 DistroWatch Weekly |
| Tip Jar |
If you've enjoyed this week's issue of DistroWatch Weekly, please consider sending us a tip.
(Tips this week: 0, value: US$0.00) |
|
|
|
 bc1qtede6f7adcce4kjpgx0e5j68wwgtdxrek2qvc4  86fA3qPTeQtNb2k1vLwEQaAp3XxkvvvXt69gSG5LGunXXikK9koPWZaRQgfFPBPWhMgXjPjccy9LA9xRFchPWQAnPvxh5Le |
|
| Linux Foundation Training |
|
| Reader Comments • Jump to last comment |
1 • Ubuntu and Lubuntu (by edcoolio on 2017-10-23 00:31:19 GMT from United States)
So, I guess Unity is officially dead. May it RIP. Personally, I hated it.
I'll also repeat my comments on the upgrade from 17.04 to 17.10 Lubuntu.
It did not go well, at all. Have a backup, always.
I ended up doing a complete format and clean load. Everything runs well, as usual, but it seems that the upgrades are always a hassle.
2 • @1 Unity / Ubuntu (by linuxista on 2017-10-23 00:52:18 GMT from United States)
Though I started with Ubuntu, I have avoided it studiously since the switch to Unity. Also a loss to the Gnome project and linux community itself through fragmentation of efforts. Glad they finally came around. Ubuntu, at least for installing on newb friends' machines, has suddenly become the most attractive option again.
As far as dirty/broken upgrades, you should consider a rolling release like Arch or Solus. In the long run it's less work and far, far less prone to catastrophic breakage than point release distros. (I've never had to reinstall Arch, and my first install is almost 6 years old now.)
3 • Ubuntu 17.10 (by Ti-Paul on 2017-10-23 01:10:19 GMT from Canada)
First impression : buggy (crash when login) and little bit slow (animations not fluid)... compared to my Manjaro KDE main install. Plus Ubuntu bootloader listed my Manjaro install but wasn't able to boot it (kernel panic), had to re-install Manjaro bootloader... Now i can boot Ubuntu or Manjaro. But as of now i don't think Ubuntu will last long on my drive. Maybe testing a lighter Ubuntu variant... even if i read that some variant are also having crash after login.
My background :
I started using Linux 20 years ago.
Ubuntu was a big help from a desktop perspective (originally with Gnome 2).
Since i'm a distro-hopper, i kept coming back to Ubuntu. Then came Linux Mint and it replaced Ubuntu as my main system.
More than 2 years ago, i tried Manjaro KDE and now i'm stuck on it. Every time i install a new distribution i keep thinking that it offers nothing new and stumble upon crash or slowiness on my 2010 i5/nvidia/4GB ram laptop..
4 • s6 Future Proofer (by Arch Watcher 402563 on 2017-10-23 01:21:08 GMT from United States)
Nice to see distros playing with OpenRC, but if starting afresh, especially with Arch, why not play with s6? It's moar better. Go visit Obarun.org which made the switch. You can run OpenRC on s6, but I'd go whole-hog. Help Obarun help you. Eric is very nice.
5 • Portable package formats such as Flatpak and Snap (by tim on 2017-10-23 03:34:15 GMT from United States)
Sigh.
Yet again, DW omits mentioning AppImage.
6 • @Ti-Paul - Ubuntu vs Manjaro (by Rajesh G on 2017-10-23 05:03:28 GMT from India)
I agree with you. I was also a distrohopper - Fedora, Suse, Ubuntu, etc. Somehow, I liked Ubuntu, including Unity (innovative thinking). By Feb-2015, I installed Manjaro. Yes, you are right! I am also struck with it. Though I like to try Ubuntu-17.10, something stops me ;). Having spent hasslefree 2.5 years in Manjaro, there is no compeling reason to try another! :D
7 • Ubuntu 17.10 (by Sanjay Prasad on 2017-10-23 05:45:59 GMT from India)
Installed 17.10 version of ubuntu works fine on my old laptop acer emachine 732z with 4GB of RAM. But none of the Screen Recorder works may be because of Wayland, tried kazam, ,vokoscreen, my favorite simple screen recoreder also tried wayland supported Green Recorder but result in System Hang, if any one has solution then please help ...
8 • Parabola, Hyperbola, OpenRC (by kernelKurtz on 2017-10-23 06:49:53 GMT from France)
Glad to see a recent relative proliferation of Arch-based OpenRC distros.
Above, the news item mentions that it's so with Parabola, and the Waiting List mentions Hyperbola (who only this week released their upgrade to OpenRC).
Seems like there's a bit of history (and maybe a good story) behind these two distros and their relationship to each other and to non-systemd approaches. I'd love to hear it--not that it really matters. I'm testing the Hyperbola offering because of their stated commitments and actions in the direction of being serious about privacy.
9 • Too much *buntu (by RoboNuggie on 2017-10-23 06:59:58 GMT from United Kingdom)
If it's Ubuntu based, thats ONE OS, you can put as many desktops or Window managers as you want, but it's still one.... so eight sections to just one OS.... ludicrous.
Too many iterations of Windows is silly, but is it no wonder that potential users are put off Linux, no because of diversity, but by simply too much duplication?
So much talent that could be redirected....
10 • Ubuntu (by dragon3 on 2017-10-23 07:27:10 GMT from United States)
@9 RoboNuggie: Have to agree totally. A Ubu for every possible configuration is a bit overboard.
Ubuntu as with Debian has been releasing their final upgrades incomplete, honestly not since wheezy has their been a stable release that just works OTB.
So many issues this time around is not worth counting and the trend seems to get worse with each so-called final release.
Have moved on to Artix, easy to use and quite stable. Devuan is a possibility too, at least their distros work!
11 • Opinion Poll (by P.R. on 2017-10-23 08:16:11 GMT from Germany)
I use void linux and therefore xbps, which is a multiplatform port system (i686,x86_64,armv6,armv7,armv8,mips).
So i can use void on all raspberryPis and odroids and similar, as well as on my laptop and my server and run the same software from the same build-template.
Thanks for the insight in ravenports Jesse!
12 • Ubuntu & Gnome (by Mark E on 2017-10-23 10:11:04 GMT from United Kingdom)
Ironically, Ubuntu switching to Gnome is bringing some welcome 'unity' to the Linux OS, as most of the major distributions, Redhat/Centos, SUSE etc. are using Gnome as well.
13 • Ubuntu (by Rick on 2017-10-23 12:29:26 GMT from United States)
It used to be Gnome 2 and KDE for desktops. Now it is ....whatever you want. The result is very sluggish and buggy distros. When will it all end and when will developers start writing good software again? Meanwhile, I will continue to use Mint 17.3 even though it is old. However, VERY stable compared to what's being offered today.
14 • Xubuntu (by Diego Rodrigues on 2017-10-23 13:46:28 GMT from Netherlands)
My upgrade to Xubuntu 17.10 went smooth! I only had to check my repo's after the upgrade but other than that everything worked as expected. As a big fan of Xfce I would like to say thanks to The Xubuntu team. You guys did it again!
15 • Ubuntu (by Geo. on 2017-10-23 14:05:40 GMT from Canada)
Ubuntu, that's nice and all, but still holding out for the next break through with Haiku.
;-)
16 • Opinion Poll (by Nathan on 2017-10-23 14:09:48 GMT from United States)
My cross-platform ports system is make.
17 • cross-platform packages (by dogma on 2017-10-23 14:44:12 GMT from United States)
In a way it feels like a power struggle. A system is central and you get your software here and there and compile it, then distributions take over and people get their software through packages and forget that anyone out there is actually writing this stuff, and then cross-platform package systems come along and people will forget that there used to be distributions at the focus. It either says something about what is important or else it says something about how we adapt to complexity and endless monstrosity of ecosystems.
(plus at-least-half-serious systemd-replacing-linux)
18 • *ubuntu inflation (by Dxvid on 2017-10-23 15:10:34 GMT from Sweden)
In my opinion distrowatch should stop marketing every flavor of Ubuntu as a separate distro release with one post each. It's always irritating to get 7+ messages about the same distro getting a new release twice a year, thus hiding other recent releases. Why not treat Ubuntu the same way as Fedora, OpenSUSE, Mint, Debian and others? Please create one news in the rss feed and one post on distrowatch.com containing all torrent files. Are they paying you money to get more publicity or why this special treatment? ;-)
Ubuntu have chosen to not include all different graphical environments on the same installation media, so they get a lot of more attention here at distrowatch. But Fedora has done the same but get only one post per release! Mint has also done the same and gets 2 posts per release as they don't get them all ready at the same time (double marketing value due to poor release planning?). This way of releasing distros requires more DVDs/isos if people want to try different graphical environments before they settle for one.
OpenSUSE, Debian and CentOS are more practical as there's one installation disc and you choose window manager during installation in a practical manner, free choice and only one DVD to burn (you only need the first iso if more than one). They only get one post here per release and releases come less frequently than Ubuntu as they focus more on stability. These distros come with many popular graphical environments too, probably more than Ubuntu.
So distros which make it easy for users to choose graphical environment and focus on stability get less publicity. But among those who have chosen to put the same release in 7+ different iso-files, only Ubuntu get extra marketing space every half a year.
And now I haven't even mentioned distros which uses only rolling release and thus hardly get any posts at all, as a matter of fact I only know of Arch and OpenSUSE Tumbleweed as this kind of distro get very little attention here while I could probably out of my head list at least 50 normal distros with stable releases and liveDVDs that I've read about here and tested. Google for some weird reason favors answers in the Arch wiki even though searches are made for other distros, and OpenSUSE very recently decided to market Tumbleweed on the front page instead of hiding it like before, so I see info about those 2 every now and then and get reminded they exist. But I understand why rolling releases can't get the same attention on distrowatch, I just added as comparison.
19 • AppImage and Ubuntu (by Jesse on 2017-10-23 15:21:03 GMT from Canada)
@5: We have talked about AppImage plenty in the past, even recommended it over other package formats. But there isn't any benefit in listing every single portable package type every time the subject comes up, there are probably at least a dozen popular portable package options.
@18: The debate about Ubuntu and whether it should be treated as one or many distributions comes up a lot. There are a lot of people on both sides of the debate and you can read our reasons for treating it the way we do here: https://distrowatch.com/dwres.php?resource=faq#ubuntusplit
20 • Finally...and long over due... (by tom joad on 2017-10-23 17:04:26 GMT from United States)
Finally...and long over due that unity is dead, dead and dead. Good F#$%^&* riddance to pure rubbish dreadful. One could see that coming, the passing of Unity, a long way down the road. I did.
Thanks Heavens for Mint with Mate. I like that a lot and keep coming back to it.
@9 I agree. Ubuntu is ubuntu is ubuntu is... Ubuntu is the same 'stew' with small variations of seasoning. There is not any Earth shaking break out difference between them. Personally, I do like Ubuntu mate though. The rest...whatever.
21 • Same old comments lol. (by Garon on 2017-10-23 17:45:15 GMT from United States)
Here we go again. Every Time Ubuntu and its child distros release a new version you hear the uninformed commenters say there are too many Ubuntus. That makes Jessie comment again on why or where to find the information as to why it is what it is. People need to remember that many active distros, including Mint, exist because of Ubuntu. That's a fact that cannot be denied. And then we have the little comments about Unity. Some people really hate Unity and I'm not sure why. How can you hate something that you never use nor plan to. That's very strange and child like. So sad. Here's my opinion. Unity was nice and useful. I found benefit in the system. It's really bad that it was so hard for so many people to learn how to use Unity. It seems people were more use to the Mac or Windows look of other desktops lol. I'm not even going to get into the systemd debate again. Like all these other useless little squabbles, they all should be dead, dead, dead. Now, how about some useful comments.
22 • ubuntu (by matt on 2017-10-23 17:59:09 GMT from United States)
I wish there was a JWM varient of ubuntu.
23 • not claiming "too many buntus", just begging clarity and CONSISTENCY (by tim on 2017-10-23 18:19:51 GMT from United States)
http://distrowatch.com/dwres.php?resource=showheadline&story=3165
2017-04-13
"Jeremy Bicha has posted an answer, indicating Ubuntu GNOME will be discontinued."
http://ubuntugnome.org/
"The latest Long Term Support release is Ubuntu GNOME 16.04.3
The final stable non-LTS release is Ubuntu GNOME 17.04"
http://ubuntugnome.org/ubuntu-gnome-17-04-released/
April 13, 2017
"As a result of this decision there will no longer be a separate GNOME flavor of Ubuntu."
http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=ubuntugnome
Last Update: 2017-08-26
Status: Dormant (defined)
http://distrowatch.com/dwres.php?resource=faq#distrostatus
"A distribution which has not put out a new release in two or more years is marked as being Dormant in our database."
24 • 'Same old comments lol' (by Dave Postles on 2017-10-23 18:25:19 GMT from United Kingdom)
Here's another one: I will not support a product that gets into bed with Amazon, an alleged tax avoider, which has also had reports of poor working conditions in Europe - even if I can remove the Amazon lens.
25 • Unity (by Peter Burns on 2017-10-24 00:27:32 GMT from United Kingdom)
@21
Maybe the fact that a lot of people struggled to get used to Unity is an indication that it's just bad UI?
It should be intuitive, not a huge learning curve to access basic functionality like a programs list.
26 • One build system, multiple platforms (by Andre on 2017-10-24 01:06:52 GMT from Canada)
I'd love to see Ravenports, or something like it, take off. As a user of multiple operating systems, I try my best to maintain as much symmetricity between them as is reasonable. There's nothing I'd like more than a unified package manager/builder; it's kind of like the holy grail. It's a real shame there isn't more impetus in the open source community to try and adopt one. There's certainly no shortage of candidates.
27 • 10k posts (by david esktorp on 2017-10-24 02:35:34 GMT from United States)
Congratulations on the 10,000th post!
28 • Unity (by Bobbie Sellers on 2017-10-24 02:43:41 GMT from United States)
I don't hate it but I think it lacked features that are more easily accessed from other
Desktop Environments.
It was designed to be used on Ubuntu Phones and another group is taking care
of the telephony. Canonical gave it up. Eventually it may show up as a cell phone
for sale.
29 • Unity: What's wrong with letting others use it? (by Jason Hsu on 2017-10-24 02:51:40 GMT from United States)
I hate the Unity interface, but I'm glad that it's being forked as Yunit, just as the popular GNOME 2 desktop was forked as MATE (which proved to be a big hit when the Linux Mint team took over). I won't be using Yunit, but I'm glad that the people who liked the controversial Unity interface won't be left in the lurch.
I cannot understand why people want Unity to go away. Ubuntu's following is smaller now than it was in its GNOME 2 days, but it's still substantial. I wish its users the best, and I hope that the GNOME 3-based Ubuntu has a similar look and feel as the Unity-based Ubuntu had. Ubuntu users are clearly the people who like Unity. The new GNOME 3-based Ubuntu won't attract the people who jumped ship because of Unity, because these former Ubuntu users are now satisfied users of Linux Mint, Xubuntu, Lubuntu, Kubuntu, Fedora, OpenSUSE, PCLinuxOS, and various other distros.
This is a free world. Nobody is forcing us to use Ubuntu or Unity. We can use whatever Linux distro we want to use. I also hate the vim editor and cannot understand its logic at all, but I'm happy that it works extremely well for some people.
30 • The objections to Ubuntu derivatives (by Jason Hsu on 2017-10-24 03:01:56 GMT from United States)
Every week, people complain that there are too many Ubuntu derivatives. Even though I dislike Ubuntu (because it's bloatware), I don't object, because nobody is forcing me to use any of the Ubuntu derivatives. Remember that Linux Mint is a Ubuntu derivative, and it provided a continuation of the old GNOME 2-based Ubuntu when its parent distro veered into its controversial Unity direction.
Ubuntu's Unity controversy proved that well-established distros with a large following should be conservative, and it's better that bold new ideas be implemented through new distros. Ubuntu with Unity and GNOME 3 wouldn't have been so controversial if they had been rolled out as brand new projects instead of continuations of the older versions.
I'm glad that the Linux world offers so many choices. When a distro makes a controversial change that people don't like or becomes defunct, its users have alternatives available. When Windows makes controversial changes that people don't like, its users have to suck it up. I'm so glad that I don't have to as a Linux user.
31 • @4 S6 (by mandog on 2017-10-24 03:14:46 GMT from Peru)
Wow we agree again S6 is excellent even boots HDDs lightening fast.
Eric is a great guy we need more like him to get Linux back on track
32 • MultiBootUSB-Live added to waiting list (by 2damncommon on 2017-10-24 05:08:08 GMT from United States)
This distro sounds tempting.
With a quick try:
I attempted to install 3 live distributions. Austrumi, Knoppix, Parted Magic to a 32GB USB 3.0 drive.
Although my USB drive was auto detected my hard drive (where the ISO files were) was not. I was able to mount the drive manually VIA the terminal.
Attempting to add Austrumi resulted in the program terminating. Tried multiple times.
Partition Magic was added.
Knoppix was added.
Partition Magic would not boot with 64 or 32 bit options.
Knoppix started just fine.
I finally tried adding another live distribution - MultiBootUSB-Live.
It was added okay.
It booted okay and auto detected my hard drive although the DVD had not.
Didn't have any further live distributions to add though.
Interesting but I've gotta give it a thumbs down at this point.
33 • Happy 10,000th!! (by Bashir Barrage on 2017-10-24 05:30:20 GMT from Lebanon)
Just wanted to wish you a happy 10,000th post from Beirut!
34 • kubuntu (by Mac on 2017-10-24 11:46:43 GMT from United States)
KDE, dolphin locked from root. Just what I wanted someone else telling me what I can and can't do. That is the hole point for me on linux is having it my way!! KDE fan for years but that sucks.
Have Fun
Mac
35 • The Archlabs review and thoughts on AntiX (by Barnabyh on 2017-10-24 12:08:16 GMT from United States)
Thank you for an interesting review of something that is more up my street. It's a bit odd to read though when these days RAM use of 180MB or even 250MB is classed as light. That's the amount of RAM GNOME 2 was using and it was seen as a heavy DE once upon a time, when LXDE was using 50 and one could even run XFCE with as little as 80MB, without any daemons like Dropbox in the background obviously.
I used to like Arch(bang) a lot and ran it for a few years until they adopted systemd early on. Crunchbang was and BunsenLabs is great but as they are also infected I'm currently running AntiX stable and really enjoying it. Works great as a Kodi media box too with the laptop attached to an old TV (that doesn't have USB yet for FireTV stick and so on).
One could of course build their own system based on Devuan but with AntiX 17 having a rc now I'll probably stick with it for a while longer. It got me hooked! So, at some point, I'll probably have to write another review to give anti the credit that is due as in the past I had always found some faults with earlier versions. Or just have it noted here.
Archlabs sounds good but as it's also using systemd I'll probably rather try the openrc spins of - was it Arch or Manjario? Absolute Linux would be nice too, sort of the AntiX of the Slackware world.
Anyway, sorry to bother you with my random thoughts.
36 • @34 Dolphin as root (by OstroL on 2017-10-24 13:05:18 GMT from Poland)
Have a look here, https://iwf1.com/how-to-add-open-as-root-entry-manually-to-kdes-dolphin-file-manager/
37 • @21 about Ubuntu (by OstroL on 2017-10-24 13:23:20 GMT from Poland)
Actually there is one Ubuntu, and the rest is Ubuntu + desktop environments. Whatever "derivative" you install, you get Ubuntu. Check nano /etc/lsb-release in terminal in any Ubuntu derivative.
@22
You can install JWM very easily in Ubuntu. You can use mini.iso and start through that, or install a derivative without Wayland and install JWM. JWM package is in the Ubuntu repos.
38 • Memory Consumption (by Rick Smereka on 2017-10-24 17:27:04 GMT from Switzerland)
@35 The QNX internet challenge published in 1999 on a single 1.44mb floppy disk (OS, Photon GUI, Voyager browser and tools) is the baseline I use for operating system memory consumption. Everything above this is bloat.
I have been systematically trying all the non-systemd OS's (rolling release, i386[non PAE] preferred) and I concur with your comments about AntiX. Combined with the Debian 'testing' repo, it is the best thing going in the Linux world (IMHO) right now. I also use Devuan daily and other than being a fixed point release and also being a lot more bloated than AntiX, it's ok.
I have been ignoring all these Arch releases since almost all of them are infected with systemd. The other Arch-based non-systemd distros that I have tried (Manjaro OpenRC, Artix) either do not install correctly to break soon after installation.
More random thoughts for the bit bucket.
39 • well I've never managed to boot Austrumi (by tim on 2017-10-24 19:55:20 GMT from United States)
Across a span of several years I've failed to successfully boot Austrumi. I tried using dd, tried using various other tools... fail. Aptosid is another which has, more often than not, fail to boot for me.
Devuan: someone posted a reddit comment describing it as "like puppy linux for graybeards". Made me laugh but, wow, yeah that sounds about right. Maybe soured grapes because I failed to achieve network connection (connman?) when livebooting several devuan derivatives. Searching online, I discovered that others have met the same no-network fate.
We have a Catch22 when trying to assess "which desktop environment" or "which distro" is quote unquote lightweight. Formal reviews, as well as anecdotal reports, fail to note important details and report from a fixed baseline. For a distroX, which ships desktop environment "Y"... the reporter usually neglects to note, and to mention: as-shipped, services A B and C are autostarted (adding __MiB overhead) and helpers, like a clipboard manager and a conky and a wonkydock are auto-started by default. Omission of those details winds up leading to reviewers and readers guessing (blaming?) a particular desktop environment for being quote unquote heavy, or lightweaight.
40 • Gotta be something better than Ravenports (by technosaurus on 2017-10-25 04:14:07 GMT from United States)
The article on Ravenports makes it sound great, but I'm a "show-me-the-code" kinda guy and OMFG what a total mess - it makes the mozilla source tree look clean. Everything is in folders named bucketXX with no organization whatsoever and its a new project, so it will proabably only get worse.
I'm not saying there isn't a niche to be filled; there is, but Ravenports does not appear to be the answer.
A better solution would be to implement a new XDG specification for package specs - modeled after the desktop entry specification so that individual packages could output a single file that any distro could grok into their own format (for backward compatibility) or use directly. It could be added into the auto-tools suite or provided as a standalone script.
In addition to the (localized) keys in .desktop files, you would have package sizes, various checksums, (build) dependencies, source url, VCS url, maintainer, license, etc... See links at the end of this post for the random stuff some distros have in their package control files.
The reason I mention the desktop files is that they already contain much of the useful information and it is commonly already localized. For example:
* Localization (as in the desktop files) would allow more user friendly package management for non-english users because each translatable field "Key=" can have a corresponding "Key[lang]=" equivalent
* Mimetype (as in the desktop files) could be used by the package manager to handle an xdg-open of a file with no default handler for its Mimetype. Then the Exec field (as in the desktop file) could open it directly when it is installed... Come on even MS can handle this one (OK, they just use extensions, but the concept is the same)
* XDG specified Categories (as in the desktop files) could be used directly by package managers or mapped to legacy groups for backward compatibility. Using the same categories in the package manager as in the menu would make it more user friendly.
* The Icon field (as in the desktop file) could be used in graphical package managers, if available, to help the user quickly find what they installed.
Integrating the package info into the build process would use information that is normally already available anyhow and thus eliminate a lot of cross-distro duplicated effort. Most of the rest of the data that isn't contained in the desktop files, is already part of the build process (dependencies, build dependencies, sizes, checksums, maintainer etc...). Just have a package.spec.in file similar to the already existing package.desktop.in files
Other fields that could be useful:
Memory usage, CPU usage, ProjectURI, DonationURI, DocumentationURI, ScreenshotURI, BugsURI, SupportURI, WikiURI, ForumURI, etc...
Then you have the various ways of package splitting: from a simple slackbuild that produces one package per source tarball to splitting out binaries, libraries, development (DEV) files, documentation (DOC), data and localization (NLS) into separate packages. These can be split even further: NLS to each language such as package-*-NLS-en_GB. Split DEV so includes, pkgconfig files, etc... are in one package and the *.so links in a DEV-shared and *.a libs in a DEV-static. Split DOC into man, info, html, etc...
Moving the majority of this stuff into the upstream repositories would be better for upstream developers too. That way they can directly update changes to things like links, repositories, contact info etc... I still see distros that list a package's homepage as freshmeat, berlios, codeplex or google code and have even seen dead guys as the contact. It's better for up to date localization too.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not a big fan of autotools, but an improved version with hooks for different types of build failures that could be integrated with the package manager would be nice. Instead of a cryptic failure message, get something like Can't find "X": _Install, _Build, _BuildStatic, _Disable, _Quit (with install being the default if available followed by _Disable if it can just be disabled) ... but we need _something_. With no defacto standard, each distro does their own thing - badly. For example: Alpine Linux started as a small distro so they don't yet have package categories - just one big pile, but at least they aren't arbitrarily divided into ambiguous bucket** folders. If you look through the distro build systems of your favorite distro (all/any of them) 90% of the BS code is related to this one thing. If each package automatically output this to a specified format, most of that code could be eliminated.
See: https://specifications.freedesktop.org/desktop-entry-spec/desktop-entry-spec-latest.html
And how various distros (random sampling) do it
https://wiki.alpinelinux.org/wiki/Apk_spec
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PKGBUILD
https://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/#document-ch-controlfields
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Module:Guidelines?rd=Fedora_Packaging_Guidelines_for_Modules
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging:Guidelines
https://solus-project.com/articles/packaging/package.yml/en/
https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Standards_YaST2_Repository_Metadata
https://people.canonical.com/~cjwatson/ubuntu-policy/policy.html/ch-controlfields.html
41 • Austrumi : Post # 39 (by Winchester on 2017-10-25 13:30:07 GMT from United States)
Austrumi 64 version 3.5.8 boots fine on my hardware. I burned it to a CD-R using either "K3B" or "XFburn". I can't remember which one but either probably will work. You likely could just update the software sources after it is up and running.
Austrumi 3.7.0 would not boot for me and I have yet to try 3.7.1 ; Earlier 32-bit versions booted fine just as 3.5.8 did.
For writing iso's to USB drives,I usually use "ROSA Image Writer" under Linux , sometimes "Etcher" or the Gnome Disks Utility or the OpenSUSE image writer ......... "Rufus" when I used to have a Windows installation.
42 • Ubuntu, Kubuntu, etc. (by David on 2017-10-25 15:07:14 GMT from United States)
When there are Development Releases of the 'buntu family, all (or at least a substantial collection) are grouped into the announcement on D'watch. When there is a Distribution Release, members of the family are treated separately.
43 • Escape from New York (by Arch Watcher 402563 on 2017-10-25 23:40:16 GMT from United States)
@38 Speaking as a Debian escapee who used Arch before the systemdeath outbreak -- you're not dropping in random thoughts, you're spilling that bit bucket.
1. Debian sucks with or without systemdeath. The almost-good Debs try to roll like Arch, but it's hard fighting Momma Debian. Things get far better than AntiX once you kiss Momma goodbye.
2. You haven't tried SliTaz, Void, Gentoo, Alpine, Puppy, PCLinuxOS, et al. By all means ignore Arch. It's a big world out there.
3. You listed only one "Arch-based non-systemd" distro. Artix is just Manjaro OpenRC gone indy. It's the same people. Artix is too young to condemn, and Parabola is just now toying with OpenRC. Let them grow. That said, I'm with you on diseased Arch spinoffs; I will never touch one.
4. If you insist on Arch qua Arch sans systemdeath, use Obarun. It positions itself as a kit not its own "distro," but its s6 scripts could work anywhere. Obarun is the first "distro" to use s6 and Eric is eager to collaborate on cures for systemdeath.
44 • Re: Too much *buntu (by Mar Visscher on 2017-10-26 12:58:36 GMT from Netherlands)
To #9 (RoboNuggie)
I totally understand what you're saying and I dig you. ;-)
Lately I was thinking: "Why so many *buntu's? Why doesn't Ubuntu switch to a model that releases only the core Ubuntu, and while installing the system to offer a menu to choose from multiple desktop environments, so you can easily choose for yourself what suites you best? Ubuntu (now with GNOME), Xubuntu (Xfce), Lubuntu (LXDE, later LXQt), Kubuntu (KDE) Ubuntu Budgie (why not calling it "Bubuntu" to stay in line with the rest) and so on maybe nice to choose from, but I think it's not really effective or efficient. Not for the development teams nor for the end-users. And I also think it's a good idea to offer just the core Ubuntu + desktop of your choice WITHOUT all the extra programs that comes along with it. Just Ubuntu and - let's say - Xfce (which now becomes Xubuntu because you chose Xfce as the prefered desktop).
Later, after installing, people can install their own programs they would like to use, instead of de-installing software that came pre-configured with it and could break something because of certain dependencies while removing it. When I install Ubuntu on someone's machine, it comes along with pre-installed software. But for some that particular software is not the best choice for them (for many reasons).
So... Ubuntu Core + desktop of choice in a menu, and later adding programs by the user itself after installation. That way you get a much leaner, cleaner and more adapted to the user kinda system. A win-win situation. How about that?
45 • @44 'Buntus (by OstroL on 2017-10-26 13:30:11 GMT from Poland)
" Ubuntu (now with GNOME), Xubuntu (Xfce), Lubuntu (LXDE, later LXQt), Kubuntu (KDE) Ubuntu Budgie (why not calling it "Bubuntu" to stay in line with the rest) and so on maybe nice to choose from, but I think it's not really effective or efficient. "
Well, the default is Gubuntu, then we have Bubuntu, Kubuntu, Kyubuntu (Ubuntu Kylin), Lubuntu, Stubuntu (Ubuntu Studio) and Xubuntu.
What's missing is Ubuntu-Unity or Uubuntu. I have seen such an Uubuntu (Unity7 iso) available. Tried it and it works, just as it was in the default Ubuntu 17.04, but based on 17.10.
46 • @36 (by Mac on 2017-10-26 13:32:55 GMT from United States)
Thanks for the link! But it is sad that KDE thinks we are not smart enough to take care of ourself. Not everyone is a noob. There is several ways around it but that just made me mad!
47 • Bride of Frankenstein (by Arch Watcher 402563 on 2017-10-26 22:32:04 GMT from United States)
https://lists.gnupg.org/pipermail/gnupg-users/2016-September.txt
"P.S.: My personal opinion: The whole Debian approach is a mess. Rather
than contributing upstream and trying to improve the code there, they
are making frankenstein builds that were never intended in this way by
the upstream projects. Nobody knows which patches they do and do not
backport and in general Debian packages are massively outdated."
48 • The vocal minority spews out FUD about Unity, systemd, Ubuntu etc. (by A. R. Chuser on 2017-10-27 22:37:54 GMT from Norway)
People calling systemd systemdeath and an infection seems quite childish. I know some people have reasons for disliking it, but some haters just seem to enjoy hating, without even being able to articulate what it is that they dislike. I guess many of these users are newly saved Linux noobs that have read something somewhere about how systemd does not follow the Unix philosophy, and therefore use it to project all their hatred through. A constructive debate is nice, and it is good that there are alternatives out there being actively maintained to avoid a monoculture, but "systemdeath" and "infection"... come one, you can at least try to come up with some serious arguments against the thing if you avoid it like the plague.
Also, the hate for Unity has always been quite irrational. There are too many desktop environments and window managers available for Linux for anybody to need to complain about Cannonical trying out some new ideas on their own distro and giving their work away for free. Linux is not like other OSes where you have no choice but to take whatever the corporate overloads give you.
By the way, Unity was developed years before the Ubuntu phone came along, so if you think it is made for convergence, you don't know what you are talking about. Unity 8, which never shipped on the desktop, but ran on Mir on the tablets and phones, was the converged desktop. Unity 7 that you could get on Ubuntu (desktop) was an offshoot of the netbook remix back in the day. I also find it funny how people say Mir never worked, when many of us ran it on our phones and tablets for a year or two before Wayland was in a usable state on Fedora. Cannonical just did not get to shipping Unity 8 and Mir on the desktop before it was killed off by Shuttleworth, but they both ran fine on my Bq Aquaris M10 tablet. My point here is that if you are going to criticise something, it is better to know at least the basic facts about the thing you are criticising in stead of just regurgitating childish hatred.
I think many people dislike(d) Unity because its UI is different than Windows. Personally, I find it uses screen real estate far more efficiently than gnome (both 3 and especially 2) and that pressing the super (windows) key is a faster way to find my programs than to press the mouse twenty times to go through menus, but that is just a personal preference. It is probably shaped by me having used Macs for twenty-five years before coming to Linux. I use LXDE on my main machine for maximum speed and tweaked to give me minimum clutter. Some people like tiling window managers and some even like Englithenment. Let's let a thousand flowers bloom, and pick the one that we like. This is why we all love Linux, right?
I find that many of the Ubuntu haters are Linux Mint users. This is extremely ironic, since Linux Mint is Ubuntu LTS with a desktop environment and the Xapps. In addition, Linux Mint users do not get security updates for their kernel by default, so it is obviously a less secure distro to use than upstream Ubuntu. Without Cannonical doing all the hard work, Linux Mint would never exist, so the criticism seems extremely misplaced. On the other hand, Cinnamon and MATE are really nice desktops and the XFCE and KDE edition of Mint are also very nice, but that is no reason to hate your upstream distro.
I'm so tired of all these noobs, trolls and haters spewing out comment after comment of misinformation, non-constructive criticism and general hatred. I often get the feeling that these people represent a small, vocal minority. The Linux landscape is quite small, and even if we like different distros, desktops, init systems... Why not focus our energy on making cool stuff and showing our enthusiasm for it in stead? I don't use Ubuntu, but I applaud the effort of Mark Shuttleworth in building up Cannonical and basically giving away a lot of work and his money for free. Many projects are constantly working towards their own goals and contribution to the further development of the Linux ecosystem. Let's applaud these people and projects when they deserve it, and let's criticise their choices constructively when we disagree with their choices, but let's not be greedy children crying out in hatred against the people and projects that provide us with all of the technology we love. That is just stupid.
49 • unity, systemd, (by edcoolio on 2017-10-28 00:52:03 GMT from United States)
@48
Agreed, 100%. In particular, the systemd emotional outbursts and name calling. It reminds me of politics in the sense that I immediately stop reading an opinion the moment a politician's name is turned into a negative childish nickname.
My only disappointment in Ubuntu stems from those that put the time and effort into learning the Unity interface. Many people did this because it was Ubuntu that was doing it. Otherwise, I suspect it would have been just another middling DE.
Now, they are (for the most part) being left in the dust.
I guess what I'm saying is that although I dislike Unity, I empathize with those peers that put the time into it and now feel as if they are being abandoned. Are they actually being abandoned? I don't know, but I do know that is the feeling around the water cooler.
As you point out, to each their own. That IS why we all love linux!
50 • Systemd and unity (by Doug on 2017-10-28 18:06:31 GMT from United States)
Systemd goes throughout the system. It is much more than an init. It has tendrils in all parts of the system. This is a fact, not FUD. "Infection" is an appropriate name.
https://www.infoworld.com/article/2832405/what-is-systemd-and-why-does-it-matter-to-linux-users.html
The big problem with Unity was that it was sending any thing you searched for on your own computer back to Canonical. "Spyware" is a good word to describe it. Now they disabled that feature by default in 16.04, but not until people complained about it.
http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2016/01/ubuntu-online-search-feature-disabled-16-04
51 • ubuntoo (by David Whattson on 2017-10-29 01:14:19 GMT from Canada)
Folks just cool down and FOCUS.
Regardless of Amazons Lens or Unity Spyware, Ubuntu's UooThoo-BooThoo remained my favorite distro till today as Ububtu maintained its rank in top three or top five on Distrowatch.
52 • @51 (by OstroL on 2017-10-29 09:36:26 GMT from Poland)
Amazon "spyware" is still on in the new default Ubuntu with Gnome-shell.
Number of Comments: 52
Display mode: DWW Only • Comments Only • Both DWW and Comments
| | |
| TUXEDO |
TUXEDO Computers - Linux Hardware in a tailor made suite
Choose from a wide range of laptops and PCs in various sizes and shapes at TUXEDOComputers.com. Every machine comes pre-installed and ready-to-run with Linux. Full 24 months of warranty and lifetime support included!
Learn more about our full service package and all benefits from buying at TUXEDO.
|
| Archives |
| • Issue 1038 (2023-09-25): Mageia 9, trouble-shooting launchers, running desktop Linux in the cloud, New documentation for Nix, Linux phasing out ReiserFS, GNU celebrates 40 years |
| • Issue 1037 (2023-09-18): Bodhi Linux 7.0.0, finding specific distros and unified package managemnt, Zevenet replaced by two new forks, openSUSE introduces Slowroll branch, Fedora considering dropping Plasma X11 session |
| • Issue 1036 (2023-09-11): SDesk 2023.08.12, hiding command line passwords, openSUSE shares contributor survery results, Ubuntu plans seamless disk encryption, GNOME 45 to break extension compatibility |
| • Issue 1035 (2023-09-04): Debian GNU/Hurd 2023, PCLinuxOS 2023.07, do home users need a firewall, AlmaLinux introduces new repositories, Rocky Linux commits to RHEL compatibility, NetBSD machine runs unattended for nine years, Armbian runs wallpaper contest |
| • Issue 1034 (2023-08-28): Void 20230628, types of memory usage, FreeBSD receives port of Linux NVIDIA driver, Fedora plans improved theme handling for Qt applications, Canonical's plans for Ubuntu |
| • Issue 1033 (2023-08-21): MiniOS 20230606, system user accounts, how Red Hat clones are moving forward, Haiku improves WINE performance, Debian turns 30 |
| • Issue 1032 (2023-08-14): MX Linux 23, positioning new windows on the desktop, Linux Containers adopts LXD fork, Oracle, SUSE, and CIQ form OpenELA |
| • Issue 1031 (2023-08-07): Peppermint OS 2023-07-01, preventing a file from being changed, Asahi Linux partners with Fedora, Linux Mint plans new releases |
| • Issue 1030 (2023-07-31): Solus 4.4, Linux Mint 21.2, Debian introduces RISC-V support, Ubuntu patches custom kernel bugs, FreeBSD imports OpenSSL 3 |
| • Issue 1029 (2023-07-24): Running Murena on the Fairphone 4, Flatpak vs Snap sandboxing technologies, Redox OS plans to borrow Linux drivers to expand hardware support, Debian updates Bookworm media |
| • Issue 1028 (2023-07-17): KDE Connect; Oracle, SUSE, and AlmaLinux repsond to Red Hat's source code policy change, KaOS issues media fix, Slackware turns 30; security and immutable distributions |
| • Issue 1027 (2023-07-10): Crystal Linux 2023-03-16, StartOS (embassyOS 0.3.4.2), changing options on a mounted filesystem, Murena launches Fairphone 4 in North America, Fedora debates telemetry for desktop team |
| • Issue 1026 (2023-07-03): Kumander Linux 1.0, Red Hat changing its approach to sharing source code, TrueNAS offers SMB Multichannel, Zorin OS introduces upgrade utility |
| • Issue 1025 (2023-06-26): KaOS with Plasma 6, information which can leak from desktop environments, Red Hat closes door on sharing RHEL source code, SUSE introduces new security features |
| • Issue 1024 (2023-06-19): Debian 12, a safer way to use dd, Debian releases GNU/Hurd 2023, Ubuntu 22.10 nears its end of life, FreeBSD turns 30 |
| • Issue 1023 (2023-06-12): openSUSE 15.5 Leap, the differences between independent distributions, openSUSE lengthens Leap life, Murena offers new phone for North America |
| • Issue 1022 (2023-06-05): GetFreeOS 2023.05.01, Slint 15.0-3, Liya N4Si, cleaning up crowded directories, Ubuntu plans Snap-based variant, Red Hat dropping LireOffice RPM packages |
| • Issue 1021 (2023-05-29): rlxos GNU/Linux, colours in command line output, an overview of Void's unique features, how to use awk, Microsoft publishes a Linux distro |
| • Issue 1020 (2023-05-22): UBports 20.04, finding another machine's IP address, finding distros with a specific kernel, Debian prepares for Bookworm |
| • Issue 1019 (2023-05-15): Rhino Linux (Beta), checking which applications reply on a package, NethServer reborn, System76 improving application responsiveness |
| • Issue 1018 (2023-05-08): Fedora 38, finding relevant manual pages, merging audio files, Fedora plans new immutable edition, Mint works to fix Secure Boot issues |
| • Issue 1017 (2023-05-01): Xubuntu 23.04, Debian elects Project Leaders and updates media, systemd to speed up restarts, Guix System offering ground-up source builds, where package managers install files |
| • Issue 1016 (2023-04-24): Qubes OS 4.1.2, tracking bandwidth usage, Solus resuming development, FreeBSD publishes status report, KaOS offers preview of Plasma 6 |
| • Issue 1015 (2023-04-17): Manjaro Linux 22.0, Trisquel GNU/Linux 11.0, Arch Linux powering PINE64 tablets, Ubuntu offering live patching on HWE kernels, gaining compression on ex4 |
| • Issue 1014 (2023-04-10): Quick looks at carbonOS, LibreELEC, and Kodi, Mint polishes themes, Fedora rolls out more encryption plans, elementary OS improves sideloading experience |
| • Issue 1013 (2023-04-03): Alpine Linux 3.17.2, printing manual pages, Ubuntu Cinnamon becomes official flavour, Endeavour OS plans for new installer, HardenedBSD plans for outage |
| • Issue 1012 (2023-03-27): siduction 22.1.1, protecting privacy from proprietary applications, GNOME team shares new features, Canonical updates Ubuntu 20.04, politics and the Linux kernel |
| • Issue 1011 (2023-03-20): Serpent OS, Security Onion 2.3, Gentoo Live, replacing the scp utility, openSUSE sees surge in downloads, Debian runs elction with one candidate |
| • Issue 1010 (2023-03-13): blendOS 2023.01.26, keeping track of which files a package installs, improved network widget coming to elementary OS, Vanilla OS changes its base distro |
| • Issue 1009 (2023-03-06): Nemo Mobile and the PinePhone, matching the performance of one distro on another, Linux Mint adds performance boosts and security, custom Ubuntu and Debian builds through Cubic |
| • Issue 1008 (2023-02-27): elementary OS 7.0, the benefits of boot environments, Purism offers lapdock for Librem 5, Ubuntu community flavours directed to drop Flatpak support for Snap |
| • Issue 1007 (2023-02-20): helloSystem 0.8.0, underrated distributions, Solus team working to repair their website, SUSE testing Micro edition, Canonical publishes real-time edition of Ubuntu 22.04 |
| • Issue 1006 (2023-02-13): Playing music with UBports on a PinePhone, quick command line and shell scripting questions, Fedora expands third-party software support, Vanilla OS adds Nix package support |
| • Issue 1005 (2023-02-06): NuTyX 22.12.0 running CDE, user identification numbers, Pop!_OS shares COSMIC progress, Mint makes keyboard and mouse options more accessible |
| • Issue 1004 (2023-01-30): OpenMandriva ROME, checking the health of a disk, Debian adopting OpenSnitch, FreeBSD publishes status report |
| • Issue 1003 (2023-01-23): risiOS 37, mixing package types, Fedora seeks installer feedback, Sparky offers easier persistence with USB writer |
| • Issue 1002 (2023-01-16): Vanilla OS 22.10, Nobara Project 37, verifying torrent downloads, Haiku improvements, HAMMER2 being ports to NetBSD |
| • Issue 1001 (2023-01-09): Arch Linux, Ubuntu tests new system installer, porting KDE software to OpenBSD, verifying files copied properly |
| • Issue 1000 (2023-01-02): Our favourite projects of all time, Fedora trying out unified kernel images and trying to speed up shutdowns, Slackware tests new kernel, detecting what is taking up disk space |
| • Issue 999 (2022-12-19): Favourite distributions of 2022, Fedora plans Budgie spin, UBports releasing security patches for 16.04, Haiku working on new ports |
| • Issue 998 (2022-12-12): OpenBSD 7.2, Asahi Linux enages video hardware acceleration on Apple ARM computers, Manjaro drops proprietary codecs from Mesa package |
| • Issue 997 (2022-12-05): CachyOS 221023 and AgarimOS, working with filenames which contain special characters, elementary OS team fixes delta updates, new features coming to Xfce |
| • Issue 996 (2022-11-28): Void 20221001, remotely shutting down a machine, complex aliases, Fedora tests new web-based installer, Refox OS running on real hardware |
| • Issue 995 (2022-11-21): Fedora 37, swap files vs swap partitions, Unity running on Arch, UBports seeks testers, Murena adds support for more devices |
| • Issue 994 (2022-11-14): Redcore Linux 2201, changing the terminal font size, Fedora plans Phosh spin, openSUSE publishes on-line manual pages, disabling Snap auto-updates |
| • Issue 993 (2022-11-07): Static Linux, working with just a kernel, Mint streamlines Flatpak management, updates coming to elementary OS |
| • Issue 992 (2022-10-31): Lubuntu 22.10, setting permissions on home directories, Linux may drop i486, Fedora delays next version for OpenSSL bug |
| • Issue 991 (2022-10-24): XeroLinux 2022.09, learning who ran sudo, exploring firewall tools, Rolling Rhino Remix gets a fresh start, Fedora plans to revamp live media |
| • Issue 990 (2022-10-17): ravynOS 0.4.0, Lion Linux 3.0, accessing low numbered network ports, Pop!_OS makes progress on COSMIC, Murena launches new phone |
| • Issue 989 (2022-10-10): Ubuntu Unity, kernel bug causes issues with Intel cards, Canonical offers free Ubuntu Pro subscriptions, customizing the command line prompt |
| • Issue 988 (2022-10-03): SpiralLinux 11.220628, finding distros for older equipment and other purposes, SUSE begins releasing ALP prototypes, Debian votes on non-free firmware in installer |
| • Issue 987 (2022-09-26): openSUSE's MicroOS, converting people to using Linux, pfSense updates base system and PHP, Python 2 dropped from Arch |
| • Issue 986 (2022-09-19): Porteus 5.0, remotely wiping a hard drive, a new software centre for Ubuntu, Proxmox offers offline updates |
| • Full list of all issues |
| Star Labs |
Star Labs - Laptops built for Linux.
View our range including the highly anticipated StarFighter. Available with coreboot open-source firmware and a choice of Ubuntu, elementary, Manjaro and more. Visit Star Labs for information, to buy and get support.
|
| Shells.com |
Your own personal Linux computer in the cloud, available on any device. Supported operating systems include Android, Debian, Fedora, KDE neon, Kubuntu, Linux Mint, Manjaro and Ubuntu, ready in minutes.
Starting at US$4.95 per month, 7-day money-back guarantee
|
| Random Distribution | 
OpenGEU
OpenGEU was a desktop Linux distribution based on Ubuntu. The project's goal was to combine the power of GNOME desktop with the eye-candy of Enlightenment 17 into an attractive and user-friendly desktop.
Status: Discontinued
|
| TUXEDO |
TUXEDO Computers - Linux Hardware in a tailor made suite
Choose from a wide range of laptops and PCs in various sizes and shapes at TUXEDOComputers.com. Every machine comes pre-installed and ready-to-run with Linux. Full 24 months of warranty and lifetime support included!
Learn more about our full service package and all benefits from buying at TUXEDO.
|
| Star Labs |
Star Labs - Laptops built for Linux.
View our range including the highly anticipated StarFighter. Available with coreboot open-source firmware and a choice of Ubuntu, elementary, Manjaro and more. Visit Star Labs for information, to buy and get support.
|
|
• 
• 
• 
• 
• 
• 
• 
