 DistroWatch Weekly |
| DistroWatch Weekly, Issue 739, 20 November 2017 |
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Welcome to this year's 47th issue of DistroWatch Weekly!
This past week we saw new releases from several projects. Slax returned with its new Debian base, GhostBSD launched a new version of their desktop-friendly FreeBSD-based operating system and Linux Mint previewed operating system snapshots using a utility called Timeshift. One of the more prominent new releases to appear last week was Fedora 27, which features GNOME running on Wayland, signed LibreOffice documents and a new settings panel. We begin this week with a review of Fedora 27 and a look at the current status of the GNOME desktop on Wayland. In our News section we talk about running desktop Ubuntu on Samsung mobile devices and Red Hat providing a version of Red Hat Enterprise Linux for ARM-powered computers. Plus the Parabola project has reported it will continue to maintain 32-bit packages, despite its base (Arch Linux) dropping 32-bit support. In our Questions and Answers column we discuss cross-distribution software ports. Plus we share the many releases of the past week and provide a list of the torrents we are seeding. In our Opinion Poll we ask how many of our readers are running desktop or laptop computers with ARM processors. We wish you all wonderful week and happy reading!
Content:
- Review: Fedora 27 Workstation
- News: Ubuntu running on Samsung phones, Red Hat unveils RHEL for ARM, Parabola continues to provide 32-bit packages
- Questions and answers: Cross-distro software ports
- Released last week: Fedora 27, Tails 3.3, VyOS 1.1.8
- Torrent corner: Fedora, GhostBSD, KaOS, RDS, Slax, Sparky, Tails, VyOS
- Opinion poll: ARM desktops and laptops
- New additions: Daphile
- New distributions: Ready Linux, Flint OS, anemOS
- Reader comments
Listen to the Podcast edition of this week's DistroWatch Weekly in OGG (70MB) and MP3 (87MB) formats.
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| Feature Story (by Jesse Smith) |
Fedora 27 Workstation
Fedora is a community developed distribution sponsored by Red Hat. Fedora ships cutting edge, open source software and is sometimes viewed as a testing grounds for new technology, such as systemd and Wayland. Fedora has a strong stance on shipping open source software and packages which are not encumbered by license or patent restrictions, with one of the few exceptions being non-free firmware which is provided to help Fedora run on a wide range of hardware.
Usually Fedora ships in three main editions (Workstation, Server and Atomic Host) along with several community spins. With the release of Fedora 27 the Server edition was delayed and is scheduled to ship in January 2018. The Workstation edition of Fedora ships with GNOME 3.26 and features GNOME's new settings panel. The distribution also reportedly offers improved search results from the GNOME Activities screen and includes the ability to sign LibreOffice documents with OpenPGP keys.
The Workstation edition of Fedora is available as a 1.5GB download. Booting from the project's installation media brings up a graphical interface with a window where we are asked if we would like to try running Fedora's live environment or immediately launch the project's system installer. The first time I booted Fedora 27 the interface locked up at this point and I could not choose either option. I performed a hard reset, booted back to the selection screen and, the second time around, I was able to select the live desktop option.
I poked around the live GNOME Shell desktop for a while and found it to be a sparse environment. The desktop is mostly empty, unless we open the Activities menu, which brings up a full screen search area and a dock where we can launch or browse available applications.
Fedora 27 -- Browsing installed applications
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Installing
Fedora uses the Anaconda system installer. It is a graphical utility which begins by asking us to select our preferred language from a list. Then we are guided through two hub screens where we can perform additional configuration options in the order of our choosing. The only two modules we really need to complete are the partitioning section and setting up a root password. We can also optionally adjust the computer's time zone, change the keyboard layout, create a user account and adjust network settings. For the most part, these modules worked well and I think Anaconda may be faster now than it was in past years. However, I still find the partitioning section overly complicated. Partitioning is spread over two screens (selecting drives and arranging partitions) and, in my opinion, the controls are not clearly presented. The installer also asks us to specify whether we are using multi-device volumes such as LVM and Btrfs, or using standard file system partitions such as ext4. Most distributions just treat all three options the same way and let the user mix and match as they like. My final gripe with the installer was it complained about the size of my swap partition, saying it should be bigger, which seems strange in an era where many people do not even bother using swap space.
In the end, Anaconda finished its work successfully, and fairly quickly, and returned me to GNOME Shell.
Early impressions
When Fedora boots we are presented with a graphical login screen. We have three login options: GNOME (running on Wayland), GNOME Classic and GNOME on Xorg. GNOME Classic provides an experience somewhat like the traditional GNOME 2 and MATE desktops, though with some features removed or moved around. The plain GNOME option loads GNOME Shell running on Wayland and the GNOME on Xorg session again runs GNOME Shell, but with the X display server in place of Wayland.
I tried all three environments and they each have their strengths and weaknesses. For example, running GNOME on Wayland on Fedora provided a relatively slow and unresponsive desktop in my test environments. When run on my desktop computer, GNOME was just a bit sluggish and programs were slow to load, but when running in VirtualBox, the Wayland session was so slow I could watch dialogue boxes be drawn element-by-element. The GNOME-Shell process used more CPU than expected, sometimes as much as 20%.
The GNOME on Xorg experience was smoother. On my desktop machine, GNOME Shell running on the X display server was pretty responsive. Performance was almost perfect, except when dealing with the Activities view, which was still a bit slow to respond. When running in VirtualBox, GNOME on Xorg switched windows and opened new applications three to five times faster than when I was running the Wayland session. GNOME Classic offered the same performance as GNOME on Xorg, but without the slow Activities overview screen.
The first time we sign into GNOME a configuration wizard appears and walks us through selecting our preferred language and keyboard layout. We are also given the chance to enable on-line services and automated bug reports. We can also link our local account to on-line services such as Google and Facebook. Once this wizard completes its steps, the GNOME Help application opens. The Help documentation provides us with tips for performing common tasks under the GNOME desktop, complete with diagrams. I really like GNOME's documentation, it is unusually detailed and a very helpful resource for new users.
Shortly after signing into GNOME Shell, a notification appeared at the top of the desktop, letting me know software updates were available. I was too slow to click the notification to follow-up, but I did open the distribution's software manager (GNOME Software) and clicked on the utility's Updates tab. The day Fedora 27 launched there were 21 updates available. There doesn't appear to be a clear way to select which updates we want to install, the software manager assumes we want them all. Clicking the update button warns us that installing updates will require a reboot. Fedora is almost unique among Linux distributions in requiring a reboot during package upgrades and it feels like an unpleasant return to my days using Windows.
This feeling persisted when I found out just how long it takes Fedora to apply updates. When the software manager rebooted the system, I was stuck waiting for over 15 minutes for the updates to finish applying, an unusually long time compared to the update processes on most Linux distributions. This delay meant it was faster for me to walk to the local post office and check my mailbox than to reboot Fedora and open my e-mail client.
Hardware
One of Fedora's better characteristics, in my opinion, is the distribution's hardware support. Fedora detected and worked with desktop computer's hardware. Networking was set up automatically and sound worked out of the box. When run in VirtualBox, Fedora was able to automatically integrate with the virtual environment and use my host computer's full screen resolution.
While everything worked in both environments, I found Fedora worked much faster on the desktop computer. When run in VirtualBox, tasks performed on the desktop took about three times longer to complete, whether it was opening an application or performing a search through the Activities screen.
Fedora 27 -- GNOME's Activities screen
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I found the distribution was sometimes slow to boot. Apart from the delays caused by software updates I mentioned earlier, Fedora would sometimes pause and display the notorious systemd message: "A start job is running". These pauses resulted in Fedora occasionally taking over a minute to boot.
In either environment, Fedora used a little over 900MB of RAM when signed into the desktop. The GNOME on Wayland session required about 960MB and GNOME on Xorg required 930MB. A fresh install of Fedora took up about 5GB of disk space.
Applications
Fedora ships with a fairly lean collection of software by default. The Workstation edition provides us with the Firefox web browser, the Evolution e-mail client and LibreOffice. GNOME features a map application, a simple calendar application and simple image viewer. The Shotwell photo manager is included along with a scanner utility and an app for checking the weather. We're also given a document viewer, archive manager and system monitor.
Fedora 27 -- Running the Firefox web browser
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Fedora ships with the Rhythmbox audio player and the Totem video player. I found I was able to play most audio files, including MP3 files, out of the box. Video formats were not as well supported. Totem will offer to check Fedora's repositories for video codecs, but cannot find suitable matches. To gain additional multimedia support, Fedora users can enable the RPMFusion repositories which contain additional packages, codecs and non-free extras. Even with the RPMFusion repositories added, when Totem tried to find matching codecs to play videos, the best it could do was come up with a list of about six packages which might contain the proper codec. Since most codec packages do not carry descriptive names, I found it easiest to simple install all of them.
Back when I reviewed Ubuntu 17.10, I found the Totem video player would work when run on the Xorg session, but not when run on a Wayland session. I was curious to find out if the problem was with Totem and could be duplicated across distributions, or if the issue was specific to the Ubuntu distribution. I found Totem displayed the same behaviour on Fedora, failing to run when I tried to launch it on Wayland, but running smoothly under the GNOME on Xorg session. This leads me to wonder why both distributions continue to ship Totem as the default media player when their default desktop session is not compatible with it.
But I digress. Rounding out Fedora's software selection, we are provided with Network Manager to help us get on-line. Java is installed for us and systemd is used as Fedora's init software. Fedora 27 ships with Linux 4.13. When running programs from the command line, if we type in the name of a command which has not been installed, but which is available in Fedora's repositories, a prompt will appear and offer to install the missing utility for us.
One of the items mentioned in Fedora's release announcement was a feature which allows LibreOffice to sign documents by using the user's OpenPGP key. This feature interested me as it provides a useful way to confirm the origin of a document. The LibreOffice suite does indeed include a feature (presented under the File menu) which allows the user to sign the current document or an existing PDF. One catch to this is LibreOffice cannot create signing keys, only use existing ones. If we do not already have keys installed under our account we need to make one and Fedora does not include a desktop utility for creating signing keys.
I also found performing searches in the Activities menu for programs that could create OpenPGP keys tended not to return results. Searches for "openpgp", "gnupg" and "pgp" returned no results. I finally got hits off the terms "cert" and "keys". Once I had installed a certificate manager and generated keys, LibreOffice was able to find them and use my keys to digitally sign documents I had created. Then, when we open a document which has been signed, assuming we have the author's verification key, LibreOffice will automatically display a message saying the document was signed and verified.
There is one other hurdle in LibreOffice's new feature, apart from needing an outside program to create and manage the keys of authors. Every time we edit and save a document, the process removes all signing keys, including our own, from the document. We need to manually re-sign the document every time we change and save it. I think it would have been convenient if, once we had signed a document, LibreOffice automatically signed it again when we had altered it.
Software management
Fedora's primary tool for installing and updating software is the GNOME Software application. This software manager is divided into three tabs where we can browse available software, remove installed items and install updates. I have already touched on the update feature and the tab for removing installed applications is fairly straight forward. The tab for browsing available software lets us find programs by either browsing categories or searching for items by name. GNOME Software presents search results and software categories in nice, clear lists with icons and short descriptions. We can click on an application to bring up a full screen description with a screen shot. Installing new software can be accomplished with a button click.
Fedora 27 -- The software manager
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On the whole, GNOME Software is a capable front end for dealing with software. There were just a few cases where I ran into issues. For example, GNOME Software would sometimes lock up for a few minutes while installing new applications and the window would go blank. The software manager always recovered from these lock-ups on its own, eventually. The other problem I ran into concerned the difference between using GNOME Software and the DNF command line package manager. There were times when I would go into GNOME Software and check for package updates and be told none were available, even after hitting the manager's refresh button. However, if I opened a terminal and ran "dnf update", the DNF tool would display packages waiting to be upgraded.
Fedora 27 -- Checking for software updates
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Settings
I talked about GNOME's new settings panel in an earlier review and I must say the new layout is growing on me. I like that I can see all the categories while inside a module. This means I don't need to back out of one module to see other available options. I find it odd the GNOME team has hidden some categories inside others, for example we manage user accounts by first going into the Details category and then opening the Users module. Other than this quirk, I quite like the new settings panel; it is visually clean, easy to navigate and responsive.
Fedora 27 -- GNOME's new settings panel
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Conclusions
On the whole there are several things to like about Fedora 27. The operating system was stable during my trial and I like that there are several session options, depending on whether we want to use Wayland or the X display server or even a more traditional-looking version of GNOME. I am happy to see Wayland is coming along to the point where it is close to on par with the X session. There are some corner cases to address, but GNOME on Wayland has improved a lot in the past year.
I like the new LibreOffice feature which lets us sign and verify documents and I like GNOME's new settings panel. These are all small, but notable steps forward for GNOME, LibreOffice and Fedora.
Most of the complaints I had this week had more to do with GNOME specifically than Fedora as an operating system. GNOME on Fedora is sluggish on my systems, both on the desktop computer and in VirtualBox, especially the Wayland session. This surprised me as when I ran GNOME's Wayland session on Ubuntu last month, the desktop performed quite a bit better. Ubuntu's GNOME on Wayland session was smooth and responsive, but Fedora's was too slow for me to use comfortably and I switched over to using the X session for most of my trial.
Two other big differences I felt keenly between Ubuntu and Fedora were with regards to how these two leading projects set up GNOME. On Ubuntu we have a dock that acts as a task switcher, making it a suitable environment for multitasking. Fedora's GNOME has no equivalent. This means Fedora's GNOME is okay for running one or two programs at a time, but I tend to run eight or nine applications at any given moment. This becomes very awkward when using Fedora's default GNOME configuration as it is hard to switch between open windows quickly, at least without installing an extension. In a similar vein, Ubuntu's GNOME has window control buttons and Fedora's version does not, which again adds a few steps to what are usually very simple, quick actions.
What it comes down to is I feel like Ubuntu takes GNOME and turns it into a full featured desktop environment, while Fedora provides us with just plain GNOME which feels more like a framework for a desktop we can then shape with extensions rather than a complete desktop environment. In fact, I think that describes Fedora's approach in general - the distribution feels more like a collection of open source utilities rather than an integrated whole. Earlier I mentioned LibreOffice can work with signed documents, but Fedora has no key manager, meaning we need to find and download one. Fedora ships with Totem, which is a fine video player, but it doesn't work with Wayland, making it an odd default choice. These little gaps or missed connections show up occasionally and it sets the distribution apart from other projects like openSUSE or Linux Mint where there is a stronger sense the pieces of the operating system working together with a unified vision.
The big puzzle for me this week was with software updates. Linux effectively solved updating software and being able to keep running without a pause, reboot or lock-up decades ago. Other mainstream distributions have fast updates - some even have atomic, on-line updates. openSUSE has software snapshots through the file system, Ubuntu has live kernel updates that do away with rebooting entirely and NixOS has atomic, versioned updates via the package manager, to name just three examples. But Fedora has taken a big step backward in making updates require an immediate reboot, and taking an unusually long time to complete the update process, neither of which benefits the user.
Fedora has some interesting features and I like that it showcases new technologies. It's a good place to see what new items are going to be landing in other projects next year. However, Fedora feels more and more like a testing ground for developers and less like a polished experience for people to use as their day-to-day operating system.
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Hardware used in this review
My physical test equipment for this review was a desktop HP Pavilon p6 Series with the following specifications:
- Processor: Dual-core 2.8GHz AMD A4-3420 APU
- Storage: 500GB Hitachi hard drive
- Memory: 6GB of RAM
- Networking: Realtek RTL8111 wired network card
- Display: AMD Radeon HD 6410D video card
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Visitor supplied rating
Fedora has a visitor supplied average rating of: 8.4/10 from 364 review(s).
Have you used Fedora? You can leave your own review of the project on our ratings page.
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| Miscellaneous News (by Jesse Smith) |
Ubuntu running on Samsung phones, Red Hat unveils RHEL for ARM, Parabola continues to provide 32-bit packages
Samsung has been working on a feature called "Linux on Galaxy" which allows a Samsung smart phone to run full featured, Linux desktop distributions. A brief video has been released which shows a docked Android phone run an application which allows Ubuntu to be run in its own window and desktop applications to be run on the Ubuntu desktop. The Liliputing website reports, "In the video, we see someone dock their phone, choose the 'Linux on Galaxy' option from the desktop, and then choose Ubuntu 16.04 LTS. While that's the only option shown, the fact that it does seem to be an option suggests you may be able to run different Linux environments as well. Once Ubuntu is loaded, the video shows a user opening Eclipse, an integrated development environment that's used to create Java (and Android apps). In other words, you can develop apps for Android phones with ARM-based processors on an Android phone with an ARM-based processor." The video and a short write-up can be found in the Liliputing post.
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Red Hat has announced the company has added ARM to the list of CPU architectures supported by Red Hat Enterprise Linux. "Today marks a milestone for Red Hat Enterprise Linux with the addition of a new architecture to our list of fully supported platforms. Red Hat Enterprise Linux for ARM is a part of our multi-architecture strategy and the culmination of a multi-year collaboration with the upstream community and our silicon and hardware partners. The ARM ecosystem has emerged over the last several years with server-optimized SoC (system on chip) products that are designed for cloud and hyperscale, telco and edge computing, as well as high-performance computing applications. ARM SoC designs take advantage of advances in CPU technology, system-level hardware, and packaging to offer additional choices to customers looking for tightly integrated hardware solutions." More information on the ARM build of Red Hat Enterprise Linux 7.4 can be found in the company's release notes.
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Parabola GNU/Linux-libre is an Arch-based Linux distribution built using entirely free software. The Parabola developers have responded to Arch Linux dropping 32-bit packages by declaring Parabola will continue to provide 32-bit options for the distribution's users. A statement published by the Parabola project reads: "As part of our community's heightened interest in platforms amenable to user freedom, Parabola will continue supporting the i686 port for the foreseeable future. The base distro will be based on packages from Arch's unofficial 32-bit port, starting today. Users don't need to do anything to make the transition. Just make sure you are using the latest libre/archlinux32-keyring (required by default since pacman 5.0.2-2.parabola1.1) and upgrade as usual. During the next few days upgrade operations will greet you with warning messages about available downgrades. These are due to the 32-bit port catching up to the state where official Arch left, and can be safely ignored."
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These and other news stories can be found on our Headlines page.
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| Questions and Answers (by Jesse Smith) |
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Cross-distro software ports
Using-the-same-repository-everywhere asks: Is there something working like AUR, but for all distributions?
DistroWatch answers: There are some cross-distribution software repositories, though they tend to be smaller than the larger, distro-specific repositories, like those run by Debian and Arch Linux. The benefit to using a cross-platform, AUR-like repository tends to be having a consistent experience across operating systems rather than a large selection of software.
One small collection of ports which should work on almost all Linux distributions, and some of the BSDs, is the Ravenports repository. Ravenports is still in its early stages and doesn't have many ports, particularly for desktop software, but it promises to provide a consistent cross-operating system experience.
A more mature, and easier to use solution is Nix. The Nix package manager runs on most Linux distributions and provides access to a collection of software which can be run across platforms. Nix is fairly straight forward to use and, apart from a fairly large collection of software, provides some great features like package snapshots and can be used by multiple users on the same system.
Another option is pkgsrc, which provides a ports framework containing over 17,000 packages. While pkgsrc tends to be associated with NetBSD, the ports system is designed to work with Linux, macOS and Illumos.
More recently, Flatpak and Snap repositories have tried to fill the role of cross-platform distribution packages. These portable packages can work on any distribution with the corresponding Flatpak or Snap software installed. Flatpak and Snap are both more focused on providing portable applications with their dependencies bundled rather than offering an AUR-like repository of ports and traditional packages, but they may be the most convenient approach if you want to get new applications installed and running quickly.
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More answers can be found in our Questions and Answers archive.
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| Released Last Week |
VyOS 1.1.8
Daniil Baturin has announced the release of VyOS 1.1.8, an updated version of the Debian-based distribution for firewalls and routers born in 2013 from the ashes of the discontinued Vyatta project: "VyOS 1.1.8 is now available for download. It breaks the semantic versioning convention; while the version number implies a bug-fix-only release, it actually includes a number of new features. This is because 1.2.0 number is already assigned to the Jessie-based release that is still in beta, but not including those features that have been in the code base for a while and a few of them have already been in production for some users would feel quite wrong, especially considering the long delay between the releases. Overall it's pretty close in scope to the original 1.2.0 release plan before Debian Squeeze was EOLed and we had to switch the effort to getting rid of the legacy that was keeping us from moving to a newer base distribution." See the release announcement and the changelog for further information.
Fedora 27
The Fedora team has announced the release of a new version of their cutting edge Linux distribution. The new version, Fedora 27, ships with GNOME 3.26 which features a new settings panel and a more comprehensive search page. The Boxes virtual machine utility now supports shared folders and LibreOffice documents can be signed with OpenPGP keys. "The Workstation edition of Fedora 27 features GNOME 3.26. In the new release, both the Display and Network configuration panels have been updated, along with the overall Settings panel appearance improvement. The system search now shows more results at once, including the system actions. GNOME 3.26 also features color emoji support, folder sharing in Boxes, and numerous improvements in the Builder IDE tool. Many thanks to the GNOME community for their work on these features. For more information refer to the upstream release notes at GNOME 3.26 Release Notes." Further details can be found in the release announcement and in Fedora's release notes. While Fedora's Workstation edition has been released, the Server edition of Fedora 27 is not expected to be launched until January of 2018.
Fedora 27 -- Running GNOME Shell
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Tails 3.3
The Amnesic Incognito Live System (Tails) is a Debian-based live DVD/USB with the goal of providing complete Internet anonymity for the user. The Tails project has released a new update, Tails 3.3. The new version features reduced bandwidth usage via Tor 0.3.1.8, the Tor Browser version 7.0.10 and version 4.13.0 of the Linux kernel. Several bugs have been fixed too: "Fix UEFI support for USB sticks installed using Universal USB Installer. Fix errors on file system creation in Tails Installer when the target USB stick is plugged before starting Tails Installer. Fix Tails Installer on Debian Sid and recent versions of udisks2. Fix the screen reader and screen keyboard in Tor Browser and Thunderbird. Make the configuration of the keyboard layout more robust when starting a session. For more details, read our changelog." More changes and known issues are listed in the project's release announcement.
KaOS 2017.11
KaOS, a rolling KDE/Qt-centric Linux distribution, has been updated to version 2017.11. Besides the very latest Plasma Desktop (version 5.11.3), the new release also introduces Elisa as the default music player: "KaOS is pleased to announce the 2017.11 release. Just days after Plasma 5.11.3, KDE Applications 17.08.3 and Frameworks 5.40.0 where announced, you can already see these in this new release. Highlights of Plasma 5.11.3 include making sure passwords are stored for all users when KWallet is disabled, synchronize XWayland DPI font to Wayland dpi, notifications optionally store missed and expired notifications in a history, the new Plasma Vault offers strong encryption features presented in a user-friendly way, Window title logic has been unified between X and Wayland windows, default X font DPI to 96 on Wayland. All built on Qt 5.9.2. This release introduces Elisa as the default music player. KaOS users have chosen this option during a recent poll. It has been a few years, but the Juk music player is finally ported to KF5, thus available again in the KaOS repositories." Read the rest of the release announcement for more information, screenshots and known issues.
Slax 9.2.1
Following a long absence, the Slax project has returned and the new version, Slax 9.2.1, features several significant changes. Slax no longer uses Slackware as its base, the project is now built using Debian packages. With this migration to Debian, Slax will also adopt the APT package management tools and the systemd init software. "After several years of inactivity Slax project has been brought to life again. For those who did not hear about it yet, Slax is a little distribution of GNU/Linux (in 200MB), which runs on your computer without installing, and makes no changes to it (unless you tell it to do so). This time, Slax uses Debian stretch as its base, and thus it can offer all the wonders of the mighty 'apt' command. If you are missing any software in Slax, use 'apt install SOFTWARENAME' to get it in an instant. I've decided to go for Debian because it made my life much easier and I believe that it will make yours too. Graphical desktop uses Fluxbox window manager and xLunch, which was written especially for Slax and with Slax needs in mind. Furthermore the development of xLunch continues independently." Further information can be found in the project's release announcement.
Slax 9.2.1 -- The default desktop
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GhostBSD 11.1
GhostBSD is an easy to use, FreeBSD-based desktop operating system. The project has released GhostBSD 11.1 which is available in MATE and Xfce flavours. The new version features easy ZFS configuration the Whisker Menu for the Xfce edition, keyboard layout fixes and an independent GhostBSD software repository. "After a year of development, testing, debugging and working on our software package repository, we are pleased to announce the release of GhostBSD 11.1 is now available on 64-bit (amd64) architecture with MATE and Xfce desktop on direct and torrent download. With 11.1 we drop 32-bit i386 support, and we currently maintain our software packages repository for more stability. What's new on GhostBSD 11.1: GhostBSD software repository. Support VMware Workstation Guest Features. New UFS full disk mirroring option on the installer. New UFS full disk MBR and GPT option on the installer. New UFS full disk swap size option on the installer. Whisker Menu as default Application menu on Xfce. All software developed by GhostBSD is now getting updated." Further details can be found in the project's release announcement.
Raspberry Digital Signage 10.0
Raspberry Digital Signage (RDS) is an operating system designed for digital signage installations on the Raspberry Pi. It displays a full-screen browser view restricted to a specified (web) resource. The project has released a new version, Raspberry Digital Signage 10.0, which is based on Raspbian "Stretch". The release announcement reports: "Marco Buratto has released Raspberry Digital Signage 10.0 today, which comes with the latest and greatest Chromium build (featuring advanced HTML5 capabilities, Adobe Flash support and H264/AVC video acceleration), so you can display more attractive resources, more easily. System parameters are set by a web interface which wraps lower terminal commands. SSH and VNC remote management systems are available as well. Changelog for version 10.0: The underlying operating system has been moved to Raspbian Stretch; the overall performance is sensibly better and HTML5 videos play a lot smoother; some improvements on code and bug fixes (the most important ones concern WiFi networks' discovery and local WordPress virtual host, which remains disabled if unused)."
SparkyLinux 4.7
SparkyLinux is a Debian-based distribution which features many editions and different development branches. SparkyLinux's Stable series has received a minor update which brings the installation media up to date with upstream Debian software repositories. The new version is SparkyLinux 4.7, codename "Tyche". "There is an update of SparkyLinux 4.7 'Tyche' out there. This is Sparky edition based on Debian Stable version 9 code name 'Stretch'. No big changes, the new ISO images provide updates of all installed packages, from Debian 'Stretch' and Sparky repositories as of November 17, 2017. Highlights: Linux kernel 4.9.0-4 (4.9.51), Xfce 4.12.3, LXDE 0.99.2, Openbox 3.6.1, Firefox ESR 52.5.0, Thunderbird 52.4.0, Pidgin 2.12.0, HexChat 2.12.4, VLC 2.2.6, DeaDBeeF 0.7.2, LibreOffice 5.2.7, Transmission 2.92, Calamares 3.1.8." More information and upgrade instructions for existing SparkyLinux users can be found in the project's release announcement.
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Development, unannounced and minor bug-fix releases
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| Torrent Corner |
Weekly Torrents
The table below provides a list of torrents DistroWatch is currently seeding. If you do not have a bittorrent client capable of handling the linked files, we suggest installing either the Transmission or KTorrent bittorrent clients.
Archives of our previously seeded torrents may be found in our Torrent Archive. We also maintain a Torrents RSS feed for people who wish to have open source torrents delivered to them. To share your own open source torrents of Linux and BSD projects, please visit our Upload Torrents page.
Torrent Corner statistics:
- Total torrents seeded: 644
- Total data uploaded: 16.5TB
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| Upcoming Releases and Announcements |
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Summary of expected upcoming releases
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| Opinion Poll |
ARM desktops and laptops
Earlier we reported on Red Hat introducing support for running Red Hat Enterprise Linux on ARM-powered computers. ARM is a popular CPU architecture for smart phones and tablets, but has not seen nearly as much adoption on laptops and desktop computers. This week we would like to find out how many of our readers use an ARM-powered workstation or laptop computer.
You can see the results of our previous poll on distributions with multiple editions in last week's edition. All previous poll results can be found in our poll archives.
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ARM desktops and laptops
| I own an ARM-powered desktop/laptop: | 227 (15%) |
| I own multiple ARM-powered desktops/laptops: | 118 (8%) |
| I do not own any ARM-based desktops/laptops: | 1186 (77%) |
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New projects added to database
Daphile
Daphile is a minimal operating system for running a digital audio player on a headless computer. The operating system and media manager can be controlled remotely using a web-based interface.
Daphile 17.09 -- The web interface
(full image size: 513kB, resolution: 1240x1004 pixels)
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Distributions added to waiting list
- Ready Linux. Ready Linux is an Ubuntu-based distribution with a retro look. The default graphical environment features a terminal which resembles the Commodore 64 interface.
- Flint OS. Flint OS is an open source operating system built on Chromium OS. Flint OS has a cloud-oriented approach to providing services and runs on both x86 and ARM powered computers.
- AnemOS GNU/Linux. AnemOS GNU/Linux is a Debian-based distribution for 32-bit x86 computers which features the LXQt desktop environment.
* * * * *
DistroWatch database summary
* * * * *
This concludes this week's issue of DistroWatch Weekly. The next instalment will be published on Monday, 27 November 2017. Past articles and reviews can be found through our Article Search page. To contact the authors please send e-mail to:
- Jesse Smith (feedback, questions and suggestions: distribution reviews/submissions, questions and answers, tips and tricks)
- Ladislav Bodnar (feedback, questions, donations, comments)
- Bruce Patterson (podcast)
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| Reader Comments • Jump to last comment |
1 • Seriously, what's the WHY of "Wayland"? (by OS2_user on 2017-11-20 01:42:24 GMT from United States)
Jesse wrote: "I am happy to see Wayland is coming along to the point where it is close to on par with the X session."
It's not just "Wayland"; I see this as THE KEY QUESTION / PROBLEM in GNU/Linux: many duplicative efforts having no clear advantage over existing, which after years get to point of merely usable.
No doubt has X has many flaws, but one could fix or extend X -- or just be content within its limits. Fracturing the "market" -- particularly with versions that simply don't work with a supplied video player as noted for Fedora above -- is making Linux LESS "ready for the desktop" than ever.
A GUI doesn't have to do much beyond drawing / filling rectangles, a little bit blitting for icons, and figuring out where mouse is, especially for clicks. Again, Windows 3.1 did it in about 4 megabytes, and on wildly varied wacky hardware, unlike now where all are essentially same, vast linear bit planes.
Sure, nearly all of you here like "experimenting", but new isn't what most people want. I wonder how many potential converts you lose just from bad GUI design. -- I converted but the continual needless changes in GUIs, combined with increasingly unreliable operation in every area, topped by the ext4 file system that simply rotted away before my eyes, forced me back to Windows. (BTW: that new WD 3T drive is entirely reliable now...)
2 • Opinion Poll: ARM desktops and laptops (by FT on 2017-11-20 02:12:29 GMT from Singapore)
Does single board computer (SBC) such as Raspberry Pi boards considered as ARM desktops?
If yes, then my poll will be "I own multiple ARM-powered SBC"
3 • ARM processor powered Laptops & Desktop (by ARM O'Stong on 2017-11-20 02:15:59 GMT from Canada)
Microsoft is having a pot-luck party with Qualcomm Snapdragon 835, MS is experimenting Windows 10 with the fastest available 4G-LTE modem, Bluetooth 5 and 802.11ad standard Wi-Fi support. While ASUS, Dell, Lenovo and HP are experimenting with ARM cellular-mobile PCs. Two leading manufacturers in China already have ARM processor powered laptops since long and these are hard to find in North-American and European Consumer Market.
4 • Fedora (by Andy Prough on 2017-11-20 03:27:56 GMT from Asia/Pacific Region)
That's really too bad to read about your bad experience with the Gnome environment on Fedora. Like Ubuntu, I found that openSUSE has a customized Gnome setup that works quite well under both Wayland and Xorg. I've given up on using the Gnome software manager though. It seems worse than useless with the way it gives different updates in openSUSE than what you get with YAST or zypper. I'm afraid it will break the system if I try to use it for updates or for installing new packages, as it does not seem intelligently designed enough to deal with dependencies reliably.
Also surprising to see the high memory usage with XFCE.
5 • Wayland is good (by M.Z. on 2017-11-20 03:32:04 GMT from United States)
@1
'It's not just "Wayland"; I see this as THE KEY QUESTION / PROBLEM in GNU/Linux: many duplicative efforts having no clear advantage over existing,"
There are a multitude of reasons why X is being replaced with Wayland, & yes the eventual goal is total replacement. The thing about X is that it is old, insecure, & filled with many now useless features & according to the people from X who started Wayland, it needs to be replaced. I don't know all the technical details, but from the research I've done Wayland is a greatly simplified way to do the best of what X should be doing & in some ways is doing right now. It does it far more securely, with more accuracy, and it has a simplified code base that should be far more maintainable & easier for new people to work on. All this while being backward compatible & allowing X to be used as needed.
Also, FYI, the main duplication of effort was the way that the Ubuntu project was creating this thing called Mir that was supposed to be the same basic thing as Wayland. This effort has basically been suspended in all but some edge cases where I understand Mir is actually being used in conjunction with Wayland, rather than as an alternative to it. So actually give what happened with the real duplication of effort, you seen to just be complaining about something old being replaced by something newer & simpler.
"A GUI doesn't have to do much beyond drawing / filling rectangles..."
And yet, you seem to be arguing that we should all stick to the old Rube Goldberg machine that is X simply because it is there & working now regardless of how bad it actually is. This contradiction makes me think you have no clue what is actually going on.
6 • Vastly different results from Fedora 27 for me (by Brenton Horne on 2017-11-20 04:01:55 GMT from Australia)
Fedora's GNOME on Wayland session seems to work better for me. Totem runs fine on Wayland (if relevant my graphics card is a NVIDIA one), although yes the video codecs GNOME Software comes up with when Totem can't play a video are numerous and have unhelpful descriptions. The only app I found that didn't run on Wayland was Plank (the dock program from Pantheon). There's no need to reboot after upgrades when you upgrade with DNF from the command-line.
The only thing I really hate about Fedora is how sensitive it is. If I chroot into it from another system (and yes I do mount up the dev, sys and proc file systems before doing this, the same way I do for Gentoo based on the Gentoo Handbook) and run `dnf update` or `dnf install broadcom-wl` (from RPMFusion non-free repo), which I do as I can't connect to the WiFi on a fresh F27 install due to my Broadcom chip, several systemd services fail on boot, preventing GNOME and agetty TTY terminals from starting. Likewise if I manually compile software and install to /usr/local, even on a running system (as opposed to in a chroot), I get the same systemd issues. If I move files around, even in the /home folder, from another system (e.g. in a chroot) I also find the system fails to boot, although oddly no systemd services I can see fail.
7 • Fedora 27 (by linuxista on 2017-11-20 04:37:34 GMT from United States)
Spent a few days last week installing fedora 27 as my secondary OS. I'm very, very impressed. Suse Tumbleweed only lasted 4 months before I couldn't wait to pave over it. I have a feeling Fedora, as long as the upgrade path is stable, i.e. to 28, 29, etc., is going to be on my machine a long time. I'm very partial to rolling --Arch has been my primary for many years-- but if Arch users are looking for a point release distro, for me at least, Fedora feels right in a number of ways.
CLI pkg mgmt (dnf) is excellent. Std install is streamlined, not bloaty (looking at you Tumbleweed). Tinkering is straightforward and responds predictably to intervention, i.e. not full of patches (ubuntu) or intermediate distro specific tools (like yast).
On the downside, COPR is pretty dismal compared to the AUR, but I got almost everything I wanted in regular repos + rpmfusion. Documentation is not great. If only Red Hat would lose that paywall.
As per Jesse's review. Gnome+Wayland on Fedora is working just fine for me. Same as on Arch. The focus on the Ubuntu dock seems pretty superficial, like choosing to buy one car over another because of the color paint or the hubcaps. There are a number of excellent extensions that do whatever the Ubuntu dock does and more that are super easily obtainable. To me doesn't seem like a valid basis for choosing one over another.
8 • @ #1 (by dennis flener on 2017-11-20 06:38:22 GMT from United States)
You said it all. Why make it more confusiing that it needs to be? The average desktop user (Are there any left] does not give a damn about xorg vs wayland or systmd vs init.d. Why not make it unified for the sake of the few desktop users still hanging on to the dinasour dream? Linux will never {probably not] overtake Windows on the desktop, and forget about smartphones or tablets. Desktops computing is the only place where Linux (might) succeed, but the diversity is definately a drawback...sorry for the rant of a non geek?
9 • ARM (by zukoda on 2017-11-20 07:21:52 GMT from United Kingdom)
I own two ARM "powered" pink pogoplugs running debian Jessie (kirkwood) as low power consumption nameservers usb camera points and USB backup devices. They have 4 USB2.0 ports and I use ssh -X ..... as access via 100MBit ethernet,
10 • Fedora (by silent on 2017-11-20 10:48:17 GMT from France)
Fedora generally does not require restart after upgrade. It is more like a feature of Gnome Software setup in Fedora. The other graphical frontend, dnfdragora-gui is also freezing and locking dnf. It is written in python3 and I wonder how it could pass the otherwise strict Fedora QA tests. Unfortunately, the development of yumex-dnf has apparently stopped. The good news is though that dnf on the CLI is fast and reliable. A GUI package manager is probably more more important for distributions that target beginners, like Mint.
Gnome is probably feeling slow not only because of dnfdragora-update, but also due to a rather richly selected default of autostarted processes that may use up lots of resources. Mate was also slow before stopping most of those.
For me Fedora 27 is a good release with a very nice wallpaper. The only real inconvenience for a home workstation is the rather short support period. The purist FOSS approach can be easily circumvented by RPMfusion.
11 • Desktop (by jymm on 2017-11-20 11:25:49 GMT from United States)
Dinosaur here, still use the Linux desktop. Pretty causal user though, and you are right I really don't care about xorg vs wayland or systmd vs init.d. I just care more that my OS works.
12 • Linux desktop (by MikeOh Shark on 2017-11-20 13:03:01 GMT from Netherlands)
Surprised to see a few people show love for the Windows way of forcing their "unified" because it's the only choice way. I won't go back to Windows. Privacy, security, stability, easy updates, easy backups, hardware portable OS, easier finding and installing applications for just about any task...
By the way, is it just my unreasonable browser settings or has Distrowatch been a little harder to load lately? (dns or other issue?)
13 • You Don't Need To Update Like Gnome Wants You To Update (by buzzrobot on 2017-11-20 13:19:41 GMT from United States)
Occam's razor says the slowness Jessie complains about re: Fedora updating is down to a slow mirror and/or slow connection. IT's not necessary to use it and it can be disabled.
The forced reboot is part of Gnome. It's how that project wants updating via Gnome Software to work. There do remain times when we should reboot. While many users will, at least, *think* they know when they should reboot and when they should not, many are also probably wrong.
Ubuntu ships Gnome with a few standard Gnome Shell extensions pre-installed. One is a stripped version of Dash To Dock that provides the Unity-like dock. A user can install Dash-To-Dock on Fedora and configure it similarly. (And any user who knows when or when not to reboot after an update can be expected to know how to install a Gnome extension.)
The point about stock Gnome Shell usability is on target. it is, in fact, more usable via the keyboard than via mouse. I suspect this is down to developer-led Linux design by developers who spend their time pecking away on laptops.
14 • There's always a reason (by Christian on 2017-11-20 13:56:23 GMT from Brazil)
I believe that there's a reason to put so much effort in Wayland and replacing X. We should not trash all this work without understanding all the reasons behind it.
Yes, I'm a casual user, and although I do only have Linux Distros on my computer, I'm not shy to use closed source software if it performs better. I do mind having the choice.
And all this "duplicated" effort in Linux is what gives us choice. Dont't like Wayland? There's something for you. Don't like systemd? There's something for you. Don't want to worry with what's going on in your computer and want something that just works with a few mouse clicks? There's something for you.
Windows and Macs may do lots of things really well, but in my opinion, is with Linux that for me my computer gives me what I want the most: to be in control and to have choices.
I've been a Fedora user in the past, and although today I rather have a more "stable" experience, I do appreciate that they working to bring new technologies to Linux. So there you go, if you don't like, you can go with something else, anytime.
15 • Cross-distro Package Manager (by MaxP on 2017-11-20 14:10:18 GMT from Germany)
The XBPS package manager (most famous from the Void linux project) is also very easy to integrate into other distributions, it is worth to mention.
You then have access to a large collection of package templates which you can then (cross-)compile for on alot of different architectures:
mips, armv6, armv7, aarch64, i686, x86_64
https://github.com/voidlinux/void-packages#using-xbps-src-in-a-foreign-linux-distribution
16 • Dash to Dock (by Luke on 2017-11-20 14:17:23 GMT from United States)
I'm on RHEL 7 at work and Ubuntu 17.10 at home. The key to making GNOME 3 more intuitive, and what Ubuntu does by default, is making the dash (which only appears in the "overview" mode) act like a dock (which is either always there or accessible by moving the mouse to that side of the screen. The most popular GNOME Shell Extension to do this is the aptly named "Dash to Dock."
There are several other tweaks I like (focus follows mouse without autoraise, Applications dropdown menu in place of that Activities button, no "hot corner", dark theme, etc.), all accessible through the also aptly named GNOME Tweak Tool. Basically, installing that should always be the first step when using any GNOME 3-based distro.
17 • Fedora (by Jordan on 2017-11-20 14:25:08 GMT from United States)
"Fedora feels more and more like a testing ground for developers and less like a polished experience for people to use as their day-to-day operating system. "
They say they're something else:
"Fedora Workstation is a polished, easy to use operating system for laptop and desktop computers, with a complete set of tools for developers and makers of all kinds."
My experience with it is pretty close to that quoted remark of Jesse, though. The differences between what the distro feels like to a desktop user and what it purports to be are only important if the user can remedy the issues and create the experience they need. Most distros out there really do have provisions for that, including Fedora.
I just don't like seeing that difference. But it's across many distros.
18 • re: 1 Seriously, what's the WHY (by Morton on 2017-11-20 14:29:52 GMT from Ukraine)
is #1 an another attempt to reason with clever arguments on the agenda how bad the GNU/Linux is in general? In real life: I'm just after setting up a new lucky first-time Linux user on the newly installed Linux Mint OS. The guy spent a ridiculous amount of time trying to fix network problem on Windows 7 & 8.1, reading thousands of posts with everyone pretty much describing the same thing in different ways. It took 30 minutes to make him happy. No problems with drivers, software and hardware compatability at all.
19 • Memory hogs in comparison - Fedora, Ubuntu, GNOME vs. Debian/KDE (by Dojnow on 2017-11-20 14:35:29 GMT from Bulgaria)
- Fedora: "The GNOME on Wayland session required about 960MB and GNOME on Xorg required 930MB. A fresh install ... took up about 5GB of disk space.";
- Ubuntu: "the distribution tended to use about 790MB to 830MB of RAM and a fresh install took up about 4.6GB of hard drive space." http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20171030#ubuntu ;
- Debian (64b, sid)/KDE: 281 to 297 MB and ~1.76 GB.
20 • Gnome and Wayland... (by lenn on 2017-11-20 14:52:06 GMT from United States)
Maybe, you guys would like to check Guntu? https://sourceforge.net/projects/guntu/
21 • hail Caesar (by lupus on 2017-11-20 15:22:43 GMT from Germany)
I´m, right now, so fed up with this dumb argument of quadruplicated efforts by stretching thin instead of working together to enhance Linux more efficiently, all hail to the big leader.
I think whoever got this Idea in his head hasn´t understood that we are only here at this very special moment in time where it is absolutely possible to run even a completely libre OS on your hardware because of enthusiasts that work for little to no money just to make their and your experience with the OS of their choice better.
Is some effort wasted? You bet´ya!
Is everything better in FOSS world? No it ain´t.
But if you are of the opinion expressed above your statements are just plain wrong from the start. You would do us and yourself a favor of keeping it to yourself cause it´s wrong and stubborn repetition doesn´t make it right. If I had a saying in this, here is the leader you may want to follow, I´d ban all those comments and the commentators for life except they come to their senses and openly regret their mistakes.
just 2 cents not even mine
22 • ARM desktops and laptops (by HM on 2017-11-20 15:33:58 GMT from Germany)
I'm using Arch Linux ARM on my Raspberry Pi 2.
Doing a pacman -Syu every week or so.
Three years and running, never had any problems,
23 • cross-distribution packaging (by dogma on 2017-11-20 15:35:25 GMT from United States)
In some ways this can be good, but some of these efforts are likely to be for the purpose of further gaining control of the direction and center of mass of linux.
24 • ARM powered desktop/laptop (by Sam Crawford on 2017-11-20 16:04:15 GMT from United States)
Only if you count my iPad.
25 • SUSE Tumbleweed / File Systems / Fedora RAM Usage (by Winchester on 2017-11-20 16:34:28 GMT from United States)
Regarding Post # 7 :
You don't really need to use YAST for software management in OpenSUSE Tumbleweed (probably not needed for that purpose in Leap either). They have "zypper" for use from the command line. "sudo zypper refresh" , "sudo zypper update" , "sudo zypper install package name" , "sudo zypper dist-upgrade".
Tumbleweed is one of the most reliable rolling distributions out there as far as providing new packages yet avoiding breakage so long as you don't involve the "Packman" repository.
I did not find the installation to be "bloated". They allow you to select or to deselect groups of software. The official installation media offers only KDE , Gnome , XFCE , and LXDE but,others are available after installation .... such as LXQt , KDE 3 , Enlightenment etc. .
The only problem with the installation in SUSE is that it tends to install GRUB into the MBR even if you tell it to install GRUB into only the root partition. Another problem for many is that SUSE uses systemD. PCmanFM QT is broken in the current version. Other than that,I find it to be a very functional distribution using LXQt. Better than Fedora,in my opinion.
Regarding post # 1 :
There are more file systems than ext4 available in Linux. Btrfs , EXT3 , ReiserFS etc. Other than that,some valid points this time. Although,I have found Windows to be the king of "unreliable operation".
Regarding post # 19 :
I have always found Fedora to be high on RAM usage in comparison charts .... desktop GUI to desktop GUI .... compared to most other distributions. Except for maybe LXDE or LXQt. Gnome under Fedora has always been on the high side from what I have read.
Anyway,personally,I am not a big Gnome user. I have PALDO on a partition but,I boot into it much less often than the other distributions,manly because of the Gnome GUI. I have it there mainly for the sake of variety.
I find it much easier to get things accomplished under LXQt or XFCE. All I need is a simple panel with an applications / system menu and maybe a quick launch dock such as Plank or Wbar or even a second panel modified into a quick launch dock.
I find it puzzling that people rely on bloated feeling environments such as Gnome 3. Maybe it would be alright after modification with high spec hardware but,what is the real advantage of it versus LXQt or XFCE??
There are some good Gnome applications despite the Gnome GUI. File Roller,Nautilus with bookmarks. Some media software. They can be run under other environments,though.
26 • none (by Tim Dowd on 2017-11-20 17:07:38 GMT from United States)
@1
I don't think we lose any converts due to bad GUI design. The desktops in most of the distributions used by new Linux users are great and have been for a long time. Most computer literate adults can pick up a Linux computer (or MacOSX or Windows 10 computer) for the first time and have no trouble using it.
You have to remember the point of Fedora IS to reinvent the wheel. That's why it exists. It's where new technology (that's being developed to solve real problems) gets released into the wild for the first time, and its users want it for that reason. When the usability issues for Wayland decrease to the point where its better than what we've got (which has been happening really rapidly) then other distros will pick up the cause. It's a pain in the neck that bugs show up in such a distro but finding them is the point of the distro existing!
As for the comment about the Linux marketplace being fractured, I don't see this at all. If you're a new user to Linux, you're probably going to find Mint or Ubuntu first, and those are both OK places to start. As your preferences develop, you then have many choices and get to pick a distro that fits your personality. That's a positive, not a negative.
27 • re: #8 and Linux Success (by Peter Besenbruch on 2017-11-20 18:31:06 GMT from United States)
"The average desktop user (Are there any left] does not give a damn about xorg vs wayland or systmd vs init.d."
I do give a damn, and what I care about is whether or not the system works. With Wayland, it doesn't, at least not yet, not with the consistency I want. Then again, Fedora isn't the distribution you want to run if you crave stability and consistency. Yes you can use it, but it sure pays to know its ins and outs. What do you get in return? You get to try some of the most recent developments in Linux. If that's your thing, Fedora is a good choice.
"Why not make it unified for the sake of the few desktop users still hanging on to the dinasour dream? Linux will never {probably not] overtake Windows on the desktop, and forget about smartphones or tablets."
I got away from Windows to escape Microsoft's imposed "unity." I don't mind using Systemd if I have to, but I have never liked Gnome in any form. I have never liked bloat, either. So I use a very non-bloated XFCE system on Debian as my default desktop. You probably don't.
I don't use a smart phone, but other family members do. Some of them are called Android phones. Android runs on top of the Linux kernel. Android, of course, is a complete failure. Windows is totally dominant on smart phones.
"Desktops computing is the only place where Linux (might) succeed, but the diversity is definitely a drawback...sorry for the rant of a non geek?"
I have had zero formal training in computers, and don't qualify as a geek, either, yet I also run something called "servers." Linux has failed spectacularly here, too. One of my systems is a basic Samba file server. Another is a VPN I put together (using Debian), and which is hosted in the cloud. I use SSH to manage it. My house also uses a router. It, too, runs Linux. It has a pretty good Web interface, yet I confess I have used SSH to poke around there, too.
In the fifteen years I have tried to work with Linux, I have gotten to know what I like. It's probably not what you like. That's what diversity is all about.
28 • Switching between multiple applications in Fedora GNOME (by Scott Dowdle on 2017-11-20 18:45:58 GMT from United States)
Just hit ALT-TAB.
29 • Wayland and gnome 3 (by a on 2017-11-20 19:05:29 GMT from France)
I agree that wayland and gnome 3 are just breaking things and pushing people away from Linux instead of solving real problems.
30 • @29 Gnome 3 and Wayland (by OstroL on 2017-11-20 19:41:44 GMT from Poland)
"I agree that wayland and gnome 3 are just breaking things and pushing people away from Linux instead of solving real problems."
I suppose, you are right. I think, Gnome 3 and Wayland would be the Nemesis of Ubuntu and Cannonical.
31 • Fedora with Cinnamon Vs Gnome (by M.Z. on 2017-11-20 20:18:35 GMT from United States)
@10 & @13
"Fedora generally does not require restart after upgrade. It is more like a feature of Gnome Software setup in Fedora."
This is exactly what I've found with Fedora 26 Cinnamon. I played with an earlier Gnome based version in a VM & had the same exact restart situation described in the review; however, there is no need to restart in Fedora Cinnamon. I believe that there was also a similar situation with Fedora XFCE.
@10
"The other graphical frontend, dnfdragora-gui is also freezing and locking dnf."
I find that a bit odd, I've mostly been using the CLI for updates on my main desktop with Fedora Cinnamon; however, what I have used of dnfDragora seems far more stable & reliable than older versions of Fedora XFCE with Yumex GUI which had constant problems installing updates that didn't exist on the command line. In fact I'd say that Mageia's new dnfDragroa was very reliable compared to yumex GUI & thought it was a great new feature when I first encountered it.
@16
"...all accessible through the also aptly named GNOME Tweak Tool. Basically, installing that should always be the first step when using any GNOME 3-based distro."
See that's basically where many Gnome 3 users lose me completely. Why not just design a desktop with sane defaults that most users want at the start? Also, why not include the configuration options that most users want, & have them ready in the default configuration? To me these things are signals that Gnome does not want to make the sort of desktop that I want. The Gnome folks seem to be more concerned with building something different with a new brand identity than they are concerned with what most of their potential users actually want. Unfortunately I think anything else is a better choice for most users.
32 • @11 (by hwms on 2017-11-20 21:41:07 GMT from United States)
I am the same. Don't know what ARM is and how it relates to anything. I just want a distro that works.
33 • @25 (by hwms on 2017-11-20 21:45:34 GMT from United States)
I have found Tumbleweed to be, for me, the most stable KDE5 distro. I ran PCLOS for years and still have it installed but OpenSuse Tumbleweed is my daily goto distro.
34 • @31: (by dragonmouth on 2017-11-20 21:53:49 GMT from United States)
"Why not just design a desktop with sane defaults that most users want at the start? Also, why not include the configuration options that most users want, & have them ready in the default configuration? "
Because many developers arrogantly think they know best what the users want. They think that THEIR version (or vision) of Linux is the Next Greatest Thing Since Sliced Bread.
35 • re: 1 Seriously, what's the WHY (by Morton on 2017-11-20 22:16:52 GMT from Ukraine)
is #1 an another attempt to reason with clever arguments on the agenda how bad the GNU/Linux is in general? In real life: I'm just after setting up a new lucky first-time Linux user on the newly installed Linux Mint OS. The guy spent a ridiculous amount of time trying to fix network problem on Windows 7 & 8.1, reading thousands of posts with everyone pretty much describing the same thing in different ways. It took 30 minutes to make him happy. No problems with drivers, software and hardware compatability at all.
36 • @8 Dennis (by Johnathan on 2017-11-20 22:30:04 GMT from Netherlands)
"forget about smartphones or tablets. Desktops computing is the only place where Linux (might) succeed"
You do realize that smartphone OS world is _dominated_ by the Linux-based Android, don't you? (See e.g. https://www.idc.com/promo/smartphone-market-share/os, or any other source on the topic.) Epic fail...
37 • Fedora @31 (by silent on 2017-11-21 10:58:42 GMT from France)
Dnfdragora is using dnf, so the results are reliable, I guess. I think that dnfdragora-gui should not immediately launch a repoquery on startup or any user entry.The user should be allowed to select multiple criteria, and then push the "Search" (Query, etc.) button. It also appeared to me that during the repoquery the GUI was unresponsive or frozen, I mean other package managers display some messages and a progress bar, and the query can be interrupted. Sometimes probably dnfdragora-update is locking dnf and that causes GUI problems as well.This is probably just a childhood disease, but it was disturbing. A faster internet connection certainly means less waiting. I only have 1MB/s at the moment. I presume that at 100MB/s everything looks fine. Dnf is working well on the CLI.
38 • failing the users (by Jason on 2017-11-21 15:22:46 GMT from United States)
Reading this review, it feels like Linux projects have really failed the user while in their pursuit of pet projects. I've tried to have as little to do with them as possible, using Xubuntu, but even then I have to manually restart many system components, such as the mouse, audio, and networking. Linux frankly felt friendlier in the 90's, even when slackware needed me to manually enter my monitor specs. The reason being was that was a clearly listed process you and the developers were overcoming together. But for a while now, it feels like users and developers are fighting each other, and your best bet is someone who has re-spun some other stock distribution in order to be readily usable, Mint being the prime example of success in this.
39 • @25 Tumbleweed (by linuxista on 2017-11-21 15:40:56 GMT from United States)
>Tumbleweed is one of the most reliable rolling distributions out there as far as providing new packages yet avoiding breakage so long as you don't involve the "Packman" repository.
Not in my experience. Not at all. I had it configured exactly as my Arch setup, and in every case Tumbleweed fell down while Arch was smooth. Whether the upgrade to NetworkManager 1.8, gnome extensions not working correctly, various other things, but the straw that broke the camel's back was the upgrade to Gnome 3.26. Tumbleweed was first out of the gate, but full of serious scaling screw-ups on my 4k display. Arch's upgrade came 2 weeks later, and was perfect. A month later and a couple of iterative upgrades, and Suse was still screwed up. Enter Fedora. So much better in so many ways, regarding smooth, unified user experience, fit and finish and general sensibility of the underlying OS vs. the kludgy assemblage of tools that Suse struck me as. Didn't expect to find such a world of difference b/t rpm distros. But Fedora outshines Suse by a mile in my experience. If the upgrade path to 28, 29, etc. is smooth, Fedora is a huge keeper.
40 • Fedora Memory Usage, Duplicated Efforts (by Jim on 2017-11-21 16:30:04 GMT from United States)
@19:
I noticed that, too. Where the heck is all that memory going? My Mac at work does the same thing. I regularly end up swapping even with 16GB internal memory. I can't explain for the life of me (other than "bloat") why terminal windows and status icons taken 100-200MB apiece (see the Activity Monitor). Don't get me started on the "normal" apps or why the kernel needs more memory than the "bloated" GNOME3 desktop on Fedora (currently at 1.45GB).
@1, 21, others:
Wasted effort exists everywhere. It's part of life. Anyone who has worked in a large company (software development or not) sees a ton of waste, duplicate efforts, completing efforts for resources, etc. The difference between those large companies (MS, Apple, others) and FOSS is that we can see into the inner-workings of FOSS. Those other big names are much the same if not worse.
41 • Fedora 27 software updates (by Jesse on 2017-11-21 16:30:17 GMT from Canada)
>> "Fedora generally does not require restart after upgrade. It is more like a feature of Gnome Software setup in Fedora. "
This is not really accurate. If you use the default software manage (GNOME Software) then updates always require a restart. For end users to not need to restart to get updates they would need to both ignore the graphical software updater (and its notifications) and go out of their way to use an alternative package manager like the command line DNF utility. This is technically possible, but definitely not typical.
Also, I'd like to point out Ubuntu also uses GNOME Software as the default package manager, but uses a different utility to handle updates. On Ubuntu when you open GNOME Software there are never updates listed (at least I've never been able to make GNOME Software on Ubuntu show me available updates, even after using the distro for a month). On Ubuntu, when updates are available a dedicated update manager window appears, lets the user select which updates they want and installs them without requiring a reboot.
Since Fedora does require a reboot and Ubuntu does not, even though they both use GNOME Software as the default software manager, I think it's safe to call the forced reboot strictly a Fedora issue.
42 • fedora memory usage (by mandog on 2017-11-21 16:51:35 GMT from Peru)
1.45gb I pressume at start-up that is 1gb more than Gnome3 on my Arch setup what is fedora starting at boot time, or what is Arch doing right at start-up to be down in the 450mb 64bt+nividia non free drivers at startup.
But then Ubuntu Fedora was allways bloated, as is Manjaro but not that bloated.
Guys you want to choose distros more carefully or learn how to disable services you really don't need.
Even KDE only uses 450mb on my arch install
43 • failing the user (by Tim Dowd on 2017-11-21 17:09:39 GMT from United States)
@38
Try using Ubuntu MATE 17.10 for a week and tell me that Linux projects have "failed the user." Anyone can have a well configured, working system in about 20 minutes, where software to do just about any task with a computer is available to them for no cost. No proprietary operating system can offer that. What you're accusing Linux developers of ignoring is something that we actually already have.
Again, Fedora is not working on "pet projects." It's working on the future. It's a distro for people who want to be part of developing the technology that runs the next generation of computers. It's NOT the distro to run if that's not what you're interested in. But it's not fair to criticize them for doing their work. It would be the equivalent of telling Einstein "what do you need to do all this modern physics stuff for? We already have Newton, it just works, so stop making it too complicated." The point is that what works great for simple problems in the past might not be up to the challenges of the future, so we have to continue to push the envelope.
In short: the diversity of the open source world is a strength, not a problem. If you just want something that works, go get one of the many distros that just work and be grateful someone gave them to you. But don't criticize developers for trying to move the effort forward just because this forward motion doesn't currently affect you. It just might someday.
44 • Failing the users, some more (by TheTKS on 2017-11-21 17:15:26 GMT from United States)
@38 Having distrohopped and internetted to fix problems with many distros for almost a year has led me to believe some problems with *nix distros are very specific to that edition of that distro, with that collection of packages & utilities, on that hardware. (Same goes for Windows, by the way. Being amateur IT for family, I see that what should be the same edition of Win 8.1 or 10 can behave differently, and sometimes very badly, on different machines. Linux hasn't been worse than Windows in general, and on one machine, much better.)
You have problems with Xubuntu that I don't run into, I have a couple you didn't mention. For all I know (the impression I get), with Xubuntu other people may have other problems and worse, some people only minor and easily fixed ones.
Have Linux projects failed their users? Users are so varied, nobody can possibly speak for all of them. With *nix I've found you've got to try at least a few out to find which work(s) best for you, and chances are high if that you will find one that mostly does what you want to do, the way you want to do it. Unless you just have to have your OS the way MS or Apple or Android set it up for you, or your hardware just isn't going to operate well on a *nix.
Of course fixes and improvements are needed and desired by users. Send suggestions. If you donate to a project you like enough, write in what you would specifically like fixed or improved.
Now for a possibly related question to other commenters: is it possible to install an OS that boots up and at least sort of works, when the downloaded iso's hash doesn't match the published one, and not because of file tampering but because of a download hiccough? One of my download's had a non-matching hash, but I didn't even try to install. And if it's theoretically possible, has anyone ever seen it happen?
45 • My armhf laptop (by K.U. on 2017-11-21 17:30:44 GMT from Finland)
A few years ago there was plenty of cheap Linux-capable available in eBay. I bought one similar to this one:
https://www.cnx-software.com/2012/08/02/allwinner-a10-based-h6-android-4-0-netbook-sells-for-140/
Linux distributions can be easily installed on it (on external SD-card) using BerryBoot Android app. I have currently DietPi installed in that way and it works OK.
Links:
*BerryBoot A10: http://www.berryterminal.com/doku.php/berryboot_a10
*DietPi for BerryBoot is available here: https://berryboot.alexgoldcheidt.com/images/
46 • @38 mismatch hatch (by pengxuin on 2017-11-21 19:32:16 GMT from New Zealand)
if you torrented the .iso. the hash should be automatically checked.
It is possible that the published hash is incorrect, only the publisher will really know.
If there is a sudden rise in queries regarding the published hash, you can be pretty sure the publisher will investigate and or republish the hash.
"One of my download's had a non-matching hash, but I didn't even try to install. And if it's theoretically possible, has anyone ever seen it happen"
if you have a virtual-box setup, you can try for yourself. if the .iso wont boot you have just wasted 2 minutes of your time.
if it does boot, you have an experiment to run ;-)
47 • @42 (by Jim on 2017-11-21 21:02:37 GMT from United States)
The 1.45GB is the current kernel_task memory on my Macbook, not memory usage in Fedora. I was comparing it to the almost 1GB Jesse reported. I agree with you wholeheartily to carefully select distributions. I wouldn't use OSX if I didn't have to for work.
48 • @46 mismatch hash (by TheTKS on 2017-11-21 21:41:05 GMT from United States)
Your suggestion to try it in a virtual box could be fun, if I ever run into this again.
Good point to check for sudden rise in queries re published hash.
My post was already too long, so I left a couple of things out to get to my question faster.
In my case, the downloaded fiIesize was also significantly smaller, so it was obvious there was a download problem. Redownloaded, got matching file sizes and matching hashes.
To address one part of if "the published hash is incorrect, only the publisher will really know", I compared filesizes and hashes at a few mirrors. All were equal.
I know that's not a guarantee that the iso is untainted and the hash matching the tainted file hasn't been replaced in all locations - but if not all iso filesizes and hashes on several sources match, that is a guarantee that there is some problem. Since some (all?) mirrors lag or fake mirrors with tainted iso's could be online (as happened for a day or so to a prominent distro last year), this would be a way to avoid that.
I guess there is a more secure way to download, but it's still on my list to learn how to do that, and how and why it's more secure. I don't know if torrenting is any more secure than the steps I laid out above - but once set up, I guess it would be less manual. Still learning.
49 • Linux over by the time. (by Lee X Noo on 2017-11-22 05:52:09 GMT from Canada)
Over by three decades, linux has traveled a very long way so far.
Over by three decades, lots of things are changed.
Most of the varieties of distro you see today can be traced back to Debian or Slackware (SlackO). Under the hood apt (debian), rpm (RedHat), yast (SuSe) are the same, just different T-shirt.
Prior to 2009, developers goal was different that today. Somewhere in 2009 developers goal was mixed with other objectives too where as Debian, RedHat, or SuSE failed to sustain as a good ones anymore. Where as other derivatives derived from these three comes with additional ingredients. There are bunch of developers are busy-busy in bundling binary blobs in to kernel to hog the memory, over by time just kernel source went up from 1 MB to almost 650 MB. Where are other group is busy-busy in removing binary blobs.
Feel yourself luck one, if you really find a distro that works for you.
Good Luck!
50 • Post # 39 .... SUSE Tumbleweed (by Post # 39 on 2017-11-22 05:55:07 GMT from United States)
The problems described in post # 39 all seem to involve the Gnome edition of Tumbleweed.
I have had SUSE Tumbleweed with LXQt installed for about a year now and have not experienced any problems after disabling the Packman repository .... other than PCmanFM-Qt not launching in its latest version. (This is also happening in another distribution though,to be fair.)
Fit and finish are not the first two words which pop into my mind when dealing with Gnome 3 in any distribution which I have used so far. Furthermore,the tools in the operating system (using LXQT) are mostly assembled in a simple,easy to access,streamlined menu .... broken down by category. All easily launched with a couple of clicks. Boots up in no time these days. I am not a huge systemD supporter but,otherwise,Tumbleweed suits my needs very well.
I don't have a 4k computer monitor but,I have found PClinuxOS to be my go-to for video related tasks. For the most part though,I deal with high resolution video using home theater equipment.
51 • @50 Tumbleweed (by linuxista on 2017-11-22 06:13:46 GMT from United States)
Fit and finish in Arch and Fedora are excellent. At least far superior to Tumbleweed. Nice attempt at burying the differences. For a lot of people Gnome is quite relevant, and it's the default and promoted by Tumbleweed that it gets the newest Gnome first. Too bad it's a mess.
Network Manager is not to Gnome. Another nice try. Sorry to present a case that's creating cognitive dissonance. But the accumulation of paper cuts and general kludginess of the user experience made me quite annoyed with it by the end.
Furthermore, to say that Tumbleweed is stable as long as you don't use the extensive packman repo with all the free/non-free audio/video apps is completely unreasonable for the vast majority of typical desktop users. That was a whole other can of worms. Among other issues, one of the package conflicts forced me to uninstall conky and the conflict wasn't resolved for a full month.
52 • @50 Tumbleweed typo (by linuxista on 2017-11-22 06:15:57 GMT from United States)
2nd paragraph should say: Network Manager is not EXCLUSIVE to Gnome. (bad markdown attempt)
53 • ARM Desktops (by Eamon Morgan on 2017-11-22 06:58:51 GMT from Slovakia)
My only PC is a Raspberry Pi 3 running retropie / kodi & xfce desktop from an SSD. It outperforms most windows 10 computers for most usual daily tasks.
54 • Post # 51 (by Winchester on 2017-11-22 10:10:50 GMT from United States)
I am not "burying" any differences. I am saying as clearly as I can at this point that they (the differences that you point out) are not there using OpenSUSE Tumbleweed with LXQt.
That's completely regardless of any promotion or regardless of any default .... neither of which have any bearing on the operation of Tumbleweed under LXQt. I don't believe that Gnome is actually the default for OpenSUSE. The installation media gives you four choices. The official download page offers both KDE and Gnome.
I have never had a single problem with my network connection while using the distribution on my desktop computer. Maybe that's because I use a wired connection. I don't know but,I do know that the distribution works perfectly fine for my set-up and I have always been able to access the internet.
Also,I don't understand your vague references to "fit and finish". Look and feel maybe?? Like I said,I prefer a good looking functional panel with an applications / system menu. Maybe a couple of applets such as a clock etc. . Maybe a quick launch bar or secondary panel. Right-clicking on an empty area of the desktop as an additional,optional way to launch software. That's it. That is my idea of good "fit and finish". Apparently,other people prefer something different for whatever reason.
55 • @54 Tumbleweed (by linuxista on 2017-11-22 14:33:05 GMT from United States)
The whole reason I tried Tumbleweed in the first place was because of the very same theoretical argument you make: that Tumbleweed, with OpenQA, should be the most stable rolling release. Turns out, it's a nice sales pitch, but in real life it was buggy and problematic. To contrast exact same setup with Arch and Solus has been polished, stable and uneventful. Go ahead and keep using it if you like it. For me, my time with Suse completely satisfied my curiosity about their offering and claims. Color me unimpressed. I won't be going that direction again.
Fedora on the other hand is extremely impressive so far. May be the closest thing to a point release distro that is current and updates enough to be almost rolling.
56 • @55 - Fedora is almost rolling (by Hoos on 2017-11-23 04:20:29 GMT from Singapore)
I agree with your comments on Fedora, although I use Korora, the respin that comes nicely configured out of the box.
The dnf commands to upgrade to the newest releases work pretty flawlessly. My install started as version 21 in 2015, it's now at version 25, and I'm due to upgrade to version 26 soon. I always do it at the end of the year, after the new release has had some time to settle.
In between, normal updates come at a rapid pace.
57 • Fedora and Gnome (by foo2foo on 2017-11-23 05:49:11 GMT from United States)
Tried Fedora 27 Gnome on a Lenovo Yoga 2 and it ran like a lame dog. Switched to the Cinnamon and it is much faster. Gnome is just so bloated and heavy.
FYSA: MX Linux 17b2 was released, but wasn’t posted on DSW. One of the major changes is an upgrade to kernel 4.13.
58 • Fedora @41 (by silent on 2017-11-23 13:28:56 GMT from France)
No, offline update with gnome-software is not a Fedora issue. Actually Ubuntu gnome-software package is patched in order to disable offline updates (bug 1546634). Offline update was the decision of gnome developers for several reasons (quoted from blogs.gnome.org):
-Installing updates while the session is running causes havoc with some apps like firefox that have file resources that have not been locked (just try updating xulrunner when firefox or thunderbird is open…)
-Installing library updates when apps are running against the old copies means the processed need to be restarted (gnome-session, sshd, etc) before the changes are in effect (for all users logged into the machine)
-Installing core OS updates and doing OS upgrades in the running session works for most people most of the time, and then when it fails it destroys your system completely with no way to recover
-Using a minimal pre-boot environment we can snapshot the system before we update the OS and afterwards (requires btrfs or something else)
-Using a fresh pre-boot environment means we can easily check OS sanity before we start updating core bits of the OS, without lots of additional processes running.
59 • @41 and 58 - Fedora, gnome-software, updates (by Hoos on 2017-11-23 14:32:04 GMT from Singapore)
Isn't gnome-software more a component of Gnome 3 Desktop Environment rather than Fedora? Yes, Fedora and Gnome 3 both have Red Hat as their major sponsor or contributor, but if you use one of the official Fedora spins with another desktop environment, I doubt that you get gnome-software as the GUI frontend for package management.
Go to https://spins.fedoraproject.org/ and you'll see a screenshot of their LXQT spin with dnfdragora as their GUI frontend for package management.
Even with Gnome 3, one need not use gnome-software. Yum-extender used to be the GUI frontend for yum package manager and I installed all my updates with it while running in the same Gnome 3 graphical session and I'd never had a problem with it. I tried gnome-software once or twice, decided it was annoying and inconvenient, and never bothered with it again.
Now that yum has been replaced with DNF, the frontend has also changed to dnfdragora.
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/Replace_yumex-dnf_with_dnfdragora
Nowadays I use dnf in the terminal emulator to update (while running in Gnome 3), but I don't think dnfdragora requires a reboot either. If I'm wrong, please let me know.
60 • Opinion Poll: ARM desktops and laptops (by P. Sposito on 2017-11-23 20:23:21 GMT from Asia/Pacific Region)
ARM Desktops and Laptops?
Where to get them?
You should address the following question to your poll:
"Do you plan to purchase any ARM Desktops and Laptops? "
61 • ARM Laptops (by Right Now on 2017-11-24 02:41:37 GMT from Canada)
@ #60
"ARM Desktops and Laptops?
Where to get them?" ---> China, Alibaba or AliExpress.
At lease two chinese manufacturers sells with their own linux pre-installed.
62 • Pine A64 ARM powered linux laptops for US$ 89 and up! (by Right Now on 2017-11-24 02:56:35 GMT from Canada)
PINEBOOK ARM Linux Laptop Powered by Allwinner A64 Processor to Sell for $89 and Up
dated 24-nov-2016
http://www.linux-arm.info/index.php/1271-pinebook-arm-linux-laptop-powered-by-allwinner-a64-processor-to-sell-for-89-and-up.
Will I buy it?
Yes, only with linux.
Not at all with Microsoft Windows 10, No more extra money for MS license.
63 • Debian (systemd) vs. Devuan (no systemd) (by Debie Devos on 2017-11-24 08:04:47 GMT from Canada)
Just had a chance to install debian jessie - xfce on i7 laptop. Debian choked and froze on couples of application tested including while surfing on firefox, power-off button pressed to reboot.
Then just decided to give Devuan a shot. Devuan (no-systemd) performed noticeably better than Debian (systemd) - both with xfce DE. Going with Devuan for a while just to know and feel the taste of ingredients.
64 • ARM laptop (by TheTKS on 2017-11-24 11:30:30 GMT from Canada)
I was surprised at how functional a low end Chromebook could be for everyday stuff. Got one as backup for kid's school work after regular laptop hd died.
Trying to figure out what went wrong (have my suspicions, don't have 100% clear evidence) and then reinstalling W10 finally convinced me to look into MS alternatives, which were this Chromebook and Linux & BSD.
I just made sure to warn the kids that whatever they do on a Chromebook (or their Android phones) becomes uncle Google's property. It's practically impossible to avoid Google if they wanted to, since their school system (and so group projects) is on Google apps and Chromebooks.
Now in the house: one Chromebook, one multiboot W10/Linuxes/BSD box, dual boot W10/Linux laptops, main box Linux only.
Thank you MS for making my life harder than necessary with W10, Xbox and more. You inspired me to finally try FLOSS - came to escape MS, stayed because I actually like using it.
65 • Fractured Development (compliment) (by Andy Figueroa on 2017-11-26 03:42:26 GMT from United States)
Posts 43 and 64 very different but brilliant. Thank you for meaningful comments. In my personal life, I'm Windows-free, roll my own Gentoo Linux desktops and servers, and I'm very happy having choices. One can use Linux, have bleeding edge or stable environments, but it's the users choice and users (Post #1) really shouldn't complain about what the developers are working on. How credible can a post be from one who returned to MS Windows? Good grief. :-)
Number of Comments: 65
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Toorox
Toorox was a Gentoo-based live DVD which boots into a KDE desktop using KNOPPIX hardware auto-detection and auto-configuration technologies. It was a useful tool for backing up data, browsing the Internet anonymously, or taking a first look at the capabilities of Linux. The live DVD can be installed to a hard disk with the help of a simple graphical installer.
Status: Discontinued
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