you said. You were mistaken."
I think you must be trolling at this point since there are very clearly three reviews of Gentoo linked on our Gentoo page. One from 2023, one from 2016, and one from 2005. Something anyone here can verify just by glancing at the Gentoo information page.
https://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20050509#1
https://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20160822#gentoo
https://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20230320#gentoolive
45 • Fedora (by Jesse on 2025-02-11 12:40:59 GMT from Canada)
@43: "Fedora is weird because it was presented as a testing ground for the commercial Redhat Linux. However, the former uses the DNF package manager, where as the latter uses RPMs."
RPM is the package format. DNF is the package manager. Both Fedora and RHEL use the same package format (rpm) and package manager (dnf).
As for PCLinuxOS, it is not based on Fedora. They just use the same packaging format.
Going back to @41 and their question: "Why is there no project to develop Fedora without systemd?"
There isn't a lot of benefit to making a Fedora based distro:
https://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20210329#qa
46 • @8 Best Troll Award 2025 (by Linux Revolution on 2025-02-11 15:02:23 GMT from United States)
You have my vote. LMAO!
47 • Ai or not-AI? This is the problem. (by Pietro on 2025-02-11 16:27:05 GMT from Italy)
Einstein: "Computers are incredibly fast, accurate and stupid. Humans are incredibly slow, inaccurate and intelligent. The two together constitute an incalculable force."
48 • AI (by Name (mandatory) on 2025-02-11 17:29:23 GMT from United States)
No AI!
49 • AI in the wider world (by Mr B on 2025-02-11 17:33:00 GMT from United Kingdom)
Aside from the discussions here about AI being part of Linux distros, check out YouTube videos featuring Prof Geoffrey Hinton, the so-called "Godfather of AI." If you are not worried about AI in general, in the long-term, you probably haven't been paying enough attention. Shades of Oppenheimer all over again I reckon. And today I read that the UK and US are not going to sign up to an international agreement on AI. Not good!
50 • Peppermint and Fedora (by rhtoras on 2025-02-12 01:12:56 GMT from Greece)
There are at least two projects based on rpm that use proper init systems. One is of course PClinuxOS the other being a version of alt linux. This version however is a mess because nosystemD is not well implemented and only pid1 is replaced with sysV init not whole init is different. It uses libsystemD and other critical systemD components.
On the other hand it is just awesome to see a peppermint version based on void linux. There are some Void linux respins like vxlinux, agarimOS or forks like voidpup. It is nice to see peppermint to be based on the best (according to reviews) linux distro on Distrowatch.
I am excited as a void user.
51 • neversystemD (by picamanic on 2025-02-12 05:07:05 GMT from United Kingdom)
I would make the distinction between distros like Artix and Devuan which have had systemD removed from Arch and Debian respectively, and distros like Void and PCLinuxOS, which are independent of any other distro. The former would seem to require ongoing work to ensure that bits of systemD don't creap in [correct me if I am wrong]. I understand that this is because of the scale of work that would be involved in a complete "divorce" from the parent distros, but does leave them vulnerable to undesirable developments of those parents.
52 • neversystemD (by rhtoras on 2025-02-12 10:38:18 GMT from Greece)
@52 there is Devuan and there is Antix. Both based on Debian and both without systemD. However Devuan is a different project with its own way of doing things. They use elogind but you can use it without. They use the official repos. Antix does not use elogind but instead uses a plain seatd and has it's own repos called nosystemD. You can use elogind if you want to use a desktop environment such as xfce. Although antix is the "hardcore" of the two i prefer Devuan as the experience is better here and there. In the end of the day Bruce Perens #2 of Debian said Devuan is better, so who am i to judge him.
Independent projects are another story. However in some cases you have to sacrifice things. For example if you try to install a package on PClinuxOS in rpm format it may or may not work. At least this was my experience.
53 • neversystemD (by picamanic on 2025-02-12 12:36:01 GMT from United Kingdom)
@53 Thanks, I had to perform a fresh Void install on a new computer recently when the old one died, so I restarted with the default XFCE4 desktop environment, along with other packages that I don't want. I will eventually use Openbox as my DE, starting Void from the console; using Seatd as an alternative to Elogind, Consolekit2, etc. This should allow me to return to a "frugal" machine.
AntiX and Devuan are viable alternatives to the above, making for a different look-and-feel, but suffer from the "catch up" game.
I have not used PClinuxOS, but can see it is a very different "beast" from other distros.
54 • Fedora based distros (by Otis on 2025-02-12 14:30:29 GMT from United States)
@45 "There isn't a lot of benefit to making a Fedora based distro:"
https://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20210329#qa
That made me wonder about my Nobara. I could not use Fedora for certain reasons that Nobara has resolved. Seems major to me at times, and at other times seems nit-picky minor, in comparison. But I did settle on a while back as it just seems more polished and worry free than its Fedora parent.
55 • neversystemD (by anticapitalista on 2025-02-12 22:35:41 GMT from Greece)
You are behind with the times - antiX-23 is now able to provide the following desktop-environments without any trace of systemd/elogind
Xfce, LXDE, LXQT, MATE and Cinnamon
56 • Wayland without elogind (by illumos on 2025-02-13 05:55:24 GMT from Japan)
@55
Can I run Wayland without elogind?
In theory, you could use seatd to run Wayland.
57 • Adding AI on the OS level (by Scott R (LXer E-i-C) on 2025-02-14 07:16:56 GMT from United States)
I absolutely do not want AI added to my OS for ANY reason. I personally think AI is a bad idea but I know it's here to stay. At the very least it should be controlled and managed by humans very carefully. Having AI in your operating system is just another pair of eyes looking over you shoulder that you didn't ask for and don't want.
58 • @56 (by Kruger on 2025-02-14 07:41:37 GMT from Australia)
Wayland without systemD is realistically not possible
BSD's like FreeBSD, NomadBSD, and systemD-free linux distros like Devuan, Void etc, will have to stay with Xorg unless some workaround is made possible.
If you thought there was a philosophical divide in Linux about systemD, wait until the divide grows due to Wayland
59 • They are not hardcore systemd-less distro (by illumos on 2025-02-14 10:55:50 GMT from Japan)
@58
Devuan and Void use elogind and are not a hardcore systemd-less distro.
So both Devuan and Void should be able to implement Wayland.
For example, Alpine uses OpenRC, but uses elogind to implement Wayland.
The question is whether true systemd-less distros that do not use elogind, antiX, PCLOS, Obarun, etc. can implement Wayland.
And besides Linux and *BSD, there are also options called illumos.
Please also consider illumos distro, OpenIndiana, Tribblix, OmniOS, etc!
60 • Immutable OS’s (by Flavianoep on 2025-02-14 12:50:28 GMT from Brazil)
I have a doubt about immutable OS’s. There is a bank security package which I depend on, which is only available as an RPM or Deb, and which installs in /usr/bin. Would there be a way for me to install a package like that in a immutable OS?
61 • Immutable (by Jesse on 2025-02-14 13:14:46 GMT from Canada)
@60: "There is a bank security package which I depend on, which is only available as an RPM or Deb, and which installs in /usr/bin. Would there be a way for me to install a package like that in a immutable OS?"
Yes, in a container. Usually set up using a tool like Toolbx or Distrobox.
62 • Operational system (by Emiliano soares de Almeida on 2025-02-14 23:06:20 GMT from Brazil)
Software
Number of Comments: 62
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