 DistroWatch Weekly |
| DistroWatch Weekly, Issue 1061, 11 March 2024 |
Welcome to this year's 11th issue of DistroWatch Weekly!
Software is always moving, always evolving, and the Linux landscape changes with it. This week we focus on changes and new developments, with a focus on desktop environments and desktop computing. Our News section is dominated this week by changing desktop environments and desktop applications. The Fedora project is working to port System76's COSMIC desktop to the Fedora distribution while making plans to drop X11 support in future Workstation spins. Meanwhile Linux Mint is planning a replacement for the discontinued HexChat application and postmarketOS is going to switch from OpenRC to systemd because of the ongoing work required to get Plasma and GNOME to work with the OpenRC init software. Plus we discuss a new FreeBSD-based project, NixBSD, which works to port the Nix package manager from Linux to the BSDs. First though we talk about how smart phones running GNU/Linux are becoming more powerful and more flexible. Can a low-level smart phone work as a portable workstation when plugged into a full sized screen and keyboard? We test this idea in this issue's Feature Story. Then we explore the topic of how to easily restart a background service on a set schedule. We're also pleased to share the releases of the past week and list the torrents we are seeding. We wish you all a fantastic week and happy reading!
This week's DistroWatch Weekly is presented by TUXEDO Computers.
Content:
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| Feature Story (By Jesse Smith) |
A PinePhone as a mobile desktop computer?
I have a tendency to look at what I have to work with in front of me, right here and right now. I'm usually not looking off to the future, trying to envision what might come next or where technology might be heading. However, about seven years ago, I engaged in this interview with Dedoimedo and was asked: "What will the Linux desktop look like in 2025?"
I honestly had no idea, but I shared a few thoughts, including this one about smart phones evolving to take the place of desktop computers:
Sometime in the next eight years I think we are going to reach a point where it is common for personal devices (smart phones, tablets and whatever comes next in that market) to either sync seamlessly with desktop computers, or the phone will become the desktop.
A few years ago Canonical was playing with the idea of an operating system that is a phone while it is in your pocket and a full featured desktop system when it is sitting on your desk. My Ubuntu phone has more CPU cores and almost as much memory as my laptop. With a Bluetooth keyboard and a wireless connection to the monitor on my desk, the phone I have now could probably serve almost all of my computing requirements. I think by 2025 my desktop workstation and my mobile phone could be the same device with a desktop environment that adjusts to the size of the screen being used to display information.
More recently, I've had a chance to play with the PinePhone, in particular while running UBports 20.04, and likened the experience to using a Raspberry Pi computer with a built-in screen and a battery for a backup power supply.
I wouldn't recommend the PinePhone as a daily driver as a phone, probably with any operating system. However, I will say that with it running a full GNU/Linux platform, it works pretty well as an ARM-powered testing device and as a small home server. It's silent, it has a built-in battery, it has a touch screen for times when we need local access, and it has a slot for SD cards, giving it expanded disk space. I'm quite content using mine as a backup and test server at home. Plus it fits in my pocket if I want to relocate the device.
In this way, I think of the PinePhone as a flexible single-board computer, such as a Raspberry Pi, more than as a phone. And, while running UBports 20.04, it feels well suited to this niche role.
I've also had a chance to run desktop Linux applications on my Murena phone, thanks to a handy container technology called UserLAnd.
All of this got me to thinking. If the PinePhone works fairly well as a mobile computer, similar to the Raspberry Pi, and some people use the Pi as a low-end desktop computer, could I set up my PinePhone running a distribution like UBports and attach a keyboard, mouse, and monitor to it? Could I have a low-end, highly mobile device that I could perform basic desktop computing tasks with and then transport it in my pocket? I decided to buy a docking station and find out.
A sample image of the dock
(full image size: 76kB, resolution: 425x355 pixels)
The dock plugs into a USB-C port (typically on a phone or laptop) and offers several ports for additional devices. These ports include an Ethernet port, USB power port, three USB ports, a VGA port, and an HDMI port. This means we can plug the hub into a power source, our phone, a mouse, keyboard, a monitor or two, a wired network, and still have a USB port left over for something else. The "something else" I envisioned was an extra hard drive, if my experiment went well.
Getting started
I plugged the dock into my PinePhone running UBports and attached a power cable to it. The phone's battery showed it was recharging, which I took as a good initial sign. I then plugged a wired keyboard and a mouse into the dock. At first nothing happened. I next plugged in my monitor to the dock and UBports crashed, initiating a reboot.
My PinePhone plugged into a dock in a nest of cables
(full image size: 9.8MB, resolution: 4032x3024 pixels)
With a little experimentation I soon discovered that if a monitor was plugged into the dock that the user interface would crash, then automatically relaunch, then crash again in an endless loop. I checked for upgrades and found there was an update for UBports and applied it. Following a reboot, this pattern continued with the device launching its graphical interface and then quickly crashing when a monitor was plugged into the dock.
Adjusting mouse settings using my mouse on the PinePhone
(full image size: 9.2MB, resolution: 4032x3024 pixels)
On a positive note, the Unity splash screen with its progress indicator was mirrored to the external monitor before the interface crashed and, when the phone was booting, status messages from systemd were shown on both the phone's screen and the external display. In other words, the dock worked and UBports could send output to it. My phone's display was successfully mirrored to the external monitor. The graphical interface just wasn't stable when the monitor was plugged in.
Trying an alternative distribution
My first experience with the PinePhone involved running a special edition of Manjaro with the Plasma Mobile user interface. I decided it would be worth my time to see if I could run Manjaro and Plasma on my device and see if it would work with my external monitor. People interested in running Manjaro on a PinePhone may wish to read the distribution's PINE64 wiki entry.
Setting up Manjaro Linux to run on a PinePhone is blissfully simple. We can download the provided image file, decompress it, and write it to a microSD card. Then place the card into the PinePhone and Manjaro will boot from it. The first time Manjaro starts it walks us through a short configuration wizard. The wizard's screens walk us through selecting our time zone, connecting to a wireless network, and then we're asked to make up a username and PIN to secure the device.
The PIN is mandatory and this is one of my few complaints about the distribution. Virtually every other phone OS I have used allows for unrestricted access and Manjaro is a rare exception and it gets annoying when I need to unlock a phone during testing over and over.
Manjaro for ARM -- Running the Plasma Mobile interface
(full image size: 745kB, resolution: 720x1440 pixels)
Once the first-run wizard completed its steps, the phone rebooted. Then locked up during the next boot. I plugged my PinePhone into the dock, attached the monitor, keyboard, and mouse then forced another restart. This time the phone came online, showed me the KDE logo, and presented me with the Plasma Mobile desktop. This interface appeared both on the phone's screen and on my external monitor. So far, so good.
The Plasma Mobile interface is fairly standard, with a notification and quick access to settings across the top of the screen. Applications can be accessed by swiping from the right of the screen. Navigation buttons are displayed at the bottom of the desktop.
I ran into some inconsistent behaviour while running Manjaro. For instance, sometimes when I attached my phone to the dock Plasma would pop-up a widget which seems to be intended to help us select the relative positions of the two displays. For example, we might want to activate one display and not the other, or place them side-by-side, or mirror them. I think that is what the icons in the widget were indicating, though there is no text to help explain what the options are. Clicking on the widget caused my interface to lock up, requiring a reboot. Other times, when my phone was plugged into the dock, no widget appeared and, instead, the display was mirrored across both screens.
I feel it is worth mentioning Manjaro would usually not boot when the PinePhone was plugged into the hub. I typically had to start the phone independently and then attach it to the dock once Plasma finished loading. Otherwise the phone would lock up during the boot process.
My main concern when running Manjaro on the PinePhone was the system was not stable. Perhaps this is due to issues with Plasma Mobile or perhaps it is a side-effect of the PinePhone's limited hardware. A session with the phone plugged into the dock rarely lasted more than a few minutes at a time and I don't think the phone managed to run consistently for more than ten minutes during its best session. Typically Plasma would lock up and stop responding to input after starting an application, clicking a widget, or accessing a module in the Settings panel. Even with no applications open, the hardware was slow to respond, with it taking several seconds for the interface to register a click and more than ten seconds to open a new application window.
In short, while the PinePhone could work with the dock while running Manjaro, it was not at all a practical experience, nor was it a stable experience.
I do wish to acknowledge the Manjaro documentation does say it is recommended to use the project's Stable branch whenever possible while I was using the Development branch. However, the latest Stable release was over a year old at the time of writing (it was released in 2022) while Development snapshots seem to be published around once a month. As such, I decided using the latest Beta release was preferable to running the much older Stable release.
I was curious to see what would happen if I plugged my Samsung phone running Murena into the dock. The answer was an uninteresting: nothing. I'm uncertain if the phone simple isn't set up to work with the dock or if the lack of cooperation is a security feature. In any event, my trial was limited to running the PinePhone with my new dock.
Conclusions
At this point, at least when using the low-resource PinePhone, running a lightweight desktop off my smartphone is not yet practical. Which was disappointing for me, especially as it seems as though the experience so is very close to being workable. The PinePhone works with the dock and my connected hardware, at least to a point. Both Manjaro and UBports send visual output to the monitor and both accept keyboard and mouse input. UBports will even allow me to configure the mouse pointer's behaviour from its Settings panel.
However, both platforms suffer from a painful lack of stability. The Unity interface on UBports crashes when a monitor is attached and Manjaro's Plasma Mobile interface is far too slow, unresponsive, and unstable to be practical on the PinePhone. But the pieces are all there, the core applications are there, the GNU/Linux base is there - and could work well if the graphical interface were just a little more stable.
What excites me about this scenario is a PinePhone (or similar low-end device) is less than $200. The dock is about $30 USD, my monitor was less than $100. For less than $400 I could almost run UBports on an inexpensive phone as a low-end workstation. The software isn't quite there yet, but it feels tantalisingly close. I'm still hoping that another operating system for the PinePhone, or some polishing of UBports, will allow me to make this trial a reality by 2025.
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| Miscellaneous News (by Jesse Smith) |
NixBSD launched, Fedora looks at porting COSMIC and dropping GNOME's X11 session, postmarketOS to adopt systemd, Linux Mint replacing HexChat
Along with the release of FreeBSD 13.3 this week, fans of FreeBSD had another bit of interesting news. A new project has been started which attempts to mirror the work of the Nix system manager on NixOS while using FreeBSD as a base. "NixBSD is an attempt to make a reproducible and declarable BSD, based on NixOS. Although theoretically much of this work could be copied to build other BSDs, all work thus far has been focused on building a FreeBSD distribution." If successful, this will allow people to create and maintain reproducible builds of FreeBSD using the atomic and declarative Nix system manager. Details on the project can be found on NixBSD's GitHub page.
* * * * *
The Fedora project might be the first Linux distribution to ship a desktop spin that includes the COSMIC desktop. COSMIC is a young desktop environment developed by System76 and written in Rust. COSMIC was developed by System76 for its own Pop!_OS distribution and a team is working on porting it to Fedora. The Fedora project has put out a request for help in getting COSMIC ready for the distribution: "As with most things in the Fedora Project, things exist because there is a community of contributors who come together to make it happen. We manifest things into existence. Fedora COSMIC and Ryan's work can go far, but only if he's supported by more people. If you want to see Fedora COSMIC happen, pitching in is the best way to make it so."
The Fedora team is considering dropping GNOME on X11 from the Fedora Workstation edition of their distribution. This would leave users with just GNOME on Wayland as the sole desktop option for the Workstation spin. A discussion about the change indicates GNOME will be offered on Wayland only for Fedora 41, expected to be released in October or November of 2024.
* * * * *
postmarketOS is an Alpine-based distribution for mobile devices. The operating system follows its parent in shipping with the OpenRC init software and service manager, though a migration to systemd is planned. This migration is largely driven by the work needed to get the user interfaces (provided by the GNOME and KDE projects) working on OpenRC: "This is of course not an easy task, one of the main blockers we found as we collaborate more closely with KDE and GNOME developers is that they have a hard time with our OpenRC-based stack. In order to get KDE and GNOME working at all, we use a lot of systemd polyfills on top of OpenRC. So while we are technically "not using systemd", in practice we already do use a large chunk of its components to get KDE and GNOME running, just different versions of those components. While we are very grateful for everybody who works on these polyfills, we must point out that most aren't a full replacement, and take additional effort to support and maintain. As much as we might want to romanticise the idea of spending 6, 12, 24 months attempting to come up with an even vaguely competitive alternative to systemd, we would quite simply rather be working on making postmarketOS better." Details on the migration can be found in the project's announcement.
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In February the HexChat IRC client published its final version. This open source application shipped as the default IRC client in a few Linux distributions, including Linux Mint. This has left distribution maintainers considering what to use as a replacement for the now discontinued IRC client. The Linux Mint monthly newsletter discusses how Mint will replace HexChat: "There are IRC clients written in GTK3 which are HiDPI compatible, but replacing HexChat with one of them doesn't really solve our problem. What Linux Mint needs, first and foremost, is a place for people to ask questions to other users. An IRC client can provide that but it's not dedicated to doing that. So with that in mind we started working on a new app called Jargonaut.
Jargonaut will be a dedicated app. It will do just that and do it better. Although it uses the IRC, it won't be developed as an IRC client. It will support pastebin/imgur via DND, uploading your system specifications, troubleshooting and many features which have nothing to do with IRC."
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These and other news stories can be found on our Headlines page.
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| Questions and Answers (by Jesse Smith) |
Restarting background services on a schedule
Starting-over asks: I am looking for a way to automatically restart a service everyday at a specified time. I'm hosting a game server and want to have it restart periodically. The game is started using a systemd unit, if that makes a difference.
DistroWatch answers: On most Linux distributions, and in the BSD family, the tool to run scheduled tasks is called cron. Each user has a file which lists the tasks which they wish to run along with the time when the scheduled jobs should be started. This file which lists the times and tasks is called a crontab.
We can create a crontab for our user account (or edit an existing crontab file) by running the command "crontab -e". This command will open a text editor and display our current crontab, listing each task we have scheduled. It's likely blank to start.
The format of a crontab file is outlined in the crontab man page. In its simplest form, a crontab entry has five time parameters and one command which is to be run. The five time fields indicate the minute, hour, day of the month, month, and day of the week when we want to run a job. Then the command to be run at the specified time follows. A star (*) character, indicates a time field when we want the time to always match.
In this example, we run a command called backup-everything which will run 1 minute after noon (12pm). We will do this on the 3rd day of the month, every month (*), regardless of which day of the week it is:
1 12 3 * * /usr/local/bin/backup-everything
In this next example we run the same script, but at 3:00am on every Monday, which cron treats as the 1st day of the week:
0 3 * * 1 /usr/local/bin/backup-everything
You might have noticed that in both examples I specified the full path name to the script, specifying "/usr/local/bin/backup-everything" instead of just "backup-everything". This is because cron often doesn't use the same path as a regular user account when trying to find executable programs and scripts. Most of the time when a cron job doesn't run properly it's due to an incomplete path name.
Getting back to the original question, let's say we have a systemd service called "game-server". We can have this service restarted every night at 2:15am by setting up the following crontab entry:
15 2 * * * /usr/bin/systemctl restart game-server
In the above example I'm assuming the systemctl program is located in the /usr/bin directory, which is typical of most distributions. If you want to check the full path of your systemctl program you can do so with the which command:
$ which systemctl
/usr/bin/systemctl
Once you have made your crontab entry, save the text file and exit the text editor. Your crontab will then be saved and will automatically restart the game server at the specified time. If you want to double-check that your crontab file has been saved properly, you can see the contents of your user's crontab file by running "crontab -l":
$ crontab -l
15 2 * * * /usr/bin/systemctl restart game-server
One possible complication you may run into is with permissions. If your regular user account does not have permission to restart the game service (or if you require sudo to launch the game service) then trying to restart the game server from your own user's crontab will fail. If you usually use sudo to start the service or if it requires the root user to launch the game service, then you'll need to edit the root user's crontab rather than your own user's crontab.
You can do this on most distributions by running the command "sudo crontab -e". This will edit the root user's crontab which should avoid any permission restrictions on your own account.
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Additional answers can be found in our Questions and Answers archive.
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| Released Last Week |
FreeBSD 13.3
Colin Percival has announced the release of FreeBSD 13.3, the production release in the legacy branch of the popular BSD-derived operating system: "The FreeBSD Release Engineering team is pleased to announce the availability of FreeBSD 13.3-RELEASE. This is the fourth release of the stable/13 branch. Some of the highlights: LLVM and the Clang compiler have been updated to version 17.0.6; OpenSSH has been updated to version 9.6p1; Sendmail has been updated to version 8.18.1; ZFS has been updated to OpenZFS 2.1.14; there have been many stability fixes to native and LinuxKPI-based WiFi drivers; the NFS server can now run in an appropriately configured vnet jail. FreeBSD 13.3-RELEASE is now available for the amd64, i386, powerpc, powerpc64, powerpc64le, powerpcspe, armv6, armv7, aarch64, and riscv64 architectures." Please read the release announcement and the release notes for more information.
Zorin OS 17.1
Zorin OS is an Ubuntu-based distribution which features layouts, themes, and compatibility tools to provide new Linux users with a more familiar environment. The latest version of Zorin OS focuses on cross-platform application compatibility and isolation, shipping with the latest stable version of WINE and Bottles: "When you run Windows-native apps in Zorin OS 17.1, you'll now get the full capabilities of the latest Wine 9.0 version. The compatibility layer now has significantly improved support for more Windows software. That means you'll be able to run an even larger selection of apps and games effortlessly. When you enable Windows App Support in Zorin OS 17.1, it now comes bundled with Bottles. This tool lets you run Windows software in a sandboxed environment and provides a neat way to organize your apps and games. Bottles comes with a built-in app store, which installs and pre-configures a growing selection of Windows apps for even better compatibility with the system." Additional information can be found in the project's release announcement.
Zorin OS 17.1 -- Running GNOME and the software centre
(full image size: 1.7MB, resolution: 1920x1440 pixels)
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Development, unannounced and minor bug-fix releases
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| Torrent Corner |
Weekly Torrents
The table below provides a list of torrents DistroWatch is currently seeding. If you do not have a bittorrent client capable of handling the linked files, we suggest installing either the Transmission or KTorrent bittorrent clients.
Archives of our previously seeded torrents may be found in our Torrent Archive. We also maintain a Torrents RSS feed for people who wish to have open source torrents delivered to them. To share your own open source torrents of Linux and BSD projects, please visit our Upload Torrents page.
Torrent Corner statistics:
- Total torrents seeded: 2,972
- Total data uploaded: 44.1TB
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| Upcoming Releases and Announcements |
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Summary of expected upcoming releases
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| Opinion Poll (by Jesse Smith) |
A smart phone as a desktop computer?
This week we talked about an experiment to see how well a minimal mobile device like the PinePhone works as a portable desktop system. While there were some elements of success in the process, the test systems didn't have the performance or stability needed to function well as a workstation.
We'd like to hear if any of our readers have tried running a smart phone as their main workstation with a full sized monitor, keyboard, and mouse. Have you tried this? Did your phone provide all the functionality you needed in a desktop machine? Let us know the details of your experiences in the comments.
You can see the results of our previous poll on 2024's first release season in our previous edition. All previous poll results can be found in our poll archives.
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Have you used a smart phone as a workstation?
| Yes and it worked well enough I still use it: | 30 (2%) |
| Yes though I did not continue using it: | 113 (7%) |
| No but I planned to try: | 299 (19%) |
| No and I do not plan to try: | 1116 (72%) |
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| Website News |
Filter torrents by distribution name
DistroWatch has a Torrent Archive which contains a list of torrents for recent stable releases. These are torrents which have typically been seeded by DistroWatch when they were first released.
To make it easier to find download options, we place a link to the Torrent Archive on the information pages of distributions, under the Download Mirrors section. For example, if you visit the Tails information page you can see a link called "DistroWatch Torrent Archive" in the Download section.
A problem some people were reporting is the Torrent Archive can get crowded. It's not always easy to find older releases of a distribution torrent. To help with that, in the past, we added an option to sort the torrents by name rather than by release date. (See the sort menu at the top of the Torrent Archive table for ordering options.)
This week we added another approach to make it easier to find torrents for a specific distribution. If you visit a distribution's information page and click the "DistroWatch Torrent Archive" link, only that distro's torrents will be displayed. For example, clicking the link on the Tails page takes us to a view of the archive with just the recent Tails torrents.
If that is not what you want, if you wish to see all of the torrent options in our archive, you can click the Show All Torrents link at the top of the archive to see the full range of options.
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New distributions added to waiting list
- Ubix. Ubix stands for Universal Business Intelligence Computing System. Ubix Linux is an open-source, Debian-based Linux distribution geared towards data acquisition, transformation, analysis and presentation.
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DistroWatch database summary
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This concludes this week's issue of DistroWatch Weekly. The next instalment will be published on Monday, 18 March 2024. Past articles and reviews can be found through our Weekly Archive and Article Search pages. To contact the authors please send e-mail to:
- Jesse Smith (feedback, questions and suggestions: distribution reviews/submissions, questions and answers, tips and tricks)
- Ladislav Bodnar (feedback, questions, donations, comments)
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| Reader Comments • Jump to last comment |
1 • Smartphone as a workstation (by Daniel Martinez on 2024-03-11 00:24:06 GMT from United States)
I voted "No and I don't plan to try it". I want to see a Linux smartphone work as a full featured smartphone on par with iOS or Android before I try to use it for other purposes.
2 • Smartphone has workstation (by Earth Hawk on 2024-03-11 01:43:09 GMT from United States)
I have a Z Fold 4. I use DeX all the time.
3 • Mobile Workstation Experience (by Vinfall on 2024-03-11 02:17:02 GMT from Hong Kong)
A few weeks ago I did a similar thing as my DIY monitor uses miniHDMI whereas rpi uses microHDMI and cannot use type-C as video input, so I ended up using Termux as a mobile workstation.
The DIY monitor supports touch screen and type-C video input (dunno what's the official name, the function is to omit a power cable), and my phone has OTG support so I can use an external keyboard.
The setup almost works, despite the annoying behavior of Termux software keyboard or whatever would randomly kill the IME with certain key combinations or even single key press, which makes abandon this idea and uses another annoying tiny wireless keyboard mouse gadget (Rii RK707)...
4 • Smartphone dominance (by Ankleface Wroughtlandmire on 2024-03-11 06:29:04 GMT from United States)
I think the elephant in the room here is the phenomenon of users that exclusively use a smartphone *without* an external monitor or keyboard. There is an incredibly large and constantly increasing number of users that have switched to using their smartphone for absolutely everything. In many cases they do so because all of their "personal" data is tied up in a jumbled mess of messages and attachments in proprietary messaging apps like Whatsapp. But I also blame Windows for becoming increasingly more annoying and unreliable with its forced updates and poor security track record that leads users to think they need to run antivirus and antimalware programs with the abysmal performance hit that these bring. So despite the frustrating limitations and inefficiency of trying to accomplish important tasks by poking/swiping fingers against a relatively small smartphone screen, many users discount real computers as unreliable and unsafe, and they just put up with the limitations of using their smartphone for absolutely everything.
5 • JuiceSSH + automated Tasker plugin on Mobile (by Jimbo on 2024-03-11 06:41:11 GMT from New Zealand)
While I don't use that many desktop applications on the Mobile - I definitely recommend JuiceSSH for managing servers remotely.
6 • Phone-PC link (by Someguy on 2024-03-11 08:27:54 GMT from United Kingdom)
What kind of joke is this?! Coupling well-protected private data with a mobile phone? No prizes for all those spammers, scammers, pen-pushers and ne'er-do-wells rubbing their hands with glee...
7 • Smartphones as a Workstation (by bassplayer69 on 2024-03-11 09:14:12 GMT from United States)
Microsoft tried this years ago with the Windows Phone and look where it is now.
8 • Docking station (by gerald on 2024-03-11 10:42:43 GMT from Austria)
It is possible to use the smartphone as a desktop computer, but not every smartphone supports this technology via the usb port. What works in most cases is a docking station with DisplayLink support. DisplayLink works with any usb port.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DisplayLink
9 • Restarting services on a schedule (by Henrique Rodrigues on 2024-03-11 10:54:01 GMT from United Kingdom)
The nice thing about systemd is that it already supports this feature, there's no need to mess around with crontabs. You can either use systemd timers for that or, the easiest is to just use "RuntimeMaxSec", which stops a service after X amount of seconds.
Another good thing about systemd is that you don't need to mess around with the original unit files, you can simply create an override by doing something like:
$ sudo systemctl edit
Then add the following and save:
[Service]
RuntimeMaxSec=86400s
Restart=always
I don't think the "Restart" directive is needed, but it doesn't hurt.
You can have as many override files as you want and you can even have unit files that are set up at the user level, not at the system level.
I really don't understant the hate against systemd, it made my life as a sysadmin so much better.
10 • Smartphone as a workstation : Galaxy Z Fold and Dex (by LapiGNU on 2024-03-11 11:58:41 GMT from France)
@#2, tried it with my Fold and the same "dock" as Jesse a few months ago. The hardware is no problem, Dex is quiet coll, but for me, the applications keep to much of an "Android touch" for me. Firefox, Collabora Office, Solid Explorer...
11 • smartphones (by dr.j on 2024-03-11 12:11:23 GMT from Romania)
a smartphone as a desktop replacement? Never.
I prefer to go the other way, in which I install the Messenger as a desktop version on the computer and always delete everything on the smartphone.
Word processing, online banking, etc. on a smartphone. Never.
Even if one day a Linux phone allows full control of a smartphone and all the programs I need on the desktop are available. Why? It doesn't make any sense. Then you'd rather have a mini-PC
12 • Smartphones as a Wrokstation (by Tamas on 2024-03-11 13:11:59 GMT from Hungary)
I also have a Z Fold 4, and I am typing this on it via DeX.
Samsung made DeX available in the S8 phone in about 2017, and it stayed.
Hopefully, multi-monitor support and faster usb-c ports might be around the corner...
Currently, S/Note/Z Fold series phones and Tab S series tablets can be used with DeX, but only one external monitor can be attached/used (or on some docks, multi-monitor is a possibility, however, only mirrored output is available on them), so at maximum two separate screens (the internal and one usb-c / wirelessly connected external screen) can be used.
However, the docks tend to include several usb-A ports, probably, some usb-c ports, as well as ethernet and some even has Displayport output.
As for tasks: I am a sysadmin, so ssh (Termius) and Teamviewer, RDP, VNC (bVNC) all can be done on both screens (because of the tablet-like inner screen of my phone), but usually, ssh and Chrome is started on DeX screen and RDP is (currently) usable on the inner screen of the phone.
13 • Smartphone fusion (by to_lose_letrec on 2024-03-11 16:28:52 GMT from United States)
I really wish I completely understood the increasing desire to bring mobile devices together with desktop.
It's something that has boggled my mind ever since desktop interfaces started looking more like mobile (as with, say GNOME), or literally running the same software (as with Windows 8).
While I understand the unity being conceptually attractive, what is wrong with having interfaces that are for fundamentally different things? It shouldn't be too hard to wrap one's head around that. After all, most of us use more than one program and more than one operating system literally every day without tension. If they can share information somehow, that's about the only level of overlap I personally need or even want.
So no, I am not using a mobile phone for a desktop, because they serve profoundly different purposes for me. If the only cost is having to carry a laptop AND a phone, that cost is not very high.
14 • Smartphones (by Vukota on 2024-03-11 16:49:38 GMT from Serbia)
While, I answered No to use it as a desktop, I may consider it for running as a server, as it has battery (thus not requiring UPS or extra brick for short outages), does not need extra cooling (i can put it in the closet/drawer) and finally is super quiet (so it can live in my bedroom). I can use it as a 5G router as well.
15 • Smartphones as a Wrokstation (by Mike W on 2024-03-11 16:55:10 GMT from United States)
While this technology is not ready for prime time today, its definitely around the corner. I have a Chormebook that can do double duty as a laptop when my needs are modest. So, its not hard to envision a smart phone that a user can drop into a charging cradle, where that cradle also allows the connection of a keyboard, mouse and external monitor.
Given the advancing power of cell phone processors, in the future a user could easily catchup on email and news while on the train heading for the office on their cell phone. Then, once they arrive at the office, drop their smart phone into a cradle and get to work on their spreadsheet, planning software, etc.,
16 • @4 Windows Cliches (by GT on 2024-03-11 16:56:34 GMT from United States)
"But I also blame Windows for becoming increasingly more annoying and unreliable with its forced updates and poor security track record that leads users to think they need to run antivirus and antimalware programs with the abysmal performance hit that these bring."
I know Windows-bashing is a favorite pastime of Linux users, but the criticisms have not seem to have changed since Windows 95/98 and XP. Windows has definitely become more reliable over the years, and I haven't installed antivirus software since Windows 7, which is the version where Defender was built into the OS. Windows security is constantly improving while Linux is seeing more successful attacks due to its increased ubiquity and motivation for hackers to find vulnerabilities. I would still say Linux is more secure than Windows, but for the average desktop user, the difference is pretty negligible these days. I have not had an instance of malware making it's way onto Windows since XP.
I think it is pretty obvious that the increased usage of phone-only computer users has much more to do with how much more one can do with a phone these days than consumers getting 'fed up with Windows'. I have never heard that opinion come from anyone other than Linux users. In fact, I haven't heard any Windows user complain about Windows for the last decade. The only Windows-bashing I hear today comes from Linux users who seem to think people who actually use Windows feel the same way.
That being said, I love tinkering with Linux and have a niche reason for always having a distro installed and ready to go. It's a wonderful OS, but it doesn't have to be "Linux or Windows". For me, it is "Linux and Windows".
17 • What, and lose everything at once? (by RedQuine on 2024-03-11 17:05:32 GMT from United Kingdom)
I know people who use their phones for everything. When I say I can't access my emails on mine, they stare at me like I'm crazy. But they're the ones who end up in a mad panic when they drop their phones, and there's always the risk of loss or theft.
The few apps on my phone are normally disabled or muted, and linked to a separate email account. I can use WhatsApp on my laptop to download & back up data, plus it's far easier to type URLs on a physical keyboard. I resent the fact that so many online accounts now require apps and/or SMS but use an old phone for those. All I carry around - and all I *want* to carry around - is the bare minimum. Even that is grudging; until 7 years ago, I only took my phone out of the house when travelling long distance.
Just because you *can* do something, doesn't automatically make it sensible. Especially if its only advantage is convenience, although I realise YMMV.
18 • missing poll option (by Steve on 2024-03-11 17:47:14 GMT from United States)
There is a choice missing from the poll today:
"I don't have/use/want a smartphone"
....and won't have one until I can no longer get and use a flip phone. But then I also use a landline for my home phone so folks that don't know my life and work experience might be tempted to label me as a luddite. They would be wrong, of course, as I'm not a luddite, I just have a lot of experience, starting with analog computers. Besides, I already have a couple of home built desktop computers so I don't need to use a smartphone as a desktop workstation.
But that's just me, if all you have is a smartphone then the idea might have appeal, leaving off the question of whether it has merit.
19 • "No but I plan to try" (by Jacob Alexander Tice on 2024-03-11 18:39:10 GMT from United States)
I have a Motorola Razr 40 Ultra, which has a feature called Ready For that creates a desktop environment thing when plugged into a dock. I'm wondering if it's usable for basic tasks but I don't have said dock.
20 • A PinePhone as a mobile desktop computer? (by migos on 2024-03-11 18:56:09 GMT from Portugal)
Thats what I want!
A smartphone that works like a phone by itself and that works like a desktop / workstation when connected to an external monitor, mouse and keyboard. Different but simultaneous interfaces for each one. I should be able to talk on the phone while I work. That would be the maximum flexibility and mobility!
Taking my PC (Linux box) with me everywhere, including to my work? Yes! Yes! Yes!
I hope some distro takes this seriously and implement it on a smartphone, and they will have a user!
21 • systemd timers (by Walter on 2024-03-11 18:57:09 GMT from Canada)
@9: > "I really don't understant the hate against systemd, it made my life as a sysadmin so much better."
I think the above post perfectly illustrates why some people dislike systemd and people who push it in situations that don't make sense.
In the Weekly's QA a solution is presented for restarting services on a schedule which just requires the user to write one line. Just edit one line in one file, knowing just the name of the service and the time when they want to restart it. This solution works on virtually ever Linux, BSD, and Unix system in the world.
Then the comment in post @9 comes up with the equivalent systemd solution which involves editing or creating a file, editing multiple lines, and not only knowing the name of the service, but also the number of seconds the user wants the service to run between restarts. Ignoring what happens if the user is more interested in restarting at a set time rather than how long the service has run. And this solution only works on around 2/3rds of Linux distributions, ignoring a third of Linux distros, BSDs, and traditional Unix. And this is presented by the systemd fan as being better.
It's worse for the user at every step of the process, requires more resources, and doesn't work in half the environments as the solution in the QA. How can systemd be considered a step forward in this situation?
22 • phone as a desktop (by MK on 2024-03-11 19:13:50 GMT from Israel)
It is a great idea, if done right. I'd really like to have a fanless PC/phone with decent performance. Apparently, it is no easy to do, and the hardware is not there yet.
23 • Phone as desktop (by Nifty on 2024-03-11 22:57:42 GMT from United States)
Unfortunately, due to circumstances, my phone is an iPhone. I have no desire whatsoever to expand its role in my life. I‘ll stick with raspberry pi’s and live USBs.
24 • systemd (by Jerry on 2024-03-11 23:49:42 GMT from United States)
@21 Thank you!
25 • Phone as a desktop (by Lupus Lunarum on 2024-03-12 08:20:39 GMT from Germany)
There already exists a little german startup trying to sell a bundle.
It´s called Shiftphone and they are for the longest time only preselling Shift Phone mu
for about 1200-1300,-€
If that ever comes to fruition IDK. Been watching their website for a long time might be a scam. See for yourselves.
Bye Lupus
26 • Smartphone (by Gram on 2024-03-12 17:31:12 GMT from United Kingdom)
Not for me, using a smartphone in this way. However for 30-40 UK pounds/US dollars, why not get a raspberry pi? All scenarios listed will work easily.
27 • phones as desktop (by Dave Postles on 2024-03-12 18:53:08 GMT from United Kingdom)
Not for me, I'm afraid. I'd still need a keyboard and a mouse. I might as well just carry my Gigabyte small form factor unit with me. In any case, I wouldn't want to pay more than £100 for a smart phone.
28 • phone desktop (by chetco on 2024-03-12 21:48:47 GMT from United States)
It's an interesting idea and this was one of the main reasons people were interested in the Ubuntu Phone. DeX and some other Android phones have this now, but last time I tried it it was not ready for heavy daily work yet, the usb transfer is pretty slow and there's no multi-monitor support yet. The applications are also just blown up mobile layouts, but that's not a dealbreaker to a lot of people considering things like GNOME and similar projects are popular. I think it'll mature in this decade or early in the next. People who are hardcore mobile gamers (which cant be that many people) also like stuff like this because emulating Android can be a PITA sometimes.
I could see this becoming popular a way to get basic tasks done as desktop sales among people who aren't gamers, video editors and 3D modelers continue to decline.
29 • systemd (by Johnny on 2024-03-12 23:00:07 GMT from United States)
@9 Thank you!!
30 • smartphone as desktop (by Jerry on 2024-03-13 11:50:33 GMT from United States)
When I travel, I commonly use my Samsung Galaxy S23 paired with a portable Wimaxit 12" monitor and a Waherfo foldable keyboard with touchpad. Works great and very comfortable, though I don't see it as a daily setup.
31 • Dex was so-so (by Moe on 2024-03-13 20:16:39 GMT from United States)
I'm surprised Google hasn't (yet) modded ChromeOS for phones.
32 • systemd (by ThomasAnderson on 2024-03-13 22:27:46 GMT from Australia)
Continuing from the previous weekly discussion about systemd is good. So many times here on the comments section, a good discussion starts only to be stopped when the comments close at the end of the week.
In light of the systemd infiltration of Linux I have been testing some systemd "free" linux distros such as Devuan, Void, Artix and PCLinuxOS, however the issue is that all have shortcomings and compromises, such as adding Elogind or other systemd components into supposedly systemd-free distros.
I tested NomadBSD, going away from Linux seems to be the next logical step, especially considering the issue of Wayland and Xorg battles taking place, with Fedora opting to not have it installed in the next release (although it can be installed from repo).
Seems to me too many things are going in the wrong direction with Linux. I did touch on the kernel bloat also and the fact the Linus, although lead dev, does not in anyway care about the issue. Sure, sometimes old hardware gets pruned, like support for SUN Sparc cpu's, but that is not the bloat that is the issue.
NomadBSD so far seems to offer everything I need, including the ability to install to disk with encryption and it also has a compatibility layer for running Linux apps and choice of shell including Bash Shell. Seems to be the way to go, as it is based on FreeBSD but better.
I guess the migration away from Linux happens to those who are dissatisfied with the state of Linux and the the path it is taking. RedoxOS isn't ready yet for a main stable, so in the meantime, NomadBSD it is. No more Systemd, everything works on a nicely maintained secure system.
33 • phone as a desktop (by paul on 2024-03-14 00:32:58 GMT from United Kingdom)
The idea that a small gadget will replace everything is a nice thought but impractical, my phone has so much personal stuff on it that I don't want to plug it in anywhere else apart from my house..... Whereas I already own a laptop, desktop, and raspberry pi's which already are attached to a display and human interfacing devices!
Maybe for a damaged phone to still use it 'headless' would make sense though.
I dunno, not for me but If that's how you want to get your Linux on then who am I to judge.
34 • systemd, BSD (by Jan on 2024-03-14 00:46:51 GMT from The Netherlands)
@32
I tested GhostBSD in live-usb, the XFCE-version (I could not get the Mate-version (the flagship) in a usable way on my external monotor, no option to change which monitor to use).
It looks nice.
However it has a small management-team.
And I wonder who is in control of keeping Mate and XFCE up-to-date (in general). It seems only Gnome and KDE and Cinnamon have a clear maintaining team.
35 • @34 (by ThomasAndersin on 2024-03-14 04:11:17 GMT from Australia)
Yes, GhostBSD is maintained by one person, perhaps 2. This was discussed briefly a few weeks ago where i was pointing out the lack of disk encryption option using GELI which is available in FreeBSD, MidnightBSD and NomadBSD.
Mate and XFCE have a proper group of maintainers. Perhaps the issue was with your graphics card. NomadBSD uses Openbox by default.
36 • smartphone as desktop (by Richard Palmer on 2024-03-14 12:27:28 GMT from France)
This is an interesting idea that I've explored with my LG G5 (running Android), but I've not used it for serious work.
I prefer to use a full Linux install on an external ssd, that I carry with me when I travel.
That said, if I had a Linux phone I would be happy to use it instead of the external disk; it appears however that even the Pinephones and other such devices have limitations.
37 • Smartphone as a computer (by Fox on 2024-03-14 20:23:40 GMT from Canada)
I tried DeX on a Galaxy S8 and S20 with a dock, and it worked very well. I was only interested in trying it, though, not actually using it to do any useful work. But I was impressed with how well it worked.
38 • smartphone as desktop (by Jerry on 2024-03-14 21:57:15 GMT from United States)
(correcting my post @30) When I travel, I commonly use my GT-I7500 paired with a portable WalkWatch 2" monitor and a Waheegit foldable keyboard with touchpad. Works great and very comfortable, though I don't see it as a daily setup.
39 • Phone (by Romne on 2024-03-15 07:08:31 GMT from Australia)
Have absolutely no intention of ever using a phone as my computer.
Yes, yes, I know that these devices are becoming capable of such uses.
But phones have to small an interface for me to work comfortably with. And, phones are prone to being lost - news item recently about someone who lost their phone, and as a result lost about $12,000.
No, I refuse to keep my life on any mobile device, such as the younger generation seem to do. Too much risk, lack of any real security, and too prone to loss (eg. if your life is on it, what happens to your life?). Likewise, suffers the Windoze syndrome - commonly used, and thus a prime target for scammers and spammers.
A phone is, to me, just that - a phone.
40 • @39 (by ThomasAnderson on 2024-03-15 23:46:16 GMT from Australia)
Care to elaborate on how that person who lost their phone also lost $12,000?
I am still waiting for an affordable, capable, Linux phone under $300, so that i can ditch android. I know it may seem hypocritical given my stance on systemd but we have to pick and choose our battles. A linux phone is still more secure and desirable than an android phone even one running Calyx or another secured android rom.
Using a Linux phone as a desktop replacement in an emegency is handy but not for daily use case.
Number of Comments: 40
Display mode: DWW Only • Comments Only • Both DWW and Comments
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