 DistroWatch Weekly |
| DistroWatch Weekly, Issue 720, 10 July 2017 |
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Welcome to this year's 28th issue of DistroWatch Weekly!
These days a lot of people rely on cloud services such as on-line storage, web-mail and streaming media. As more of our data shifts to on-line services, it allows people who embrace web applications to run slimmer operating systems. This week we start with a look at Peppermint OS, a distribution which off-loads some tasks to on-line services. In our News section we discuss features coming to the next version of openSUSE, link to a bug fix for Tails 3.0.1 and remind readers that Ubuntu 16.10 is nearing the end of its supported life. Plus we share links to new hardware, including several laptops, which the Free Software Foundation has certified as respecting users' freedoms and privacy. Also in this issue we explore osquery, a tool which allows the administrator to gather information about an operating system using SQL database queries. Plus we share the releases of the past week and provide a list of torrents we are seeding. Many of these torrents are tracked by our own, new torrent tracker and we welcome readers to help open source projects by uploading distribution torrents. In this week's Opinion Poll we present a guest question about installing software on Debian Stable. Plus we are pleased to welcome the ArchStrike, Redcore Linux and UBOS distributions to our database. We wish you all a fantastic week and happy reading!
Content:
- Review: Peppermint OS 8
- News: New features coming to openSUSE, Tails fixes networking bug, Ubuntu 16.10 reaching EoL, the FSF certifies new hardware
- Tips and tricks: Gathering system information with osquery
- Released last week: Rockstor 3.9.1, Proxmox 5.0, SharkLinux 2017.07, Pardus 17.0
- Torrent corner: Antergos, Bluestar, Pardus, Proxmox, SharkLinux, SmartOS, Sparky, Tails, Zorin OS
- Upcoming releases: Fedora 26
- Opinion poll: Running Debian Stable on laptop and desktop computers
- DistroWatch.com news: New torrent tracker
- New additions: ArchStrike, Redcore Linux, UBOS
- New distributions: ArchBox
- Reader comments
Listen to the Podcast edition of this week's DistroWatch Weekly in OGG (116MB) and MP3 (92MB) formats.
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| Feature Story (by Jesse Smith) |
Peppermint OS 8
Peppermint OS is a lightweight Linux distribution built primarily from Ubuntu 16.04 LTS packages. The latest release of Peppermint, version 8, ships with support for booting on UEFI-enabled computers. Peppermint also supports loading on computers protected by Secure Boot. The distribution ships with version 4.8 of the Linux kernel with Ubuntu's Hardware Enablement (HWE) drivers so the distribution should run on most modern computers.
Perhaps the most interesting item Peppermint ships with, and what sets it apart from other lightweight Ubuntu-based projects such as Lubuntu and Linux Lite, is a feature called Ice. The Ice software helps users set up short-cuts to websites and web-apps. These short-cuts can be added to the Peppermint application menu and launched in a streamlined web browser window, giving the web-resource the appearance of a natively run application.
Peppermint 8 is available in 32-bit and 64-bit builds. I opted to download the 64-bit version which is 1.2GB in size. Booting from the downloaded media brings up a menu giving us the chance to load the distribution's live desktop environment, launch the system installer, begin an OEM install or verify the integrity of the installation media.
Peppermint's live session boots to a desktop environment which contains a mixture of Xfce and LXDE components. The hybrid desktop uses LXDE's LXSession software while running the Xfwm4 window manager and Xfce's panel. The panel -- with its application menu, task switcher and system tray -- sits at the bottom of the screen. An icon on the desktop can be used to launch the distribution's system installer. The application menu is divided into two panes with the left side displaying categories of software and the right side showing specific application launchers.
Installing
Peppermint uses Ubuntu's Ubiquity system installer. Ubiquity is a graphical application that walks us through a streamlined series of option screens. We're asked to select our preferred language from a list and given a chance to install media support. The installer can automate disk partitioning or provide us with a simple interface for partitioning our hard drive. Ubiquity then gets us to select our time zone from a map of the world, confirm our computer's keyboard layout and we are asked to provide a name and password for our user. Peppermint's installer works fairly quickly and concludes by offering to restart the computer.
The installer is the same whether launched from the live desktop session or from the boot menu. I also ran through the OEM install option once. The process is exactly the same, except the OEM install provides a default user account with the name "oem".
Peppermint 8 -- Enabling the firewall with Gufw
(full image size: 964kB, resolution: 1280x1024 pixels)
Hardware
I tested Peppermint in two environments, a VirtualBox virtual machine and on a desktop workstation. The distribution worked very well when running on the desktop computer. The system booted quickly, was responsive and all of my hardware was detected. Peppermint ships with a local printer manager application which made it fairly easy to set up my networked HP printer and the distribution used approximately 200MB of RAM when logged into its hybrid desktop environment.
When running in VirtualBox, Peppermint started out well. The operating system ran smoothly in VirtualBox, but was unable to make use of the host computer's full screen resolution. I installed VirtualBox guest modules through Peppermint's Additional Drivers tool, but this did not help. I then tried installing the latest VirtualBox guest modules from the project's repositories and this did not work out well either as it caused the system to no longer recognize keyboard input. A little investigation revealed that installing VirtualBox modules had removed several HWE driver packages, disabling my keyboard.
Once I got things put back the way they had been via a re-install, I played around with display settings and found I was unable to change my screen resolution through the Monitor configuration module in the Peppermint settings panel. The Monitor module always sets the VirtualBox monitor to its disabled setting, which means we cannot change screen resolution without disabling all visual output. I later found Peppermint has a second display configuration module called ARAndR which did allow me to adjust the screen's resolution settings. In the end, using a combination the Additional Drivers tool to install VirtualBox modules and the ARAndR tool to change screen resolution gave me the display settings I wanted.
Applications
Something I noticed when I first started using Peppermint was the organization of the application menu. While fairly easy to navigate, the menu has a few characteristics I found hard to get used to. The first is the application menu contains a mixture of local applications and web-based applications. Which software is run locally and which is run through a web browser is not clear and some experimenting is required to discover the items that run on-line. The second concern I faced was some applications are listed under their name while others are listed with a description. For example, in the application menu the entry called Files is the Nemo file manager and the Bittorrent Client entry is the Transmission bittorrent application. On the other hand, "ImageMagick (display Q16)" and "guvcview" are presented with their names only and no description. I think I would be fine with either approach, but I would prefer the application menu's entries to be consistent in their naming scheme.
Looking through the menu we find the Chromium web browser (with Flash support), the Transmission bittorrent software and the Evince document viewer. There is a Dropbox client which, when opened, launches a web browser to help us sign up for a Dropbox account. The VLC multimedia player is available along with a full range of media codecs. There is no dedicated audio player. We are supplied with the Xviewer image viewer, an archive manager, calculator and a tool for scanning images. We can get on-line using Network Manager and partition disks with the GNOME Disks application.
Peppermint supplies us with several web-app launchers, including the Pixlr image editor, GMail, Google Calendar and Google Drive. There are also several small games available through the application menu. Each of these launchers opens a web page in a dedicated web browser with a minimal interface. When working from the command line we find Peppermint supplies us with the GNU Compiler Collection. The distribution uses the systemd init software and runs on version 4.8 of the Linux kernel.
Most of the applications that shipped with Peppermint worked well for me. The default collection of software, while small, tends to be effective. My one big issue came from the Chromium web browser. After browsing for a few minutes, Chromium would simply stop displaying web pages. I could type in URLs and the browser would indicate the page had loaded, but fail to display anything. This happened several times and I found, when the bug occurred, Chromium would fail to even display its own settings page. I installed the Firefox web browser and found it worked smoothly without the display issue Chromium experienced, even when browsing the same pages.
Ice
Launchers for accessing web-apps are managed by a desktop tool called Ice. The Ice application is divided into two tabs. The first tab helps us create new short-cuts to web-apps and simply requires that we provide a URL for the desired website and a name. Ice can then look up an icon for the web-app and create a short-cut to the on-line resource in the application menu. Ice's second tab lists existing web-app launchers on our system and gives us the option of removing them. Web-apps opened from Ice launchers are presented in a window that shows us the requested web page without any of the usual web browser controls cluttering the interface.
Peppermint 8 -- Managing web-apps with Ice
(full image size: 1.2MB, resolution: 1280x1024 pixels)
Settings
Peppermint features a custom settings panel with five vertical tabs displayed down the left side of the window: User, Tweaks, Hardware, Network and System. Each tab contains a handful of configuration modules which help us adjust the user interface and underlying operating system. The User tab contains settings that adjust the look of the desktop, our keyboard's settings and language support. The Tweaks tab offers settings for adjusting system sounds, notifications, Flash settings and software update options. The Hardware tab includes modules for working with printers, monitor settings and power management. The Network tab covers setting up network connections, adjusting the firewall, setting up Samba network shares and enabling Bluetooth. The System tab handles user accounts, managing software packages, the system clock and disk partitions. Apart from the issue with screen resolution I mentioned earlier, each of these configuration modules worked well for me. The settings panel mostly launches very simple, single-purpose graphical modules which makes manipulating the individual settings straight forward.
Peppermint 8 -- The Peppermint settings panel
(full image size: 907kB, resolution: 1280x1024 pixels)
Software management
Peppermint provides its users with two graphical package managers. The first is called Software Manager (aka mintInstall). The mintInstall application begins by showing us a grid of software categories. We can click on a category to see a list of available applications, sorted with the most popular items first. Clicking on an entry brings up a longer description of the application, some screen shots and user reviews. We can click a button to install the selected software in the background while we continue to browse other items. I found mintInstall to be easy to navigate and the interface was responsive.
Peppermint 8 -- The software manager
(full image size: 670kB, resolution: 1280x1024 pixels)
The second graphical package manager is Synaptic. While mintInstall divides software into categories and focuses on desktop applications, Synaptic simply presents us with a list of available packages without concern for their role on the system. Synaptic works quickly, can handle upgrading installed packages and is quite flexible. Synaptic's interface is less modern looking, but it is a stable and capable package & repository manager.
When software updates are available, Peppermint displays a blue shield icon in the desktop's system tray. Clicking on the icon launches the mintUpdate update manager. Updates are listed along with a safety rating. A safety rating of 1 indicates a package is tested and safe while a score of 5 suggests the updated package is likely to cause stability issues. By default all updates are displayed and selected for us, but we can adjust mintUpdate to exclude updates with a high (unsafe) ranking if we value stability over security updates. I found the update manager worked well for me and, even with all potentially dangerous updates installed, my copy of Peppermint continued to work smoothly.
Peppermint 8 -- The update manager
(full image size: 714kB, resolution: 1280x1024 pixels)
Conclusions
I think the Peppermint OS distribution has a lot going for it. The distribution provides users with several years of support along with many software packages, thanks to its Ubuntu LTS base. The distribution is fairly light, requiring relatively little RAM and the desktop was very responsive in my test environments. For someone looking for a light operating system with a classic desktop environment, Peppermint is a good choice and it is one of the reasons I tend to recommend the distribution to people trying to prolong the life of older computers.
I did run into a little trouble with one settings module and the default Chromium web browser. However, I was able to work around both of these issues. I installed Firefox and used a second display module and that sorted out my problems nicely.
Peppermint's main claim to fame is the way it mixes web-apps with native applications and whether you love the distribution or not will likely hinge on this feature. If you like the idea of running some applications on-line in a streamlined browser window, making them look and act like locally run programs, then Peppermint is ideal. The Ice launcher manager makes it easy to set up links to on-line resources and present them in a way that is nearly like a native application. On the other hand, if you wish to draw a distinct line between the programs you run locally and the on-line resources you access (the way most Linux distributions do) then Peppermint's main feature may not appeal.
Personally, while I am not a fan of web-apps in general, I do like Peppermint's minimal style. The distribution ships with a low-resource desktop and not many applications to clutter up its menu. This combination makes the operating system fairly attractive, even if I don't plan to use on-line image editors and games.
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Hardware used in this review
My physical test equipment for this review was a desktop HP Pavilon p6 Series with the following specifications:
- Processor: Dual-core 2.8GHz AMD A4-3420 APU
- Storage: 500GB Hitachi hard drive
- Memory: 6GB of RAM
- Networking: Realtek RTL8111 wired network card
- Display: AMD Radeon HD 6410D video card
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Visitor supplied rating
Peppermint OS has a visitor supplied average rating of: 7.6/10 from 95 review(s).
Have you used Peppermint OS? You can leave your own review of the project on our ratings page.
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| Miscellaneous News (by Jesse Smith) |
New features coming to openSUSE, Tails fixes networking bug, Ubuntu 16.10 reaching EoL, the FSF certifies new hardware
The release of openSUSE 42.3 is expected to be published around the end of July. "The next minor version of openSUSE Leap is version 42.3. The release is mostly a refresh and hardware enablement release that will include more than 10,000 packages coming from both community and enterprise developers. openSUSE Leap 42.3 is extremely stable and hardened because it shares source code from SUSE Linux Enterprise (SLE) 12 Service Pack (SP) 3. Leap also benefits from the bug fixes and maintenance of community developers and SUSE engineers." The openSUSE team has put together a list of features which will be included in the new version. Some of the highlights include lockless TCP listener handling which will allow for faster and more scalable network servers. The systemd software will include the ability to limit the number of processes in a control group (cgroup), offering protection against runaway process forking and "fork bomb" attacks. Additional changes coming to openSUSE 42.3 can be found on the project's Features page.
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Tails is a Debian-based distribution which connects users to the Internet via the Tor network for anonymous web browsing. Tails recently released an update, Tails 3.0.1, and some users have reported problems with the minor point release. "If you upgraded Tails 3.0 to 3.0.1 with an automatic upgrade you most likely are experiencing problems, one of the most serious being that Tor does not work which makes most Internet activity impossible. If you are affected you can repair your Tails 3.0.1 by doing a manual upgrade to 3.0.1." Affected users can work around the issue by following the manual upgrade instructions.
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Adam Conrad has sent out a reminder to people running Ubuntu 16.10 (code name "Yakkety Yak") that this version of Ubuntu is nearing the end of its supported life. People currently running Ubuntu 16.10 may wish to upgrade to version 17.04 or switch to a long term support (LTS) release such as Ubuntu 16.04. "Ubuntu announced its 16.10 (Yakkety Yak) release almost 9 months ago, on October 13, 2016. As a non-LTS release, 16.10 has a 9-month support cycle and, as such, the support period is now nearing its end and Ubuntu 16.10 will reach end of life on Thursday, July 20th. At that time, Ubuntu Security Notices will no longer include information or updated packages for Ubuntu 16.10. The supported upgrade path from Ubuntu 16.10 is via Ubuntu 17.04." Upgrade instructions can be found on this Ubuntu community help page.
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The Free Software Foundation (FSF) has announced the organization has added 15 new devices to the list of hardware that respects user privacy and freedom. The list of newly certified hardware items includes three laptops, a few docking stations, a Bluetooth device and a few wi-fi USB adapters. An announcement on the FSF's website states: "The Free Software Foundation (FSF) today awarded Respects Your Freedom (RYF) certification to fifteen devices from Technoethical (formerly Tehnoetic): the TET-N150HGA, the TET-N300, the TET-N300HGA, the TET-N300DB, the TET-N450DB, the TET-BT4, the TET-X200, the TET-X200T, the TET-X200S, the TET-T400, the TET-400S, the TET-T500, the TET-X200DOCK, the TET-T400DOCK, and the TET-D16. The RYF certification mark means that the products meet the FSF's standards in regard to users' freedom, control over the product, and privacy." The Free Software Foundation's complete list of certified hardware can be found on the organization's Respects Your Freedom certified products page.
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These and other news stories can be found on our Headlines page.
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| Tips and Tricks (by Jesse Smith) |
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Gathering system information with osquery
osquery is an interesting technology that has intrigued me for a while, though I have been slow to try out this cross-platform utility. The osquery software allows the user to query information about the host operating system, gathering data the same way we would pull information from a database. Put another way, osquery lets us treat the operating system like a set of database tables where we can write SQL queries to find out about the system's status.
The osquery documentation reports the utility runs on Windows, macOS, Linux (Ubuntu LTS versions and CentOS 6 & 7 are supported), and FreeBSD. I first tried running osquery on a FreeBSD server, but found the package for FreeBSD was unavailable at the time of writing. (There is a port of osquery for FreeBSD for people willing to compile the software.) Digging through the osquery Downloads page I found a generic Deb file which should work for most modern Linux distributions based on Debian. In my case, I successfully installed the generic osquery Deb package on a Debian 8 "Jessie" system. The software's source code is available under a BSD-style license and enterprising users may wish to try to compile osquery from its source.
The osquery software is divided into two main pieces, the client (osqueryi) and daemon (osqueryd). I chose to focus on the osqueryi client which is a command line program that interprets our questions and displays answers in simple tables of text. Before trying out osquery it will be very useful to be familiar with SQL-style database queries as that is the primary way we interact with the osquery software.
The osqueryi interpreter uses the same commands and syntax as the SQLite database software. We can run the ".schema" command to show a list of tables and fields osquery recognizes. We can then use these listed tables to form questions osquery can answer.
As an example, there is a table called etc_hosts which contains the hostname and IP address information found in the system's /etc/hosts file. To see a list of addresses and hostnames in our system's hosts file we can launch osqueryi and, at its prompt, run the query:
SELECT * FROM etc_hosts;
There is a table called users which contains information found in the operating system's password (/etc/passwd) file. To see a list of all system accounts (accounts with a user ID of less than 1,000) we can type the following into osqueryi:
SELECT username FROM users WHERE uid < 1000;
There are some more dynamic commands which osquery will recognize. For example, we can get MD5 fingerprints of any file our user can see on the system by accessing the hash table.
SELECT md5 FROM hash WHERE path='/etc/passwd';
If we want to know what version of which operating system osquery is running on we can check the os_version table:
SELECT * FROM os_version;
There is a processes table that will show us the same information available through the top and ps commands. In this next example, I list all programs being run by my user (UID 1000) which are running with a reduced priority, or "nice" value.
SELECT pid, cmdline FROM processes WHERE uid=1000 AND nice > 0
If I wanted to know how long my computer had been on-line, I could check this with another query:
SELECT days, hours, minutes, seconds FROM uptime;
There are lots of additional tables which will return all kinds of information about what the system, and its processes, are doing. A full list of tables and fields can be found in the osquery documentation.
At this point some people may be thinking that these potential queries are all very well, but why use osquery when there are already well established command line programs which can be used to gather the same information? Why use osquery to get uptime or a list of running processes on the system when we could just use the uptime and ps commands? There are two good reasons I have found so far for using osquery rather than the standard set of Linux/BSD command line tools.
The first is that osquery provides a standard interface across multiple platforms. The available command line programs vary a little across operating systems and we cannot use the exact same commands on Windows, macOS, FreeBSD and GNU/Linux. The osquery software provides us with a set of tables and SQL queries which should work exactly the same across each supported operating system. This makes osquery a great information gathering tool in mixed environments.
The second and, for me at least, more compelling reason to use osquery is it allows the user to run complex queries, linking together separate pieces of data which would be difficult to gather with a simple shell command. The examples I used above have simple command line shell equivalents, however if we want to gather more complex information, osquery's SQL syntax makes it fairly easy for us to put together separate groups of data.
In the following example, I look up a list of programs running on my computer which are listening for network connections, or acting like network services. This information is gathered from the process_open_sockets table. Then I compare that list of programs with all the running programs from the processes table, which includes information on who is running each program. In the end, I get back a list of running programs that are acting as network services on my computer, along with which network port is being used and which user is running the program. In short, I can see not only what programs are acting as network services, but who is running them, opening potential security holes.
SELECT port.pid, port.local_port, p.uid, p.cmdline FROM process_open_sockets port, processes p WHERE port.local_port > 0 AND port.pid = p.pid;
Once again, this query should work the same way, regardless of which operating system it is run on, making osquery a very flexible information gathering tool. Earlier I mentioned there is a background daemon (osqueryd) which allows us to schedule queries. This enables us to set up automated reports that can check who is using a computer, what programs they are running and even if the digital fingerprint of a file has changed.
One of the few limitations I have run into while using osquery is the software will not alter the underlying operating system. This is, usually, a welcome security feature, but it means I am unable to update my hosts file or a user's information from within the query tool. This is probably for the best as it would otherwise open a potentially large security hole.
The osquery software presents its users with a wide range of tables for gathering, sorting and combining information. And, while these same functions could probably be duplicated with shell scripts, they would not be as cross-platform as what osquery provides. I also like that osquery uses established SQL syntax to present information as this makes the queries we write relatively short and recognizable to anyone who has worked with databases. This is definitely an administrative tool worth looking into.
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More tips can be found in our Tips and Tricks archive.
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| Released Last Week |
Rockstor 3.9.1
Suman Chakravartula has announced the release of Rockstor 3.9.1, an updated build of the project's CentOS-based Linux distribution designed specifically for Network-Attached Storage (NAS) or private cloud storage scenarios: "Rockstor 3.9.1 is now available. Six contributors have come together to close 30+ issues, including major feature updates and bug fixes to make this update happen. Disk encryption with LUKS is the biggest feature we've added and something the community has been wanting for a while. We've also added support for scheduling power management and jumbo frames, just to name a few. This update also comes with a 4.10 kernel from 'elrepo' and a btrfs-progs update from the Btrfs community. For new installs, we created a brand new 3.9.1 ISO image. Please purchase a subscription for Stable updates subscription after install and enjoy these benefits. Stable update subscribers can update from the UI as usual. Here's the list of issues we closed in this issue: support full disk LUKS; schedule power down/up of the system; graceful shutdown with cron job; UI Shares view incorrect sort on size...." Here is the full release announcement as published on the project's weblog.
Proxmox 5.0 "Virtual Environment"
Proxmox Virtual Environment (VE) is a Debian-based commercial distribution for running containers and virtual appliances. The Proxmox company has announced the release of a new version of the distribution which is based on Debian 9 "Stretch". "We are very happy to announce the final release of our Proxmox VE 5.0 - based on the great Debian 9 (codename 'Stretch') and a Linux Kernel 4.10. Replicas provide asynchronous data replication between two or multiple nodes in a cluster, thus minimizing data loss in case of failure. For all organizations using local storage the Proxmox replication feature is a great option to increase data redundancy for high I/Os avoiding the need of complex shared or distributed storage configurations. With Proxmox VE 5.0 Ceph RBD becomes the de-facto standard for distributed storage. Packaging is now done by the Proxmox team. The Ceph Luminous is not yet production ready but already available for testing. If you use Ceph, follow the recommendations below. We also have a simplified procedure for disk import from different hypervisors. You can now easily import disks from VMware, Hyper-V, or other hypervisors via a new command line tool called 'qm importdisk. Other new features are the live migration with local storage via QEMU, added USB und Host PCI address visibility in the GUI, bulk actions and filtering options in the GUI and an optimized NoVNC console." Additional information can be found in the company's release announcement.
SharkLinux 2017.07
The SharkLinux project produces a distribution based on Ubuntu and offers frequently updated installation media. The SharkLinux project as announced the release of a new snapshot, built on July 5, 2017. The new build offers improved hardware support through Ubuntu's Hardware Enablement (HWE) kernel, fixes for secure shell key generation and a slimmer default install of LibreOffice: "After a hiatus SharkLinux is releasing a new ISO build introducing several changes of significance. While normally an update to the ISO occurs each week, this will be the first update since mid June as builds were halted until several changes were completed and passed testing. Some of the most notable changes since June's build: Base System no longer supporting 4.4.* Generic kernel and will now be including Ubuntu-HWE-Edge series 4.10.* as the default. Mainline builds are still made available starting from 4.8* to most recent build. Finally offline installs are no longer required. The install media will no longer disable Internet connectivity when the install is started. Now using whiskermenu's 1.7.2 version instead of 1.5.1. Tooltips now show description of application on hover. Slight menu changes although nothing too significant. All configurations remain open to customization. Power/boot options relocated from the menu to the panel. Labeling is more clear with the icon clearly that of an on/off icon, with the location being next to the clock in the bottom right corner of the screen. LibreOffice no longer ships full suite. Base system now ships with word processor and spreadsheet by default with an option to install the remaining applications via dedicated cloud repo." Additional changes can be found in the project's release announcement.
Pardus 17.0
Pardus is a Turkish desktop distribution based on Debian. The Pardus project has announced the release of Pardus 17.0 which features the Xfce 4.12 desktop environment and version 4.9 of the Linux kernel. Applications such as Firefox 52.2 and LibreOffice 5.2 are also included. An English translation of the project's release announcement reads: Enjoy the most up-to-date and stable versions of software such as Firefox, LibreOffice, Thunderbird, and VLC Media Player while your hardware works smoothly and with high performance in the Pardus operating system that comes with Linux kernel 4.9.0. See the impact of power management on battery life on laptop computers thanks to the integration of these software as well as tlp software into Pardus." Further information on the software available in Pardus 17.0 can be found in the project's release notes.
Pardus 17.0 -- Running Xfce
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Development, unannounced and minor bug-fix releases
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| Torrent Corner |
Weekly Torrents
The table below provides a list of torrents DistroWatch is currently seeding. If you do not have a bittorrent client capable of handling the linked files, we suggest installing either the Transmission or KTorrent bittorrent clients.
Archives of our previously seeded torrents may be found in our Torrent Archive. We also maintain a Torrents RSS feed for people who wish to have open source torrents delivered to them. Thanks to Linux Tracker we are able to share the following torrent statistics.
Torrent Corner statistics:
- Total torrents seeded: 481
- Total data uploaded: 14.4TB
You may note that this week's "Total data uploaded" torrent statistic is lower than last week's. This is because the old stat, which we were importing from the Linux Tracker server, included all data uploaded by both ourselves and any users who were using torrents linked to our Linux Tracker account. The new, lower value represents only data our server has uploaded.
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| Upcoming Releases and Announcements |
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Summary of expected upcoming releases
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| Opinion Poll |
Running Debian Stable on laptop and desktop computers
One of our readers suggested the following poll concerning running Debian Stable and repository usage on desktop and laptop computers.
I am very curious about usage patterns among those who use Debian Stable on the desktop/laptop, i.e. excluding servers and enterprise. Those of you who run Debian Stable on your desktops, workstations and laptops, do you use Debian's Stable repositories exclusively? Do you install software from other Debian repositories, use third-party repositories or even compile software from source code? Feel free to share where you get your Debian software in the comments.
You can see the results of our previous poll on single purpose, single platform projects in last week's edition. All previous poll results can be found in our poll archives.
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Installing software on Debian Stable
| I use official Debian Stable repos only: | 243 (11%) |
| I use official Debian Stable repos and Backports only: | 265 (12%) |
| I pin at least one app from Testing/Sid/Experimental: | 37 (2%) |
| I install at least one app from a third-party repo: | 151 (7%) |
| I install at least one package from a third-party website: | 92 (4%) |
| I install at least one application from source: | 28 (1%) |
| I install at least one Flatpak/Snap/AppImage: | 17 (1%) |
| I have done at least two of items 3-7: | 269 (12%) |
| I run a Debian flavour other than Stable: | 283 (13%) |
| I do not run Debian: | 865 (38%) |
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| DistroWatch.com News |
New torrent tracker
In response to distribution developers reporting they are having trouble finding open torrent trackers where they can publish torrents of new releases, we have set up a torrent tracker for DistroWatch. The tracker allows visitors to DistroWatch to upload torrents for new versions of Linux and BSD.
At the moment the DistroWatch tracker is still in beta testing and we invite people who would like to upload open source torrents to e-mail us to gain upload privileges. Torrents uploaded to the DistroWatch tracker will automatically be added to our Torrent Archive.
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New projects added to database
ArchStrike
ArchStrike is a distribution for security professionals and researchers based on Arch Linux. ArchStrike provides an extra repository of security software and is available in 32-bit and 64-bit builds. ArchStrike provides a live desktop environment based on the Openbox window manager.
ArchStrike 2016.07.21 -- Running the Openbox window manager
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Redcore Linux
Redcore Linux explores the idea of bringing the power of Gentoo Linux to the masses. It aims to be a very quick way to install a pure Gentoo Linux system without spending hours or days compiling from source code, and reading documentation. To achieve this goal, Redcore provides a repository with pre-built binary packages which receives continuous updates, following a rolling release model.
Redcore Linux 1706 -- Running the LXQt desktop
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UBOS
UBOS is a Linux distribution designed to greatly reduce the amount of time required to set up and maintain common network services. UBOS features a command line utility, ubos-admin, which makes it possible to set up services such as Wordpress, NextCloud and wiki software with a single command. Backing up all services and restoring them can also be accomplished by issuing a short command in the shell. UBOS is a rolling release distribution based on Arch Linux.
UBOS 11 -- Displaying a list of installed services
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* * * * *
Distributions added to waiting list
- ArchBox. ArchBox is a desktop distribution based on Arch Linux. ArchBox features a live disc running the Openbox window manager and offers the option of installing the distribution to the local hard drive.
* * * * *
DistroWatch database summary
* * * * *
This concludes this week's issue of DistroWatch Weekly. The next instalment will be published on Monday, 17 July 2017. Past articles and reviews can be found through our Article Search page. To contact the authors please send e-mail to:
- Jesse Smith (feedback, questions and suggestions: distribution reviews/submissions, questions and answers, tips and tricks)
- Ladislav Bodnar (feedback, questions, donations, comments)
- Bruce Patterson (podcast)
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| Reader Comments • Jump to last comment |
1 • Debian repositories (by Trihexagonal on 2017-07-10 00:40:58 GMT from United States)
I use FreeBSD as my main desktop OS but do run a Debian box and use the Stable repository exclusively.
2 • Peppermint (by Katcipis on 2017-07-10 01:17:37 GMT from Brazil)
Glad to see my favorite distro been nice reviewed. Only waitting to check the performance of Wattos 11, the contender.
3 • Debian (by Promet on 2017-07-10 02:02:19 GMT from Hong Kong)
I sometimes use Debian in VirtualBox. When I use Debian, I always stay at testing repo and keep rolling.
Some software in Debian sid can even be more conservative than other distro's stable version, meh.
4 • "this did not work out well either..." (by OS2_user on 2017-07-10 02:12:32 GMT from United States)
"... as it caused the system to no longer recognize keyboard input." Lucky you're an expert, as myself would have just deleted the VM and then the ISO file.
"I was unable to change my screen resolution" -- Yeah, I've found they love to hide the real controls in a 2nd obscure place, never bothering to mention: "second display configuration module called ARAndR".
"Which software is run locally and which is run through a web browser" -- Good, good. It's 2017 and we're moving back to time-shared terminals.
"The Ice software helps users set up short-cuts to websites and web-apps." Wow. Just like Windows, which I'm pretty sure has been doing that via "Properties" since at least 1993. -- Now that I think, DON'T know how to start a browser with specific URL in Linux, the icons don't seem to have "Properties".
Oh, well. I have given up on Linux (except for PCLinuxOS 2017, data seems safe, I just don't trust the GUI), but when I see the same struggles with basics here every week, the snark has gotta pop out.
I thought PCLinuxOS 2007 was great, was awed that could surf the web while it installed, no problems, and in only about 20 minutes! Now, you're writing code beyond anyone's abilities or needs. -- Just my 2 bucks. You're welcome.
5 • Debian (by dreadnaut on 2017-07-10 03:15:03 GMT from United States)
Stopped using Debian 2 years ago, replaced it with Devuan. My Devaun aplha install was finally upgraded to final stable in May. Not once did it even hicup over those two years.
No way would I use a distribution or derivative that doesn't have the user best interest in mind.
Not going to kick the systemd dog, clearly everyone knows that the original statement of it's implementation was a ruse for something more sinister.
6 • @4 (by dave on 2017-07-10 03:17:34 GMT from United States)
"Lucky you're an expert, as myself would have just deleted the VM and then the ISO file."
Nobody (with a brain) expects every OS to function perfectly in a VM, especially when that OS is a specialty OS such as Peppermint.
"Good, good. It's 2017 and we're moving back to time-shared terminals."
Terminals never went anywhere; they were rebranded as 'thin clients' and later 'netbooks'. The OS being reviewed was originally intended for netbooks. Despite changes in the marketing nomenclature, that general system target has not really changed.
"Wow. Just like Windows, which I'm pretty sure has been doing that via "Properties" since at least 1993. -- Now that I think, DON'T know how to start a browser with specific URL in Linux, the icons don't seem to have "Properties"."
Well if you couldn't figure it out, it must not be possible. ;)
"Oh, well. I have given up on Linux (except for PCLinuxOS 2017, data seems safe, I just don't trust the GUI), but when I see the same struggles with basics here every week, the snark has gotta pop out."
Snark? More like Troll.
"I thought PCLinuxOS 2007 was great, was awed that could surf the web while it installed, no problems, and in only about 20 minutes! Now, you're writing code beyond anyone's abilities or needs. -- Just my 2 bucks. You're welcome."
Use it and Windows Vista til you turn as blue as the screen in front of you.
7 • Synaptic (by Pat Menendez on 2017-07-10 03:30:07 GMT from Canada)
The review of Peppermint 8 has a factual inaccuracy. "Synaptic simply presents us with a list of available packages without concern for their role on the system" Synaptic doesn't just give you a list of packages and does have them available by category. Simply click on "sections" at the bottom and all the packages are arranged by function or category. I wish that everyone would switch to Synaptic. I've enjoyed using many other distros but end up with package management problems and walking away. In the 21st century as important as package management (pulling in dependencies) and updates should be simple as Synaptic and as 100% as consistently reliable as Synaptic.
8 • Synaptic (by lupus on 2017-07-10 04:29:12 GMT from Germany)
#7
Pat is right. For the moment I´m a happy camper with Manjaro and trying to solve the Solus Puzzle why they don´t integrate more Software, but whenever I somehow run into those shop like appliances for dealing with Software like in some Buntus or Elementary I directly turn to search if Synaptic is directly available because it is a tried and true piece of Software that never failed on me or annoyed me in one of the bazillion ways the more modern Softwareshops always do.
In Manjaro I had to learn to live without it..... and to my complete surprise there always is a way!
9 • Peppermint vs Linux Lite (by Simon Wainscott-Plaistowe on 2017-07-10 06:23:29 GMT from New Zealand)
I was using Peppermint to refurbish old computers but have recently switched to Linux Lite because to my mind it provides a slightly more consistent interface, also it leans towards local apps rather than the mix of web & local. Peppermint is an awesome distro though, I like it a lot. Anyway, to those who find it's almost but not quite what they want, I'd suggest giving Lite a try.
10 • Debain Package Poll (by cykodrone on 2017-07-10 07:40:12 GMT from Canada)
When I WAS running Debian, before systemd(isease), I used backports and downloaded .deb packages, as long as they matched my installed Debian version. I've even used alien to transform .rpm packages in to .deb packages. Then there's stuff like the Tor Browser (the repo install really sucks in Devuan, it keeps borking the signature check), I downloaded the distro agnostic executable (tor-browser-linux64-7.0.1_en-US.tar.xz, probably a higher version now) from the Tor Browser site, plopped the extracted folder in /home (you have to run it at least once first for it to create an icon you can work with), then made a menu entry in Xfce with 'Menu Editor'. Oh, I guess I should mention you have to find the Tor Browser icon (/home/username/tor-browser_en-US/Browser/icons/) and copy it to /usr/share/icons/, make sure the newly copied icon has the same permissions as the other icons in the same folder before using Menu Editor. You could just do it the simple way, run Tor once, right click on the newly created Tor icon and Send To/Desktop (Create Link). I've even compiled a few apps, if you have an internet connection and can copy and paste a command in to a terminal, you're good to go (if dependencies can be met, it's good to have backports enabled before compiling). I know most of you here know this stuff, it's actually aimed at newer users.
11 • PeppermintOS is the only distro that works smoothly out of box (by jinalix on 2017-07-10 09:12:09 GMT from Canada)
As a veteran distro-hopper PeppermintOS never failed me as i have installed iit nto countless old machines for those folks with old computers .....
Peppermint isn't only pretty it also works out of the box. ... all smooth and charming.
Thank you PeppermintOS team ...!
12 • welcome back PARDUS ,,,! (by Malabadix on 2017-07-10 09:25:19 GMT from Canada)
I'm very delighted to just to see that Pardus, my Turkish delight distro has returned to its original grounbreaking as a DESKTOP-tailorred distro for computer user out there.
13 • re. 4 & others (by Someguy on 2017-07-10 09:47:51 GMT from United Kingdom)
Used to like Peppermint, but no longer: trying to re-invent the wheel. An OS is nothing unless it usable by regular folk. Not to deny the guys who enjoy inventing new/different ways of operating, the Arch-ists and the Gentoos and co. PCL, Mint and a couple of others are popular because they work for more of us, have helpful fora, and exhibit raw productivity. K.I.S.S. still pertains.
14 • Custom scripts problem with Peppermint (by lenn on 2017-07-10 10:49:22 GMT from Canada)
There are some bugs in Peppermint. The old scripts don't always work well with newer Python. One of the problems Jessie had with Chromium happens from that. This problem with Chromium was happening for sometime (in Peppermint 7) too. Chromium is developing faster than the custom scripts.
Peppermint 4 was quite interesting in the old days, but things have changed in much faster for Peppermint 8 to catch up. If you want to get rid of the problems with Chromium, you have to reinstall Chromium in the vanilla state. When you do that, most probably the ICE integration would break. So, you have to decide, whether to use any other web browser to browse the web and use ICE with the default Chromium. After a while, you'd probably uninstall Peppermint.
15 • Synaptic (by Jesse on 2017-07-10 11:25:19 GMT from Canada)
@7: I think there was a misunderstanding with regard to my description of Synaptic. I Was not saying you cannot filter the list of packages. In this context I was pointing out Synaptic does not treat any packages as special or different. Most modern software managers will show just desktop applications by default and filter out non-desktop software. Synaptic does not do that. It treats all packages the same. That is what I meant by Synaptic not caring about a package's role.
You can filter packages in Synaptic, but each package is treated the same as the others.
16 • Web Application Launchers (by Winchester on 2017-07-10 12:23:07 GMT from United States)
Directly from this review :
"Ice's second tab lists existing web-app launchers on our system and gives us the option of removing them."
So,what would be the issue?? It seems pretty easy to sort out with a minimal time investment.
"On the other hand, if you wish to draw a distinct line between the programs you run locally and the on-line resources you access (the way most Linux distributions do) then Peppermint's main feature may not appeal."
Shouldn't one be able to simply edit the .desktop files in order to clarify the situation?? Change the title from (as an example) "Pixlr" to "Pixlr Web Application" or to "Pixlr Online Image Editor".
Alternatively,the aforementioned second tab in "Ice" should be able to be used to accomplish the same basic result. An example would be to examine the contents of a web app launcher,copy them into a text editor,remove the original launcher,and then create a new web app launcher with a more descriptive title. "Pixlr Online Image Editor" again as an example.
You could probably also edit the menu and .desktop files to create a new menu category entitled "Web Applications" and that would be another way of sorting them out.
A couple of side notes :
1) PALDO (Pure Adaptable Linux Distribution) has a similar feature through the latest version of the Epiphany Web Browser. In the Epiphany menu,there is an option to "install as web application" which creates .desktop files which,of course,can be edited. Change the title,category,point to an alternative icon,change the "exec" command in the desktop file to launch via FireFox instead of Epiphany. This is a strength of GNU / Linux operating systems ..... they can be customized and configured to meet individual preferences.
2) Local image editing applications such as the GNU Image Manipulation Program,Image Magick,and Pinta do not seem to support overlays. The online application "PicMonkey" makes it easy to overlay one image onto another with various modes of "blending" the images. "PicMonkey" can be used to create visually appealing icons and wallpapers although it now requires signing up for at least a free account.
17 • @ 15 Synaptic (by OstroL on 2017-07-10 14:26:03 GMT from Poland)
"Most modern software managers will show just desktop applications by default and filter out non-desktop software. Synaptic does not do that. It treats all packages the same. That is what I meant by Synaptic not caring about a package's role."
Which one is the 'most modern software manager' here, the Mint Install?
"You can filter packages in Synaptic, but each package is treated the same as the others."
I believe that's the best part of Synaptic, its treating all packages equally. With Synaptic, you'd know which dependencies might be installed, while these 'most modern software managers' want you to be a click and shoot guy. By using these software managers, your installation depends on the whims of the creators of those software managers. Synaptic had been there for so long earned the trust of its users.
18 • Peppermint (by Chris on 2017-07-10 14:33:40 GMT from United States)
I've been running Peppermint since version 1. In fact, I first found it on here about 7 years ago, when I was running Mint KDE. Peppermint is currently the only OS I run on my computers. (I occasionally test other Linux distros, but not much) It tends to "just work," there's not a lot of configuration required out of the box, in my opinion. Just a few personal tweaks, but that's true of any OS. I like its stability and the fact that it comes with a minimal amount of pre-installed programs, allowing me to add what I want without having to uninstall a lot of stuff I don't care for right off the bat. I've never been a fan of web apps or ICE, but it's cool for what it is. Anyway, it's nice seeing a good review of my favorite OS.
19 • Peppermint (by Hotdiggettydog on 2017-07-10 15:15:24 GMT from United States)
I'm with Chris. Peppermint is a class act. I've used all the mentioned alternatives. They have their strengths and their bugs.
20 • @18 (by dave on 2017-07-10 16:00:45 GMT from United States)
yo dawg, did you just say ICE is cool? ayyyy nobody can argue with that ;)
21 • Debian (by Steve on 2017-07-10 17:21:24 GMT from United States)
Since Debian jumped on the cancerous systemd bandwagon I quit using it. I've been using FreeBSD for servers and PCLinuxOS for a desktop.
fyi... I wouldn't have as big a problem with systemd if they had kept it as JUST an init system, but it quickly turned into a cancer spreading throughout the entire system. That is so microsoft and I turned to Linux to get away from that crap. Never have understood what is so wrong with initV... it works, it's easy to manipulate, it's easy to manage, and it uses plain text files for config, and it only does init... what's so wrong with that?
22 • @21 (by Martin on 2017-07-10 19:33:20 GMT from United Kingdom)
I completely agree! I used to use Debian in one form or another but have now gone over to Deuvan derived distros for precisely those reasons.
23 • SystemDisease (by Miss Terry on 2017-07-10 19:55:53 GMT from United States)
Fully agree with #21, et al.
SystemD is Redhat cancer. Devuan is the cure.
Long live the Unix philosophy of simplicity and modularity.
24 • Peppermint && (by kaczor on 2017-07-10 19:56:35 GMT from United States)
Most of you might not remember, Peppermint was started in 2010, when Mint didn't want to continue with the LXDE release. The developer of that LXDE section left to create Peppermint. Two months later Peppermint ICE came about. Nothing serious had been changed in that ICE software since then. Some might say 'Peppermint Ice has been rewritten from scratch' again for Peppermint 5, it was just bug fixed to match the fast developing web browsers. Anyway, ICE had been actually losing fans from about Peppermint 3 days. Around Peppermint 5, there is no one really to bring it to life in the team. There was an idea to put Peppermint in to 'had been' category, that is close down.
Messing up (or mixing up) Xfce's wm and Lxde's apps is going to trouble, specially in upgrading. If it stayed with Openbox wm and used whatever panel (xfce4, lxpanel, tint2), it would have been a great distro.
Because Peppermint wants to use the Whisker menu, it needs Xfce4 panel. The control panel looks different, but the buttons direct to known settings apps, most Xfce, one or two Lxde. Actually, the dev is complicating matters and creating unnecessary problems for users by mixing xfce and lxde apps. The appearance settings app of Xfce is much better than the Lxapperance app, considering Peppermint uses Xfwm4 as its window manager. There is no actual reason to use Lxde logout, instead of very good Xfce4 logout app (extension).
These problems were in Peppermint 7. This latest release 8 is just a bug fixed Peppermint 7, but some bugs are still there. Peppermint is based on Lubuntu (not based on as some try to say). All Peppermint OSs were based on Lubuntu.
Pepermint is not faster than Xubuntu or Lubuntu, especially Lubuntu, for it uses Openbox as its WM. The only difference it has over Lubuntu or Xubuntu is the ICE configuration. Not an advantage, but a difference.
Xfce4 Windows manager tweaks is renamed as Peppermint Control Center. Changing of backgrounds is done by Nitrogen (usually used in Openbox), instead of native Xfce app. Using Lxapperance, instead of Xfce4 Window Manager doesn't give any special effect. The same with using Lxde's logout instead of Xfce4's logout. Lubuntu doesn't have a menu like Whisker, so the use of Xfce4-panel. Lxpolkit, instead of gnome policykit. Mint update, instead of update-manager and etc.
The only difference is the ICE software. They were very good in those olden days. Most of the web browsers are so advanced these days, such software practically loses its value.
25 • Archbox (by gekxxx on 2017-07-10 20:33:07 GMT from Belgium)
Archbox looks great, so I decided to install. I find the installer incomplete as it seems not able to partition the HD from scratch. I was proposed to use the partition of my current installed system. So I think the installer needs some more work.
26 • Archbox & Debian 9 (by Bill on 2017-07-10 23:36:10 GMT from Canada)
Archbox is not sufficiently developed for install. Please do your homework before publishing your distro. Debian 9 is simply the most stable distro I have experienced in the last 10 years. My compliments to those who have worked so hard to make is such a success. Antergos is a truly remarkable arch distro for the average or new user and a welcome addition to the linux. There are may good linux distros available for a new user.
Bill
27 • Previous 3 Posts (by Winchester on 2017-07-11 05:06:47 GMT from United States)
Regarding Post # 24 , what does web browsers becoming more advanced have to do with "Ice" losing its value?? Perhaps because it integrates with an outdated version of Chromium?? The purpose seems to be to save time and to save a step launching a web based online application. Almost like having an icon in the browser's bookmark bar except you can save the step of launching the browser to its home page and then going to the site of the web application. This saves time for people who use web-based applications. Sure,you can manually create desktop files without "Ice" once you learn the exec commands and manually download and size the icons but,the aim,I assume,is to make it easier on beginners.
Regarding post # 25,the installer may need work regarding partitioning but,obviously you can partition the hard drive beforehand with any number of live iso's.
Regarding post # 26,why do you consider ArchBox "not sufficiently developed for install"?? I used the live iso without any problem but decided not to install only because I don't want to have more than 1 Arch based system. I am not saying that you are wrong or right but,I am interested to know the reason(s) for your opinion. Others have reported success installing ArchBox.
28 • pepeprmint os (by peer on 2017-07-11 05:14:19 GMT from Netherlands)
Peppermint used to be a great os in my opinion. I started with peppermint 2. Until peppermint 5 every version was an improvement. But then it became too complex for me.
I tried 6, and 7 but I did not like it anymore.
I used to like peppermint because it was simple, fast and worked on all ps's I tried. So I still have a weakness for peppermint.
29 • @ 26 (by lenn on 2017-07-11 05:35:02 GMT from Canada)
"Archbox is not sufficiently developed for install."
Well, that's quite funny. It installs vanilla Arch + some additional apps. The installer is the same that installed Arch Linux in the old days. Installers can differ, but the system you are installing is Arch Linux. And, that's all you need, if you are interesting in having an Arch Linux system in your computer.
"Debian 9 is simply the most stable distro I have experienced in the last 10 years."
Maybe, but what does Debian 9 has to do with Archbox, Aantergos or Arch Linux?
30 • @ 27 (by kaczor on 2017-07-11 05:56:57 GMT from United States)
> except you can save the step of launching the browser to its home page and then going to the site <
I suppose, its very rare to find someone without an open web browser at any time on any running desktop computer or a laptop. You don't open the web browsers home page and then go to other pages you usually look in every day. There are bookmarks, speed dials and so on for quite sometime. You can open your browser with all your sites/pages you like anytime. If you enable tab previews, you don't even have to move away from your current web page to check what's there in another tab.
ICE was a good thing, something fab few years ago. Is it today?
31 • Debian User - Boring Person (by Peter Besenbruch on 2017-07-11 06:32:53 GMT from United States)
I've run Debian since Woody, and full time since Sarge. Before that I distro-hopped and tried to get things to work. I was a KDE user, but jumped to XFCE during the KDE3 to 4 fiasco. The most exciting things on my desktop are wallpaper images that change every two days. My title bars are slightly translucent. When I maximize a window, the title bar goes away. Please stop me if I cause too much excitement.
Lately I have gone into the cloud, and set up a Debian based VPN server. Every once and a while I type "my ip" into DuckDuckGo and find that my VPN is still talking to my computer. That's getting boring.
I'll finish by saying that the only thing more boring than updating to the next Debian Stable is watching XFCE change with it. The change from XFCE 4.10 to 4.12 was so profound as to produce heart palpitations and fainting spells. I'm still trying to find what's changed.
32 • @ 24 and @ Jessie (by OstroL on 2017-07-11 08:00:52 GMT from Poland)
The first picture in Distrowatch review says, "At Peppermint we don't make choices for you."
Peppermint doesn't allow you to choose the themes you like. Someone might say, why not, you can change the themes from "Change Look and Feel." But can you really? You'd never change the top bar and the borders. They'd always be dark and have the Numix look. Change to Clearlooks for example and see for yourself.
This is done by deleting the Xfce Window Manager (Xfwm themes) and Xfce Apperance (Gtk themes) by Pepeprmint. Why doesn't the reviewer see such things?
33 • I Can Haz Linuks! (by Kragle von Schnitzelbank on 2017-07-11 09:01:22 GMT from United States)
Some version of U'bu is now available in the Microsoft Windows 10 store,
A tidy reversal of running Windows sandboxed in a VM?
34 • I use Debian testing (by paperman on 2017-07-11 11:02:41 GMT from France)
I use debian testing. I mostly use what's in the testing repo but I also build some apps from source if they're not in the repo.
35 • debian (by dogma on 2017-07-11 13:51:46 GMT from United States)
I’ve switched mostly to freebsd at present, with a bit of oldoldstable debian. For reasons that start with an ’s’. When oldoldstable is no longer supported at all, it will be time to make a decision on how the devuan community is looking, probably.
36 • XFWM (by davidnotcoulthard on 2017-07-11 15:50:09 GMT from Indonesia)
@32 Can't you just install/re-add XFWM's customiser to the app menu (by editing a file in /usr(/local?)/share/applications)? (I don't use peppermint though so I wouldn't really know)
37 • Non-systemd distros (by davidnotcoulthard on 2017-07-11 15:54:45 GMT from Indonesia)
@23 Or there's Salix and Slackware, in case Devuan goes Kaputt (not that I expect that to happen - if MATE can avoid that, why not Devuan?)
38 • systemd (by THOR on 2017-07-11 16:16:06 GMT from United States)
I started running Debian in 2003 and I love it! I do not understand why people are upset with systemd
would some tell me what the problem is. I ran a lot of other systems and none even come close to being as good as Debian just look at how many people copy it change its name and call it their own. I think systemd made it better!
39 • Debian User (by admin on 2017-07-11 16:20:48 GMT from Mexico)
I always run and use the Debian testing repos, I like to be on the (leading edge,)
never had a serious problem. I love Debian because is fast, stable and everything justs works.
40 • Systemd (by Doug on 2017-07-11 17:10:00 GMT from United States)
@38 THOR
I think comment 21 explained it best.
Systemd does things an init has no business doing.
41 • @ 36 (by lenn on 2017-07-11 17:17:05 GMT from Canada)
Why don't you install Peppermint and reinstall XFWM's customiser to check what'd happen? It'd simply break. The same way, try to install original synaptic in Linux Mint. It'd break too.
You don't have to worry much about upgrading distros such as Voyager, as it is simply Xubuntu with 2 additional xfce4-panels and some interesting scripts.
I might say the same about Linux Lite. It also has quite interesting scripts, but you can upgrade it to 17.10 without a problem. Other than the nice welcome screen, a very good manual, its just Xubuntu with another wallpaper. These scripts bring in Index, Start, Support and Contribute, but they are harmless for the rest of the system. Its the same with LXLE, only that is based on Lubuntu.
42 • Peppermint (by Scuttlbeuck on 2017-07-12 03:26:00 GMT from Nicaragua)
I am not a Buntu / debian user debian hates me..and Buntu i tried many years back maybe the first or second version released...never liked it at all...I was a Mandriva or slackware user then but distro hopped on most distros that came out.
I Have installed a lot of peoples comps with Peppermint in the past (and WattOS) mainly for people new to linux and on older comps...I find Peppermint to be nice and easy for newbs, easy to install and very stable...
But these days with easy to install Gentoo with Calculate one of the best distros I have used for a long time, and awesome slackware based distros like Salix and Slackel. I find i can now install a lot of different distros for people without much thought or need to revisit to keep up to date.
@26 Archbox is not sufficiently developed for install......Wrong !!!! just installed it...i prefer this installer to many of the new ones, if given a choice i reject any graphical ones maybe i have just installed a lot over the years
43 • This site has been blocked by your ISP. (by OstroL on 2017-07-12 06:13:46 GMT from Poland)
"This site has been blocked by your ISP.
Well, not yet. But without net neutrality, cable companies could censor websites, favoring their own business partners. We can stop them and keep the Internet open, fast, and awesome if we all contact the U.S. Congress and the FCC, but we only have a few days left. Learn more."
Most governments dream of controlling everyone and to have an eye on everything the citizen is doing. USA is suppose to be the leader of the "free world". But is it?
44 • Peppermint, THE MiNiMALiST and the best ! (by Nemrut on 2017-07-12 08:21:10 GMT from Canada)
@19 - i want to secoond Chris, as i have the exact same positive experience running Peppermint ..., and hope Peppermint devs never dreail from Peppermint's main attraction: THE MINIMALISM
@24 - Thank you kaczor for your really interesting history briefing of Peppermint ...
And now here's a simple request from the Peppermints' devs: it would be truly helpful if Peppermint comes with a usb-persistence installer
45 • Post # 30 / Post # 41 (by Winchester on 2017-07-12 13:44:16 GMT from United States)
Re: Post # 30
> "I suppose, its very rare to find someone without an open web browser at any time on any running desktop computer or a laptop." <
What about the time immediately after starting the operating system??
>"You don't open the web browsers home page and then go to other pages you usually look in every day."<
I do. Maybe not the web browser's DEFAULT home page but,whichever page is set as the home page in the web browser's preferences settings. That is still true even if a "speed dial" page is set as the browser's home page.
>"There are bookmarks, speed dials and so on for quite sometime. You can open your browser with all your sites/pages you like anytime. If you enable tab previews, you don't even have to move away from your current web page to check what's there in another tab."<
This method still requires at least one extra step compared to a desktop file which launches the browser to a specific web page,a site that you do not wish to be set as the web browser's default home page.
>"ICE was a good thing, something fab few years ago. Is it today?"<
I think so. Fab ..... I don't know or really care for that matter. I would say that "Ice" is still a good thing. It saves time compared to manually writing customized desktop files completely from scratch for those who know how to do that. Also,it makes it easier for beginners to add such desktop files to their system. Beginners,many of whom might not have even otherwise known this type of desktop customization was even an option.
It's not a huge deal but,it is nice in certain situations. My grandmother has a Facebook icon on her desktop which,when clicked,launches the web browser to Facebook. My kids like online games. They have a National Geographic Animal Jam icon on their desktops which launch the web browser directly to the Animal Jam log-in page.
There's no real reason to bash "Ice". If you don't want to use it or need its functionality,then obviously,you don't have to use it. The pre-installed launchers can be very easily removed, It's nice having it available for people that it benefits.
Re: Post # 41
This may sound petty but, I am grateful that there are distributions out there which offer the same basic functionality as Xubuntu or Lubuntu but without the ridiculous titles. I find it easier to give someone a system called Voyager or Linux Lite with a straight face as opposed to giving them something called "Xubuntu". Just the same LXLE sounds MUCH better than "Lubuntu".
On the more practical side (even though I actually don't use operating systems from the Ubuntu family much,especially of late),I have found that "WattOS" boots up faster than "official" Ubuntu distributions and supposedly (I can't confirm or deny this particular aspect) uses less power.
46 • Peppermint OS 8 (by eco2geek on 2017-07-12 15:00:38 GMT from United States)
OstroL (@32) wrote:
> Peppermint doesn't allow you to choose the themes you like.
> Someone might say, why not, you can change the themes from
> "Change Look and Feel." But can you really? You'd never
> change the top bar and the borders. They'd always be dark
> and have the Numix look.
You can use "Customize Look and Feel" (lxappearance) to change the style of the widgets. To change the windows decorations (the "top bar and the borders", as you say), use the Peppermint Control Center > Window Manager tab > Theme drop-down box. It's mix and match.
Not sure why there's so much negativity toward Peppermint in the comments. It's been around for a while; it's an interesting mashup of LXDE and Xfce; it's got some interesting default software choices (e.g. Nemo and Chromium); and it's got an online user guide and online forum, all for the price of "free".
47 • @43 - Net Neutrality (by Chris on 2017-07-12 15:11:29 GMT from United States)
@43 - So you appear to equate a government mandate, even one with allegedly good intentions, to equal freedom? Hmm...interesting.
If I do not like an OS (or any product), I choose a different one. If I do not like my employer for whatever reason, I request changes be made, find a new one, or start my own business. If I do not like a business' practices (i.e., my ISP), I request changes be made or take my money elsewhere. If no options currently exist for such things, but enough demand does, then a better option will soon exist for me to choose or create myself.
In a truely free-market, one votes with their voice, feet, wallet, and hands; I do not need any government mandate for that. I think people confuse what freedom really is.
48 • web browsers (by Trihexagonal on 2017-07-12 15:51:53 GMT from United States)
@30 - "I suppose, its very rare to find someone without an open web browser at any time on any running desktop computer or a laptop.You don't open the web browsers home page and then go to other pages you usually look in every day. "
I only open a web browser when I actually want to visit a site, and then have it open to about:blank. After I'm finished I close it out.
In contrast, I have one terminal and file manager open at boot to work from, and usually open another terminal right away to run top or for multitasking as long as the machine is up.
49 • systemd (by homo truculentus on 2017-07-12 16:53:09 GMT from United States)
With very few exceptions, virtually all major Linux distributions use systemd. That is because the vast majority of Linux developers actually think systemd is better than sysvinit. That's why they decided to use systemd in their respective Linux distros. I see here a bunch of people that are clearly clueless compared to those developers. Yet, the clueless have very strong opinions and are very vocal (which was expected). That's OK, because the vast majority of Linux users use systemd regardless. Until someone writes a better replacement for systemd, systemd remains the best init system (at least according to the most knowledgeable Linux users, the developers).
50 • @47 (by Jay on 2017-07-12 17:29:34 GMT from United States)
That's the theory, but in practice it doesn't work that way. Many people don't have the interest/time/skills to do their own versions of stuff when nothing exists. I'm not going to try to start my own internet just because I don't like how something is done. I have to work within the system, like it or not, but many "choices" or "possibilities" just really aren't practical anymore.
51 • @49 (by Anonymous Coward on 2017-07-12 18:03:53 GMT from United States)
systemd best init system
This depends on which developers you refer to. For the gnome developers, yes for KDE developers maybe? But for simple desjtop developers, it would be a different answer.
52 • Arch_way_to_learn_and_tailor (by k on 2017-07-12 19:41:24 GMT from France)
@ 26
For example, if you need a state-of-the-art rolling-release linux operating system on a USB "thumbdrive" to boot on UEFI hardware.
The Arch community offers full documentation for UEFI-tailored installation and then, if you want a fully "developed" desktop to accomodate most users's needs, install Manjaro with Gnome, pacman install "linux", pacman install Gnome, and free yourself.
53 • Oh boy! (by OstroL on 2017-07-12 20:32:31 GMT from Poland)
@ 40
"This may sound petty but, I am grateful that there are distributions out there which offer the same basic functionality as Xubuntu or Lubuntu but without the ridiculous titles. I find it easier to give someone a system called Voyager or Linux Lite with a straight face as opposed to giving them something called "Xubuntu". Just the same LXLE sounds MUCH better than "Lubuntu"."
They say, don't spit in the well, you just drank from, do they?
@46
"You can use "Customize Look and Feel" (lxappearance) to change the style of the widgets. To change the windows decorations (the "top bar and the borders", as you say), use the Peppermint Control Center > Window Manager tab > Theme drop-down box. It's mix and match."
No you can't. You don't know what I am talking about. You can change to any theme as far as you use Peppermint's recreated Arc theme-borders and top Menu bar. Ford said "“A customer can have a car painted any color he wants as long as it’s black.”
@48
"I only open a web browser when I actually want to visit a site, and then have it open to about:blank. After I'm finished I close it out."
Sure, you are one of the rare kind, no doubt!
54 • @ 45 - Interesting statement (by kaczor on 2017-07-12 22:06:52 GMT from United States)
> On the more practical side (even though I actually don't use operating systems from the Ubuntu family much,especially of late),I have found that "WattOS" boots up faster than "official" Ubuntu distributions and supposedly (I can't confirm or deny this particular aspect) uses less power. <
You say, "I actually don't use, but ... I'd comment on 'Buntu systems". Funny!
WattOs is based Lubuntu, so check your
systemd-analyze blame
on both WattOS aand Lubuntu, and tell us which one is booting faster, and which service hinders/helps one distro from booting slower than the other. You'd be surprised that the boot time depends on the quality of your computer, rather than the distro you use.
55 • systemd haters (by obsessyhater on 2017-07-13 03:55:15 GMT from Australia)
The systemd hate has nothing to do with reasonable argument. Because they don't use their real names, locations, jobs, or equipment. If they were serious they would put forward a more technical argument. Like this:
John Smith
Smith St
Smith Suburb
Smith City
"I Work for SmithTel,and operate a FooSmith laptop, i9, 16gb Ram, with HD graphics.While running Linux distro/s.with systemd I have found the following issues that ppl should be aware of: issue a, issue b, issue c, etc."
But instead of technical argument all they do is bellyache: Oh systemd is corporate malware, Oh, systemd is spying on me, Oh systemd is calling home, Oh woe is me with systemd.
56 • systemd "haters" could possibly be people who just don't like it (by GaryW on 2017-07-13 07:13:41 GMT from Australia)
Classic straw man "argument". I think systemd is a solution in search of a problem, and vastly over-complicated for what it needs to do. Perhaps, when some QA people get involved, it might be pruned into something useful, and an advance on what went before.
57 • Extix Budgie (by kaczor on 2017-07-13 08:08:34 GMT from United States)
Checked the new Extix 17.7 Budgie. It has an interesting set of applications and a newer kernel. Nice to see PCmanFM, rather than Nautilus. Installed Thunar with just a little dependencies. It shows in System Tools, rather than in Accessories or Utilities. PCmanFM is also in System Tools. Bit strange. Budgie DE takes only 50.3MB, where the Budgie WM takes only 24.1MB. Very light indeed.
Ikey had said that Budgie 11 is in the github and the autohide for panel is implemented in it. Maybe, a new PPA would come with Budgie 11.
58 • @ Net neutrality (by OstroL on 2017-07-13 09:14:38 GMT from Poland)
This came today from Team Vivaldi;
" Today internet users and online communities unite to sound the alarm about the US Federal Communications Commission's attack on net neutrality (the rules that prevent internet service providers like Comcast and Verizon from slowing down, censoring, blocking, and charging extra fees online).
Head to the Vivaldi Blog to read why we're taking part in today's day of action.
If you live in the US, leave a comment with the FCC by visiting battleforthenet.com. Every comment makes a difference.
Don’t miss your opportunity to be heard."
It must be hard to live in the US with so much government snooping.
59 • Manjaro (by dawo on 2017-07-13 10:20:56 GMT from Germany)
Beside that Manajro is (very) late with security updates, i noticed a few things that i find strange: When installing and choose to use an own partition layout, at least based on bios mode, you HAVE to use ext4 as filesystem for root (/) or installation won't finish. When you pick another filesystem for /home it won't be mounted after the restart, because they write the filesystem into fstab in uppercase letters and when booting it's looked for lowercase (i.e. writing XFS and checking for xfs). /home not being mounted means that the first account from setup don't get his directory created.
60 • Boot Speed / Post # 54 (by Winchester on 2017-07-13 15:48:16 GMT from United States)
>> On the more practical side (even though I actually don't use operating systems from the Ubuntu family much,especially of late),I have found that "WattOS" boots up faster than "official" Ubuntu distributions and supposedly (I can't confirm or deny this particular aspect) uses less power. <<
>You say, "I actually don't use, but ... I'd comment on 'Buntu systems". Funny!
>WattOs is based Lubuntu, so check your
>systemd-analyze blame
>on both WattOS aand Lubuntu, and tell us which one is booting faster, and which service hinders/helps one distro from booting slower than the other. You'd be surprised that the boot time depends on the quality of your computer, rather than the distro you use.
In reality,I said "I actually don't use operating systems from the Ubuntu family MUCH,especially of late" which is quite different from "I actually don't use".
I know what WattOS is based on. In experimenting with approximately 35 different distributions ON THE SAME HARDWARE,I have found WattOS and Solus to be the fastest 2 of them to boot. The difference in boot speed is very striking and easy to notice. Again,this is on the same hardware. Furthermore,this is with the default configurations loaded via the "official" check sum verified iso files. Faster than any Lubuntu, Bubuntu, Fubuntu or whatever else among those distributions which I have tried. Just an honest observation.
If I had more free time,I would look into analyzing the situation but,I don't have that kind of free time. So,I go by the default settings boot speed.
I have a 4 TB hard drive partitioned with multiple distributions. Solus is one of them. I no longer have WattOS installed because I lean towards rolling distributions. So,if you insist I can time the Solus boot speed.
61 • @30 (by Walt on 2017-07-13 16:36:00 GMT from United States)
I do have a web browser set to open to the last set of tabs/websites I visited. However, there are sites I don't visit everyday or want to use without cluttering my screen with a bunch of other tabs (e.g., Netflix, Facebook, gMail, Pixlr, etc.). For these, I find ICE to be a great tool. In fact, I liked it so much, that when I switched from Peppermint to Antergos and found ICE was available there, I installed it right away.
62 • @58 Poland (by linuxista on 2017-07-13 19:54:24 GMT from United States)
>It must be hard to live in the US with so much government snooping.
Do you think that the US isn't snooping on you too and sharing it with your NATO member gov't?
63 • @50 & @58: Freedom and Net Neutrality (by Chris on 2017-07-13 19:54:27 GMT from United States)
@50 - I respectfully disagree. Fully working within the system, the theory can become practice if you truely want it to do so; it nearly always has for me. I do not know you, but I have confidence in your pre-existing abilities to have informed opinions, make recommendations or complaints, boycott as you see necessary, and/or create or use alternatives.
Many people don't have to have the interest, time, skills, or resources to do their own versions of stuff when nothing exists - it only takes market demand, a few capable people willing to fulfill such demand, and some patience for them to do so.
For example: GNU/Linux was not created by one person overnight, but here it is none the less. How much did you need to contribute to use GNU/Linux today in lieu of some proprietary OS? I know I have not had to contribute anything.
On the subject of net neutrality, while you could, you do not need to start your own ISP if you do not like the way your non-regulated ISP functions - if the demand exists, someone else ultimately will. I have ridden this ride before.
For example: Circa 1994-1996, at the advent of the commercial internet, I lived in a small government/university city where all ISP activities were controlled by the governments (for employees only) or universities (for employees and students only). While such provided ISP access to roughly 80% of the local population, it did not cover everyone and the restrictions for eligible users were onerous! Enough people complained, but the governments and universities would not budge! To the rescue, a couple of local geeks saw the demand and created a local, completely free (as in beer and speach) ISP before any of the big telcoms entered the market. To my knowledge, they still operate it today.
@58 - While some of the activities of U.S. TLAs (Three Letter Agencies) and their international equivalents are terrible violations of individual freedoms, conflating such with net neutrality is pure FUD! The two subjects have nothing to do with each other. The various TLAs of the world violated individual freedoms before the advent of net neutrality and will do so with it or without it!
64 • @60 (by kaczor on 2017-07-13 20:58:42 GMT from United States)
>Faster than any Lubuntu, Bubuntu, Fubuntu or whatever else among those distributions which I have tried. Just an honest observation.
If I had more free time,I would look into analyzing the situation but,I don't have that kind of free time. So,I go by the default settings boot speed.<
When you say, "Lubuntu, Bubuntu, Fubuntu or whatever else", the saying "don't spit in the well you just drank from" becomes quite true.
The time you took to write the comment, you could've wrote in your terminal, systemd-analyze blame and you'd had the answer.
Your eye trying catch up, or your finger trying stop the stop watch won't help.
(Who's talking about Solus? You didn't mention Solus in your #45, did you?)
65 • @ 62 (by OstroL on 2017-07-13 21:12:32 GMT from Poland)
"Do you think that the US isn't snooping on you too and sharing it with your NATO member gov't?"
I don't care two hoots, even if that happens.
I got that email from Vivaldi Team. I got lot of such emails from many US sites.
It said, "If you live in the US, leave a comment with the FCC by visiting battleforthenet.com."
Didn't get a single one from European sites.
66 • No more Debian but more Devuan (by Chris on 2017-07-13 21:51:03 GMT from France)
I've been using and learning Debian for years and it was fine.
But I began struggling with how to escape from systemd, which was not fine. Stretch was the last nail on the coffin.
I don't want to talk on technical merits but I still wonder how another init system (be it better or not) is becoming a second kernel. I would rather more trust Linus than Lennart on that part, so I gave up.
Devuan is like another path from Debian without the choice of turning systemd as a compulsory dependency for a lot of apps (and increasing).
Eventually, the situation reminds me of when I dumped Microsoft's products years ago, it was unthinkable then for a lot of people to escape from Windows. But I deed and am proud of it.
As a Linux user, I like to manage my systems but not to be managed by them. So now is another fight, I'm trying to dodge Red Hat's growing hegemony on the Linux ecosystem.
Note: I also used and appreciated great RHEL derivatives (PUIAS/Scientific) but obviously quit on RHEL7.
67 • @65 - Please Stop (by Chris on 2017-07-13 21:55:30 GMT from United States)
@65 - Please stop spreading the FUD (see @63, part two). No matter one's position on net neutrality, equating it with government spying is a dishonest waste of time.
Regarding your comments, "I got lot of such emails from many US sites." and "Didn't get a single one from European sites." To be blunt, No $#!@! Since the senders are trying to impact a U.S. FCC decision, that ONLY applies to U.S. ISPs and residents, you would not get any from a European organization in a European country. Please think.
68 • 55 systemd reasons against it. (by Anonymous Coward on 2017-07-13 23:51:03 GMT from United States)
We cannot support systemd because
1. No binary logs
2. Not just an init, runs services in parallel to increase boot speed, neglecting if serviceA depends on serviceB
3. No more simple use of chkconfig to list, add or remove services at startup.
69 • @67 (by OstroL on 2017-07-14 07:29:24 GMT from Poland)
Only answering linuxista (from US) on his comment on "Do you think that the US isn't snooping on you too and sharing it with your NATO member gov't?"
I should be bit worried thinking the US government snooping on us here, but I am not worried at all.
That "fud", btw had been spread by US sites. Here in Europe, a website can't (sort of) place a cookie without our acceptance. They do place the cookies, but we are warned. Do they warn you in the US too? (This website uses cookies to customize your experience. Third-party cookies may also be used by our advertisers. Learn more)
On the question of "snooping" by authorities (or any other agents), we know that our credit/debit cards, our mobiles, gsp in vehicles, etc can always pinpoint where we re and that the credit/debit card can tell the type of things we buy, our spending style, spending frequency etc. If we worry about this, then we have to stop using these conveniences. No, we won't stop using them.
70 • @ 53 and 59 (by Corentin on 2017-07-14 15:17:21 GMT from France)
@ 53
"Sure, you are one of the rare kind, no doubt!"
No, (s)he is not! :)
@ 59
Strange... I have Manjaro on a laptop and I never had this.
I installed Manjaro with:
- /boot ext2
- / jfs
- /home jfs
with absolutely no problem. And I always have no problems with this system..
"Manajro is (very) late with security updates"
Lol!
71 • @66 (by Jay on 2017-07-14 16:28:27 GMT from United States)
I agree with your reasons/preferences regarding systemd. I feel the same way. I've found OpenRC to be very nice, and on my Arch system, it actually booted faster than the systemd version (side-by-side VMs to compare).
I with there were a Debian OpenRC equivalent. I like that Devuan did what it did, but I would have chosen some other init rather than sysvinit, which distributions were trying to replace in the first place. OpenRC solves the same problems that systemd does (parallel starts, respawning services, etc.) while just being an init. In fact, other than RH seems to hate Gentoo, I don't know why they and anyone else isn't picking it up.
72 • @69 (by Chris on 2017-07-14 17:02:44 GMT from United States)
@69 > "That "fud", btw had been spread by US sites."
Understood, but that does not mean it needs to be propogated further, which you did. Again, we can all debate the need or not for a governmental mandate regarding "net neutrality," but conflating it (directly or through propagation) with nation-state spying is none the less FUD.
@69 > "Here in Europe, a website can't (sort of) place a cookie without our acceptance. They do place the cookies, but we are warned. Do they warn you in the US too? (This website uses cookies to customize your experience. Third-party cookies may also be used by our advertisers. Learn more)"
Yes, we too here in the U.S. frequently have our browsers spamed by your European mandated cookie warning. But everyone I have spoken to in the U.S. presume approximately 95% of websites leave one or more cookies (not statistically sound), making such cookie warnings more of an annoyance than the cookies themselves.
I speculate that we often see your cookie warnings because it is a European mandate, the internet is without borders, and many U.S. websites do not want to bother programming to distinguish between visitor's origins.
To deal with cookies and the logical presumtion of their existance, we in the U.S. either adjust our browser settings, use a cookie management browser add-on, or just accept their presence. The European cookie warnings are just more unnecessary garbage with which to deal.
73 • @ 72 (by OstroL on 2017-07-14 19:03:00 GMT from Poland)
"To deal with cookies and the logical presumtion of their existance, we in the U.S. either adjust our browser settings, use a cookie management browser add-on, or just accept their presence. The European cookie warnings are just more unnecessary garbage with which to deal."
Made you angry? Nice to be a patriot.
Garbage, you say? Have you seen anyone from Asia or Europe crying about TLAs (Three Letter Agencies) here? Anyway, check how many adclick type cookies you have in your computer. You might be having 100 fold such cookies than the amount of websites you've looked in.
Annoyance, you say? I don't care enough to click accept for that to go away. Eyes read only straight most of the time(except when you write, you look at the keyboard).
"many U.S. websites do not want to bother programming to distinguish between visitor's origins." Naive!
Do you want me to laugh or cry?!
74 • Manjaro (by dawo on 2017-07-14 21:34:47 GMT from Germany)
@70 - Have you tried it with the actual iso (17.0.2) or are you talking about an old flawless installation? My old one (15.x) had no problems with that cases too, but the new one. No matter what i tried as mentioned: no problems when i picked ext4, but ...
75 • clarification (by Trihexagonal on 2017-07-15 00:08:12 GMT from United States)
@70 "No, (s)he is not! :)"
He, thank you.
@73 "Anyway, check how many adclick type cookies you have in your computer. You might be having 100 fold such cookies than the amount of websites you've looked in."
1 cookie, from distrowatch, and when I close my browser it will be deleted automatically.
I can teach you how to set up your browser if you'd like. Free of charge, despite the less than amicable attitude you display here.
If you'd like to learn how to build a FreeBSD desktop from scratch I provide info that at no charge, too.
@73 "Eyes read only straight most of the time(except when you write, you look at the keyboard)."
You'll have to learn touch-typing on your own. May I suggest Mavis Beacon Teaches Typing? It's free, as well.
76 • Cookies (by Jesse on 2017-07-15 00:35:53 GMT from Canada)
>> "1 cookie, from distrowatch, and when I close my browser it will be deleted automatically. "
Just to clarify something, often times people assume that cookies are used for tracking purposes because that is what ad companies tend to do. But cookies also serve a useful function. For example, you cannot login to a website without cookies to save your session info.
At DistroWatch we do not use cookies to track your movements or browsing habits. We only use them in a few corner cases. For example, if you select a language other than the default on DW, we use a cookie to remember your language selection. Likewise, if you explicitly select to use either the Desktop or Mobile version of DW, a cookie remembers that preference. Otherwise you'd have to re-select your language and mobile/desktop preference time. Otherwise we go out of our way to avoid using cookies as much as possible so we don't litter your browser with them.
77 • cookies (by Trihexagonal on 2017-07-15 00:43:30 GMT from United States)
@76 "Just to clarify something, often times people assume that cookies are used for tracking purposes because that is what ad companies tend to do."
I'm sorry if my statement in response to adclick type cookies made it sound like you used tracking cookies, as I know you do not and did not intent to infer so.
78 • Debian testing Xfce without systemd (by debianxfce on 2017-07-15 02:22:13 GMT from Finland)
Run as root the following commands:
apt-get install sysvinit-core sysvinit-utils
cp /usr/share/sysvinit/inittab /etc/inittab
Edit the kernel command line to have: init=/lib/sysvinit/init console=hvc0 console=ttyS0
To boot to the desktop automatically, do:
Code:
sed -i "s/HEED_DEFAULT_DISPLAY_MANAGER=true\?/HEED_DEFAULT_DISPLAY_MANAGER=false/" /etc/init.d/lightdm
update-rc.d lightdm remove
update-rc.d lightdm defaults
update-rc.d lightdm enable
reboot
To launch Synaptic from menu, run:
nano /usr/share/polkit-1/actions/com.ubuntu.pkexec.synaptic.policy
Change allow_any, allow_inactive and allow_active fields to yes.
79 • @80 (by OstroL on 2017-07-15 12:53:32 GMT from Poland)
"The fault lies in you not setting your browser up correctly, no matter which country you live in. You have heard of the "World Wide Web, haven't you?"
You don't open web pages from EU, but in the US. In the US (and Canada, I believe) the web sites can place cookies without your consent, but here in the EU, the web sites are not allowed to do so, without the consent of the user.
The question is whether I know how to use web browsers or not, but whether the websites are allowed to place cookies, even session cookies, without the "informed consent." (I know how to use the web and the browsers.) Not clicking the Accept button means the user hadn't given the consent. It means there shouldn't be a cookie stored. If a session cookie is essential for the website to show up, it should go after the website is closed.
(WWW was created by an Englishman Tim Berners-Lee in 1989, and the 1st program was made at CERN in Switzerland.)
My test was done on this site, and for the post #76. I am writing here, so I can only write about this site. Jessie runs the Distrowatch website, so he'd know how to reply to that. Like I said, my trust for Distrowatch doesn't change, and its just a question.
80 • Cookies (by Jesse on 2017-07-15 13:10:52 GMT from Canada)
@79: If you read up a bit more on EU cookie law I think you'll find there is a bit more to it than what you are describing. For example, cookies required to provide the user with services requested (changing language, shopping carts, etc) are exempt. Also, continuing to use the website after being told the site uses cookies also is classified as informed consent by the law, whether you click an "Accept" button or not.
How cookies are handled after you leave the site are up to your browser, not the website. Cookies from third-parties are subject to the interaction of your browser with their servers.
I'm not saying these rules are good or bad, it's just the way the regulations are set up. We've tried very hard to make sure we follow the regulations without overly annoying our readers.
81 • @ 80 Cookies (by OstroL on 2017-07-15 13:38:03 GMT from Poland)
A cookie from a website you know and like to use is not a problem, but the problem lies in the 3rd party cookies that you don't care or want. The owner of the website cannot check what the 3rd parties are doing and also cannot guarantee the safety of those cookies to the user. That's the problem.
"Third-party cookies may also be used by our advertisers." Even if the user by using the given website gives consent by just using it, the user hadn't given the consent to the placement of the 3rd parties.
I can understand that you trust your advertisers, but do you trust their advertisers and so on. All of them can place cookies this way. Once one advertiser is given the permission, his advertisers are getting the permission in the roundabout way. That's a dangerous situation.
82 • Cookies (by Jesse on 2017-07-15 13:50:42 GMT from Canada)
@81: "A cookie from a website you know and like to use is not a problem, but the problem lies in the 3rd party cookies that you don't care or want."
This is why all modern web browsers allow you to select whether to accept third-party cookies or not. If you enable third-party cookies in your browser settings you are opting in to accept them. If you do not enable this feature you don't get cookies from third-parties. Some browsers, like Qupzilla, even let you whitelist cookies, everything else is blocked.
This is getting pretty off-topic, so let's get back to talking about technology discussed on this site, like Peppermint and osquery.
83 • thanks (by tim on 2017-07-15 16:48:11 GMT from United States)
@78 great info! I thank you
84 • Screenshot of Peppermint using the Clearlooks theme (by eco2geek on 2017-07-15 23:55:03 GMT from United States)
@53:
> No you can't. You don't know what I am talking about. You can change to any theme as far
> as you use Peppermint's recreated Arc theme-borders and top Menu bar. Ford said "“A
> customer can have a car painted any color he wants as long as it’s black.”
I sure don't know what you're talking about. For example, here's a screenshot of Peppermint using Clearlooks:
https://extraimage.net/image/N55M
Have a nice day.
85 • @ 84 Clearlooks theme on Peppermint (by lenn on 2017-07-16 07:34:03 GMT from Canada)
That is not Clearlooks, but a modified theme, Clearlooks-phenix
86 • @84 (by lenn on 2017-07-16 13:39:59 GMT from Canada)
Have you found out why you can't have the Clearlooks theme the way it should be in Peppermint? It was like that from 2010 Peppermint One.
Number of Comments: 86
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