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1 • 32-bit (by brad on 2016-06-20 00:37:07 GMT from North America)
I still use a 32-bit OS on my oldest laptop, because it is a Pentium M, which ran Windows XP in a former life. I *could* have upgraded it to Vista.
: - )
I currently run Manjaro XFCE on it; it's slow, but useable. I also have a USB stick with TinyCore, which runs fine. In my oodles of spare time, I'll try to learn more about TinyCore, and possibly run it on my ancient laptop.
All my other laptops are 64-bit, and run a number of different distros; each of them also runs Windows 10.
2 • 32 bit (by Steve on 2016-06-20 00:43:20 GMT from Oceania)
I still use 32 bit Peppermint OS on an old Acer Aspire netbook which cannot run a 64 bit OS. It's a fast handy little machine with excellent battery life while running Peppermint.
3 • 32-Bit OSes (by Zork on 2016-06-20 00:52:09 GMT from Oceania)
I still love my old hardware and get use from them... Have a couple of Pentium 3's running as servers on my network and a Pentium 4 I use as a LinuxFromScratch play-till-it-breaks machine.... So I still use 32-bit OSes...
My Desktop and Laptop are both 64-Bit OSes... Desktop is Ubuntu 14.04... Laptop is Dual-Boot with Win 10 ( needed for business unfortunately ) and Ubuntu 16.04...
4 • Rump Kernel v Monolith Builds (by Arch Watcher 402563 on 2016-06-20 00:52:15 GMT from North America)
The value in the Linux kernel comes from hardware drivers. I view the kernel as a library of drivers wrapped in payers of endless churning nonsense.
To spelunkers and explorers - do not be constrained by Linus-branded monoliths. Pulling drivers out, you can run apps without fuss: http://rumpkernel.org
I would love to see future NON-Linux distros running Linux kernel drivers BUT NOTHING ELSE FROM LINUS, LENNART, OR LKML IN GENERAL.
5 • Mixture of 32 & 64 bit (by Roy on 2016-06-20 01:07:26 GMT from North America)
Windows 19 ran great with 64 bit but Lubuntu 16.04 gave me problems with 64 bit when I tried to use the Nvidia and Intel proprietary drivers. I loaded a 32 bit 3 year old version of Debian with the 3.2 kernel. Then a Debian 8.05 64 bit replaced it on all of my 4 hard drives with one being solid state. Then I replaced it with Ubuntu-MATE which is working great. Everything I thought I needed Windows 7 to Windows 10 upgrade for I find Ubuntu-MATE 16.04 is better for.
6 • 32-bit OS (by Troy on 2016-06-20 01:43:09 GMT from North America)
I have an old Sony Vaio laptop I got from someone who was done with it, and I enjoy playing on it with Mint 17.3, but can only use 32-bit software with the old Centrino CPU.
7 • Rump Kernel v Monolith Builds (by erinis on 2016-06-20 01:49:04 GMT from North America)
Spelunkers ? Back to the cave Batman. Is that not what Microsoft is presently trying to do and accomplish ? Just a thought. Huuuum
8 • 32 Bit (by Mark on 2016-06-20 01:49:08 GMT from Asia)
I use 32 bit because the 64 bit drivers for my printer don't work as they should. Hardware companies support for linux is in my experience very half-hearted. Thus, I use what works.
9 • I use 32-bit only (by Misalf on 2016-06-20 02:25:28 GMT from Europe)
Tiny Core 32 bit, on a 2009 Intel Atom 32 bit single core netbook, as well as on a 2011 Pentium D 64 bit dual core desktop PC. None of which have more than 4GB RAM and they seldom need to perform very CPU intensive tasks. I don't know of any reason not to use a 32 bit OS.
10 • 32-bin vs 64-bit (by Andy Figueroa on 2016-06-20 03:21:17 GMT from North America)
My main system is a Gentoo 32-bit system originally installed around 2003. It meets my needs and converting a mature, stable system to 64-bit isn't worth the effort.
11 • 32bit (by Rizki on 2016-06-20 03:36:09 GMT from Asia)
i Still use 32bit os linux because some old hp pc on my office still working. none of them have 4 gb ram. and i also prefer stability for my desktop environment like linux mint 32 bit
12 • "My Grandpa" at home cannot run 64 bit OS (by BeGo on 2016-06-20 03:56:14 GMT from Asia)
I still have Pentium 4 HT PC at home, which not compatible with 32 bit OS.
Furthermore, I still need 32 bit Windows OS to run some "ancient" Windows Apps which not compatible to 64 bit one.
btw,
@#5, Windows 19? :P :)
13 • 32-bit on ... ? (by Kragle von Schnitzelbank on 2016-06-20 04:00:01 GMT from North America)
Are you asking about OSs on VMs, or bare metal?
14 • Interesting (by Joel on 2016-06-20 04:23:06 GMT from North America )
Donating to Devil Linux on episode 666?
15 • 32-bit vs 64-bit x86 (by Thomas Mueller on 2016-06-20 04:56:10 GMT from North America)
I use both 32-bit and 64-bit, rarely 16-bit (FreeDOS). Reason for 32-bit is that some things are not yet 64-bit-ready, Wine 64-bit is at a much earlier stage of development than Wine 32-bit. Then some OSes, such as Haiku, are so far only 32-bit but with development versions for 64-bit.
16 • The more things change (by azuvix on 2016-06-20 05:17:12 GMT from North America)
Funny, had you asked me whether I use 32 or 64-bit software a couple of years ago, I would have told you that I saw no particular reason to use a 64-bit OS for my day-to-day. Now I'm typing this on a KVM host that runs ZFS and regularly serves up several VMs with a few gigs of RAM.
Yeah, that's pretty far out of 32-bit land...
17 • 64-32 (by mes on 2016-06-20 05:33:21 GMT from Europe)
My main pc is about vijf years old and 64 bit. It is running mint 17.3 KDE.
I have a old pc (2002) with amd-processor. This 32 bit pc is running AVLinux 2016 smoothly.
And I have a EEEpc (2009) als 32 bit on which i have installed android-x86.
18 • Updating Mint (by herold on 2016-06-20 06:02:45 GMT from Europe)
I have updated Mint from 16 on several boxes both Desktop and Laptop without re installing.
Had some issues which could all be solved and no data loss. I would NOT reccomended going that way without some prior experience in linux or another way to look for solutions in the internet. But the last update was a lot smoother than previous ones,
Mint improves fast.
19 • 32 v 64 bit (by Roy davies on 2016-06-20 06:22:15 GMT from Europe)
Up until recently, I had a 13 year old Acer laptop that could only run 32 bit OS's. My desktop and 9 year old laptop will run either 32 or 64 bit. I think distro developers who ignore the fact that there are older machines capable of only running 32 bit are irresposible. Using 'supply and demand' as an excuse for cutting 32 bit options is a restrictive practice. There are still a great many older machines out there that are still usable with 32 bit distros. Not everyone can afford new machines evry few years. What happened to 'if it ain't broke, don't mend it'?
20 • 32 bit (by Guido on 2016-06-20 06:55:51 GMT from Europe)
I have to use 32 bit, because my laptop is 9 years old, with originally 1 GB memory only. But Xubuntu 16.04 is running very good.
21 • 32bit advantage & the AMD-Intel case (by Sondar on 2016-06-20 07:07:08 GMT from Europe)
The minnow won in Court against the shark, forcing the bully to license AMD64! There is real advantage in running 32bit OSes on 64bit machines - try it and be surprised.
22 • Why 32-bit? (by Chris Whelan on 2016-06-20 07:16:20 GMT from Europe)
I voted that I use both 32- and 64-bit.
I support several smaller distros in a limited way by testing. To that end, I keep a couple of older laptops that are 32-bit only.
There are a fair few users of antiX that only have 32-bit non-PAE machines, but still get good usage from them.
23 • 32 vs 64 (by Marame on 2016-06-20 07:29:14 GMT from Europe)
I have both 32 and 64 bit and will switch to 64 slowly. I have some mainboards who refuse to work in 64 bit (some old laptops and socket 478 etc), one Acer Veriton which should work in 64 bit mode but has all kind hardware related problems (drivers, works happily with 32bit). Some mainboards will work in 64 bit mode when I change processor, four pieces Asus P5LD2 SE pcb version 1 for example. A Pentium 4 531 or 600 series does the trick. They are slower in 64 bit mode, a 530 processor in CPU Blowfish (from System Profiler and Benchmark) gets 10.7 and 531 gets 14.
64bit is future but I hope there is 32bit versions for some years still. Debian Mint 17 up to 2020.
24 • 32 and 64 bits : depends on CPU and hardware. (by Frederic Bezies on 2016-06-20 07:46:22 GMT from Europe)
I'm using both 32 and 64 bit archlinux distributions. 32 bit with Mate on my old eeePC, 64 bit with Mate on both my laptop and my "tower" PC.
64 bit CPU are 13 years old now so seeing more and more 64 bits distributions is logical in a way.
I only hope Archlinux will maintain a 32 bit version as long as possible. At least a year or two, until my eeePC goes to its end of life.
First 32 bits CPU were produced in 1985... Time to say good bye ? :D
25 • 32 and 64 bits : depends on hardware (by johnhsmith on 2016-06-20 08:05:49 GMT from Europe)
I'm using 32 bits on most old hardware (2G ram being the most dictating constraint).
I also consider it for newer hardware, since "modern" 64 bits distros and software tend to be bloated, consume far more disk space than the natural difference between 32 and 64, and hence make for bigger and slower backups.
However 64 bits is still required for professional use, some photo processing, some Java applications, and some virtual machines. (For the latter, 32 bits + PAE is a solution -- though not well enough supported in recent distros)
26 • 32 v 64 bit (by Allan on 2016-06-20 08:06:16 GMT from Europe Europe)
I have an old laptop and old desktop that are both 32 bit.
The old desktop with a 32 bit Pentium 4 is used for testing new distributions and with an added SSD runs without problems.
My 20 year old laptop with an Intel Celeron processor and added an SSD still runs like a dream using 32 bit Antergos.
My main desktop is 64 bit but i still think its to early to start dropping 32 bit iso's as many people will have added upgrades to 32 bit machines which are still running strong.
27 • 32-bit vs 64-bit (by Semiarticulate on 2016-06-20 08:06:18 GMT from North America)
I'm writing this on an old 32-bit Toshiba laptop running OpenBSD 5.9. I still have a few machines that I derive value from that are still 32-bit. For every day use, this laptop does exactly what I need it to do. I'm not a fan of filling landfills with older tech that still gets the job done.
As an aside, your OpenBSD upgrade would have been even smoother if you had entered a line such as this one in your .profile:
export PKG_PATH=ftp://ftp3.usa.openbsd.org/pub/OpenBSD/$(uname -r)/packages/$(uname -m)/
Thanks for the awesome articles. Please keep 'em comin'.
28 • 32bit (by Daz on 2016-06-20 08:18:38 GMT from Oceania)
Still have 2 32bit machines Dell D620 and a much prized T42 Thinkpad both running LinuxBBQ spins. In no hurry to upgrade - still lots of worthwhile choices to run - tinycore, Puppy, Debian, LinuxBBQ, Salix, Antix, Porteous, Slackware, Some Ubuntu spins like Lubuntu.
29 • 32bit vs 64bit (by DaveC on 2016-06-20 08:29:57 GMT from Europe)
I use both 64bit on my main computer and 32 on an EEEPC.. the EEEPC will have to remain using 32bit operating system a it has a 32bit processor. Hopefully, 32bit versions will still be around when support runs out for MInt17.
30 • Mint upgrade (by Michele on 2016-06-20 08:42:08 GMT from North America)
"I performed the live upgrade in two stages, using "apt-get upgrade" and "apt-get dist-upgrade""
First step is "apt-get update", next upgrade and dist-upgrade.
31 • Comparing more live version upgrade methods - Mageia 4 (by Filip on 2016-06-20 08:57:45 GMT from Europe)
I guess Jesse was missfortunate (I tried 30 mirror links with only one fail) as finding Mageia 4 is easy. Besides on any mirror which still keeps old version (http://any--mageia-mirror/mageia/iso/4/) there are many options:
- On entry page http://www.mageia.org/ there's a link to current version (and also the next one currently in development) which is very easy to modify ;) http://www.mageia.org/5/. Just change the number.
- On a map of the website there's a link to it: http://www.mageia.org/map/
- On the 'Downloads' page http://www.mageia.org/downloads/ there's a title 'Looking for Mageia 4 ?'
32 • RE:Comparing more live version upgrade methods (by debianxfce on 2016-06-20 09:05:07 GMT from Europe)
Rolling release os is the smartest way to go. Debian has large server and user base and experimental-unstable-testing cycle for software quality. It is easy to start with Debian testing Xfce and update every day or newer.
http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/stretch_di_alpha6/amd64/iso-cd/
With testing you use packages from stable to experimental and some ubuntu packages like flash-installer.
For nvidia cards, use latest driver from nvidia site. For amd gpus you can use mesa radeon or amdgpu driver and newer gpus can use amdgpu-pro from amd site.
33 • Simplicity (by John on 2016-06-20 09:38:25 GMT from North America)
Hi All,
I want my stuff to run anywhere. Why delete the option of running on older hardware?
Also, I try to ONLY install from some physical medium. The whole upgrade idea has BIG brother written all over it. Talk about getting really hacked.
It would be nice to include a background "You have been hacked" scanner in ALL major OSs. If the program changes, chances are something very bad just happened.
John
34 • Old and new stuff (by mjjzf on 2016-06-20 10:01:15 GMT from Europe)
I own a couple of old Thinkpads, both Lenovo and IBM. As is their way, they have gone a lot of miles and can do a lot more before retirement. I need sturdy, not speedy hardware.
That is the 32-bit part. I also have a 64-bit machine with Fedora that my son uses for Minecraft and another my wife uses with Mint for office work.
35 • 32-bit OS? Bah-humbug! (by Paraquat on 2016-06-20 10:07:35 GMT from Asia)
32-bit vs 64-bit OS? Bah-humbug! Everybody knows that the greatest operating system of all time was 8-bit CP/M running on an Apple II back in 1977. It could support a whopping 64 kilobytes of memory - why would anybody need more? With that much address space, you could type a whole 128-characters - that's the entire Roman alphabet, plus numbers and some punctuation! We didn't need no stinkin' unicode, which was only invented to appease foreigners.
Back in my day, computers didn't have enough memory to address a hard disk, but then again, why would you want one when 8" floppy disks could store a generous 80 kbytes of data? Later on, they made smaller disks that could hold more, but to be honest nothing can beat the old cassette tape drives - you could store 10 whole songs on one of those!
You young whippersnappers with your fancy pansy "smart phones" - why back in my day you didn't have to type anything on no "touchscreen" - all you had to do was pick up the receiver, crank the box and tell the operator who you wanted to talk to, and you got connected right away!
But some of you still wanna talk about "32 or 64 bits" - why I remember when a shave and a haircut only cost 2 bits. Biggest mistake we made was switching to paper money, I reckon. But now I hear we're going back to "bitcoins" - none to soon, far as I'm concerned.
Remember when air was clean and sex was dirty?
36 • 32 vs. 64 (by Bob Hayden on 2016-06-20 11:09:46 GMT from North America)
A couple years ago I switched from Mepis 32 to Kwheezy 64. I could not detect any advantage but many Windows programs no longer ran under WINE. So this time I switched to Debian 8 32-bit.
37 • 32 bit (by kc1di on 2016-06-20 11:15:53 GMT from North America)
Hi I marked 64 bit because that's all I have left at home, but at work we still have a few 32bit machines, they are scheduled to be retired this year and will most likely end up with 32 versions of some linux Distro on them then I give them away to kid. who need computers.
anyway the hand writing is on the wall and 32 bit is on the way out.
:(
38 • 32-bit vs 64-bit (by Alessandro di Roma on 2016-06-20 11:16:23 GMT from Europe)
I run Xubuntu 15.10, 64-bit where I can (Samsung N150 Plus) and 32-bit elsewhere (Acer TravelMate 4020). I don't perceive big difference, maybe the Samsung is a bit faster.
By the way, my Acer TM 4020 has been produced in 2004 as a Windows XP machine, but with RAM upgraded to 2 GB and Xubuntu 15.10/32 (installed thanks to forcepae boot option) it fits perfectly my needs. Only the battery has gone, but I use the machine only at home, and everything else works perfectly, why waste money to buy a newer one?
The world is full of millions of Windows-XP machines, their fate is 32-bit Linux or the waste dump!
39 • OpenBSD documentation and upgrade (by Bill on 2016-06-20 11:26:20 GMT from Oceania)
"OpenBSD provides clear documentation, step-by-step instructions and the upgrade happens very quickly."
No surprises there! Welcome to OpenBSD.
40 • 31 • Finding Mageia 4 (by Kragle on 2016-06-20 12:20:43 GMT from North America)
Also easy to find many seeds still running torrents
41 • 32-bits versus 64-bits... (by NetherMark on 2016-06-20 12:36:08 GMT from Europe)
In my opinion the 32-bits architecture is dropped two years too soon by the distro builders. Many Linux user still use their old hardware to run Linux. There's no need yet for most Linux adepts to switch to 64-bits (read: new) hardware, because most Linux distros run fine on them. The older machines still fit to their needs. Including mine, because most of my computer are 32-bits, and they are running smoothly and fast, sometimes even faster than a brand new machine with the newest technology.
One of my computers is 13 years old, it runs Lubuntu without any problems and is still acceptably responsive for an old machine. And I got two 8 year old laptops which run multiple distros like Linux Mint (both Mate and Cinnamon), Lubuntu, Ubuntu, Ubuntu Studio, Ubuntu GNOME and Arch all together. And those machine run as fast as lightning.
So why should I need to replace those machines while they still work? Because the distro builders decided for you to do so? When distro builders decide to stop supporting 32-bits hardware, I feel myself forced to buy a new computer and to throw my old, but still fine working machines away. Bad for the environment (more waste, more spilling of sources) and bad for my wallet too. And guess who takes advantage of all this? Right: Microsoft. Because almost every computer is sold with Windows on it. So in the end I sponsor a company I don't want to sponsor. :-(
I hope some distro builders read this and decide to extend support for 32-bits hardware for at least 2 more years. After that period a lot of 32-bits computers are probably broken, throwen away etc. But now it's too early (in my humble opinion)...
42 • Finding Mageia 4 (by Jesse on 2016-06-20 12:46:58 GMT from North America)
>> "I guess Jesse was missfortunate (I tried 30 mirror links with only one fail) as finding Mageia 4 is easy.... On the 'Downloads' page http://www.mageia.org/downloads/ there's a title 'Looking for Mageia 4 ?'"
Yes, I followed that link. Do you know what I found? Every time I clicked the Download button to grab a copy of Mageia 4, I ran into a "404 - Not Found" error. I tried three different mirrors and they all came up missing the ISO file. The website claims the ISO is still available, but the links to download are broken.
You may have gotten lucky and found a copy, but it requires more than just following the links on the webiste.
43 • 32 bit (by pfb on 2016-06-20 12:58:25 GMT from North America)
My Pentium 4 still works!
44 • 32-bit vs. 64-bit (by Donnie on 2016-06-20 13:09:14 GMT from North America)
I use 64-bit distros on all of my newer machines with 64-bit processors. However, I do have a few old machines with 32-bit CPUs that require 32-bit operating systems.
45 • @ Jesse (by Blue Knight on 2016-06-20 13:19:25 GMT from Europe)
@ 42, Jesse
On the French version of the Mageia site, the links are not broken. I just tried. Try here:
http://www.mageia.org/fr/4/download_index.php
46 • Issue 666 (by Soorya on 2016-06-20 13:19:39 GMT from Asia)
Distrowatch makes a donation to Devil-Linux and announces it in issue 666? Surely this has to be some sort of coincidence.
47 • Mageia link (by Jesse on 2016-06-20 13:22:53 GMT from North America)
>> "On the French version of the Mageia site, the links are not broken. I just tried. Try here:"
The French site still uses the same mirrors. The links lead to the same place which, once again, gives the 404 - Not Found error. I just tried it. You are probably in an area which connects to a different set of mirrors (one of the rare few with the desired ISO). I am not, therefore I cannot download the file, no matter which locale I am accessing.
Not that it matters, the trial is over. It's not as though I'm going to download and install Mageia 4 now.
48 • 32-bit use... (by jay cee on 2016-06-20 13:41:14 GMT from North America)
@22, 27, et.al...
have been long-time advocate of keeping working puters out of landfills...
& of "appropriate" use by users - as when our local school system buys the most expensive latest model computers...for 6 & 7 yr olds!
believe also that although 32-bit IS old it's still very useful for teaching new programmers to work efficiently & write code economically... most ppl still use the office computer as a glorified typewriter/organiser/spreadsheet generator... & how fast can you TYPE?
run hereabouts 2 64-bit computers... & 7 more 32-bit! keep 'em rolling...
49 • 32-bit OS's needed here (by John on 2016-06-20 14:04:50 GMT from Europe)
I have two laptops (HP and Lenovo) with 32-bit architecture processors. My two desktops are newer and have 64-bit processors. I have found no significant improvement in 64-bit OS's so will use either 32-bit or 64-bit systems in my desktops. With my two 32-bit laptops I have no choice.
BTW, my 32-bit HP laptop is ancient, perhaps 15 years old or more, but still run fast and efficiently with Mint 10. I will be keeping my 32-bit operating systems on disk because some old computers simply fail to die!
50 • 32bit (by scrumtime on 2016-06-20 14:14:47 GMT from North America)
I have quite a few Comps that are still 32 bit and a few 64.... I buy up a lot of computers from businesses that are upgrading and install various Linux distros..then give them to some of the people around my places in Central America...some dont have internet access some do..some dont even have electricity and water 24hrs a day.!!
But it has given them opportunities if Distros keep dropping 32 bit many wont have upgrades..and my chances of getting new hardware diminishes for them.
I run Both 64 bit and 32 bit versions of the same distros and really there is little performance personally i prefer the 32bit and install 32 on 64 machines..
I wonder how many people throw their car away when its 10 yrs old just because the newer ones have a different set of seats.....you dont you keep it running untill it just wont....
I wonder how many people will just stop using desktops and lappys if they can't get there 32bit upgraded and just use a Phone why would many spend $$$$ just to buy a new desktop when they have the latest phone ..basically ditching Linux desktops
51 • 32vs64 (by GreginNC on 2016-06-20 14:25:44 GMT from North America)
I run 32 bit Slackware as my main day to day system on my Main desktop simply because there is some software still only available for 32 bit or with excessive tweaking for 64. Plus I run 64 bit Slackware on my laptop and a few other distros both 64 and 32 bit on other systems around my house and really don't see any great benefit of using either over the other, at least not yet.
52 • 64 bit (by VS on 2016-06-20 15:04:50 GMT from Asia)
I run 64 bit mainly because I use Chrome along with my chromecast device as Chrome no longer supports 32bit.
53 • @ 42, Jesse (by Filip on 2016-06-20 15:14:41 GMT from Europe)
@ 42, Jesse
>> I tried three different mirrors and they all came up missing the ISO file.
Hi Jesse. Thanks for trying and reporting this. I'm asking as a Mageia website contributor.
I can try to fix it if you please answer me:
1. Which ISO exactly you tried?
2. Can you list 404 mirror(s)?
3. Can you post an output of https://www.mageia.org/mirrorlist/?release=5&arch=x86_64§ion=core&repo=release on pastebin or somewhere?
Recently I improved (hopefully ;) ) best matching DL mirror function. It should pick one from your country (geoip) if it exists otherwise on continent if it exists and as a fallback random mirror.
There's a MirrorBrain in works by sysadmins but it might take some time as we're already in version freeze for Mageia 6 now.
Thanks,
Filip.
54 • re. 51 (by Someguy on 2016-06-20 15:19:16 GMT from Europe)
Sympathy with GreginNC . Fatdog64 is a case in point. Some very clever guys have built this based on Puppy. There are various unfathomable patches trying to adapt 32bit drivers, apps, & .sfs. Some work, others not. Some are machine specific. Despite the best brains working on it, it's often only a short interval before another glitch pops up. In principle it's a great project; could probably benefit from more input? Then there's the software vs hardware rat race to contend with. There's no profit in keeping old software running on old hardware unwilling to lie down and die. Not a bit like cars which look shabby, rust and are the 'wrong' colour after 5-10 years!
55 • 32-bit (by Dave Postles on 2016-06-20 15:48:34 GMT from Europe)
It's perhaps a bit tedious to continue to add examples, but I have just 'inherited' a Gateway (yes!) notebook/laptop from my wife who wanted something more contemporary. I've installed Slitaz, basically because (i) it looks rather nice and (ii) the base install is slim and you construct your preferred final system. I owe them a donation.
56 • 32-bit (by David on 2016-06-20 16:02:04 GMT from Europe)
I have two 32-bit computers. Both work and run the programs I need. Why should I replace them? It would be a waste of money and natural resources.
57 • 32 bits (by David on 2016-06-20 16:09:50 GMT from North America)
I have an 11 year old laptop that needs a 32-bit OS. Most of my other computers are also running 32-bit OSs because that's what I had always used, and there was no compelling reason to re-install any of them as 64-bit. I didn't start doing that until I did on a few systems because of Chrome dropping 32-bit Linux support (that was lame). For VMs, I have no intention of ever switching from 32-bit to 64-bit, as it's all downside (more RAM and disk space usage) and no upside.
58 • @14_666_Devil_Linux (by gee7 on 2016-06-20 16:41:17 GMT from Europe)
Well spotted, Joel.
DistroWatch humour can be devilishly funny ...
59 • @35 (by azuvix on 2016-06-20 17:03:23 GMT from North America)
You have made my whole day. That was glorious. XD
60 • 64bit for main but 32bit on older PCs and in virtualbox (by Jaki143 on 2016-06-20 18:44:31 GMT from Europe)
I use a 64bit distro on my working system but have two older systems which need 32bit. I don't use them that often but don't want to give them up.
In virtualbox I can only use 32bit distributions too because with my current cpu the mainboard bios seems to disable amd-v which is needed for 64bit virtualization :(.
61 • Upgrade in place (by mikef90000 on 2016-06-20 20:50:56 GMT from North America)
Jesse, you seem to have confirmed what I've long experienced. An upgrade in place requires such a large download and further processing. Installing from a downloaded ISO image (nuke and pave) is quicker and more reliable IME.
Ironically the absolute worst upgrades I've experienced are ................. Windows 10 - what a huge flaming pile of sh** Windows Update has become.
62 • 32 vs 64, rolling releases and other stuff (by Mike on 2016-06-20 22:43:33 GMT from North America)
I think it's good that 32 bit distros are still available, but the fact that they are dwindling among the majors is tough on some. I understand the reasons why, but there are a lot of folks out there with older equipment that can't afford to upgrade to a 64 bit system. Although the rise of chromebooks is helping to alleviate that (I know, "not true linux"), but if you're financially challenged, you do what you have to do. So, what are the options if you have a 32 bit system and no dough? I usually recommend that they run a 32 bit Puppy Linux if they have minimal needs like a chromebook user. It's really fast on older equipment, thought it does have its limitations. However, many of the newer Puppy derivatives are trending toward accessing the majors repositories, and I doubt the majors will archive the 32 bit repos when they drop 32 bit support. There's also the mini distros, like Porteus, MX, Tiny Core and Absolute that seem committed to 32 bit but how long can that last if 64 bit is the standard for programming. Chrome has already dropped 32 bit support for linux. Maybe if a few bucks can be scraped up, the best bet is to find a cheap used or reconditioned 64 bit chromebook and convert it to a full linux distro. There is plenty of online documentation to make that happen. My laptop is an older HP Chromebook 14 that I'm currently testing the new Linux Lite on, but I have had Sparky and Antergos on it in the past, which brings me to rolling distros.
My main, everyday system is a Acer Chromebox MO75U with an i3 and 16GB of ram. I run Sparky testing (maybe not a true rolling release in the strictest sense of the term) on it and I've never had even a hiccup with it. It's always been rock solid, but I can't say the same for other rollers. Though Arch is a great learning tool, as stated in the Q&A today, for the average user it is, in its own format, not really set up as a desktop friendly distro. If you have ever used Arch, then you know a lot about fonts and how to make them readable, but for the average user it just doesn't cut it. This is not a knock, it is very good for what it is supposed to be, an advanced linux distro, and the documentation is first class. However, derivatives like Antergos have smoothed out a lot of the Arch quirks for the average desktop user, except for getting Network Manager to work reliably. That can be worked around easily, if you have skills, and they will probably fix that in the near future. Gentoo and related derivatives fit into the same category as Arch, advanced only. Fedora has the latest and greatest, they say, and I found it very reliable, but is really no more rolling than debian testing as you are more or less just doing a dist-upgrade every six months. I am glad however that it now will be easier to do and hopefully less time consuming now that the upgrades will be handled by the package manager rather than a cli operation.Today I downloaded Gecko to see what a maybe working SuSe Tumbleweed will be like. Fingers are crossed.
63 • why I still use 32 bit distros (by Mike Perrin on 2016-06-20 23:21:23 GMT from North America)
I use an ALIX 1C AMD Geode embedded board running 32 bit Debian 8 as a file server and have an Asus eeePC 1000 with Atom N270 processor currently running Ubuntu 16.04. The eeePC still works so why throw it away. I have several 64 bit machines running various flavors of Linux and have had no problems with the 64 bit distributions.
64 • 32-bit, 64-bit, etc (by Kragle on 2016-06-20 23:59:12 GMT from North America)
One motivation comes via hardware vendors wanting people to replace older hardware.
For certain things, 32-bit is simply more efficient; for others, 16-bit or even 8-bit. Eventually, we should see modular systems with multiple CPUs of varying 'bit'ness, activating or speeding/slowing as needed, providing far more efficiency, flexibility, capacity and inter-connectivity than we can expect from most current (stubbornly counter-productive) vendors' designs.
65 • 32-bit OS's - Like Windows 10? (by RO on 2016-06-21 00:59:28 GMT from North America)
That is to say, Windows 10 on Atom tablets/hybrids/convertibles, etc, with 1 GB RAM and 32 GB disk that use a 32-bit UEFI to restrict the otherwise 64-bit capable CPU to keep the license cost down for 32-bit "Windows with Bing", and thus attempt to fend off Android tablets in a bottom-feeding race.
I keep dabb\ling with those little freaks in hopes of finding a Linux distro with 32-bit UEFI install (option at least, as with recent Knoppix versios) that will also include drivers for the wonky hardware such as touchscreen, wifi, power management, etc. I love the hardware, but that Windows software... ugh!
66 • 32/64 bit (by jeff jones on 2016-06-21 01:28:40 GMT from North America)
on my 2 netbooks i use 32bit debain testing lxde, on my old IBM x60s debian testing 32bit XFCE. also have a old desktop that will not quit running antix 32 bit fluxbox., 64 bit on all the rest.
67 • What He Said (by Arch Watcher 402563 on 2016-06-21 01:38:50 GMT from North America)
@7 erinis - Totally mystified by your loopy remark, I can say only that a correspondent calling himself "Digging-deeper" brought up the topic of dirt. Since he wants to "learn how Linux works, how all the pieces fit together" it may be easier to start with rump kernels than the whole Giza Pyramid. Certainly the constraints are much looser and it's far more DIY than even LFS.
@all - So it's 32-bit week at DW. I use old 32-bit machines. They look more and more like a last refuge for user security as the Intel Empire Sith Lords bake networked rootkits directly into their CPUs. Personally I will never buy another one.
https://boingboing.net/2016/06/15/intel-x86-processors-ship-with.html
68 • 32, 32-PAE, 64 Intel, 64 IA, 64 AMD, ... (by Greg Zeng on 2016-06-21 04:25:43 GMT from Oceania)
Comments above are simple, as is the triggering question. Using Dw "Search" for Distributions that can use the CPU-architectures: 386 (142), 486 (25), 586 (15), 686 (54), IA64 (3).
Not listed by Dw are those Distributions that claim to have versions for either 64-AMD or 64-INTEL. "64-INTEL" could mean the x64 bit of the Intel CPU that avoids AMD's version of 64, which Intel's first x64 CPU.
Also avoided by Dw, for reason of the code-writer's silliness, is the missing 32-PAE details. Often "32-bit' might mean "32-bit only", but not PAE. Just few Linux distributions care enough to know this, let us know it as well.
The Intel Atom CPU is 64 bit, even though the EEE-PC has a maximum of 4 GB main memory. As noted by others, 64-bit operating systems & applications seem to demand more storage space than 32-bit alone. WINE-64 not working as well as WINE-32, etc ... suggests that 32-bit applications will probably be better? Benchtesting (timings, memory use, battery-power drainage) will probably show inconsistent, un-repeatable & insignificant results.
Many writers & code publishers seem ignorant of 32-PAE. IMHO, it should be the smallest default distribution available in any brandname. For organizations, it will work (supposedly) easy on any x86 compatible CPU.
Most stationary computers, and some portable computers can have the main memory upgraded from the 4GB maximum of the 32-bit-CPU. In Linux, the only way to address this extra main memory is using 32-PAE or 64-bit distributions. So for organizations or individuals that are limited to 4GB main memory only, 32-bit is preferred.
69 • 32-bit usage (by sidzen on 2016-06-21 04:53:35 GMT from North America)
Old hardware is primary reason for using 32 bit; another is I will not use systemd distros and continuously fall back on Puppy Slacko PAE.
The latter action greatly due to not being able to find many really interesting distros to test out, as was the case in the past (2.5 to 5 yr ago).
The advent of UEFI and systemd have changed GNU/Linux, and not for the better IMHO. "Free" now comes with caveats!
70 • @62; 32- and 64-bit MX (by Hoos on 2016-06-21 05:39:31 GMT from Asia)
@Mike said: "...There's also the mini distros, like Porteus, MX, Tiny Core and Absolute that seem committed to 32 bit but how long can that last if 64 bit is the standard for programming..."
MX is not a "mini" distro. It is a full-fledged and fully-featured Debian Stable derivative running on XFCE 4.12. Its own description on the homepage is that it is "a midweight OS designed to combine an elegant and efficient desktop with simple configuration, high stability, solid performance and medium-sized footprint."
You are probably confusing it with antiX, because MX is a collaboration between antiX developers and the Mepis forum community.
I have MX14 (which only has 32-bit versions) on both my 64-bit computers and an old 32-bit netbook.
MX15 comes in both 32 and 64-bit versions. I have 64-bit MX15 running as well. Both are very good. Perhaps MX14 uses a little less RAM, but it's not a huge difference if you have modern levels of RAM. On the other hand if you're on an older 64-bit computer and have difficulty increasing the little RAM you have, certainly every bit of RAM savings counts.
I can understand that some people are upset their favourite distro is no longer going to churn out 32-bit versions, but don't agree with all the "how dare they?!" and "they are irresponsible" comments. As more third parties drop 32-bit support, the distro developers have more limitations and issues to work around if they want to continue releasing a 32-bit version. Maybe they don't have the time or the finances to do it all.
However there are other 32-bit distros around still. For instance, MX and antiX, which have the added attraction (for some people) that they are not using systemd for init.
71 • 32bit choice (by Simply-the-best on 2016-06-21 06:50:26 GMT from Europe)
Folks looking for the whole six pack, X-Slacko offers a Slack compatible 01micko-designed Puppy-based Xfce in 32bit. Not the slimmest Puppy and needs a little re-education, but, otherwise offers all your heart desires. Maybe.
72 • @69 - 32-bit old hardware, UEFI & systemd (by Paraquat on 2016-06-21 08:07:41 GMT from Asia)
Hi sidzen,
I understand what you're saying. If your main purpose is to avoid UEFI and systemd, you don't really have to go with old hardware or restrict yourself to a 32-bit OS.
First hardware...you can find new 64-bit boards which have the Compatibility Support Module (CSM) option, which allows legacy BIOS-type booting (as opposed to UEFI). You can even format the hard drive in the old ms-dos MBR system if you don't want GPT. I'm not a Luddite and don't oppose change, but for myself I have found UEFI booting to be unreliable, especially in a multi-boot setup. I'm also worried by the fact that Microsoft hasn't given up with its so-called Secure Boot initiative, which despite the name is less about security and more about preventing users from booting any OS other than Windows.
Anyway, unless your hard drive is larger than 4TB, UEFI/GPT is not all that important. If your hard drive is larger than 4TB and you feel the need for Windows 10, the argument in favor of UEFI/GPT becomes a lot stronger, but again as a Linux geek, be weary of Secure Boot.
So much for talking about hardware. About software - if you'd like a 64-bit Linux that doesn't use systemd, I'd suggest taking a look at Devuan. Right now it's still a beta-release, but seems to do most everything that Debian can do (I'm using it right now, and it's been rock solid so far). You might also want to explore FreeBSD as an option, at least when release-11 comes out (early September according to their road map).
Actually, no reason why you couldn't have Puppy, Devuan, FreeBSD and one systemd OS (Ubuntu?) to give yourself a nice basis for comparison. People will always insist that their distro is "the best," but no reason to take anyone's word for it. Distro-hopping is a time-honored tradition.
cheers,
P.
73 • 32-bit... (by Vukota on 2016-06-21 08:40:55 GMT from Europe)
I install 64-bit on all newer hardware that can run it (Raspberry Pi or ARM based stuff anyone? :-)) and has at least 4GB of ram.
Unfortunately I have few Intel Atom CPUs that are 32-bit only, plus Rasberry Pi 2. Also, for most VMs 64-bit is a pure waste of resources (as long as they are not using more than 3GB of ram).
74 • Upgrading operating systems: Linux & Windows. (by Greg Zeng on 2016-06-21 08:58:52 GMT from Oceania)
Linux upgrading can be by "System Replacements" and "Running Upgrades". Piece-meal upgrades of the Linux kernel can be done easily and quickly in Manjaro-based & Ubuntu-based computers. So if you use USB3 ports, you need to use Kernel 4.6.1 or later, disregarding what is supplied to you. linuxplanet.com/news/linux-4.6-charred-weasel-adds-usb-3.1-support.html
If you value your paid job, you also need to upgrade your web browser, since research shows that only apathetic iSheep stay with default applications. www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2015/03/people-who-use-firefox-or-chrome-are-better-employees/387781/
If you use Cloud based applications, like Peppermint, WattOS, & Chromebook systems suggest, it is very easy & quick to upgrade the operating system. None of the fussiness of applications of normal operating systems.
Piece upgrades ("apt-get upgrade" and "apt-get dist-upgrade") do not have better appearances, functions, etc. Alternative to the Dw review here (piece by piece updates of individual units) is "System Replacements". This might be "Mint 16 Petra" to "Mint 17.3 Rosa". This might be the best way, with the fuss restricted to most of the personal customizing for the applications.
It is hard to separate the Linux applications to another partition that can be shared by many other different operating systems. My 12 GB Linux operating system includes all the applications, with each of the ten Linux operating systems having their own versions of my applications. Settings are not easily transported between operating systems (two exceptions: Firefox-based & Chromium based). This contrasts to Windows-10, which demands about 40 GB for each operating system. The 28 GB for the applications is shared by the three (3) Windows and ten (10) Linux operating systems (using WINE). Pagefiles, cache, temporary files not included, since these are generally on a separate partition of the motherboard's mSATA (one terabyte) Samsung SSD, shared by all the installed operating systems.
Using fast USB3 flash sticks, each system replacement in Linux takes five to ten minutes (Debian or Redhat based, without compilations), with just one re-boot needed. This compares to Windows-10, which takes 30 - 50 minutes, with several re-boots). My favored customisation can take up to an hour, for any operating system: preferred storage areas, fonts, coloring, etc.
Luckily Firefox-based & Chromium-based applications remember most of my personal defaults, in all three Windows & ten Linux operating systems on my Dell XPS-15 notebook (multi-booting with Linux's Grub-Customizer).
Perhaps a Manjaro-based distribution like Netrunner (Manjaro) might be an ideal test? Many (most?) Arch-based "Running Upgrades" have had such bad results that users needed to emergency use Mint, etc, or just dump their Arch-based distribution.
On YouTube, the most ex-enthusiast Arch user was Spatry; "Zoo Crew: Arch Linux Beginner Discussion." (2min 35secs) was true in 2012, but not now. Youtube.com/watch?v=wgj7a641sci
My latest Windows "Single Language" ver 10586 has an "upgrade" to the latest Insiders version, which I daringly applied. So silly. Avira anti-virus protection no longer works. "Single Language" is rubbish. All my Windows applications that are not on the same partition as the operating system, have lost all their customizing. About half of the applications need no operating system customizing, acting like "portable" applications, whether they are so labelled or not.
Generally these portable Windows applications work well in Linux with WINE, except for the GUI font sizing. Differences between 64 & 32 bits, I have yet to explore. Benchmarks on memory use, power, storage & speeds are not yet explored. For system admin of many systems, these might be important.
If any sys admin wishes to replicate my findings above, and to take them further, I suggest http://www.dell.com/au/p/xps-15-9550-laptop/pd?oc=z510496au&l=en&s=dhs, with the latest GPU & CPU, instead that of my 2013 model Dell notebook. Given a hardware upgrade, I would gladly extend these studies further, with more detailed published results.
75 • 32/64bit. (by Willi-amp on 2016-06-21 09:07:47 GMT from Europe)
It's Laptops that drive 64bit forwards. They break, get damaged, get lost, and are replaced with new. Repair is seldom an option. 32bit Desktops go on for ever. So much for Neon experts who say they are very rare. The British government want the Public service to use Open-source software and the hardware is largely 32bit, thousands in schools and town-halls across the country, most still running XP. The replacement OS will have to be 32bit and any Distro builder that goes 64bit only is just not thinking. Long live Sparky.
76 • Learning GNU/Linux and UNIX in general (by Andy Mender on 2016-06-21 09:17:16 GMT from Europe)
For learning the ins and outs of GNU/Linux management I would not recommend Arch Linux as it's too simple in terms of setting things up and Ubuntu is definitely not a good solution either due to the ridiculous amount of hand-holding. It's easy to set up a server with it, though what do you really learn via GUIs alone? I would rather recommend CRUX for learning how to write system-level Shell scripts and Gentoo for overall flexibility. It's [Gentoo] designed with admins and developers in mind.
For UNIX management either FreeBSD or OpenBSD would be a good bet, I think :). I personally use FreeBSD and I believe it gives the user a good understanding of the intricacies of system administration.
77 • 64bit vs 32bit. (by Jordan on 2016-06-21 12:02:29 GMT from North America)
I've never noticed a difference. Is that okay?
78 • Poll - 32 v 64 bit Os's (by HansieSlim on 2016-06-21 20:48:50 GMT from Africa)
I normally run into trouble using 64-bit software and therefore I use 32-bit OS's.
79 • 32- or 64 bits ? (by Demigaucher on 2016-06-21 21:24:34 GMT from Europe)
Several old computers (AMD Athlon & Duron) at home. With slackware-based distros
+ Xfce (Salix), then are very reactive, and perfect for home desktop: why spend money
for new hardware since my needs are satisfied with the current one ?
Best regards
Demigaucher
80 • 32-bit for me (by JB on 2016-06-21 23:20:51 GMT from North America)
I use a 32-bit version of Linux MInt 17.2 MATE on my Dell Optiplex 740 desktop. With the exception of my first desktop (which cost $1,100 new in 2000 and ran Win 98se), I have always bought used computers as surplus on auctions, etc. to save money. I suppose that, eventually, the 64-bit machines will become surplus & then I'll get one of those. :)
81 • Upgrades (by Bonky on 2016-06-22 01:53:43 GMT from North America)
@74 "Perhaps a Manjaro-based distribution like Netrunner (Manjaro) might be an ideal test? Many (most?) Arch-based "Running Upgrades" have had such bad results that users needed to emergency use Mint, etc, or just dump their Arch-based distribution."
Are you delusional....In 4 years i have never had any more than the odd issue with GTK whilst using Manjaro all upgrades have gone smoothly...I have never heard of anyone having so much trouble they needed and emergency disc to fall back to...Maybe on vanilla Archyou may experience an occasional problem but again i don't remember any show stoppers.....now talking about Ubuntu , Debian, Opensuse, Those have all died miserably which is why i gave them up
82 • 32-bit or 64-bit (by Steve on 2016-06-22 03:25:27 GMT from North America)
I bought a new 64-bit laptop to use as my primary home computer to replace a 2004 Gateway Pentium 4 32-bit desktop computer running Windows XP. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the older computer. I am currently running Linux Lite 3.0 32-bit on the older Gateway computer and it actually works better now than it did with Windows XP. I just couldn't make myself trash a perfectly good computer. I can do everything on that computer that I could do with Windows XP. Linux developers need to be not so quick to ditch 32-bit distributions because there are still a lot of older computers in use that can benefit from installing LInux.
83 • 32-bit vs 64-bit (by slick on 2016-06-22 03:36:36 GMT from North America)
Have not installed 32-bit in a few years but glad to see on DW that many users enjoy and depend upon 32-bit.
Sincerely hope that devs pay attention and continue providing support for 32-bit and keep those older machines humming! Also the users who just prefer the 32-bit over 64-bit.
84 • Computer Hardware forces software changes ... like it or not. (by Greg Zeng on 2016-06-22 04:47:58 GMT from Oceania)
Desktop computing is almost dead. These hardware items, to an anthropologist, are concentrations of software knowledge.
Slow learners do not like the fact that all knowledge has a half-life. There are ways, off-topic atm here, to minimize damage by staying with old hardware and old software. We cannot avoid our forced changes of hardware, nor software, unless you are proud of your membership of the GOP (grand old party).
Moore's Law affects both hardware & software. In my undergrad days (1968), we learnt Fortran on a mini-computer. This year, our handheld smartphones replace the vegetarian card-feeders. Now we have AI-GUI, waterproof, shockproof, VDU, UPS, and fast cloud-computer links.
GOPs who stay with junk from last century are creating enormous green-house gases; highly inefficient CPU cycles, transport, storage and admin costs. Desktop PCs etc require large, wasteful UPS, inefficient cooling fans, and massive supporting structures to try to justify the old technologies. NASA is launching modified Linux smartphones into orbit now. IOT (Linux-powered) is everywhere, invisible to everyone now: finance, transport, health, buildings, tools.
In the Linux communities, retards believe in re-inventing the wheels (compiling Linux from source), instead of standing on the shoulders of many giants, like System-D, Ubuntu "Snap", Linux's Wayland, etc. Any Linux marking group needs to disregard these small-minded, minority tumors in the expanding body of Linux. Tumors will always be there. The focus should be imho gambling on the innovative growth errors. Pure CISC (x88, Motorola 68000) & RISC (ARM) computing are dead. Combinations are in computing fashion, with all types of multiple, cooperative computers needing both complex, dizzying mixtures of hardware & software.
Linux is not perfect. BSD is playing catch-up, trying to be better than its older siblings: Unix & Linux. The Linux community is changing so fast, no one except the Linux marketing group, can dare try to keep track of this marketing niche.
85 • 32 Bit (by zcatav on 2016-06-22 05:01:19 GMT from Europe)
I use antiX 32 bit on my netbook. Secondary OS is Sparky Linux 32 bit on same machine.
86 • 32-bit linux. (by Drizzt on 2016-06-22 06:56:13 GMT from Oceania)
i use 32-bit. Two main reasons:
1) more compatible - 32-bit will work with both hardwares, and less things work with 64-bit.
2) very standard usage, no geeky stuff - so 32-bit does fine, on a netbook. No need software that are more 'fancy'/itellegent, and the basic ones i use likely don't make use of 64-bit anyway.
Note: these comments are based on me being a beginner to linux, so hopefully i am not blabbing on some nonsense stuff.
And maybe a third reason - done some searching on the net and couldn't find a site that mentions directly if my netbook is 32-bit or 64-bit machine, except for an old one that mentions the person is installing 32-bit Fedora 14 and will install 64-bit version when F16 is out as the machine is a 64-bit one. So it i think it is 64-bit, but doesn't hurt to stay 'safe' based on the first two reasons above.
87 • Upgrades and 32bit. (by Willi-amp on 2016-06-22 08:43:06 GMT from Europe)
After nine years my PCLinuxOS has been killed off by an 'upgrade'. And as for 32bit, I hope Bill Reynolds has been reading these Comments.
88 • not everyone is a smombie (by dontspyonme on 2016-06-22 09:28:41 GMT from Europe)
@84 Thanks for dissing everyone who doesn't follow the newest trends. I resent being labelled as a "republican" in the US-sense.
If you think touch-based mini devices with screen sizes that fit into your hand are the future for everything, thats fine for you. Calling those of us who want something that is more useful and doesn't get replaced every two years "retards" is NOT appropriate, however.
And you would do well to remember that the focus on "smart"phones has a lot to do with collectiong excessive amounts of data on the users, especially movement profiles, biometrics etc. If you are fine with this, that's ok - but you should accept that there are people who value their privacy.
And don't forget that constantly producing new handhelds with the newest technology and throwing away the old ones that may contain toxic components isn't exactly friendly to the environment either.
89 • command line for hardware info (by brad on 2016-06-22 12:21:40 GMT from North America)
@86 - lscpu at the command line should be able to tell you whether your processor is 32- or 64-bit. There are other command-line tools that can help as well, and can make you feel a little less like a beginner (we *all* were once, you know...)
: - )
90 • Still supporting many 32-bit computers (by Only use AMD APUs on 2016-06-22 14:28:33 GMT from North America)
I still have a couple of 32-bit notebook PCs that are quite usable. I normally use openSUSE which is now only available in 64-bit versions.
I've found that the 32-bit Debian 8.5 LXDE works well on older, slower, low RAM PCs and I use it on 32-bit PCs.
I also support a number of friends who have old 32-bit PCs and either can't afford to upgrade to a newer PC or don't want to. Those run Puppy or Debian 8.5
91 • Why I use 32 bit over 64 (by SM on 2016-06-22 14:36:23 GMT from North America)
In the past I had trouble locating certain 64bit packages but finding the 32bit version easily. That may not be the case so much anymore, however I have just stayed with the 32 bit while using I686. Performance is not a complaint so I feel that since 32bit with I686 has done the job just fine, there is no point in me changing at this time.
92 • Mild concerns running 64 bit or 32 (by Green Sun on 2016-06-22 15:05:04 GMT from North America)
Pros:
Encryption benefits with larger registers.
3 GB Barrier may be present for 32bit OS: "exact barrier varies by motherboard and I/O device configuration, particularly the size of video RAM; it may be in the range of 2.75 GB to 3.5 GB" Misconception that 32 bit OS is restricted to 4GB - PAE unless you have chipset/mobo issues.
'more general-purpose registers than their 32-bit counterparts' 'leads to a significant speed increase for tight loops'
Java programs that run on a 64-bit Java virtual machine have access to a larger address space.
Cons:
'same data occupies more space in memory (due to longer pointers and possibly other types, and alignment padding). This increases the memory requirements of a given process and can have implications for efficient processor cache utilization'
93 • Hardware replacement (by Kragle on 2016-06-22 15:58:15 GMT from North America)
There are costs in replacing hardware which can easily exceed power savings over an expected "lifetime". Using existing hardware allows testing the proposition that newer is better than smarter.
94 • 32 vs 64 bit OS (by Jeff on 2016-06-22 17:20:34 GMT from North America)
I have a Toshiba Netbook NB205-N210 with an Intel Atom N280 processor, which does not support 64 bit architecture.
I also run a byo box with an AMD A6 processor and an ASUS motherboard which is running on 64 bit OS
95 • Guess I am a luddite (by BluPhoenyx on 2016-06-22 19:45:16 GMT from North America)
I like old hardware. In fact, I use computers from various eras including 6502 systems such as the Apple II. I feel a bit offended by Mr. Zeng's statements for a variety of reasons. The most important to me, however, is the fact that I was raised to get the most out of the things that I purchase, especially those that cost a lot of money. Even a few hundred bucks for a new computer can be a huge expense to people on a fixed income.
Old doesn't imply useless. Based on Mr. Zeng's point of view we might as well scrap all the old houses, automobiles and other items we own and get something new. Can you imaging the amount of debt that people would be in? Things are bad enough as it is in our current throw-away society.
Back on topic, I use both 64 bit and 32 bit for various reasons. One of which is a game that my wife and I play together that will, most likely, never be updated. I also like working on older laptops that people have no use for. There can be a lot of life in the hardware and most just need a new keyboard and/or battery. It's a great hobby that provides this disabled luddite something useful to do.
96 • Thanks (by Ken Frank on 2016-06-22 22:00:07 GMT from North America)
Linux gave new life, to me. I was a field tech covering the western states working on Windows based process control systems, mainly refineries. In the 1990s we had started with systems based on HP Unix, later replaced with Windows. But it was then I started working with Linux at home although I back burnered then to focus on work.
Having had to take early retirement due to physical disabilities in 2015, I found myself needing a technical challenge. It was either that or waste away. Re enter Linux. Working with distros has breathed new life into me. I currently run Mint on my desktop and Debian on my laptop although there are many distros for me to investigate, for which I am greatful. Current projects, Zorin, Kali. Keep up your good work! Ken Frank.... aka G-pa
97 • 32bit vs. 64bit (by Sherman Jerrold on 2016-06-22 23:49:07 GMT from North America)
I use only 32bit Linux versions because I have older hardware and I rejuvinate old computers for people; installing Linux in parallel with their existing Window$. I thank those distros that remember that many of us with limited budgets are still using old PCs. I have even added Linux to a 1998 Dell pentium with a 700MHz processor and only 250MB of RAM and the owner was pleased because she could now safely (although somewhat slowly) browse the Internet.
98 • @84 Desktop computing almost dead? LOL (by imnotrich on 2016-06-23 05:44:18 GMT from North America)
Desktop Computing IS computing. To get actual work done you need a desktop, period. If you need portability, a laptop.
Tablets and smartphones are mostly toys, always will be - because of their size, lack of storage space, CPU lack of horsepower, small screens and limits of human vision/finger dexterity.
Not counting extreme gamer machines, as a whole desktops have become more and more energy efficient over the years everything from the power supply to replacing spinners with SSD's. I'd agree that power management settings on both Windows 7/8/10 as well as Linux often do not work properly and often have to be disabled but that's an OS problem, not hardware.
I submit that keeping older, still working desktops alive rather than euthanizing them prematurely is the environmentally friendly thing to do as well as makes good economic sense. I can't afford to spend $500-1000 on a new PC every few years, but parts here and there are not a problem - sometimes I already have the parts in my junk box thanks to another PC that became an organ donor prior to being sent to ewaste heaven.
Another workplace trend that you neglected to mention are thin clients, which are still technically a desktop but in many cases are more energy efficient than a laptop. For work that doesn't require lots of CPU/RAM but still needs a human to read a normal size screen, thin clients are great.
Oh wait - are you one of those Ubuntu Unity fanboys who believe the same UI is valid/useful across multiple devices? If so I am sorry for you.
99 • @62 Is the number of bits relevant w/r "standards for programming" (by dbrion on 2016-06-23 08:19:45 GMT from Europe)
What made GNU/linux well known was :
(a)the high quality of its software (Windows has managed since 2009 to achieve an equivalent quality: before, it was not their policy) and
(b) their high portability -W$ did not achieve it- , which remains very serious : if you have an application which works on a 32 bit MIPS, it should not be difficult to port it into a 64 bit PC (and one can test on a PC (it is recommanded) the non hardware dependant part -typically : computing, use of (serial) streams - of an AVR application -a 8 bit processor, can emulate zx81 and partly Apple IIE; maybe it is in everyone's key board and coffee machines...).
As far as ordinosaurs are concerned : it is very likely that burning them/ putting them into waste will be more environment unfriendly than their (said to be ) huge power greediness (and I hope that new, whith hundreds of bits PC -just wait and let Moore's law make you feel very great- , when they are manufactured, are Planet friendly... but it should be verified )
100 • Desktop computing and future (by Andy Mender on 2016-06-23 08:20:26 GMT from Europe)
I agree with 98. Smartphones can do a lot already and are definitely more powerful than i386-i586 computers from 'way back'. However, they act mostly as simple tools for checking e-mails, organizing schedules, contacting people, etc. They are rather crappy for Internet browsing and watching movies due to their small screen. Also, they cannot do the heavy lifting of proper desktops...
I can understand that the laptop sector may dwindle a bit, since there seems to be a high demand for 11" and 13" laptops and bigger laptops are getting thinner and thinner (no DVD drive anymore, etc.). With all of the focus on cloud computing and virtualization it's enough to have a small, functional *top and offload all of the computing to dedicated machines (servers, mainframes, etc.). Portable gaming rigs are a different category and should not be considered inclusively.
Powerful workstations will prevail as many act as servers or high-performance computing machines, even if some are considered 'legacy hardware' by manufacturers.
The biggest economic problem is that our lovely capitalism is built not on production for the 'cause of humanity', but to make money. This is a sad, vicious cycle. Hardware manufacturers earn money to feel better (successful, meaningful, etc.) and they must sell in order to earn. Therefore, it's in their utmost interest to convince everyone that their new flagship product is 'the new big thing'.
101 • 32 bit operating system only (by roman on 2016-06-23 10:03:03 GMT from Oceania)
Currently I am using Ubuntu 15.04 on my Mac mini ( intel cpu ) 500gb SSD and 4gig ram installed
I have been using Ubuntu on this machine since 10.04 came out.
I tried to install 15.04 63 bit but found machine was slow and was failing doing mundane things .
I find the 32 bit versions work well and are quite stable.
102 • 32 bit operating system only (by Saif on 2016-06-23 14:20:48 GMT from Asia)
Currently i am using Linux Mint 18 32bit in my Laptop (Celeron B800 + 2gig ram). I use 32 bit because i can't run heavy application (like IDE or Firefox (yes, firefox is heavy because i open 6+ tab when i use it)) in 64bit linux with only 2gig ram. I plan using 64 bit when i can buy a better laptop though.
103 • Upload Torrent for Ultimate Edition 5.0 (by Cairo on 2016-06-23 16:19:35 GMT from North America)
Hi,
I'm a relatively new convert to Linux; having started in April 2015 with ChaletOS and progressing through trials of Peppermint 6, Zorin 9, Linux Lite, Anti-X MX15, Manjaro, Q4OS, Ubuntu Mate and currently Linux Mate 18. I'm intrigued torrenting a goby UE 5.0 and the use of torrents. I'd appreciate if you would upload a torrent for UE 5.0 so I can try. both,
Thanks
104 • @103 UEv5.0-Maté torrent link (by Somewhat Reticent on 2016-06-23 16:56:29 GMT from North America)
Been done: http://linuxtracker.org/download.php?id=51bfe43402f503adf6753cde067beaa01a3e1d34&f=ultimate-edition-5.0-x64-lite-mate.iso.torrent&key=6c2d037a
Be sure to read release notes - some DEs need more GPU
105 • why I use 32 bit os (by bob solomon on 2016-06-23 20:38:04 GMT from North America)
I use 32 bit OS only on 32 bit machines; 64 bit otherwise.
106 • Sorry Hoos (by Mike on 2016-06-23 20:58:16 GMT from North America)
Hey Hoos. You're absolutely right. For a few years, Anti-X was my go to recommendation to people with older 32 bit systems. I am also familiar with MX, and way back in my distro hopping days, I used Mepis for a while. I guess I had a brain fart when I tossed MX in with the minis. My apologies to anticapitalista.
I see since my last comments that tablets and mobile phones are taking a beating from some posters as being useless since the screens are too small for video. If you expect a large video presentation when you leave your home, it stands to reason that you need to carry a large device with you. However, when you are home, that constraint disappears since a monitor or TV would probably be available. I live in a 10 occupant rooming house (not a dump, but not exactly a high rent district either) that caters to lower income, retired (like me) social security or disability income types with a lot of turnover where I provide internet access and device repair to the tenants as a hobby now, so I see all kinds of various older equipment that some people seem to think are junk and can only be used for email and Facebook. Not true. I recently had a guy move in with a older Samsung Galaxy TAB 3 Lite 7" T110 and an old 720p tv. It has Android 4.2.2 Jellybean on it and cannot be upgraded to 4.4.2 KitKat. Recent Amazon listings show them selling for $120. Well, for $22 on eBay, you can buy a refurbished Chromecast and cast your video to the TV. The reason I mentioned the Android versions is that Jellybean will not cast browser tabs, so streaming from a website won't work, but apps like Youtube, Hulu, Netflix and such work just fine. Luckily, that tenant with the T110 had a relative with Hulu and Netflix accounts, so now he has all the entertainment he needs on a big screen and he's happier than a... , well you know. So, the idea of these kinds of devices being useless, especially to lower income folks looking to upgrade their multimedia experience, is a little short-sighted. I recently have seen new small tablets available at Blinq (online seller of new, refurbished and used electronics and more) for less than $40 with Android 5.0 Marshmallow on them that will cast anything, tabs, desktops, etc. So, small, inexpensive devices are not useless. I have found that many of the USB mini computers are very limited, but there are the $99 Kangaroo pocket computers that can be used to plug into HDMI anywhere. I have one myself and it's a very solid piece of equipment with decent, but not overwhelming performance. With the dock, it's not much larger than a 5" phone. It's a stock Win 10 device right now which I use to keep up with how useless MS is, but I've seen some folks on the Arch forum working on trying to get Arch running on them, which would make it a half price alternative to a Chromebox converted to a full linux disto that is also portable. I expect performance will be stellar when converted to a lightweight distro.
While I'm on a roll, I wonder if DistroWatch might want to do a Q&A or Opinion Poll about refurbished electronics. I spent 4 years in the Army (Army Security Agency, the Army's answer to NSA) as an analyst/tech then a few years as a 101 toll test man at our local telco (yup, greybeard for real with duck dynasty having not much on me) and better than 15 years as a test tech in the defense electronics industry plus another 5 years or so in other non-defense related tech jobs. I always buy refurbished when available, and when I mention this to people looking to upgrade their equipment, they think I'm crazy. So, I ask them where they think refurbished products come from. I get a lot of blank stares with that. I then explain to them that they were all new at one time or were production rejects. Then the new ones broke, or the buyer didn't like it or whatever, which brings us to how production electronics really works. . Most stuff is produced in assembly line fashion with test at various points of production by people that only know how to run one test at their station. Sure, there's heat tests and finals, but as you know, products of less than optimal quality still make it out the door. Home use and abuse is the real test bed. When items come back, they come to guys like me, along with the production rejects. We would then go over them with a fine tooth comb and make sure that the product is fit for delivery to the gov't or resale. But isn't that expensive for the manufacturer? Somewhat, but trashing product in most cases is a lot more expensive than fixing it. Reconditioned returns cannot be sold as a new items but there is still a lot of value there when you consider the markups. I was making about $28/hour at that time (this was a decent buck back then) and most defects were of a common variety missed during production or were unforeseen engineering problems (cough), so fixes were relatively quick and painless and we had people to do reassembly when we were done tearing things apart and fixing them. Why have a $28/hour tech doing an $7/hour assembly job? Anything of a more exotic nature got put on the back shelf and played with during slow spells. In other words, fixing things was a much better idea fiscally than just trashing them most of the time. Total basket cases were stripped of components we identified as usable and disassembled by low cost temps with screwdrivers and soldering irons. So when you buy a refurbished item from a reputable manufacturer, it's been gone over by trained, certified technicians whose job it is to fix defective products. This is not to say that production techs are useless or are unskilled, but it is not their job to fix things, just to move product down the line and send defective items to us. I have much more confidence in refurbs than new, and I have rarely been burned when buying refurbs and they generally have a warranty with more than sufficient time to identify a problem at home (the ultimate test bed) at significant savings over the cost of a new product.
107 • VP Greg Welcome Aboard (by Arch Watcher 402563 on 2016-06-23 23:07:56 GMT from North America)
@84 Dear Greg, WTF is a vegetarian card-feeder?
I appoint you VP in my Distrowatch campaign to obsolete that last-century, coal-powered protocol, e-mail. I'm not GOP if you're worried. I have mentioned the Grandma and Bubba demographic.
Linux marketing has bigger problems than tinkerers who read Distrowatch. Start with mister potty mouth. He's the first joker people find in Google searches, sticking his middle finger into the camera. Let's just say he gives his project an image problem. I suggest a stylized logo to let Granny know how he cares for her use case. How about a laser shark flying its middle flipper in the air.
Linus runs exactly one distro, Fedora. I doubt he even reads Distrowatch. Lennart's great advance was 1990s Windows INI files. We haven't graduated to GRAPHICAL USER INTERFACES for boot dependency graphs. Yay, progress!
The Internet of All the Unencrypted Spy Things is embedded stuff. Embedded engineering always hits a decision point for the choice between 8-bit, 16-bit, or 32-bit. Almost never is it 64-bit, unless it's a full-up PC/104, and even then, it's usually 32-bit. Less bits means cheaper, and cheaper means better for business. Nobody thinks about human progress when there's money at stake.
I guess we'll ignore the fierce Intel monopoly on hardware in our surrender to market forces.
Our anti-geek platform has an environmental plank: too many watts per square centimeter giving us tumors. I'm growing one myself. A tower faking a tree stands 100 yards from where I sit with more of them every eighth-mile in either direction. It's jolly cancerous outside my Farady Cage. The grade school soccer field is quite special. The local school marms decided to irradiate school kids with not one, not two, but FOUR (4) cell towers, one on each corner of the soccer field, for the good rent money from Verizon and friends.
And then there's WiFi, but I seek the impossible. We politicians must be reasonable. We can't win without at least some geeks on side. Opposing WiFi and cell forests both will lose them all. Let's pander to the WiFi demographic.
Puppy and Slacko work for old systems but I often run SliTaz Rolling (i386 I think) even on high-end gear. It's Openbox and pretty, plus lightning fast. You can run SliTaz from RAM. It leaves Lennartware boot times in the dust.
108 • Mageia 4... (by G Rohner on 2016-06-24 00:33:20 GMT from Europe)
I guess I was also lucky, coming across a Mageia mirror that was still alive. The reason I mention it is that by coincidence, I was just after digging out an old Athlon pc (32-bit obviously!) which has Mageia 3 installed. Booting it up, I was surprised to be told that there was 438 updates available - 390meg of downloads! I thought, 'what the hell!' so initiated an update before heading out to do some shopping. Five hours on, I was dismayed to find that less than half of the updates had been installed (not a network problem either). Not prepared to wait another 5 hours, I hit the reset button - only to find that Mageia 3 will no longer boot in any mode! Oh well...
I then had a look for Mageia online (1, 3 & 4) and found all of the ISO's, and they all would start downloading.
109 • @81 Arch/Manjaro upgrades (by linuxista on 2016-06-24 05:16:42 GMT from North America)
Yes, @74 is delusional. I used to keep a Mint backup to my primary Arch install, but deleted it years ago because I never had to use it. Now I have an Arch primary and a Manjaro backup. The Arch has been going strong for 6 years now. I'm glad Jesse's doing these tests of the release upgrade models. It reminds me of why rolling is actually easier and more stable in the long run.
110 • @106 uselessness of phones (by dontspyonme on 2016-06-24 11:10:18 GMT from Europe)
You misunderstand. Phones and tablets are not useless "because the screens are too small for video". While I personally wouldn't want to watch anything on a mini-phone-screen, "looking at stuff" is in fact the ONLY thing these devices are useful for.
The moment you need to do actual work, i.e. create something, the screen size and especially the user interface of these devices cripple you. Without a decent keyboard and a pointing device that is much more precise than fat fingers, you can't effectively create useful text documents or figures or do any decent graphics work.
Until that changes, handhelds will remain toys and means for "looking at stuff", not for creating it. This also explains why (expensive) tablets are so popular with management types, who don't do actual work themselves.
111 • 32bit/64bit arch (by ibuidan on 2016-06-24 15:44:07 GMT from Europe)
My computer is 64bit compatible Intel Pentium dual core 2ghz 200x10 and I run 64bit Debian GNU/Linux with JWM(Joe's window manager) and 64bit applications only except a 32bit game I run in Wine compatibility mode. my previous computer is 32bit Intel Pentium uni 1.5ghz 100x15 and I use it for running my experimental 32bit software projects. That's all.
112 • 32-bit (by Dr. David Johnson on 2016-06-24 18:02:08 GMT from North America)
I have always enjoyed trying out different open-source operating systems on older hardware. That has, in the past, usually meant downloading the 32-bit forms, but more and more I have been getting rid of VERY old hardware, and so I have fewer boxes that will not support 64-bit. I don't mind that some distros are phasing out 32-bit, as it seems there will continue to be 32-bit options available with some distros for the near future, anyway.
By the way, thanks for a great site that keeps evolving. I really have enjoyed the articles on upgrading/updating major releases. (Not surprised OpenBSD was relatively easy to upgrade!)
Keep up the good work!
David
113 • Why I'm going to switch (by W Faulkner on 2016-06-24 19:41:25 GMT from North America)
Yes I'm going over to the 64 bit Linux OS been using 32 bit since Win 95 and it time.......just saying!
114 • 32 v 64 and Learning Linux (by Tazer91 on 2016-06-25 12:28:03 GMT from North America)
I use a mix of 32 and 64 bit due to older hardware. My laptop still requires 32 bit. But all my newer machines use 64 bit.
Also in terms of learning Linux, another distribution to check out is Gentoo. Gentoo was/is a great learning experience for me. Their documentation is very good as well, and their assistance within the Gentoo Forums is top notch. So I would definitely recommend giving that a look in addition to Arch.
115 • There we go again (by NinoNino on 2016-06-25 23:50:02 GMT from North America)
@87
"After nine years my PCLinuxOS has been killed off by an 'upgrade'. "
That's the nature of things, nothing's perfect. Reinstall.
"And as for 32bit, I hope Bill Reynolds has been reading these Comments."
It's been said before: Tex didn't stop the 32 bit version because he's evil, he just doesn't have the time and means to do it! All may be good reasons, he just can't.
116 • @110 Re: The Usefulness of Cellphones (by Ben Myers on 2016-06-26 02:59:08 GMT from North America)
In general, you are right that cellphones are good for looking at information, but not at creating information. Exception: the cameras in many new cellphones create photos that rival those taken by the best point-and-shoot cameras. But I would never ever want to author a long document or create a spreadsheet on a cellphone. Cell phone apps convert a phone into a multi-purpose device with GPS navigation, compass, altimeter and others that serve a very real purpose.
Ever the notice the trend toward bigger cellphones, with 5" or larger screens and quite high resolution? These tablet-like phones still are not good for creating information, but I know more than a couple of people who load their documents, spreadsheets and PowerPoints onto a large cellphone which is then hitched to a projector. For some, a little more convenient than a small 12 or 13 inch laptop carted around for presentations.
Whether a cellphone is useful for anything other than a phone depends on what you want and can to do with it. Visit the Android or Apple Store to see what's there.
117 • 32 vs 64 bit OS (by Glenn on 2016-06-26 12:50:50 GMT from North America)
I continue to use a 32 bit OS (Lubuntu 14.04) out of necessity for my low-mileage Dell D800 Latitude notebook with a Banias Pentium M processor that is not 64 bit-capable. Although the 1.4 Ghz processor speed and 5400 rpm 120Gb HDD make it slow to boot, it is quite capable of generating text documents in Libre Office, sending & receiving email, playing music files and playing SD DVD movies. I like its keyboard better than newer ones, and its speakers are louder and clearer than my newer 64 bit notebook. Because the D800 motherboard has a 2Gb maximum RAM capacity, a 64 bit OS would bring no advantages to this hardware. Indeed, PAE is unnecessary with only 2 Gb which is why I do not understand the push for 32 bit PAE kernels only in most OS's. Few of the single core processors had more than 3 Gb RAM capability, negating the need for PAE. Multi-core processors are all 64 bit-capable, negating the need for 32 bit PAE. All I need for my D800 is the 32 bit nonPAE kernel.
118 • 32-bit systems (by RollMeAway on 2016-06-26 18:52:03 GMT from North America)
As I have stated many times, I only have 32-bit computers. 5 desktops and 2 laptops at home. I use 11 32-bit computer at my work.
Yes, I can afford to buy a new system but not eighteen !
I cannot bring myself to trash a perfectly good system, just because a distro developer is short handed.
If developers are short handed, likd Bill Reynolds at PClinuxOS, why not drop the 64-bit version. 32-bit distros work quite well on 64-bit systems.
Then nobody is left behind.
Number of Comments: 118
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| • Issue 1082 (2024-08-05): Linux Mint 22, taking snapshots of UFS on FreeBSD, openSUSE updates Tumbleweed and Aeon, Debian creates Tiny QA Tasks, Manjaro testing immutable images |
| • Issue 1081 (2024-07-29): SysLinuxOS 12.4, OpenBSD gain hardware acceleration, Slackware changes kernel naming, Mint publishes upgrade instructions |
| • Issue 1080 (2024-07-22): Running GNU/Linux on Android with Andronix, protecting network services, Solus dropping AppArmor and Snap, openSUSE Aeon Desktop gaining full disk encryption, SUSE asks openSUSE to change its branding |
| • Issue 1079 (2024-07-15): Ubuntu Core 24, hiding files on Linux, Fedora dropping X11 packages on Workstation, Red Hat phasing out GRUB, new OpenSSH vulnerability, FreeBSD speeds up release cycle, UBports testing new first-run wizard |
| • Issue 1078 (2024-07-08): Changing init software, server machines running desktop environments, OpenSSH vulnerability patched, Peppermint launches new edition, HardenedBSD updates ports |
| • Full list of all issues |
| Star Labs |
Star Labs - Laptops built for Linux.
View our range including the highly anticipated StarFighter. Available with coreboot open-source firmware and a choice of Ubuntu, elementary, Manjaro and more. Visit Star Labs for information, to buy and get support.
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| Random Distribution | 
iDeal OS
iDeal OS is a computer operating system, a custom respin of the powerful MX Linux distribution, with the best privacy and security settings enabled by default. The main goals of iDeal OS are privacy and security, offering to surf, shop, trade and bank online with complete peace of mind, without annoying advertisements, tracking, logging, bugs, viruses or unwanted disclosure of personal information. iDeal OS is available in two different editions: "Emerald", which offers applications for everyday computing needs, and "Diamond", with is a powerful digital workstation with a wide range of professional tools.
Status: Active
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| TUXEDO |
TUXEDO Computers - Linux Hardware in a tailor made suite
Choose from a wide range of laptops and PCs in various sizes and shapes at TUXEDOComputers.com. Every machine comes pre-installed and ready-to-run with Linux. Full 24 months of warranty and lifetime support included!
Learn more about our full service package and all benefits from buying at TUXEDO.
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| Star Labs |
Star Labs - Laptops built for Linux.
View our range including the highly anticipated StarFighter. Available with coreboot open-source firmware and a choice of Ubuntu, elementary, Manjaro and more. Visit Star Labs for information, to buy and get support.
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