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1 • security extension (by Bill S. on 2015-11-30 01:12:57 GMT from North America) |
I use DuckDuckGo w/ Adblock Plus and Ghostery.. Couldn't live without them. lol
2 • poll (by pcninja on 2015-11-30 01:16:49 GMT from North America)
I use multiple privacy/security extensions.
I use uBlock Origin, Encrypted Web (fork of HTTPS-everywhere), NoScript, and uMatrix.
3 • NetBSD's Rumpkernel (by flies on 2015-11-30 01:53:00 GMT from Asia)
NetBSD also has something very similar to Qubes, which is Rumpkernel. it is a very small kernel which can run in userland.
4 • Browser Extensions (by Michael on 2015-11-30 01:54:58 GMT from Oceania)
I use AdBlock Plus, Flagfox, ImTranslator, save-to-read and for searches I use ixquick. All useful from time-to-time but the first 2 essential.
5 • Extentions (by Marv on 2015-11-30 02:03:52 GMT from North America)
I Use AdBlock Plus, Ghostery and Web Of Trust.
6 • How about old/legacy DEs/WMs? (by kneekoo on 2015-11-30 02:18:04 GMT from Europe)
Nice reviews. I was disappointed about the issues of Qubes 3.0 on your test environment. I don't know if it was a hardware problem but I hoped to get more information about the distro without having to test it on my own.
"Knoppix 7.6.0 -- Running the KDE desktop" <- the screenshot shows LXDE
How about interviewing the developers of old and legacy Desktop Environments about their DEs and their adoption and relevance today?
Trinity DE, MATE, Enlightenment and Openbox would be good starters for the following questions:
1. Where do you stand with the development (bugs, features, requests)?
2. How satisfied are you with the current state of the project?
3. How did you manage to keep a balance between resource consumption and users' demands?
4. Are you satisfied with the adoption rate of your project and what do you think could rapidly change that for the better?
5. Name a few big distros having your project available in the default repositories.
6. Do you feel the need for a more modern/appealing look of the DE/WM?
7. Do you envision something big or radical in the project's future 5 years from now?
7 • Interviewing developers (by Jesse on 2015-11-30 02:34:20 GMT from North America)
>> "How about interviewing the developers of old and legacy Desktop Environments about their DEs and their adoption and relevance today?"
I would love to do that. Unfortunately it is difficult to get developers to return e-mails requesting an interview. On average only about one in ten responds at all and, of those, not all want to answer questions.
That being said, if any developers want to talk about their projects, desktop environment or otherwise, I am happy to hear from them.
8 • KaOS / Calamares (by Reuben on 2015-11-30 02:35:28 GMT from North America)
I tried the KaOS image in VirtualBox. All I got was a python error after starting the installation. So I was not able to test out KaOS itself. It also lacks many features. I like the idea of several distributions cooperating on a single installer, but it's simply not ready yet.
9 • Here are the Firefox add-ons I can't live without: (by Brian_H on 2015-11-30 02:40:18 GMT from North America)
Here are the Firefox add-ons I can't live without:
Adblock Plus - Been using this for at least 10 years Be sure to disable the "let a few ads slip through" option.
Classic Theme Restorer - Banishes Mozilla's awkward Australis GUI theme.
DictionarySearch - Allows you to right click on a word and get a dictionary definition. Handy!
Download Youtube Videos as MP4 - Adds a download button to Youtube video webpages. Allows you to download YT videos as regular files and watch them anytime offline.
Load Tabs Progressively Fixed - Just as the name suggests, it throttles the number of webpages that load simultaneously. Absolutely fantastic on older computers and something all web browsers should have implemented years ago.
Middle Click To Go Back - Re-maps your middle mouse button as a "go back to previous webpage" button. Been surfing the web this way ever since I bought my first wheel mouse back in 1999. Back then I had to use Microsoft's Intellimouse software to remap the middle mouse button.
NoScript - Another one of those essential add-ons to keep the non-sense on webpages from getting out of hand. Really helps lighten the processing burden on old computers.
Smoothwheel - This add-on replaces the native smooth-scrolling on Firefox. It's smoothes out screen scrolling better and uses less processing power. I use the "1/3 page" step size.
X-notifier - Adds a button to the toolbar that fetches your webmail from several services such as Gmail, Hotmail, etc
10 • @1 (by Dr.Chimpanski on 2015-11-30 03:53:37 GMT from Europe)
DuckGo is tracking and it is not fast as it used to be 4-5 years ago.
Yandex is faster.
(We at work call it DuckF..kGo and the avatar speaks pages for itself)
Have funn using it.
PS: In the past (years ago) DuckFGo was not tracking but that has changed :)
11 • @10 DuckDuckGo (by linuxista on 2015-11-30 04:51:07 GMT from North America)
I use DDG and was surprised by your assertion that DDG tracks. I searched around...
and couldn't find any evidence of it. Can you point out what has changed about their tracking policy and where you got the information?
12 • Privacy-Security & KaOS 2015.10? (by NuBee on 2015-11-30 05:20:36 GMT from North America)
Privacy-Security: DuckDuckGo, Disconnect, HTTPS Everywhere, Privacy Badger, Better Privacy.
KaOS 2015.10: On my desktop, when trying to boot into the live DVD option, I keep getting a reboot "loop". Any ideas what is causing this? Thanks.
13 • AddOns (by noOne on 2015-11-30 05:52:40 GMT from Europe)
I use different stages of content filtering and all my add-ons are 100% FOSS:
- HTTPS Everywhere
- uBlock Origin (with Disconnect block lists enabled) <-- block list filter
- Privacy Badger <-- filter based on algorithms
- NoScript <-- disable scripts
- Request Policy Continued <-- prevent sites from chainloading contents from other sites
14 • µblock origin not adblockplus (by Frederic Bezies on 2015-11-30 07:48:26 GMT from Europe)
I was a long time user of adblockplus. But I switched to µblockorigin and it is far.
Not really fancy to set up, but powerful. I was using also disconnect, but as long as disconnect list are used with µblock origin... :)
Speaking of privacy badger ? Well, it used to work on my nightlies of Firefox. Not anymore :(
15 • browser privacy & security add-ons & DDG (by M.Z. on 2015-11-30 08:09:50 GMT from North America)
In Firefox I use the following privacy & security add-ons:
I leave all but WOT turned off in Opera 33, but I only use that for a few select sites that I trust & want to help out via full proper page views. It's sort of a gratuity for sites I like because as I understand it this helps pay for things far better than page visits with full blockers enabled, whether you click the ads or not (I never do).
@10/Dr.Chimpanski & 11
I use DuckDuckGo for nearly all my searches & agree with #11, which is to say any claims against DDG should be backed up with evidence. I find it to be a fast & competent search alternative & don't appreciate spurious accusations (which of course could be valid if backed with actual evidence). If you're going to make such a claim by all means tell us why you believe such or thing, or better why any reasonable individual should believe some accusation posted on the web rather than the stated policy of DuckDuckGo.
16 • Browser extensions (by Someguy on 2015-11-30 08:33:34 GMT from Europe)
Don't bother. Ads pay for the success of 'free' software. Apart from which, my friends credit me with being immune to hyper-suggestion, subliminal persuasion, overt blasts, and most other mind-infiltration attempts. Besides, I might miss something....
17 • Ad block encourages ignorance. (by Greg Zeng on 2015-11-30 09:00:02 GMT from Oceania)
Please do not allow the paranoid to control the internet. Experts dealing with users of DuckDuckGo, adblockers, etc are upset with ignorance of these users. In some medical areas, so many are unaware of the popular commercial advertisers, their services, products and end-user guides.
Cookies and web-scripts help web users better their internet life so much that I'm very puzzled why the paranoid dare look a the internet. They do not want the internet to help them be sensitive to the end-users needs.
Adblocks, etc are always used in my case, but I do allow Google ads to appear. HTTPS etc were too damaging and restrictive to my use of the internet.
Generally I like web browsers with very many add-ons and extensions. So Safari, Internet Explorer, & Midori are too simple for a modern web user IMHO. But this issue is off-topic to this week's survey.
18 • Browser add-ons (by Ghost Sixtyseven on 2015-11-30 09:33:46 GMT from Europe)
On Firefox I use:
uBlock Origin - previously I used AdBlock Plus
19 • Browser extensions (by John on 2015-11-30 10:13:47 GMT from Europe)
As an old Opera user, I just moved to a Free browser that has everything built-in, Fifth :)
- built-in ad blocking: check
- built-in HTML5 video downloading: check
- traditional good UI: check
- can disable JS per-site or per-tab: check
- doesn't track you or send anything anywhere: check
- fully Free Software: check
It doesn't support add-ons, everything is implemented in native C++. Too bad it's not really packaged in most distros.
20 • Multiply Browsers (by GrzegorzW on 2015-11-30 15:34:53 GMT from North America)
With Firefox I only use AdBolock Plus, but I don;'t care too much when doing some shoppings or reading news or reading distrowatch or LWN - who. My approach is following: use dirrefent browsers for different purposes.
- For reading technical documentation guides etc. (including offline in /usr/share/doc) I use Konqueror - because it is integrated with KDE sessions and after reboot opens where I finished.
- For on-line banking I SOLELY use QupZilla, and I DON"T USE this browser for anything ELSE.
- For all other, free browsing, shopping etc. I use Firefox.
In addition I keep my sensitive information in files encrypted using encfs, and I decrypt folder only when I need this information and unmount it imadiately after I used it. When using those files I avoid doing anything else on computer I typically doing it just after system boot.
I'm aware that this may be is not top enterprise security, but as relativly normal, not rich ;) user it mekes me feel quite secure.
BTW: Answering Nix question from last week: Nix creates /nix folder and installs all software into this folder. So yes installing LibreOffice pulls down to /nix entire X.org and even glibc. But htis is only with first program, next ones uses already installed nix delendencies. Otherwords - nix create kind of paralel software stack when used on not NixOS system.
21 • Web browser extensions (by Fernando Santucci on 2015-11-30 15:39:49 GMT from South America)
I do not use privacy/security extensions:
Why? Because if the Youtube content providers run out of coins dropping into their pockets, soon YouTube will also start charging the public to watch your content and will transform the Internet on the same cable model with paid access and advertising.
However, I preserve my privacy with the following actions:
* Using Firefox as default browser;
* Using DuckDuckGo the default search engine on the desktop, laptop, tablet and smartphone;
* Not using Google Chrome browser;
22 • #21 (by jadecat09 on 2015-11-30 16:01:24 GMT from Europe)
I do not use privacy/security extensions:
Why? Because if the Youtube content providers run out of coins dropping into their pockets, soon YouTube will also start charging the public to watch your content and will transform the Internet on the same cable model with paid access and advertising.
The exact same reason I will not use Adblock/Adblock Plus.
23 • Browser privacy extensions / KaOS (by Will B on 2015-11-30 18:55:30 GMT from North America)
I use PrivacyBadger and uBlock Origin, and use DuckDuckGo for my search engine.
Here's the deal (@22, for example)...I *want* to help support sites I frequent by allowing them to show me ads, but with all of the crazy stuff going on with ad networks, and because I'm autistic and most of these ads are crazy distracting, I use PB and uBlock Origin. Because of my sensory issues, I just can't read an article with an animated gif anywhere within sight...it just messes me up too much.
== KaOS ==
I've tried KaOS in live mode and I really like it, although it's a little too 'heavy' resource-wise for my tastes. Wayland didn't work right for me, either. I tried a Wayland session and my screen went all nutzo...reminded me of the old days when trying to get CGA/EGA/VGA going with early Windows and Linux ;-)
24 • NetBSD review (by email@example.com on 2015-11-30 22:55:20 GMT from Europe)
Nice to see you have reviewed the latest NetBSD release. NetBSD is really an interesting project; why ? Take a look to the website, handbook, system installer as Jessie has reviewed: all of those are 'old', 'incomplete', 'complicate'; that's it ; nobody cares about NetBSD.. take a look of DWW comment.. nobody are taking about NetBSD. Amen.
But, who cares? Are you a UNIX guru, are you not? Who cares, again. NetBSD is a beautiful niche where cool people can publish good source code or good documentation for the handbook. Really, get NetBSD a try: join the mailing list and contribute. Surely, you will see your name printed in a couple of NetBSD project. Take it different, take NetBSD.
25 • reasonable ads (by M.Z. on 2015-11-30 23:16:23 GMT from North America)
@21/22 - unilateral disarmament is stupid
I agree that there are lots of nice websites that provide useful services & deserve ad revenue; however, there are also sites I like that use giant pop over ads & a vast array of sites I'm unsure of. Why not block bad behavior that I don't want to put up with? If there were an easy solution that made everyone happy & created both happy web surfers & revenue for websites I'd go for it. Sadly bad behavior exists, as does excessive tracking, so I will continue to block things in my default browser while giving sites I like a try in another unblock browser after looking trying them in Firefox w/ blockers.
I honestly don't think blockers would even exist if some companies hadn't gone too far in their quest for profit. Now they have millions of power users blocking them & millions more threatening to do the same. If the online ad agencies behave well the trend may well reverse, but they need to change in order to earn back the trust of users.If I never see another pop over ad in an unblocked website & receive feed back from reliable sources that websites aren't doing excessive tracking, then I'll start removing add-ons to block such behavior. I would like to see it happen, but I'm not going to roll over & let them destroy my web browsing experience for their profit. Maybe some are lucky enough never to have see some of the giant annoying ad; however, form my perspective unilateral disarmament is stupid, because it only encourages bad behavior.
26 • Uninformed NetBSD Review (by Oko on 2015-12-01 01:45:39 GMT from North America)
NetBSD review as it stands does more harm than good to already vulnerable NetBSD project. Namely ZFS has been "experimental file system" in NetBSD for a number of years now. The truth of the matter is that if the core wanted to have ZFS they would have it many years ago. The truth of the matter is that core doesn't want it and we my argue if the 64-bit kitchen sink volume manager/file system in one is appropriate for the project which prides itself with being portable and light. However NetBSD indeed has a pure gem of a file system WAPBL which is the best thing after the slice of bread if you play with embedded hardware. It also has seldom advertised Xen Dom0 support (not sure how that would be relevant for desktop crowd frequenting Distro Watch) besides great regression testing tools and few other things like famous pkgsrc. Whether it has anything to offer to a typical desktop users is a different story. What is more worrisome project has been on steep decline for a number of years and has less and less to offer even to hardcore UNIX users besides ability to run on retro hardware.
27 • Browser extensions & BSD distributions (by Frosch on 2015-12-01 03:02:23 GMT from Europe)
I use Qwant as my default search engine, for better privacy, and I use uBlock Origin as add blocker, which is very nice.
I liked your review of NetBSD. I wonder however how many people use it as a daily-use desktop system. I can't see many advantages of doing so. It may work fine, but most apps available are not very up to date, and configuring the system is quite difficult compared to most desktop operating systems. You did not tell much about setting up Xfce, but I read the tutorial you followed and it is not very easy for the average desktop user. So I think the only people running NetBSD as a desktop must be NetBSD developers or people using it daily as a server or for special tasks, who are accustomed to it and want to use the same OS on their desktop.
In my opinion, FreeBSD is better for desktop use. DragonFly can be good as well, since it has access to the huge FreeBSD ports. DragonFly 4.4 is upcoming, you should review it when it is out :)
28 • Extensions (by a on 2015-12-01 03:24:28 GMT from Europe)
Way too many extensions…
For privacy/security: Ghostery, NoScript, uBlock Origin, Cookie Controller, BetterPrivacy, RefControl, Privacy Badger (not sure if useful), HTTPS Everywhere, Web of trust (that one is mostly useless, annoying or even misleading).
Can’t live without: Stylish (to make the web dark).
Others: Greasemonkey (to improve/fix a couple sites, and for ViewTube which prevents youtube videos from starting automatically), Screen Dimmer, Classic Theme Restorer, Autohide RSS Icon, Classic Toolbar Buttons, Context Search, Copy Pure Text, Downloads Window, Fire Gestures, GNotifier, DownThemAll (downloads manager), Lazarus Form Recovery, Linkification, NoSquint, Status-4-Evar, Switch to tab no more, Tab Mix Plus, Tabs on bottom.
29 • Extensions (PS) (by a on 2015-12-01 03:26:32 GMT from Europe)
Oh that was for Firefox. And I also use ixquick as a search engine.
30 • Web Browser Extensions (by Rick on 2015-12-01 03:48:08 GMT from North America)
Not really an extension, but I use a 'host' file from http://winhelp2002.mvps.org/hosts.htm. Easy. Blocks most stuff (which is all I really care about). Imperceptible performance hit. No extra network traffic to do it job.
31 • NetBSD (by Mitt on 2015-12-01 08:36:45 GMT from Europe)
I use NetBSD on my desktop and here's what I like about it:
- really HUGE amount of documentation on their site, it is organised, of high quality, man pages are more comprehensive than in Linux, pretty much everything you google will point you to either the site or mailing lists;
- tons of different packages in pkgsrc repositories (by the way, pkgsrc is ported to all Unix'es, including OS X and Linux), among these packages there is GNOME 2 (!!!);
- binary compatibility with older releases, which means, binaries that you've made ten years ago will work without recompiling (mostly);
- the same NetBSD across all platforms, including some exotic, like toaster;
- friendly community, every question gets its answer, folks are always ready to help, no flamewars and no guttermouths;
- it's one of the most traditional Unix'es, almost completely a POSIX compliant;
- the license which is clear and easy to understand without a lawyer.
32 • browser add ons... (by tom joad on 2015-12-01 14:06:33 GMT from Europe)
Over the years I have become a privacy-aholic over the years.
I use noscripts, adblock, ghostery pretty consistently. I use ixquick too. I use tor most of the time. I spook my MAC address. I have asked for a protonmail.com account. I just learned about them a few days ago. They are fast growing so I will have to wait to see if I can get in. I make sure all my accounts are available to TOR or Tails including online storage.
I will be ditching Yahoo everything ASAP.
The folks 'out there' just don't have the need to know.
33 • Browser Extensions + NIX (by nolinuxguru on 2015-12-01 14:12:15 GMT from Europe)
OS=Debian7Linux, desktop=XFCE4, browser=Chromium, privacy=uBlock Origin + HTTPS Everywhere.
@20 thanks for the NIX info, I guessed it must have been something like that. I was looking at GUIX [GNUs adaptation of NIX] as a way into using their "distro", but the complexity turned me off. My search for a ready-made distro kit continues [not LFS!].
34 • Browser Extensions (by wrkerr on 2015-12-01 14:50:29 GMT from North America)
I browse with Firefox and I search with DuckDuckGo.
On the desktop I use Adblock Plus (while allowing exceptions for non-intrusive ads), Privacy Badger, and HTTPS Everywhere.
On mobile, I also use the HTTPS Everywhere extension. Privacy Badger isn't yet supported on Firefox Mobile for Android, so there I turn on Firefox's new built in tracking protection (privacy.trackingprotection.enabled). This is essentially a clone of Disconnect's functionality, which isn't as intelligent as Privacy Badger but has a similar effect. On my rooted Android devices I use AdAway instead of Adblock Plus, but on the devices I won't root, I still use the Adblock Plus browser extension.
35 • Webrowser extensions that work well. (by H. Hornblower on 2015-12-01 19:52:45 GMT from North America)
[Self Destructing Cookies] removes the website cookies that accumulates during every online visit. This browser extension really removes the tracking cookies within 15 seconds after every website cookie is strored at the computer system's operating system installed browser folders. Have tested this with multiple versons of LinuxOS, Win 7, and Win 8.1. Note that some variants of Firefox browsers like IceWeasel and Seamonkey did not allow web browser extension (add ons) to install.
[Print Edit] is a wonderful print preview utility for Firefox browsers.
This browser extension really allows the user to preview an HTML or PDF document online web page, edit each unwanted web page element before removing said elements, and then allows the user to save as PDF format, or print out to Laser or Inkjet printer. This action saves a lot of Laser toner powder and Inkjet ink fluid. No more extraneous distraction from the printed documents. This worked well for LinuxOS, Win 7 and Win 8.1.
Favorite Firefox browser search engines include the https://www.duckduckgo.com
Users wanting more privacy should visit mostly "https" websites when available instead of the usual "http" websites.
Best yet inquire and query the website host and personnel whether they have an "absolute secured" data and application mainframe that has no operating systems installed to any permanent memory storage hardware. This means using only the "light speed" Magneto-optical drives that have no re-write capability once the data is "snapshoted" which is impossible to hack by humans and impossible to hack by any cybernetic means.
This way enabling the stored data to be impossible to alter and corrupt. Access times are in the "atto seconds" which also enables "quantum relativity fuzzy logic" type of dynamic amorphous poly-dimensional encryption with this type of storage device. SSD and USB (Static RAM) are too slow, not reliable after several sustained passes, and not have good longevity for the price paid. Keep it simple and compatible.
36 • Holy Tinfoil! (by Kragle von Schnitzelbank on 2015-12-01 20:50:30 GMT from North America)
"Magneto-Optical (CD-MO) technology allows tracks to be erased and rewritten on 12cm CDs that are rated to allow millions of rewrites. These drives use two heads (one to write and the other to erase), in a double-pass process. System information may be permanently written in a small, premastered area, but the rest of the area is available for recording, and re-recording many times." Brought to you by Philips & Sony in 1990.
37 • @11 linuxista & @15 M.Z. (by Dr.Chimpanski on 2015-12-02 03:06:04 GMT from Europe)
@11 The Information on DDG Website is all nice written. Thank you for pasting it over, for all of us to look at. (You will not find anything there regarding uncomfortable privacy data).
(Also. Statements like , they would face serious consequences if abusing their policy is the same o same o...No consequences will ever happen. You use this thing and if you find little thing, what will you do? Pay an attorney on some one who has good Intention, creating a private Browser, yet nothing is perfect?)
Almost every VPN service acts this way to, but it is not always the way its written.
It is written also that USA is a free Country..
Coming back to DDG;
Now, yes some basic check on privacy by using this Search engine shows greater privacy compare to Google we admit that. Strong TLS encryption
managed by DigiCert Inc. This company has very good reputation. Those 2 Companies located in the US. Good good now Is DDG hanging in the Air suspended from Gravity? Not really , do they use any servers? Amazon maybe? Another US Company.
DDG do not operate their own data-center, but instead are “hosted”. Could there be some SSL decryption key installed? (Easy!)
Sorry about our harsh first comment (10), it was written little under time pressure.
No precise technical data will be shown here, nor do exist any on our hardware.
No need to spoon feed anybody. Fact is that we are done with this Search engine and from 5 years
ago are not missing anything by not using it.
You like using DDG, be happy using it and have blast. Have some what peace of mind you are not being tracked as heavy , maybe like any other Search engine do the tracing. We wish them all the best , especially as it is very hard to come up with the financial in order to maintain the existence.
We like: Ixquick / Google / Yandex / Bing and many others, just alternating. Never sticking to one.
There is no search engine really out there publicly available that is anonymous or you name it all you want. The Bills must be payed by some one.
@15 You are all right. Sure it would make the comment (10) more credible if shown some technical data to back it up. There is no intention to do that either. Do what you want to do and believe. But it is not always possible to spoon feed Information as you and others would love to see. The test was done some what 5 years ago and we do not have precise data on our hardware anymore, . We are simply done with DDG. Our decision. No further discussion is being taken on this subject anymore.
As far as Add blocking software we like to add, that we use Add block and we turn it off on content, we like to support. However if even on content we support and like, if the Adds start to be animation alike and annoying or on you tube one 30 Min. Video clip starts displaying Adds every
5Min. Then the Add block is turned back on in no time. So much for that.
On Distrowatch We have partial disabled the Add blocker (not only one is installed), so view ADDS make it through and those do not bother at all, as long we do not see the naked Girls from Dating Advertising we are all good.
Also people, please stop writing with all the (naive) good intention what Browser extensions
(Addons) you use , because this Website is not being read by only the good people so to speak. You start being very naive, in giving way to much Info. Am sure Advertising companies and who knows what other Institutions, just now read what you have given them for free with probably big pleasure.
38 • Web browser extensions and annoying ads (by Thomas Mueller on 2015-12-02 03:07:38 GMT from North America)
I had the problem with Firefox or Seamonkey that whenever I visited a commercial web site such as tigerdirect.com or staples.com, I would subsequently get a bombardment of ads from those businesses on other web sites, even distrowatch.com. I had the feeling of being stalked online. I found in the privacy settings the option to block third-party cookies, and that stopped all those ads from businesses whose web site I had recently or previously visited without compromising browser functionality on sites that require cookies such as online banking. I still avoid clicking on ads that go through a third-party advertiser such as anything with doubleclick.net or googleadservices.com (among others). I prefer to go to the desired website directly rather than a third-party advertiser.
39 • netbsd (by Tim Dowd on 2015-12-02 21:29:05 GMT from North America)
I am a fan of NetBSD and use it weekly (it keeps my old iMacG4 working.)
I've got XFCE 4 installed and mostly run X clients tunnelled over ssh from one of my Debian boxes.
This is not a flame on NetBSD because I really love it, but do you really find it the best choice for desktop use?
As Jessie said above, keeping the system up to date is quite a chore. It's not impossible but it's not straightforward.
Also, just because GNOME2 is in pkgsrc doesn't mean you can build it. There's a lot of dependencies that are broken at this point as they've moved on. I've failed to complete a build on both PowerPC 32 and i386.
I love that NetBSD is here for exotic hardware (like my iMacG4, which no modern Linux distro supports (its got a graphics card that requires the nv driver instead of nouveau) and I think it's a great choice for a server or a computer without X. I'm impressed that you've got it up to speed for desktop use and I'm curious why that's your choice.
Again, not a criticism. I really enjoy tinkering with it too.
40 • Gnome 2 & DDG (by M.Z. on 2015-12-03 04:24:25 GMT from North America)
@31/39 - Gnome 2
It does seem odd to get hyped up about Gnome 2 at this point. I get not liking Gnome 3, but of course Mate is widely available, actively supported, & a direct copy/replacement for Gnome 2. Why not use Mate instead if you like Gnome, because as #39 indicates, there are likely to be a lot more problems in something depreciated like Gnome 2. I prefer other alternatives, but Mate does seem nice from the time I've used it.
@37 - DDG
So you have no good reason for the negativity against DuckDuckGo. Why not just say you prefer another search engine instead of being pointlessly negative & tossing FUD? That sort of thing is in bad taste.
41 • @39 @40 (by Mitt on 2015-12-03 09:06:18 GMT from Europe)
First of all, I have a working desktop with GNOME2. I didn't meet any broken dependencies, but I installed package by package maybe that's why. Anyway, I enjoy Xfce as well.
Mate is not available in pkgsrc. GNOME2 is *much more* stable than 3; it's still in CentOS 6, by the way, which is supported until 2020. But for sure, Mate is somewhat enhanced GNOME2. I pointed it, because, for example, in Debian 7/8/Sid, if you will try to install GNOME2 (not Mate), you'll break everything, because libraries are incompatible (I've tried it hehe), and it is not recommended anyway.
Keeping the system up-to-date is quite simple, a command to update repositories, and a couple of commands to upgrade pkgsrc. It's usable, everything is pretty straightforward.
Of course, it's a matter of taste. I've tried a dozen of different distributions, Linux or BSD, user-friendly or for more advanced users, and comparing to them I'd say it's one of my most favourite choices so far.
42 • security extensions (by GreginNC on 2015-12-03 10:19:22 GMT from North America)
I use NoScript, HappyBonobo - both webrtc and mime types, Ghostery, HTTPS Everywhere, BetterPrivacy, Blender, Self-Destructing Cookies and last but not least Flashblock. A couple of those have overlapping funtionality but I disabled those in one so there would be no likely conflicts.
43 • i'm glad it works (by Tim Dowd on 2015-12-03 21:34:26 GMT from North America)
Your last statement (it's a matter of taste and it's my favorite) is pretty much what matters. I really enjoy using it too and I find it's a good learning tool.
The machines I use it on are really resource limited so building is a hassle for me, but that's just my use case. There are many use cases and thus room for many distros! I was honestly just curious about your use.
44 • Mint site down (by Firstserve Netter on 2015-12-04 01:46:46 GMT from North America)
For two days there has been a message at the Mint website that they know the site is down, that they are working on it, and that they expect to be up tomorrow. Anyone know what is going on?
45 • #44 Mint down (by zykoda on 2015-12-04 07:51:55 GMT from Europe)
Hard drive failure muted, but unconfirmed.
46 • #44 further (by zykoda on 2015-12-04 07:57:37 GMT from Europe)
47 • Release cycles.. (by Jordan on 2015-12-04 18:49:57 GMT from United States)
I just saw this phrase at Keith Curtis' bloggy site, reviewing Arch's latest release:
"..I think Arch is a great OS for the desktop where things are evolving so quickly, and each component has its own release cycle."
Eh.. this whole notion has me puzzled about the Windows vs Linux thing.. I'm not
geeky (smart) enough to know how much of the Windows updates are "component"
updates and how much are .. other stuff ("security," and all that.. yeah I know
about the id numbers they assign to each update but a lot of that info seems
cryptic to me and a lot seems like it could be lies). I also obviously do not know
what the Linux updates really entail, although I see the list when alerted.
Mint alerts me to updates now and then and I look at them and run them and see
that it's components in the system, and yeah I do keep wondering just what is at
the base of all this.. why do components in a good distro need to be updated at all.
What is evolving? Degenerating? I know that evil hackers want to exploit certain
ports etc, so security has to be patched for that. But what's the rest of it about?
48 • Release cycles (by M.Z. on 2015-12-04 21:46:19 GMT from North America)
@47 - Linux release models
I think Windows is like FreeBSD & has updates to the core system separated from other updates to a far greater extent than most versions of Linux. There is some similarity between old Windows service packs & updates like Red Hat 7.1, but high stability distros like RHEL & Debian tend to have a lot fewer updates to all their packages & get bug fixes rather than new features. This is in part because all software in the default repos of such distros is treated more like a piece of the entire OS as a whole, while other systems like Windows are only concerned with their core OS & a handful of components like Internet Explorer that are treated as 'in house' items. For stable versions of Linux the work on testing & validation of software is done my distro makers because those using the distro want some sort of assurance that they are getting more than fly by night small open source software projects in a stable OS. When you get RHEL you get their Quality Assurance/QA system on thousands of pices of software that are in the default Red Hat repos & have one point of contact for all that software. Of course with Windows such business have MS to help with a few things, but most other software is commercial & supported by independent vendors.
This stable release model is great for businesses that want reliable software backed by a name they can trust like Red Hat, but some desktop users, especially certain power users, want what is hot & new so they use a rolling release distro. That it what Arch & other rolling distros are for. They are far more experimental & tend to either be supported by an independent non-commercial group like Arch or are upstream of a stable project like Fedora Rawhide (upstream of Fedora & Red Hat). Some rolling distros will aggressively roll out updates that would be akin to service packs in a very rapid fashion & I hear Fedora Rawhide in particular tends to break things a lot with buggy updates. Others rolling distros, like PCLinuxOS, are slower to update base components, but in either care you are more reliant on upstream projects & their QA system & don't have as much of the extra layer of protection/cover a commercial entity can provide an IT department. For some home users this doesn't matter, but other are happy to jump on something like Debian because they aren't interested in hot new software.
Anyway that is my understanding of the different Linux release models & why they exist. In either care you get both bug fixes & security updates, but if you get a rolling distro you get more features faster. For instance with PCLinuxOS you get the latest version of Firefox by default, while Debian, & presumably RHEL, use something like the Firefox ESR, (or the identical Debian Iceweasel), for their default browser.
49 • How many $$ to download the RoboLinux 8.4 installer? (by Ben Myers on 2015-12-04 22:00:08 GMT from North America)
Just read the announcement which says that RoboLinux provides free download live distros, but one has to pay to get the installer to put it on a computer for real.
Then I went to the RoboLinux web site and was unable to find out how much the charge is for the installer. Well, maybe the amount is buried somewhere, like on the installer download page. But the amount sure is not shown prominently.
I have no objection to paying for software. Maybe it's me, but I like to know up front and in advance how much I might have to pay for the installer or any other software. Or a used car, for that matter.
Since the RoboLinux web site is moot on the amount of the installer charge, I guess won't download it and try it live. Pity. I may be missing out on something wonderful, although I find the default fighter jet desktop is a bit off-putting.
50 • Mint is good now (by M.Z. on 2015-12-04 23:19:36 GMT from North America)
They got everything back up & Mint 17.3 shipped. It looks like a good release, & I especially like the sound of the new & improved software sources tool. It has always looked like a killer feature that put Mint ahead of the pack & now it's got even better location based sorting. They also got LibreOffice 5 in the upgrade. I hope the KDE release goes far smoother though, give the website problems.
51 • Release cycles.. @48 M.Z. (by Jordan on 2015-12-05 01:36:05 GMT from North America)
Thank you. Your explanation is a keeper.
52 • Browser Extensions (by cykodrone on 2015-12-05 11:03:48 GMT from North America)
I use NoScript and Adblock Plus, that and I have Firefox set to delete everything except passwords on close. I don't use Goggle, haven't for years now, or Snoopbook.
53 • Robolinux (by Jesse on 2015-12-05 14:51:06 GMT from North America)
@49: According to the Robolinux website, the fee is about $3 USD. http://robolinux.org/ROSSF-membership/lxde-v8/
54 • 49 • 53 • Robolinux (by Kragle on 2015-12-05 18:45:30 GMT from North America)
Yes, a minimum of "$3.00 plus .37 cents Paypal fee", which includes one year's monthly "significant upgrade"s - otherwise priced at $1 each for a "Non Member" (running Live only?).
According to another page, each "membership" is specific to a DE (Desktop Environment), such as KDE or Xfce. Each month's "audit" appears to list names and revenues; no expenses are shown.
Still another page notes that a VM tailored to Microsoft Windows version XP or 7 (or 10) requires another "tiny donation". (Use the Microsoft license from the PC you're replacing, right?) Claims of running virus-free are based on keeping a backup VM "mirror clone" copy of all software and data in a separate partition which does not sync while the VM is running. This implies greater storage and performance requirements, of course. Emphasis on Windows malware doesn't consider malware targeting Linux, or browsers (or other apps) on multiple platforms, or time-delay factors. I saw no mention of incremental backups on that page, though compression was mentioned elsewhere.
"Extensive" support or phone support is extra, as is supporting more than one computer or VM. Though a global support team is implied, support is only available during business hours on Eastern Standard Time - or by email? There is a limited FAQ; no wiki or forum was apparent.
While this may not suit everyone, clearly some prefer this pay-as-you-go business model.
55 • @ 53 @54 RoboLinux fees (by Ben Myers on 2015-12-05 22:06:13 GMT from North America)
Well, the good news is that some of the fees are visible somewhere on the RoboLinux web site. The bad news is that they are not too easy to find, and the description of the fees (according to 54) is a little vague.
I don't mind paying for someone's hard work, and software development is darn difficult. But how about a clear and concise easy-to-find table of the amounts charged and what one gets for the money? This does not seem to be asking too much.
56 • Release methods (by M.Z. on 2015-12-05 22:09:44 GMT from North America)
Glad to help. One other important thing I forgot to mention is that all versions of Linux tend to use shared libraries very heavily, while I think this is less the case in Windows. For stable distros it's sort of like having only one go to version of DirectX or Java in Windows & doing updates to fix bugs & security issues. This help create far less bloated software, while something like a PBI in PC-BSD & I think many Windows programs tend to pull in all needed dependencies into a larger software package. These are easier to upgrade without disturbing other software at the previously mentioned cost of bloat. The way things are much more interdependent in most Linux systems helps create the incentive to stay with one version & patch, because if you change on library to support a new program things will be far more likely to break. This is the main reason stable systems like RHEL & Debain are considered by their fans to be less likely to break. In a rolling distro everything has to be carefully managed & timed correctly so as to minimize the chance that a program & dependent library don't end up on incomparable versions which will make things break.
I think that this is really at the core of why stable versions of Linux exist,. It's a space saving measure that has become adopted by most distros which allows the central repos to exist & provide consistent software in smaller packages. Of course nothing prevents you from installing bigger self contained software packages alongside smaller pices of software from the main repos of your distro, & I believe that this is how businesses receive most commercial software fro Linux. If the software is designed correctly & properly self contained you could also install different versions of software alongside things from the default repos, as I did with LibreOffice 5 in my LMDE 2 install. It sits quite happily along side the version of LibreOffice that shipped by default with LMDE, but I think it is a bigger piece of software & it was designed not to hook into the package management system. I think that LO 5 is the only piece of software on my laptop that has to be managed independently/WO a package manager like a Windows program. That's one of the trade offs in big independent self contained software packages vs small interdependent packages.
57 • @56 Shared Libraries (by Ben Myers on 2015-12-06 05:58:36 GMT from North America)
Windows DOES use shared libraries. Badly. With Microsoft having been a 99.0% marketing driven company ever since the intro of Windows 1 in 1985, the care and feeding of DynaLink Libraries (DLLs), Windows' software sharing mechanism, has been chaotic at best, and often disastrous. There have been and continue to be occasions of DLL hell, wherein various versions of the same DLL get in the way of one another. The DLL mess is what happens in software development when either standards are not followed, or they are incomplete or they get changed ad infinitum. Developing software for Windows has always been a very difficult proposition, which is what happens when a single organization has total control over the software environment, and there is no open source.
58 • I should have remembered (by M.Z. on 2015-12-06 12:52:44 GMT from North America)
Now that you mention it, I should have remembered running into 'DLL hell' on some old Windows versions. It really was fairly terrible. PC-BSD PBI are the major alternative.
59 • 57 • 58 • Standards!? (by Kragle on 2015-12-06 17:48:16 GMT from North America)
"when a single organization has total control over the software environment," yet refuses to control vendor pranks (esp. anti-standard "lock-in" strategies), giving both Apple and Linux/BSD market opportunity. (All sorts of authority, yet no responsibility?)
"and there is no open source" was not true. Freed Open-Source brought benefits of competition and standards, and a surge in market growth. Of course, with versions after 7 Microsoft wants to lock users back into a "store" (taking market control back from Google?).
Speaking of "major alternative" to version-hell, how does PC-BSD's PBI stack up to cross-platform ZeroInstall?
Number of Comments: 59
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