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1 • SymphonyOS, fedora .. (by musty on 2014-09-22 09:40:38 GMT from France)
Hi. Nice to see symphony back in town but it not as good as it was before...
I cant wait no more to test the new Fedora and see if separating workstation from server will speed things off.
thank you for all the reviews you bring us.
ps: can you test some linux-tablet, (if they exist) ?
2 • openSUSE scare (by cykodrone on 2014-09-22 15:26:11 GMT from Canada)
The perils of being corporate backed, house of cards, meet pulled rug. Part of the reason why I stick with Debian.
Peace out.
3 • great tip on reptty (by oringo on 2014-09-22 15:31:13 GMT from United States)
I've always wanted to do this but thought it was not possible. I guess nothing is impossible with an open system. Question, in other guides that I've found through googling, the recommendation is to first background the task, disown it from shell, then reptty in another shell. Is the disowning processing unnecessary?
4 • reptyr (by Jesse on 2014-09-22 16:05:07 GMT from Canada)
@3: No, there is no need to stop a running task before moving it to another terminal. There is no reason for you to background it or disown the running process. All you need to do is open a new terminal and run "reptyr" and the command does all the work.
5 • Debian is just as evil, lol. (by Garon on 2014-09-22 16:09:39 GMT from United States)
@cykodrone,
Debian has plenty of corporate sponsors. Without this corporate sponsorship, besides the many volunteers working on Debian it would not, could not, exist in its present state. By the way, Debian calls them "Partners," and not sponsors but they are there giving support to Debian, and there is nothing wrong with that.
6 • tmux is the new black (by Scott Dowdle on 2014-09-22 16:53:21 GMT from United States)
@Jesse Smith - Thanks for the reptyr tip. Just wanted to mention tmux. It's like screen but more cats meow. First thing I do though is remap the tmux prefix key from the default (control-b) to match screen's (control-a). Some people enjoy running one inside of the other. That's too much inception for me.
7 • Mezzo Desktop (by Eric on 2014-09-22 17:23:13 GMT from Canada)
The Mezzo desktop used by the SymphonyOS distro IS a "web technology". The desktop is mainly programmed in Perl with a little bit of JavaScript presented in HTML form, so the desktop IS HTML or a "web app".
8 • @5 yeah but... (by cykodrone on 2014-09-22 18:06:17 GMT from Canada)
...if a "Debian sponsor" pulled out, it wouldn't bring the whole organization down, not quite the same. Kinda like sports figures' corporate backers, once they blacklist, hard for those athletes to recover their status.
9 • Web app (by Jesse on 2014-09-22 19:21:34 GMT from Canada)
>> "The Mezzo desktop used by the SymphonyOS distro IS a "web technology". The desktop is mainly programmed in Perl with a little bit of JavaScript presented in HTML form, so the desktop IS HTML or a "web app". "
The language a piece of software is written in has nothing to do with whether that software is a web app or not. You can write web apps in C, you can create location applications in PHP. Web apps are served from a remote host and run in a document interpreter on the local machine (usually a web browser). Mezzo is stored and run locally, therefore it is not a web app.
10 • Web tech (by Somewhat Reticent on 2014-09-22 22:09:04 GMT from United States)
Doesn't Hybryde (F)use web-tech to Facilitate seamlessly switching DEs?
11 • systemd, Salix Fluxbox 14.1 (by Paraquat on 2014-09-23 01:24:22 GMT from Taiwan)
I'm somewhat distressed that systemd is destined to be the default on most distros. Right now using Ubuntu which is still not systemd encumbered, but will be soon.
It's not that init systems are a religious issue with me. I would be happy enough with systemd if it wasn't so complex. You have to have faith that there are programmers out there who can actually understand it and debug it, and spot any vulnerabilities it might have. That's the part that worries me, as I'm a security nut. Ironically, Fedora - which gave birth to systemd - is one of the most secure distros thanks to Selinux. But Selinux is itself complex enough to understand, so putting systemd on top of it means that you've really got to have faith in the (mostly unpaid) developers who volunteer to keep Linux secure and stable.
Concerns like mine have sprouted a boycott systemd movement:
http://boycottsystemd.org/
So I've been casting around to have a second distro on my hard drive which isn't systemd dependent. Slackware is one such distro, but easier to work with (due to package management) is Salix, which is a Slackware spin-off.
Published on Distrowatch just after DWW was posted was an announcement for Salix Fluxbox 14.1.
http://distrowatch.com/?newsid=08609
I will be downloading and testing it shortly.
12 • systemd (by cornelius on 2014-09-23 11:12:39 GMT from Canada)
Systemd must be superior to sysvinit since almost all distros have switched to systemd. Heck, even LFS has announced a systemd based variant.
I like systemd mainly because:
1. My quad-core (soon octa-core) desktop boots *way* faster.
2. I've been using systemd in Fedora for three years now. Never had an issue, not a single one. Never. And I use Fedora every day at work and at home (two boots per day).
3. I enjoy the pain of those who oppose it.
13 • systemd (by greg on 2014-09-23 11:44:30 GMT from Slovenia)
I am not going to pretend I know much about background and all. but the real tests regarding security concerns and such will come when this stuff get's moved to corporate/government servers. no one cares if a few users pcs are using it. they can't really steal much form them. but other corporate servers is a whole other issue.
the part I got form reading about it is that current system makes sense and can easily be read even by relative non techie, while the system obfuscates things in some computer language. kind of like nginx - faster and leaner than apache but commands on apache make sense even to me that I am not a programmer. it's like talking to a computer by giving it clear commands. no need to learn some codes...
14 • Corporate Backers (by Bob on 2014-09-23 15:28:14 GMT from Austria)
Anything wrong with corporate backers? I'd finally like to see a distro matching Android's qualities. That could'nt be done with the usual student hackers alone.
15 • re 2 and 14 the evil corporations (by corneliu on 2014-09-23 16:06:28 GMT from Canada)
@Bob:
Exactly. The stupidity of boycotting corporate Linux distros is beyond words when you consider the fact that more than 80% of the kernel code is submitted by engineers paid by the evil corporations. Last year RedHat contributed more than 10% and Suse 3.5% of the code. Part of the reason why I stick with Fedora.
16 • systemd, sponsors, etc (by Kragle von Schnitzelbank on 2014-09-23 16:07:12 GMT from United States)
Any large complex system change will be buggy at first; systemd's no exception. Hopefully, over time, it'll get better UIs.
Corporate backers aren't inherently evil (they're simply amoral) but it's simply foolish to be too dependent on any one supporter, corporate or otherwise.
Other than proprietary lock-in app stores and drivers, what does Android offer?
17 • corporate backers, Android (by Kazlu on 2014-09-23 16:24:34 GMT from France)
I join Kragle von Schnitzelbank here: it's not about who writes the code, it's more about who decides to do this and to include that on your distro. It's who it was assembled by. Some distros are not only backed by a company, this company commands life or death of that distro, and so can shape it in the form it wants, to fit the company's interests. Others are just backed by companies, several of them, making them less dependant of a single company. The distro team, consisting of people not coming from a single company, then can have less biased decisions.
@14: About Android: What qualities does Android have that no GNU/Linux distro has? In my opinion, Android can't match the qualities of many GNU/Linux distros, so I wonder.
18 • re 16 (by corneliu on 2014-09-23 17:19:47 GMT from Canada)
Quote: "Other than proprietary lock-in app stores and drivers, what does Android offer?"
1. Drivers have nothing to do with Google. It's the hardware companies that write the drivers. So that part of your comment is irrelevant as far as Android's openness is concerned.
2. The official app store is never imposed on you. You can install and use alternative app stores. Heck, you can even download from the Internet any app you want and install it freely, no app store required.
19 • Android, systemd & corporate backers (by M.Z. on 2014-09-23 20:03:57 GMT from United States)
@16 & 17
What qualities does Android have that other Linux based projects don't? Isn't it obvious? How about a massive amount of consumer market share & common visibility? I'm sure Android could stand to be more open, but didn't Apple try to sue people for unlocking phones that were purchased from their company? Android seems to give smartphone owners a lot more control over the devices that they own, while providing a relatively open platform & helping to create a competitive market. Given the importance of the smartphone market it seems perfectly obvious that Android rivals any Linux based project for the title of most important Linux based OS. It may be far from perfect, but Android seems to me to be the least bad alternative amongst the major smartphone competitors, and the fact that other projects are based on it proves that it is still relatively open.
@11
I've heard others claim on slashdot that systemd was far less complex & problematic that people were making it out to be & the wisdom of the tech minded crowed over there gave some of them a +5/5 insightful rating. Now if tech minded people start saying that systemd is the same kind of poorly coded gibberish that openssl was after the heartbleed bug was found, then I'll know we have a problem.
__________________________________
On the more general topic of corporate backers, well I for one am glad that companies like Red Hat are around to do so much heavy lifting for Linux & similar open source projects. We are all dependent on them, but we also have things like the GPL to help protect our rights as users. Even if the biggest backer of a GPL licensed product disappears, code can still be forked. The forking of OpenOffice into LibreOffice proves that in the open source world companies have to respect their users or face the possibility of new competition appearing overnight. After all RMS created the GPL to protect you the user, so don't worry the bad eggs will all get forked in the end.
20 • init (by meh on 2014-09-23 22:32:58 GMT from United States)
As long as the system is booted properly, services are started properly, and logs are kept properly why does the init process warrant so much woolgathering from people?
21 • @20 (by :wq on 2014-09-23 23:40:30 GMT from United States)
Because the hand wringing, allegations and recriminations over the good and bad of change are the closest thing tech-minded people have to a soap opera?
22 • Mezzo Desktop (by Eric on 2014-09-24 00:31:51 GMT from Canada)
@9 http://forum.hardware.fr/hfr/OSAlternatifs/Logiciels-2/debian-desktop-symphony-sujet_56460_1.htm#t806137
Since the SymphonyOS's site is having problems I'll paste here as to what "Mezzo" down below, which is largely "Orchestra".
/begin paste
Orchestra is Symphony's application environment. This set of programs and tools allows programs composed of just HTML and Perl to run as local GUI apps. Anyone who writes Perl CGI scripts will feel at home writing Orchestra applications. Orchestra will be used extensively in the Symphony OS.
Orchestra is made up of two main parts, a localhost only http server and a slimmed down mozilla renderer. Because mozilla is used as the base for rendering Orchestra apps can utilize the following technologies:
* Javascript/DHTML
* Perl/CGI
* Java Applets (when plugin is included)
* Flash (when plugin is included)
* Embedded media players (when plugin is included)
* XUL Interfaces
* Any other technologies for which a Mozilla Plugin is available.
Eventually support is planned for the following technologies
* PHP
* Python
* Bash Shell Scripts as CGI's
* Compiled CGI scripts
* SVG Graphics (when support is compiled with the mozilla renderer)
/end paste
23 • Systemd integration, KDE, Gnome, Debian (by gregzeng on 2014-09-24 05:21:59 GMT from Australia)
Being a KDE toyboy, I'm interest in Debian's assessment
gnome 3
kde -1
lxde 0
xfce 0
cinnamon -2
mate 0
(Debian Desktop Requalification Jessie, with my "unweighted totalling final scores", (from: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianDesktop/Requalification/Jessie)
On the Android readiness, etc - "architecture requalification status for jessie" (Debian), only amd64 & i386 are ready. (https://release.debian.org/jessie/arch_qualify.html)
So now I'm waiting for the soon to be ready "KDE Plasma 5", still in beta, in a few weeks. Daily betas are downloable from: (http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/kubuntu-plasma5/daily-live/), which I'll be testing on my multi-booting Dell XPS-15.
24 • @19 Android (by Kazlu on 2014-09-24 09:41:47 GMT from France)
"What qualities does Android have that other Linux based projects don't? Isn't it obvious? How about a massive amount of consumer market share & common visibility?"
Agreed, that means Android is more successfull than any GNU/Linux distro, but how does it make it better? I see only one possible advantage: if you have more users, potentially you discover more bugs that can then be fixed. Then it's up to Google to decide what is a bug and what is a feature. Of course, that advantage only benefits the user if his/her device is still supported by the manufacturer, else say goodbye to bugfixes.
I agree with most of the things you said after, but that only says that Android is, both technically and from a user freedom point of view, better than iOS and Windows, nothing concerning its advantages over GNU/Linux distributions.
25 • @23 Debian desktops (by Kazlu on 2014-09-24 09:46:38 GMT from France)
Isn't that a bit biased towards GNOME? How come systemd integration being as important as accessibility? How *depending* on systemd is seen only for its benefits and not for its drawbacks? As long as the tools provided by the DE work and the user is able to perform given tasks, who cares if systemd is "integrated"?
It seems like MATE is in good way after all, it just lacks testing but that could be improved shortly. It's not my favorite DE, but I feel it would fit very well as the Debian default DE. If there is not enough time to test MATE, maybe sticking with GNOME for Jessie but considering MATE for the next release would be a good move.
26 • Systemd..... (by Smellyman on 2014-09-24 13:26:02 GMT from Taiwan)
is the new moving the buttons to the left!
27 • @20 (by Pearson on 2014-09-24 16:59:03 GMT from United States)
You'll probably get 15 answers for every 10 people you ask.
My answer is "Generally, it shouldn't matter. But, migrating to systemd has implications -- lack of a sense of control, impact on non-init things (like logind) -- that concern some technical people."
28 • The more things change, the more they stay the same (by :wq on 2014-09-24 18:04:20 GMT from United States)
All of the teams haven't weighed in yet, but I doubt there will be a switch back to Xfce as the default desktop for Jessie. Prior to Jordi Mallach's 2014-08-07 blog post, I think the change in course was already set in motion somewhere around the time of the "Xfce 4.12 stabilization" thread (Jun-Aug) on the xfce4-dev mailing list.
Furthermore, having gone through a temporary switch to Xfce during Wheezy's development, and now again for Jessie, I don't expect the DE evaluation issue to be raised again in any serious way for Jessie+1 (at least as it regards Xfce), as there is no reason to believe circumstances will have changed in a significant way. Xfce will still be Xfce, GNOME will still be GNOME, and Debian will still be Debian. It's pretty much a foregone conclusion. Maybe MATE or KDE have a shot for Jessie+1, though given MATE is seen as being a regressive choice, and KDE is deemed to be not accessible, I doubt those stand much of a chance.
As for the Debian XFCE team having "not seen much added contributions from it being the default in testing", I think it would actually take Debian making a commitment to Xfce being the default for that to happen. Otherwise, I expect a bulk of potential contributors would assume exactly what happened.
I do expect Xfce to be the default DE for Debian GNU/kFreeBSD.
29 • Debian (by KI on 2014-09-24 18:56:10 GMT from Belgium)
Debian is a great OS but few people use it as it is. Most people either carry out an expert install (be it a minimal install, or one with an alternate DE, etc) or just install some saner derivative. Things have always been like that. In that sense I see Debian more as a proto-distribution than as a ready-to-use OS.
The problem right now seems to be the lack of leadership for the best developers tend to find jobs in the private sector.
30 • @24 Android (by Angel on 2014-09-25 02:35:40 GMT from Philippines)
"Android is, both technically and from a user freedom point of view, better than iOS and Windows, nothing concerning its advantages over GNU/Linux distributions."
Great! Now give me the names of some Linux distros that can replace Android on my phone and do as good a job on my tablets.
31 • Just an init system (by RollMeAway on 2014-09-25 03:55:51 GMT from United States)
If systemd was "just an init system" many users could learn to accept it.
Problem is, with every new release it takes over more functions.
As stated last week, a recent blog rambles about plans to take over package
management for all distros. Guess that means no more *.deb or *.rpm pkgs.
Just *.systemd packages.
I relate it to finding a small red rash on the back of your hand.
It is minor, doesn't really hurt, so you kind of ignore it.
Then you discover the rash has covered your entire arm. Better do something about this.
The next morning you wake up and it has cover both arms and now shoulders.
Left unchecked it will take over your entire body.
Just like systemd is taking over our favorite operating systems.
32 • Systemd (as in system-delete) (by Ooops on 2014-09-25 04:35:38 GMT from Canada)
31) RollMeAway
NOW you warn us? Too late for me. Took over my entire body. Awoke after "molting". My new body proceeded to "Roll Myself_away"back to the security of my "backup" system running ye old reliable init system under Slackware, one of the last refuges of sanity.
33 • @32 Systemd and Slackware (by KI on 2014-09-25 05:28:53 GMT from Belgium)
Yes, I am also considering migrating to a more POSIX compliant system.
From what I have read, Slackware would be the best option. I am also considering a binary Gentoo derivative for it seems that Gentoo will also remain systemd-free.
The problem I see with Slackware is package managing. Does it handle dependencies now? How many packages are there available?
Are there other options with a package managers similar to apt-get in terms of dependency handling (both when installing and uninstalling) and with large number of packages in the repos?
34 • Slackware dependencies (by jadecat09 on 2014-09-25 06:57:51 GMT from United Kingdom)
For a 'proper OS' you are the dependency handler.
35 • Slackware dependencies (by jadecat09 on 2014-09-25 07:15:33 GMT from United Kingdom)
I should add that if you are so inclined, there is Slapt-get for dependencies, and Sbopkg for SlackBuilds.
36 • @33 - Slackware dependencies (by Uncle Slacky on 2014-09-25 07:25:38 GMT from France)
I think there are Slackware derivatives (like Salix, for example) which include package management with automatic dependency handling.
37 • re Slackware dependencies (by Ooops on 2014-09-25 08:47:58 GMT from Canada)
34) 35 and 36)
Thanks for your replies to 33) - pretty much sums up anything I could have replied. Personally, I usually compile from source and use checkinstall. Have not tried Sbopkg and would be interested in any feedback on tradeoffs and preferences between checkinstall and Sbopkg.
One thing that has not been pointed out is that on SysV systems, the init files often have multiple spaghetti code of symlinks. Works fine, but when troubleshooting, I like the simplicity of Posix style init script.
For binaries, slaptget is prettymuch like aptget for Slackware.
Slackware also supports rpms, but there may be complications because of different versions and types of rpm between rival distributions. Compiling from source may seem like more work, but has saved me many headaches in the long run.
Gentoo is a completely source-based distro with excellant documentation, but I prefer plain text-based docs as opposed to xml files (same sort of thing between openbox and fluxbox window managers).
I THINK Landor may be one of the most experienced Slackware users around here? Maybe we can get more such tutorials. The nice thing about Slackware is, you REALLY get to know the plumbing. Things are far less likely to break, but if they do, you have a better understanding of how to fix things.
Another tip: Note the just released update to LFS (Linux from Scratch). Eevn if you don't read the whole thing through, it is a "must have" reference to understand the plumbing. After all, that IS one of the reasons to use Linux rather than Windows.
There are some good books on FreeBSD (eq - Absolute FreeBSD from NStarch Press) as well as documentation from their site, but have not come across any book on OpenBSD.
Guess that's enough tips for one post without "hogging" all the space....
38 • @30 Android (by Kazlu on 2014-09-25 09:21:08 GMT from France)
"Great! Now give me the names of some Linux distros that can replace Android on my phone and do as good a job on my tablets."
I can't since I don't know your phone :) I think you may install Ubuntu on some Nexus phones, but other than that there is no GNU/Linux distro that works on phones I believe.
But that was not my point. I was actually responding to #14 Bob: "I'd finally like to see a distro matching Android's qualities." The point was not to find a GNU/Linux distro to install on a phone or tablet, but to know what are the qualities of Android that you can't find on a GNU/Linux distro. A matter in OS properties rather than on which device it is supposed to run. Sorry if I wasn't clear enough :)
39 • @33 (by kc1di on 2014-09-25 09:32:39 GMT from United States)
As someone has said their it slap-get , you may want to take a look at PCLinuxOS also, it's to this point systemd free as far as I know. And uses apt-get for rpm as the pkg manager. It has a huge repository of programs that just work mostly.
40 • Debian (by Mac on 2014-09-25 13:14:50 GMT from United States)
As of 9-15 Debian Jessie is working great for me hope the final is as good. It does take a bit of work to get it going the way I think it should. Hope the way systemd is going it don't mess it up. Have been with and liked Debian for years. And I also use kde for de. But to me linux is all about choice hope that never ends.
Have fun Mack
41 • Shellshock - Security Concern (by Bob on 2014-09-25 14:29:23 GMT from Austria)
... "more serious than the Heartbleed bug" ...
... "found in software component known as Bash ... part of Linux & Apple's Mac OS" ...
... "Shellshock could hit at least 500 million machines" ...
... "security researchers warned that the patches were "incomplete" and would not fully secure systems" ...
Windows needs a break anyway with Win 9 Preview around the corner ;-)
42 • shellshock (by sam on 2014-09-25 16:09:25 GMT from )
using centos 6 here, was reading the news on shellshock and the update icon popped where it does on gnome 2, it was a bug fix for bash. I cannot tell if it was fixing shellshock or something else affecting bash. I have already applied the update and do not know how to go back and check the details of what was fixed. If they have done it so fast, they they are great.
43 • Shellshock (by jadecat09 on 2014-09-25 17:54:57 GMT from United Kingdom)
Got this news from The Register. Slackware had already sent a security warning and patch.
Have a great day/night
44 • Shellshock (by Jordan on 2014-09-25 18:42:39 GMT from United States)
The BASH fixes are "incomplete," according to RedHat.
It's still out there. Been looking around for large scale exploits but have seen none so far (1:42pm U.S. Central Time 25 Sep 14).
45 • Some quotes about systemd (by RollMeAway on 2014-09-26 04:07:08 GMT from United States)
Poettering:
"it unifies system objects and their dependencies"
"One goal of systemd is to unify the dispersed Linux landscape"
"trying to gently push everybody towards the same set of basic configuration"
"we’d like to unify the most boring bits where there’s really no point at all in being different"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Systemd:
"While systemd has succeeded in its original goals, it's not stopping there".....
"systemd wants to control most, if not all, of the fundamental functional aspects of a Linux system"
So, continuing my analogy from post #31.
You find the simple rash has now covered your head, all your head and facial hair has fallen out.
Good thing is now you don't have to shave, or wash, cut, and comb your hair !
Now you discover most of the people around you all look like you do.
How do like your new system created by systemd ? (er I mean a simple rash)
Such a shame you cannot control it.
46 • media bash FUD party (by cykodrone on 2014-09-26 05:04:23 GMT from Canada)
Wow, the sky is falling again, NOT. I don't ever remember getting a patch/fix this fast with any expensive proprietary OS. My tinfoil hat is ablaze again, lol, anybody else get the feeling the powers that be want to scare people to NSA friendly corpware?
47 • BASH vulnerability (by frodopogo on 2014-09-26 05:20:22 GMT from United States)
This is the test line to type (or paste into) the command line in Terminal:
env x='() { :;}; echo vulnerable' bash -c "echo this is a test"
Then hit Enter.
If you get the response "vulnerable this is a test".... it's vulnerable. If you get another response, it's been patched.
Linux Mint 17 has already been patched.
One article mentioned CUPS vulnerabilities, so I installed those updates too.
This is the Ars Technica article mentioning a BASH "exploit in the wild":
http://arstechnica.com/security/2014/09/concern-over-bash-vulnerability-grows-as-exploit-reported-in-the-wild/
48 • @Shellshock (by KI on 2014-09-26 07:52:40 GMT from Belgium)
Apparently, the bug started to be exploited 4.5 hours after its existence was announced in the media. Never before.
Now this is a problem. Because it would seem that the guys who found the bug decided to spread the information without giving the developers the time to release a fix. Why? Most likely because in our society one gets more fame by acting like this than by acting in a more ethical and responsible manner.
And I guess there is nothing we can do about it.
49 • Ethical (by Somewhat Reticent on 2014-09-26 12:42:42 GMT from United States)
If clear attempts to warn security agencies of an urgent threat is dismissed and ignored, what to do?
50 • @49 @Shellshock (by KI on 2014-09-26 17:41:07 GMT from Belgium)
Yes, but what I mean is that, in an ideal scenario, by the time the media find out about the bug, a patched version should be ready so that system administrators have the time to update the application before anyone can possibly exploit the vulnerability.
51 • re 45 -> systemd (by corneliu on 2014-09-26 21:02:16 GMT from Canada)
I see that we are going the analogy route. OK. Here is mine:
Let's imagine a true and tried system that has been around for ages, it is simple, well tested and just works. Let's say an oxen cart fits the given description. Also the oxen cart does not have a single point of failure. If one ox goes down, the other can do the job.
Now why would anyone want to switch to a more complex solution which also has one point of failure (one engine), is new and not tested enough such as for example a truck? Obviously the truck would be systemd and the oxen cart would be sysvinit.
I know my analogy is not perfect, it's just an analogy, but it is obviously better than RollMeAway's.
52 • @45 & 51 systemd BoogeyMan (by FUDBucket on 2014-09-26 22:07:27 GMT from United States)
The way I see it is, you have three choices, if systemd really bothers you:
1) Switch to a Distro, that has been and is very clear about never using systemd.
2) Fork and roll your own, minus systemd.
3) Quit Linux and using a entirely different OS.
It really is not that hard. Thus far, I have no issue with systemd. If it should start to turn into some unholy beast, then I drop it like a bad habit, move on and be like gone, with the wind.
No wringing of hands or sweating bullets, required.
Peace out.
53 • @Systemd-free distro (by KI on 2014-09-27 07:22:28 GMT from Belgium)
Thanks to everyone for your suggestions:
1.- PCLinuxOS looks indeed like an option worth considering.
2.- For a binary-based Gentoo derivative I meant something like Sabayon or Calculate Linux. I have already used Gentoo for over a year and Funtoo for nearly a year. Both are great but I was spending too much time administrating the system.
3.- Salix seems really impressive, but there seem to be still few packages in the repos.
4.- Installing everything from source (or from binary packages) without automatic dependency control is not an option for me.
I think I will go for PCLinuxOS first. It seems that the performance is also remarkable.
54 • #53 (by jadecat09 on 2014-09-27 11:21:08 GMT from United Kingdom)
I think you will find Salix is compatible with the Slackware repos
55 • @53 • @Systemd-free distro (by mandog on 2014-09-27 21:15:03 GMT from Peru)
I think you will find Sabayon uses Systemd
You can also use any system Systemd free it only takes about 3 mins so its really not that bad to use your favourite distro
56 • systemd takeover (by WonderWoman on 2014-09-28 00:55:53 GMT from Australia)
After 20 years Linux it's still nowhere on the desktop. Might be because it's a kernel + userland + other things and not a predesigned OS? So why not let these ppl go all the way - unify the internals, the packaging, everything. Let's see what a full systemd distro could be like. You never know, it might do the trick and usher in the "year of the Linux desktopd".
57 • @56 - systemd distro (by Ika on 2014-09-28 02:25:28 GMT from Spain)
"Let's see what a full systemd distro could be like."
Obviously it would be Windows like. That simple.
58 • A fully s*****d distro could be like a ... (by Kragle on 2014-09-28 13:48:52 GMT from United States)
Tivo'ized 'droid gnome? Sole survivor of mmorg zom'bot bash?
59 • re 57 (by corneliu on 2014-09-28 19:34:01 GMT from Canada)
Quote: "Obviously it would be Windows like. That simple."
You mean Linux will be extremely popular?
60 • #59 (by jadecat09 on 2014-09-28 20:17:07 GMT from United Kingdom)
Er, It already is.
61 • re 60 (by corneliu on 2014-09-28 23:39:17 GMT from Canada)
On desktop?
This discussion was about the desktop in case you didn't read the previous comments.
Number of Comments: 61
Display mode: DWW Only • Comments Only • Both DWW and Comments
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