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1 • Slacko (by Snazzy on 2011-12-12 09:12:43 GMT from United Kingdom)
Long-term user of Puppy. The speed of development of these spin-offs is amazing. Not only that, but you scarcely need to mention a gliche on the Murga Forum and the developers have posted a solution. If you liked Slacko, you'll also like the all-new Saluki, the all new RacyNOP, the ever-popular Lucid and 3HD not to mention the base versions Wary and Racy which constantly receive attention from Kauler, their originator. Nothing in this kennel stands still. One can see claims of 'sleek', 'fast', 'small', whatever, from other developers - apart from a few like sg TinyCore & SliTaz, those claims are without substance. Use Puppy version on old boxes you dragged out from under the bed to do useful, valid tasks at speeds you cannot believe. Save the planet from landfill !
2 • Puppy Slacko (by Mike on 2011-12-12 09:27:48 GMT from Netherlands)
I believe to remember that Puppy used to run entirely in memory. Is this (still) the case? Using 50 Mb of memory seems a bit contradictory..........
3 • Irony (by wolftec on 2011-12-12 09:44:46 GMT from Portugal)
Reading this review on a Slacko Puppy Laptop. It's fast and flawless on a Pentium 4 machine with 512Mb ram.
4 • Puppy Slacko 5.3.1 (by Lobster on 2011-12-12 09:47:01 GMT from United Kingdom)
Yes Puppy runs in memory
Touchpad issue is sorted in 5.3.1 (now available)
http://puppylinux.org/wikka/HomePage
Growl Security (under network) means Puppy is more secure than your average HD installed big dog Linux. We don't do FUD, we educate our kennel :)
http://puppylinux.org/wikka/security
With Woof2 build system we are set up to move to the ARM processor or use rpm base to build our scripts
5 • Puppy 5.3 (by Barnabyh on 2011-12-12 10:32:51 GMT from United Kingdom)
It still runs in RAM unless you install it to hard drive. But if not installed you get these pop up messages every time you boot and this can get quite annoying after a while.
6 • KahelOS-GUI Installer (by pera on 2011-12-12 10:57:21 GMT from Serbia)
KahelOS is Arch Linux with GUI installer and some artwork. I think this will give more popularity to Arch Linux,especially among intermediate users. This was needed to Arch all this years,it is very stable,simple and powerful distro,and it was pity that only power users could use it.Chakra also based on Arch had some their ideas and packages,it wasn't pure Arch Linux ever.
7 • Puppy (by OldTimer2 on 2011-12-12 11:23:45 GMT from United Kingdom)
I remember trying to install an version of Puppy on an old, old laptop (400 Mhz), many years back and whilst it worked when in RAM the rest wasn't pretty.
I found the Puppy installer to be a pain.
In the end I used AntiX, which took 5 mins to install.
I hope that Puppy has improved the installation regime.
Many smaller distros are great when run in memory, but try to install them & you see the limitations of the designer's thinking (my way or the highway).
8 • Slacky 5.3 (by deNiros on 2011-12-12 11:49:44 GMT from Belgium)
Nice review of Slacko. Small correction to the review, Slacko, and other puppy linuxes, have a compiler and complete development environment. Just download and add the dev_nameofpuppy.sfs to you disk and let it load at boot.
Puppy Linux might seem to be suited for low end hardware only. However, I am running a 64 bit version, named Fatdog64-521 puppy, on a core i5 with 8GB internal memory and intel SSD laptop. And it is really great in combination with an SSD, since changes are only written once every X hours to the disk, plus discard works, once configured.
Now, with puppy linux this thing is superfast, nothing is holding it back. Applications load instantly once the icon is clicked. It runs in memory, and mine has plenty ( 8GB), it only uses small applications/scripts. And when I need another application, i just compile it myself, by using the pet making script. Why would I wanna run a big OS on this laptop which makes it feel slower then yesteryears computers.
Ah, yeah, and for security, internet apps like pidgin, firefox and irc run as user spot (so no root only), plus you can easily configure a firewall.
9 • opensuse w/ kde3 (by tonny s on 2011-12-12 11:51:24 GMT from Indonesia)
just want to greet opensuse 12.1 KDE 3 version. Will try it ASAP. Nostalgic :)
10 • Desktop Usage (by mcmillan on 2011-12-12 12:12:41 GMT from United States)
Not that Arch is a representative sample of Linux users, but they have also collected data on package usage
https://www.archlinux.de/?page=FunStatistics
(% of users that have installed packages)
KDE SC 39.34%
GNOME 36.33%
Xfce 27.28 %
LXDE 9.98 %
e17 4.55 %
Openbox 28.22%
Compiz 19.18%
Fluxbox 1.18%
Xmonad 6.12%
Wmii 4.83 %
I3 3.35 %
FVWM 3.12 %
Window Maker 3.05 %
Ratpoison 2.34 %
subtle 1.36 %
11 • openSUSE KDE3 (by ix on 2011-12-12 12:18:34 GMT from Romania)
I'm downloading it now, openSUSE has always done a good job with KDE, and KDE3 is a great DE.
12 • puppy slacko it works. (by lott11 on 2011-12-12 12:27:40 GMT from Colombia)
My last install for recovery of old unit was on Pentium 155 MMX with 312 Meg ram.
This PC was in garage for 2.5 years now it is happily running in school.
Along with 7 other older units, they have 30 units in total, the newest model is P4 with 1GB ram.
The smallest is a P 133 with 256 Meg ram.
So tell me that this don't work.
This units where recovered when customers updating to newer models.
I gave them the option to do the same they declined, so I asked if they would donate them to the school.
Well the rest is history, for a school that had no resources, this worked well.
So if you do have any older PC's, and you are not thinking of turning it in to a NAS server or a router.
Please think there are others less fortunate.
There are people that do not have the resources to get them.
Think just! Donate for a good cause.
Like a school or kids that can not purchase them.
This can turn someone's life around.
You can make the difference.
Most of this are on puppy Linux with Italc for monitoring and tutoring.
13 • Wild Dogs (by Eddie on 2011-12-12 12:33:32 GMT from United States)
This looks like another good release for Puppy. It amazes me how much Puppy bounces around and is built to use different repositories. I've never been bored playing or using a Puppy release. Barry seems to be a very smart man with a little wild dog in him. I'm always looking forward to playing with the new Puppies.
14 • puppy linux (by lott11 on 2011-12-12 12:53:17 GMT from Colombia)
I know of one other project that does the same thing and that is Helios.
http://www.heliosinitiative.org/
There may be something like in your neck of the woods.
So you may help them out it is you choice.
This dose not mean that it is the only one, just ask around.
Well if not think puppy is a choice so is BSD NAS for free NAS or coyote or smoothwall even Pfsence.
It's up to you, turn that old PC to a good use.
15 • Puppy runs faster (by Lobster on 2011-12-12 12:56:02 GMT from United Kingdom)
Puppy runs from memory, even if you install to USB or hard drive. It only calls from the hard drive or other booting device, if there is less than 256MB of ram (less memory for smaller or older puplets). Many of us have a big dog Linux on the hard drive and Puppy on a DVD or USB boot. As Puppy boots and runs faster from memory than the big dogs, the hard disk can be used for file storage, rather than potentially compromised executables.
Puppy saves data in a save file for settings, docs and other files. The save file, up to 4GB can be enlarged or you can move and back up to more permanent storage. Or of course you can run in multi-session mode - leaving an audit trail.
Our programming 'dev-x; system includes Glade, C, C++, python, Vala, Genie and Bacon
http://bkhome.org/bacon/index.html
16 • @Jesse Smith (by dragonmouth on 2011-12-12 13:01:09 GMT from United States)
"One of Puppy's unusual characteristics is that the distribution, by default, automatically logs the user in with the root account. While this is convenient (we're never prompted for a password when logging in or performing administrative tasks) it means that an important layer of security is stripped from the distribution."
That may be true, but how much more secure are the distros which allow ordinary users access to admin tasks just by entering their own user password? While the system MAY be protected from external hackers, it is vulnerable to any ham-handed, careless, inquisitive, uneducated or unhappy user joined to said system.
17 • Puppy Linux (by Bob Hayden on 2011-12-12 13:05:58 GMT from United States)
Why do Puppy reviewers insist on installing it to a hard drive and then complaining that one logs in as root?-) This distro is meant to be run from the CD on which system files cannot be changed. If you manage to mangle them in memory, they will be restored on the next boot. Of course if you don't follow directions, there may be trouble!-)
http://puppylinux.org/main/How%20NOT%20to%20install%20Puppy.htm
I will admit that some users (including me) do sometimes install Puppy as a traditional Linux distro, but that's not what it is designed for. I have done that many times with versions going back to 2 and found Puppy to be the distro most likely to install that way without self-destructing or messing up my system. For example, it does not automatically overwrite the MBR like some bigger distros. I'll agree that it would be nice if the hard drive install script included an option to log in as someone other than root, for the naughty folk who insist on a hard drive install, but that's not what Puppy is for. We wouldn't review Mythbuntu by discussing its inadequacies for doing advanced statistical analyses.
18 • puppy works (by lott11 on 2011-12-12 13:32:01 GMT from Colombia)
Ho by the way I run all of the PC's from the server.
And all the other PC's are running as clients in the school.
Why it simple! all the change in or around can not be modified by any of the clients.
All work is store on the drive by user login but not on the OS or server.
It is the same every time they start the OS.
No worries.
The kids can not modify the server, nor any one online or on the net.
They are never on root privileges.
So it's like running it of a CD or USB.
19 • HP & WebOS (by Sly on 2011-12-12 14:28:58 GMT from United States)
Last week, HP announced they were donating their WebOS platform to the opensource community. I'm pretty impressed with WebOS so I hope the community takes the ball and runs with it.
20 • Re: 16, Puppy Linux (by Coffee on 2011-12-12 14:35:33 GMT from France)
> While the system MAY be protected from external hackers, it is vulnerable to any
> ham-handed, careless, inquisitive, uneducated or unhappy user joined to said system.
... which doesn't disprove the original argument, which is that a Linux desktop run from a properly specified and password-protected USER account is inherently more secure than a Linux desktop run from a ROOT account that doesn't even have a password. Why are people always mudding the water with unrelated stuff instead of sticking with the issue at hand?
21 • Statistics about usage... (by disi on 2011-12-12 14:41:42 GMT from Germany)
Here are profile stats for Gentoo...
https://soc.dev.gentoo.org/gentoostats/profile
Only 92 machines submitted so far.
22 • Puppy save (by Bill on 2011-12-12 15:10:34 GMT from Canada)
If I run Puppy from a USB,will it automatically save back to the USB on exit?
I just want to make sure that if I run it on a work machine that it won't save to the local hard drive.
23 • Re 22 (by eamonnb on 2011-12-12 15:23:38 GMT from United Kingdom)
When Puppy asks if you want to save it gives the choice of HD, the USB its running from, or another USB device. That's my experience to date.
24 • Puppy Save (by Lobster on 2011-12-12 15:24:41 GMT from United Kingdom)
Puppy will save where ever you tell it or not at all. Including USB, Hard Drive and with multi-session CD or DVD.
Get the FAQS
http://puppylinux.org/wikka/FrequentlyAskedQuestions
Get Started
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=526#526
25 • kahelos is a joke (by dude on 2011-12-12 15:28:54 GMT from United States)
It took arch, and it just replaced the artwork.
I've tried the installer multiple times in the past, they managed to make it uninstallable.
They have put a lot more time into their website than their installer.
Not to mention their installer was broken for at least 2 years before this release.
While they have redesigned their site at least 3 times in those 2 years.
26 • @20 Puppy Linux's unique user approach (by Vic on 2011-12-12 15:35:37 GMT from Canada)
Being a long time Puppy user and a regular reader here at DW I'm no stranger to the debate over Puppy's use of a password free root as the default user. For those not familiar with the project it is explained best in the second link of comment @4 by Lobster (whom if I'm not mistaken is a regular user and contributor to the puppy community). I suggest reading the second part regarding use of root in Puppy.
Here it is again for convenience: http://puppylinux.org/wikka/security
It is a different approach to a traditional linux user account implementation where each user logs in under there over username with password. Puppy's method has it's obvious short comings, especially in a traditional HD install where running as passwordless root leaves the / file system more vulnerable to operator error and outside attack. When Puppy is used in it's recommended way, which is running in frugal where the / file system remains in read only .sfs loaded into memory at each boot with user data stored in a save file or external medium, running as root becomes less of an issue. Further more applications which directly access outside networks, such as chat clients and browsers, are by default launched as the restricted user spot, limiting access to the rest of the running system.
Is this more secure than a traditional passworded user account set up? IMHO no. That said one has to remember the projects intended audience and it's goals at being a simple single user, easy to use, light, efficient desktop alternative to proprietary systems and heavier Linux projects, that offers the same user experience run from a CD live to USB to HD installs. In that spirit the developer(s) of Puppy have offered a still relatively secured system (when used in it's intended way) that does away with the complications of a multi user system while still being Linux. Personally I think they do a good job of it.
Puppy is not a replacement for traditional full Linux setups for everyone, though for many that use it, can be just that. For me it is a fun, fast, little tool that continues to grow and change, continually offering something new use. I look forward to trying each of their releases and keep a copy handy on my live USB at all times.
27 • Puppy Linux (by Snazzy on 2011-12-12 16:12:58 GMT from United Kingdom)
Running as root from a liveCD-R incurs no inherent security risk. On the other hand, it enables easy, fast copying, moving and deleting of directories, files, names or even editing single words&letters on other ('bent') OSes on other discs&media that refuse to boot/run/function - not mentioning any particular OS that regularly gives grief, but sure that everybody knows which one is meant!
28 • @27 Nope (by Eddie on 2011-12-12 16:25:12 GMT from United States)
I have no ideal which other os you are talking about.
29 • Puppy Slacko (by David McCann on 2011-12-12 16:52:05 GMT from United Kingdom)
Those who successfully installed Puppy were luckier than I. If you tell it to install to an existing partition, it does just that; it does'nt format it first, leading to a horrible mixture of two distros. Putting Grub on the partition didn't work (nothing was done) so I had to install it manually. I then found that no configuration file had been created, so when I rebooted I was given a Grub prompt to boot by entering commands! It's easy to say that it's not meant to be installed, but then why provide an installer? When it was set up, I found no help in Abiword, or in most other programs. Downloading the Abiword help package didn't correct that. I think that Puppy is becoming more of a hobby project than a serious distro. Got an old computer? Install AntiX or Vector Light.
30 • Puppy (by grape jelly on 2011-12-12 17:46:44 GMT from United States)
Even putting aside the cutesy appearance, I don't think this distribution is very good, in any form.
- Rox-filer is *really* not user-friendly, e.g. it can't do recursive overwrites
- The installation process is unintuitive for novices
- Package management is done quite badly; updates are not possible and conflicts abound due to 2+ package formats
- The automount rules often fail to recognize when a drive has been attached or detached
- Running as root *is* bad security, no matter how you try to spin it. The only reason it's not a practical issue is Linux's lack of popularity on the desktop. Noscript, iptables, etc. are useful, but they probably won't protect you from e.g. a trusted website that's been hacked; or a trojan spread through IM clients; or...
All told, I think Puppy is a great idea - there *should* be a good, functional Linux distro for old computers. But IMO the execution of this idea is not good at all.
31 • @29 Puppy Slacko (by Vic on 2011-12-12 17:58:44 GMT from Canada)
Currently replying from a frugal install of Slacko on my laptop. Luck had nothing to do with it. Reading the directions for installing Puppy go a long way and the procedure is well documented with the installer itself and also on the project's website.
Quick link here: http://www.puppylinux.com/install.htm
My personal method of installing Puppy does not even require the installer. I start by creating a folder /puppy in the root of my target partition which already has a different linux distrobution installed. Into that folder I copy three files which I extract from the Slacko iso. The necessary files are vmlinuz, initrd.gz, and in the case of Slacko puppy_slacko_5.3.sfs. (If using this with a different version of Puppy just substitute the corresponding .sfs file from the iso.) Assuming that I'm currently running the already installed distro (in my case Mint) I just update that installs grub configuration. Based on your version of grub the method will vary, but grub management is well documented online. In my case it was as simple as adding
menuentry "Puppy Linux Frugal (on sda1)" {
set root=(hd0,1)
linux /puppy/vmlinuz
initrd /puppy/initrd.gz
}
to /etc/grub.d/40_custom, and then running 'sudo update-grub'.
That was it, two steps, three minutes, done. Not many projects can be install so quickly.
As far as help files are concerned the project makes every effort to keep the .iso file small as possible, hence the exclusion of extras such as help. Most common help can easily be found online. In the case of abiword here is a quick link I grabbed from their site:
http://www.abisource.com/help/en-US/
Puppy is an excellent tool. Sorry to hear your experiences didn't reflect that, but reading the documentation the devs of the project provide goes a long way in clearing up many of the difficulties one could experience using it for the first time. As the reviewer mentioned Puppy goes a long way in incorporating plenty of instructions in the included tools. And what help isn't found in the project itself is just a quick online search away. IMHO AntiX or Vector Light, each great and different than Puppy, don't offer any more in the way of hand holding for new users.
Vic
32 • Puppy (by Jesse on 2011-12-12 18:06:54 GMT from Canada)
@16:
>> "That may be true, but how much more secure are the distros which allow ordinary users access to admin tasks just by entering their own user password? While the system MAY be protected from external hackers, it is vulnerable to any ham-handed, careless, inquisitive, uneducated or unhappy user joined to said system."
It sounds to me you're saying security features are not any good if people don't use them. Which is both true and irrelevant. If I complained about a car that didn't feature seat belts would you argue it doesn't matter since some people refuse to wear their seat belt? Most security features are helpful only as long as people are willing to use them.
@27:
>> "Running as root from a liveCD-R incurs no inherent security risk."
That may be true if you don't have a hard drive in the computer, but most of us do. The root user can mount and access hard disks, which puts the machine at risk both from the local user and external exploits.
33 • gOS (by JWM on 2011-12-12 18:50:16 GMT from United States)
I had tried gOS and thought they had some interesting ideas how to make Linux more user friendly. Maybe the creator's of gOS can make a desktop interface environment replacement for Ubuntu? I generally like the strength of Ubuntu and the many adjustments they quietly do that make the system run well. I just can't use Unity or the Mac Menu. This may be an opportunity to for gOS to show their stuff. I had high hopes for gOS. Maybe there is life after discontinued.....
34 • Puppy, brilliant for all types of machines and uses. (by Tony on 2011-12-12 19:00:18 GMT from United Kingdom)
Puppy in various forms has helped me re-use numerous older machines that were destined for the scrap heap, rescue data from virus ridden Windows machines and recently at a Permaculture course allowed a number of computers to connect to the WiFi where the installed Windows could not. People were also amazed at the speed their machine could run at!
There is also a very helpful, friendly and knowledgeable community. A while back I emailed a thought to the creator Barry K suggesting a change to some wording to make it easier for newbies to understand. Within 4 hours he had replied and made the updates, what a hero!
Even if you don't run it on your machine for day to day work keep a copy on CD, it's like a software swiss army knife and there are so many varieties like light house puppy etc that you will surely find one for your purpose.
35 • Re: Estimating desktop environment share (by coolpup on 2011-12-12 20:14:34 GMT from Canada)
I suppose if someone was interested enough, a poll could be set up someplace.
36 • Desktop popularity on openSUSE (by M. Edward (Ed) Borasky on 2011-12-12 20:23:08 GMT from United States)
I'd guess that KDE 4 is more popular than Gnome on openSUSE, given that the default when installing from the DVD has been KDE for several release cycles and the release cycles are eight months. I ran KDE 4 through the whole 11.2 life cycle, but I switched back to GNOME 2 for 11.3 and switched to GNOME 3 as soon as it was available on 11.3.
Does Smolt track which desktop users have?
37 • Suggestions on best distro for... (by mz on 2011-12-12 20:31:29 GMT from United States)
While hearing you guys talk about puppy I though I'd ask if anyone had an opinion on a relatively slim distro. I'm really into PCLOS and Mint for my own machines; however, I was going to give someone an old PC with Linux on it so they can do the basics, surf the web, do word processing etc. I don't want to have to reinstall Mint in 6 months or a year, and with PCLOS an occasional thing comes up that I don't want to have to go fix for someone else. I'm thinking of using a RHEL clone that would do the basics and have support for a long time, but am wondering if there is a better option for a noob. The free machine I have is only 650 Mhz, but it does have 512 MB of RAM so it's not all bad. I'd really like to hand off a machine that could do dial up in addition to being able to use a quicker connection, and I'd like to think that after showing how to do updates and use a package manager I would be able to get by without much extra support. Any suggestions for something better than CentOS or Scientific?
38 • A good replacement for Kubuntu? (by Leo on 2011-12-12 20:35:42 GMT from United States)
I have a bunch of machines running Kubuntu, this is actually all I have, except for one that moved to Bodhi (eee-701). I am not sure for how much longer
Now that KDE-4 settled at the plasma interface, a new release of KMail (Kmail2) broke my email (and everyone else’s) terribly, so I had to spend a day fixing that. However, performance after that was so bad, not in small part due to Akondai, but also for KMail specific things like email filters not working anymore, the email client taking minutes to load a local folder, etc. that I had to move to Thunderbird a month later. Another fun day.
The beauty of KDE is in the libraries and integration. However, I had to give up: first on KOffice, then on most of KDE-PIM, because it was impossible for me to synchronize events with other devices, share calendar entries, etc. Now I gave up KMail, so I was happy to uninstall. Still, sometimes akonadi takes one core doing who knows what, because I removed all akonadi sources from their config window. So, I don’t benefit all that much from the integrated experience.
Meanwhile, the society is moving to a could centric computing experience. No matter how much everyone complains, Ubuntu made the right move with Unity, at least conceptually. KDE has one more shot before it becomes a niche desktop. What it needs is:
• stop throwing computer science experiments such as nepomuk and akonadi to the end users
• provide a light and beautiful Plasma experience
• componentized things, make it easy to write “apps”
Kubuntu, in turn, should cut the crap, and provide the simple, beautiful desktop (I love Plasma), and use best in class apps for each category: Libre Office (this is already there), Thunderbird, Firefox or Chromium, etc.
Anyways, my 2 cts. In the meantime, is there any good replacement for Kubuntu, along these lines? A large user base is very important to me. That's why I like the *buntu's. Maybe mint KDE?
39 • Errata (by Leo on 2011-12-12 20:38:04 GMT from United States)
In my previous comment, I meant to say CLOUD (not "could"), so it should read
"Meanwhile, the society is moving to a CLOUD centric ..."
40 • Is Puppy really faster? (by TobiSGD on 2011-12-12 21:19:48 GMT from Germany)
I have seen many claims here that Puppy is faster than other OSes, just because it is run from RAM. I don't see any substance for that. Of course it will have faster loading times the first time you start an app, but since after that first start the application is cached the speed up is not anymore existent after that.
And I doubt that if you do some "real work", means let the computer actually compute something, like rendering images, compiling software or encoding videos I really doubt that Slacko will be faster than Slackware or Lucid will be faster than Ubuntu.
I would really like to see any benchmarks for that, so if someone has a link to some benchmarks, please post them here.
41 • Puppy Linux (by greg on 2011-12-12 21:37:20 GMT from United States)
I think Puppy Linux is a great tool. I am a bit confused, by their choices for partitioning, however. Most of their distros use sda1, for instance, but a few, such as Legacy Puppy use hda1. That makes it very difficult to install multiple distros, if you are using grub2 as your main bootloader.
42 • Puppy Slacko (by CliffyB on 2011-12-12 21:37:42 GMT from United States)
"The background is mostly black with refracted light..." It`s the Dark Side Of The Moon by Pink Floyd cover art. Young people nowadays...
43 • @38 (by mz on 2011-12-12 22:14:52 GMT from United States)
From what I can tell/remember there haven't been any official releases of Mint KDE after version 10, which only has 4 more months support. Of course there is a package called 'kde-full' in the Mint repos that should install the full DE. But then I thought that stuff like nepomuk and akonadi could be turned off. I know PCLOS uses Thunderbird and Firefox by default, and at least one of those things you called 'experiments' are turned off by default, so I like it as a KDE option. Oh and there was a recent opinion piece on the best KDE distros here:
http://www.linuxbsdos.com/2011/11/17/top-6-kde-distributions-of-2011/
44 • @37 (by anonymous coward on 2011-12-12 22:38:59 GMT from United States)
>Any suggestions for something better than CentOS or Scientific?
Go for Debian Squeeze with gnome 2.32. It has a larger repository, and a bigger community. Or if you can wait till l Xubuntu 12.04, do so. It has 5 years support.
45 • @16 (by Adam Williamson on 2011-12-12 23:27:39 GMT from Canada)
Most distros actually only give the *first* user root access with their own password by default, not *all* users. Or it's a checkbox at user creation time.
46 • @42 (by Anony Moss on 2011-12-12 23:38:49 GMT from Sweden)
Waggin' your tail, - the moments that make up a dull day ...
Another brilliant release.
47 • Demi Lovato Linux (by Jason Hsu on 2011-12-12 23:45:26 GMT from United States)
Remember Hannah Montana Linux? There is now a Demi Lovato Linux. Check it out at http://demilovato.sf.net/ . It's based on Ubuntu with GNOME3. I wonder if Demi Lovato Linux was created by the same person who released Hannah Montana Linux.
48 • They took my lunch money... (by mz on 2011-12-13 00:09:08 GMT from United States)
Look out kids or Linux Mint will beat you up and take your lunch money:
http://linux.slashdot.org/story/11/12/12/141227/linux-mint-diverting-banshee-revenue
Of course $3.41 is about half the cost of a foot long sub + meal deal.
49 • @20: Coffee (by dragonmouth on 2011-12-13 00:12:14 GMT from United States)
"... which doesn't disprove the original argument, which is that a Linux desktop run from a properly specified and password-protected USER account is inherently more secure than a Linux desktop run from a ROOT account that doesn't even have a password. Why are people always mudding the water with unrelated stuff instead of sticking with the issue at hand?"
Nobody is denying that fact. But you do ask a very good question. That argument was not made in the Puppy review. In fact, it was not made in any posts until yours. So why are you mudding the waters with unrelated stuff instead of sticking with the issue at hand?
BTW - if a user can access admin functions with his own password, the system IS NOT secure, inherently or not.
50 • @32: Jesse (by dragonmouth on 2011-12-13 00:39:15 GMT from United States)
"It sounds to me you're saying security features are not any good if people don't use them"
Sorry, Jesse, that IS NOT what I am saying. What I am saying is that Ubuntu and its derivatives have a faulty security paradigm. It has been this way since the first release of Ubuntu. How can a system be considered secure, when by design, any and every user can become an administrator just by using their own password?
51 • gOs is very good OS! (by Denz on 2011-12-13 00:47:00 GMT from Poland)
I hope someone resurrect this distro or perhaps create an install package for ubuntu. It will surely kick Unity and GNOME 3 interface out of the door.
52 • @45: Adam Williamson (by dragonmouth on 2011-12-13 00:56:30 GMT from United States)
"Most distros actually only give the *first* user root access with their own password by default, not *all* users"
I don't know about most distros but PCLOS, Debian, Mepis and antiX have an explicit root user with its own signon and password. Neither the "first" user nor any subsequent one are granted root access by default. OTOH, Ubuntu and its derivatives grant root access not only to the "first" user but to all users joined to the system. In fact Ubuntu et al do not allow an explicit root signon.
53 • Fedora needs a LTS (by JD on 2011-12-13 01:37:22 GMT from United States)
I've. just been thinking why can't or why doesn't fedora have a LTS release like Ubuntu and Mint? A release supported for 3 years.? They just seem to churn out lots of releases that aren't supported very long. Don't get me wrong I love red hat. But why can't fedora be supported for 3 years?
I know they said fedora is a pro user distribution But even a pro user might get tired of the update often ways. I mean it's hard to give fedora to someone because in about a year its already out of date and unsupported I feel this is a big problem.
Say you install fedora for someone... In a little over a year its out of date and unsupported :(
I'm a Ubuntu user. But I used to use fedora v.10-14
Gnome shell made me not want to upgrade so I. Went to Ubuntu fulltime everywhere. (though. I was planing on doing so anyway since Ubuntu focuses on a desktop distro.)
54 • Ubuntu (by Jesse on 2011-12-13 01:58:42 GMT from Canada)
>> " How can a system be considered secure, when by design, any and every user can become an administrator just by using their own password?"
That's not how Ubuntu works. Only users granted sudo/admin rights can use their own password to launch admin tasks. Really this isn't all that different from having a separate root account. In either scenario you just need one password to run a program as root. Does it matter if I need to put in my own password or a second password, the end result is the same and with sudo you can lock down what access each account has.
>> " OTOH, Ubuntu and its derivatives grant root access not only to the "first" user but to all users joined to the system. In fact Ubuntu et al do not allow an explicit root signon."
None of this is correct. Ubuntu only grants sudo/root access to the first user and other users you specify admin access for. If you don't create additional admin accounts only the first user retains the root ability. Further, it's entirely possible to use the root account on a Ubuntu machine. Most people don't, but it's still there if you want to use it. If you want to you can disable sudo access on Ubuntu and only use the root account, just like on Debian or Red Hat systems.
I recommend you read the Ubuntu documentation on the subject, it should clear up your misconceptions. https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RootSudo
55 • @53 (by jeff on 2011-12-13 02:35:22 GMT from United States)
"I've. just been thinking why can't or why doesn't fedora have a LTS release like Ubuntu and Mint? A release supported for 3 years.? They just seem to churn out lots of releases that aren't supported very long. Don't get me wrong I love red hat. But why can't fedora be supported for 3 years?"
Are you being serious with this question? Fedora is produced by Red Hat. Red Hat is a corporation. Corporations want your money. By making Fedora LTS, Red Hat would lose out on a lot of customers who are forced to pay for reliable, LTS support. I suggest a Debian-based distro, the repo's are bigger and APT is faster.
As for Puppy, I've played with it on and off over the years. It's okay. Considering that there are lighter distro's based on Debian, such as antiX, I don't use it for older computers.
56 • I'll try Slacko... (by Rational Egotist on 2011-12-13 03:40:15 GMT from Australia)
Most of todays distros use up to 1/3 of my monthly download bandwidth, and I've never tried them. As much as I like the idea of choice, I don't like BloatWare.
57 • @17 - Incredible State of Almost (by Vakkotaur on 2011-12-13 03:50:28 GMT from United States)
Indeed the HDD install may well not be the intended purpose of Puppy, but many want the supposed speed and lightness benefits of Puppy AND the convenience of having it right on the HDD (which is harder to lose/damage - in some ways) than a USB stick or CD. Thus the desire to have a user account that looks and acts like a user account - even assuming Perfect Security of the Puppy system, it generally will feel weird and risky to many users and if the user is constantly uncomfortable, rightly or wrongly, you've lost him. Also, the "reboot if anything really goes wrong" makes one think, "If I wanted Windows, I'd run Windows." I suspect what many are waiting for is what (much to Puppy fans annoyance) could be called "Puppy done right" - Runs in RAM, is very light, but is meant to boot from HDD and lets users use a user account that isn't called root.
That MAY already exist in some form. I simply haven't found one that seemed like it to me that didn't have some other odd issue for me.
58 • @53, Fedora LTS (by TobiSGD on 2011-12-13 04:41:45 GMT from Germany)
In fact, Fedora has an LTS, it is called Red Hat Enterprise Linux and you have to pay for it. If you don't want to pay you are free to use the free derivatives, like CentOS or Scientific Linux.
59 • Xubuntu 11.10 (by KevinC on 2011-12-13 04:46:05 GMT from United States)
I confess to being an unrepentant distrohopper, but I running Xubuntu 11.10 64-bit and it is strong. After some tweaks it's really a nice distro. According to HTop using ~700mb out of 4gb right now w/ Chromium open and 4 tabs, 2 dl's and Clementine playing the Black Keys "El Camino." XFCE is really coming into its own. While I love LXDE, it still needs a bit of polishing to get there. No real problems w/ Kubuntu 11.10 (tho 11.04 was a bit better), I miss the experience of Gnome2 & XFCE is really there. Gonna try Vector 7 soon and maybe AntiX and KahelOS (tho not a Gnome3 fan....not a hater either). OpenSUSE 12.1 KDE 64 bit was no go for me. Nouveau failed before install was done. Eventually fixed it so it would boot to desktop, but it puked errors. I played w/ it a bit, and instantly longed for 11.4...I'll pass. Same goes for Fedoras since 14. I have 11.10 Ubuntu installed and Unity is actually 1/2 decent netbook interface & I can do it on the desktop, but far from what I want to use everyday. Mint 12 was fail, but I updated the RC, so will retry the final release & see where that goes. Anyway, I have no dl limit so far (but dire warnings from my ISP). Until my internet gets castrated, I'll test it all. As of today tho, Xununtu 11.10 is NOT going to be replaced. Thinking about trying this for s--ts and giggles: http://deviceguru.com/ubuntu-11-10-without-shell-shock/
Think I'd keep the top panel on top tho.
60 • @53 @55 @58 (by Adam Williamson on 2011-12-13 05:11:30 GMT from Canada)
RHEL is hardly just 'Fedora LTS'. Fedora and RHEL are really pretty different beasts.
Fedora is not 'produced by Red Hat', it's produced by the Fedora community; that's not just marketing flannel, there's a substantial amount of work put into Fedora by people who aren't paid by Red Hat, and saying Fedora is 'produced by Red Hat' is insulting to those people - like Kevin Kofler, just to pick the first example that comes into my head, who works very hard on Fedora's KDE desktop, something RHEL does not include at all.
Anyway, why is there no Fedora LTS? Simply put, there aren't the resources for it within the Fedora community; no-one involved in Fedora (be it Red Hat staff or anyone else) has wanted there to be an LTS release strongly enough to actually step up and do it. Supporting a distro for a three or five year period is a pretty substantial undertaking, as supporting software gets harder and harder the more outdated that software gets; the *last* year of a five-year maintenance cycle is more work than the *first* year. It'd take a pretty committed, reasonably large group of people a lot of work to actually pull off an LTS release that users would be happy with, and that just hasn't ever come together.
An LTS release wouldn't really do a huge deal to drive forward Fedora's goals, and it's an area that's fairly well covered by other distributions; these are secondary reasons it's not a major priority for Fedora.
Most people involved in Fedora don't think there's anything wrong with the situation where Fedora just isn't the right distro for someone's needs. If someone wants a reasonably cutting-edge desktop distro with a long term support cycle I wouldn't hesitate to suggest they take a look at Ubuntu LTS, for e.g. It's fine for Fedora to do what Fedora does, and it's certainly the case that sometimes, what you need for the task at hand isn't Fedora. My opinion, anyway.
61 • @44 (by mz on 2011-12-13 05:41:54 GMT from United States)
Not half bad ideas, but I don't think I would want to wait for the next *buntu LTS to come out and I think Debian only has about 2 years of support which is less than ideal. I'll certainly consider them though, thanks.
62 • @60 RHEL and KDE (by Mike on 2011-12-13 05:48:12 GMT from United States)
Hi Adam, while it isn't the default desktop I am pretty sure that KDE is provided in RHEL as an option. Not trying to disprove your example but it just didn't seem like the best example possible.
http://docs.redhat.com/docs/en-US/Red_Hat_Enterprise_Linux/6/html-single/6.0_Release_Notes/index.html#id3927949
63 • Puppy is fast (by Tony on 2011-12-13 07:17:13 GMT from United Kingdom)
Hi TobiSGD, puppy both starts fast, starts programs fast and also runs fast. It runs fast because there are virtually no background services running, it uses a fast desktop and it uses so little ram you are unlikely to start eating into a swap file unless manipulating large images for instance. Hope that helps.
64 • @61 - Debian support (by Ralph on 2011-12-13 07:24:33 GMT from Canada)
Debian has 3 years of support, although the current stable branch will only be supported for 2 more years (plus 2 months).
65 • re 32 (by Snazzy on 2011-12-13 07:45:47 GMT from United Kingdom)
""Running as root from a liveCD-R incurs no inherent security risk."
That may be true if you don't have a hard drive in the computer, but most of us do. The root user can mount and access hard disks, which puts the machine at risk both from the local user and external exploits."
Missing the point, Jesse! My machines are never at risk from the local user - it is I, alone. Any mistakes I make deserve to be punished. As for external exploits - operators have only to switch off their router when working under root. Presumably they have already malware-checked everything they've downloaded or copied whilst working as another user, probably in another machine?! I try to switch on my brain before switching on my PC, but this can be challenging before my my first morning cup of tea.
66 • @37 It depends... (by Koroshiya Itchy on 2011-12-13 09:06:53 GMT from Belgium)
The choice of distro depends on what your friend is going to use the computer for. It is clear that with those specs you will need something lightweight and old-hardware aware. Please, have a look at:
http://distrowatch.com/search.php?ostype=All&category=Old+Computers
Puppy, its various derivatives and SliTaz all seem excellent options. However, if you plan to be installing a lot of binary packages on a regular basis and/or compiling a lot of code, you may want to go for antiX and profit from the huge Debian repos and the power of apt.
67 • @60 About "Fedora LTS" (by Finalzone on 2011-12-13 09:09:10 GMT from Canada)
Fedora Legacy was an attempt for LTS which predated Ubuntu LTS. As you rightly stated, lack of manpower permanently shut down that project. Should someone or a group want to step up to revive it, they are free to do so.
The url of Fedora Legacy is still online: http://fedoralegacy.org/
68 • Puppy Linux 5,3 Slacko - Jesse Smith/Robert Storey (by Antonio Mendonça on 2011-12-13 09:43:24 GMT from Brazil)
Gostei da análise do Puppy é realmente uma boa distro.Porém, a análise deveria verificar dois pontos: execução de um cd/dvd de filme baixado da Internet(rmvb) e impressão de um docimento qualquer.Obrigado
69 • re.68 (by Snazzy on 2011-12-13 10:44:30 GMT from United Kingdom)
Both functions can be implemented, but, depending on your hardware and requirements, you may need to look on the Forum to find specific advice that best suits your needs:
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=588893#588893
Otherwise, one of the developers will be happy to respond to your requests.
70 • re: 30 • Puppy (by deNiros on 2011-12-13 10:57:34 GMT from Belgium)
grape jelly said:
- Running as root *is* bad security, no matter how you try to spin it. The only reason it's not a practical issue is Linux's lack of popularity on the desktop. Noscript, iptables, etc. are useful, but they probably won't protect you from e.g. a trusted website that's been hacked; or a trojan spread through IM clients; or...
My puppy runs internet apps as user spot, so not as root. But btw, running as user on a regular distro won't protect you either from malicious software or website. services can be run from usermode. A script can do harm to your userdata. It's all a matter of trust really. If you as a regular user run skype from your userdirectory, you know your personal data is being compromised.( since skype steals data for commercial reasons) So if you trust skype as a regular user, that is your fault/mistake.
And let's be realistic, for a home user, is there a difference in importancy when it comes to the system or your userdata. I don't think so, since your system probably consists of one user.
71 • @60 (by jeff on 2011-12-13 13:29:51 GMT from United States)
I am aware that there are those who work on Fedora who are not being paid by Red Hat. There are actually hundreds of Linux distro's maintained by only volunteers.
The reason Fedora LTS doesn't have the manpower is because Red Hat won't help. On the other hand, RH is happy to help with Fedora, where it can test technologies for its enterprise products.
72 • Fedora LTS (by musty on 2011-12-13 14:35:05 GMT from France)
I have a pc running fedora that came from 13 up to 14, 15 and 16 just with "yum update" and "preupgrade yum".
I confess that it requires some tweaks and disciplines but that is linux world and its joys
73 • @70 Puppy and root (by Koroshiya Itchy on 2011-12-13 15:41:39 GMT from Belgium)
For me, there is a huge difference between malicious software hacking just the user account or the entire system. The harm a malicious piece of code can do as a regular user is limited and can be minimised in a number of ways. Now, if it has root access it can even harm your hardware and nothing will stop it.
74 • Puppy Linux review (by tk on 2011-12-13 15:54:04 GMT from Kenya)
I find that Puppy Linux makes it easy to setup firewall and dial-up internet and it also provides encryption option for the personal storage file.
75 • Degrees of security (by Pearson on 2011-12-13 16:54:02 GMT from United States)
__sigh__ we're haveing *this* argument again.
Security can only be measured in degrees. Imagine several homes in a row on a street. The first home has the doors and windows open, the second the doors are closed but unlocked, and so on until the last home has all doors locked, deadbolted and the windows barred.
Which homes are "secure"? Which ones "unsecure"? Does the last home become "unsecure" when the door is unlocked to gain entry?
In *some* environments (not very meny nowadays, alas), it's considered perfectly OK and secure to leave your doors unlocked while away for the day. In others, it isn't.. Even if it were, you'd think twice about building a home without locks. So, no locks are "inherently less secure" -- not necessarily insecure.
Likewise, all the bars and locks won't prevent someone from running a car though the front room (accidentally, of course!). Though the locks and bars are "inherently more secure", is it really "secure enough" if someone *really* wants to get in?
Runnong all things as root, with personal/valuable data available, is "inherently less secure". There are fewer hurdles for "the bad guys" to bypass.
So, let's stop talking in absolutes about one distro being "unsecure" while another is "secure". What people need is a distro that is "seucure enough" for their needs. For most people that means only running as root when needed, and limiting access to the root account.
76 • @62 (by Adam Williamson on 2011-12-13 16:59:47 GMT from Canada)
Whoops, I think my termination notice is in the mail =)
Nice catch, as you say, there are other examples, though. That's just the first one that hit me.
77 • @71 (by Adam Williamson on 2011-12-13 17:04:08 GMT from Canada)
Well sure, you can look at it that way. In the same way, the reason Fedora doesn't have a perfect Windows emulator is 'because Red Hat refuses to help'. The reason every copy of Fedora doesn't come with a free pony is 'because Red Hat refuses to help'...
78 • gnome 2.32 support (by walter_j on 2011-12-13 17:30:47 GMT from Canada)
I'm trying a number of distros to replace ubuntu 10.10 and haven't found anything. Opensuse 12.1 kde came close, but kde is sooo unstable. Lots of segfaults leaving me with a barely useable system. similar experience with kubuntu.
Given my lack of success in finding a replacement for ubuntu 10.10, I'm now willing to kick in money to get gnome 2.32 running in the next lts kernel. I'm not interested in mate at this time, and would like just a plain gnome 2.32 de. Anybody know of a project such as this that we can support?
79 • @78 (by Patrick on 2011-12-13 18:21:23 GMT from United States)
Uhm... mate!
Why are you looking for another project but are not interested in the one that sets out to do what you want?
80 • mate (by walter_j on 2011-12-13 18:50:45 GMT from Canada)
The mate site is down, so I couldn't find more info on it. If it is gnome 2.32, I'm in...
81 • @78/80 (by mz on 2011-12-13 19:08:10 GMT from United States)
Mint 12 has mate on the DVD by default, which is basically a rework of the last Gnome 2.x version. Of course there are still bugs to work out and issues related to repackaging the DE, so KDE is probably working better right now on most distros. I logged into it a few times on my Mint 12 laptop but it seems more sluggish and slower to load than MSGE/Gnome 3, so I haven't played with it much but it is there. I think it might be ready for prime time when the next release comes out, but of course by then Gnome extensions may have solved most of the issues with how horrible Gnome 3 is by default. I'm sticking with KDE for the most part and really haven't had any issues with 4.6 as long as I don't screw with those activities things.
82 • Puppy-love/hate (by mchlbk on 2011-12-13 20:08:05 GMT from Denmark)
I really want to like Puppy. It could be perfect for a netbook.
For me the big problem is the pathetic package manager. The idea of access to major distros' repos is appealing but the package manager is increadibly clumsy and frequently leaves you hanging with all sorts of dependency issues. Often the installed programs are outdated and updating is not easy.
If the package manager is fixed Puppy could be my main os but for now it's "just" a tool.
About the root-issue: I seem to remember that when you shut down for he first time (when you are asked if you want to create a file with your settings) you are asked if you want to use the "unsafe" always-root approach or try an experimental approach with enhanced security. I might be wrong, as I said I just use it as a tool and have no need for extra security. But if I'm right the developers are actually trying to fix the problem.
Can anyone confirm this?
83 • KahelOS installer (by condor on 2011-12-13 22:19:22 GMT from Romania)
I've tried the installer and ... surprise: KahelOS wants to use the entire hard drive!!! It does not accept a proposed free partition. ... It's a bug or...a feature?
84 • Re: #78 Gnome 2.32 Support (by tdockery97 on 2011-12-13 23:37:54 GMT from United States)
If memory serves me correctly, Fuduntu has claimed that they will support Gnome 2.32 for as long as possible and avoid Gnome 3.
85 • sudo (by Barnabyh on 2011-12-14 04:59:46 GMT from United Kingdom)
Sudo does indeed allow for very flexible permissions on what a user who is in the sudoers file is allowed to do. You can also set the time out to 0 here, which means it won't remember the password at all and will prompt again every time, as opposed to the 5 minutes, or is it 15 even(?), that Ubuntu uses.
For example one could set it up to only allow the user to run the package manager and update the system, not everything that root can do. The use of aliases is making it even more flexible.
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1132821
Unfortunately most distributions with sudo by default allow everything, in order to make it 'easy', or more 'humane', for newer users. By restricting what can be done it could act as something half way between normal user account and full blown root access.
86 • Fuduntu review (by Vic on 2011-12-14 17:10:30 GMT from Canada)
A few comments above mentioned Fuduntu, which has been on my to try list. Would love to see a review of this sometime on DWW. Since I had the time I downloaded the iso myself and have been trying it out live. So far I'm pleased with it. Seems like every distro I've tried lately have been small hits for me (Vector 7, Crunchbang 10, Mint 12). Wonder if I'm just getting easy to please of late... Anyways, if there's time for it give Fuduntu's latest a run, I enjoy reading others experiences and the insight and feed back it generates.
87 • Fuduntu review (by Jesse on 2011-12-14 17:52:11 GMT from Canada)
@86:
We've covered Fuduntu here twice in the past year. Once in its early 14.x days, back around 14.1, I think. The other came shortly before their move to fork away from Fedora.
88 • @87 Short Term memory (by Vic on 2011-12-14 19:32:20 GMT from Canada)
My apologies, did a quick peak into the list of archives and I recall reading both, hehe. Really have got to glance over the list before making requests! That said I've noticed some minor changes to the project since it's last review, though not enough to elicit a new one. Still, the feeling I've gotten playing with it live is good enough to carve yet another partition on my laptop so I can test it further. The poor little HD is getting crowded! Which is fine, it's a spare I use just for test driving new releases anyways.
Vic
89 • open source project (by Michael J King on 2011-12-14 20:52:55 GMT from United Kingdom)
open source version of an angry birds type game needing supporters, distrowatch? anyone? http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1384519763/pissed-off-penguins/posts/151334?ref=email&show_token=d8bc511bc9c92b3a
This is very close to its target but still needs support to get the go ahead
90 • Lubuntu 12.04 with Unity? (by Henning on 2011-12-14 21:56:31 GMT from Denmark)
I've downloaded the daily builds of Lubuntu 12.04 from the last two days.
Much to my surprise, the live image, by default, boots into a desktop that looks like some version on Unity!!!!
Been searching the web, but couldn't find any info about what is going on.
Is Lubuntu switching to the Unity interface as well? (Hope not, I stuck with Unity through Ubuntu 11.04, but finally gave up when 11.10 came out)
91 • More defunct distros than active ones?!? (by bornagainpenguin on 2011-12-14 22:46:59 GMT from United States)
....Quick....somebody start a few dozen distros! ; )
--bornagainpenguin
92 • @91 defunct distros (by subg on 2011-12-14 23:34:45 GMT from United States)
...or dip into the overflowing waiting list.
93 • @91 defunct distros (by bornagainpenguin on 2011-12-15 02:04:21 GMT from United States)
No, that would make too much sense! ;)
--bornagainpenguin
94 • Puppu Linux's ROOT as DEFAULT... (by NICK VLAHOS on 2011-12-15 05:50:14 GMT from United States)
Please CORRECT ME if I'm WRONG..but wasn't there an "option" to change or configure the "default user" login from "root" (admin) to "spot" (non-admin user)?? This was supposed to already be pre-configured and available as an "option" after installation of the "live" distribution(s) ?? THAT solved it on MY install of "Flux Pup" and others. Thank You..(NGV)
95 • Lightest "Distro" for Old (er) Hardware... (by NIXTER57 on 2011-12-15 06:14:09 GMT from United States)
Simply put...the "Lightest" candidates I've had the pleasure of using (on P-ll gear 300Mhz and up) are... Tiny Core(10Mb), Slitaz-Stable(30Mb), Puppy Wary 5.2.2(120-130Mb) & last but NOT least..AntiX!! All are GREAT and easily documented & configurable depending on use and application!! Honorable Mention also goes out to NimbleX(200+Mb & tricky to install) and PureOSLite(Debian Based & Bigger..but runs like the WIND w/enough ram!!).
96 • re: 95 lightest distro (by Michael J King on 2011-12-15 14:15:58 GMT from United Kingdom)
Bodhi Linux with E17 fits in nicely between Slitaz and Puppy on boot up, More modern than any of them.. Worth checking this one out, it has a great forum too! Bodhi Linux will also be one of the distros supporting the raspberry Pi, $25 pc out next month with its own arm processor spin.
97 • Puppy (by Openplus on 2011-12-15 18:57:40 GMT from India)
Puppy was my all time favorite ,I love this distro for one reason, its speed and can be used as alternate desktop
98 • PearOS- WTF ?? No HD installer app (by Roland on 2011-12-16 04:52:44 GMT from United States)
I downloaded PearOS 64bit, put it on a thumbdrive with unetbootin, and booted it. It's a beautiful OS, but the one thing I couldn't find was any kind of disk installer. No mention of it on the PearOS website, either. WTF ?? Too bad!
Maybe it'll be "fixed in the next release."
99 • @98 - Pear OS installer (by LinuxFreak on 2011-12-16 07:01:38 GMT from Germany)
I downloaded the 32bit edition, and the installer can be started directly from the boot menu, without even starting the live session. Perhaps it's the same with the 64bit edition?
100 • Puppy (by fernbap on 2011-12-17 00:24:59 GMT from Portugal)
I have been using puppy for long, as the best way to rescue old hardware. After being installed, puppy is also extremely easy to use.
The reason behing some of the few reincarnations comes from puppy's main issue that is still preventing it to being a "mainline" distro: the lack of a repository. I understand it has a cost attached, and i'm not blaming Puppy for that.
Lucid puppy is the way puppy found to borrow a repository from a "mainline" distro in order to present its users with a large choice of software. Slacko is the same, only this time borrowing the repository from Slackware.
My favorites, besides the main edition, is macpup. But you have a lot of puppies to chose from.
101 • Walter@78 (by retlaw on 2011-12-17 01:32:48 GMT from Canada)
You can have a fast and efficient desktop with either Linux Mint Debian rolling or Zorin. Both are great. I have both installed and prefer Zorin. There is an appearance changer app in Zorin that makes it Identical to Gnome 2. The Java apps work, compiz works. I have found nothing to grumble about! You do not have to go to KDE 4.###. I have tried and I do find it unstable. I have gone through about 10-12 distros in the last two weeks trying to replace my good old Mint 11. I could keep using it, but with all the talk about going with the "future", we can count on a lack of support.. Like many others I gave Gnome 3 Mint a week on my machine. I have no good words for it.!
102 • @51 gOS @99 PearOS (by PF Yeawood on 2011-12-17 09:52:04 GMT from United States)
@51 gOS
I downloaded gOS the other day and installed it in Virtual Box. I took a chance and tried Update Manager. Got over 300 updates. Odd, since it was based on Ubuntu 8.04. Got two more this morning. Not bad for an LTS that should have hit EOL back in April of this year.
@99 @98 PearOS
Yes, the AMD64 version does have a separate boot option for installation. I Installed it on my Acer netboot with 2Gig ram. Dual boots with Ubuntu Natty. I use Natty for the classic Gnome, no effects. Like each for different reasons.
Paul
103 • Clem dreams (by forlin on 2011-12-17 19:12:19 GMT from Portugal)
Beware: this is no way intended, by no means, as a flaming comment. Dont like, pls don't feed it.
"about the size of Mint's user base, Clem replied, "It's extremely hard to estimate. Ubuntu announces 20 million people....this figure seems really unreliable to me. What we know for a fact is that our user base was three times smaller than theirs a year ago..."
This is a nice one, Clem.
You say all user base is quite impossible to estimate. At the same time you know "for a fact".your user base is 3 X smaller than xBuntu.
We would love you to share your "facts" with us.
"We're focused and confident we'll outgrow Ubuntu eventually though in 2012."
This is a good dream and we all wish it will come true.
104 • Kororaa checksum Gnome 32 bit? (by gnomic on 2011-12-18 03:07:49 GMT from New Zealand)
Anyone downloaded the 32 bit Gnome DVD and got a checksum that agrees with the md5sum on the download page? Alas, mine does not, raising the question is the d/l bad, or is the published checksum incorrect? Have seen this happen from time to time after a sequence of trial versions before the final.
105 • Re: Kororaa checksum Gnome 32 bit? (by Chris Smart on 2011-12-18 07:06:09 GMT from Australia)
Hey Gnomic,
I double checked the md5sum and it matches the ISO on my machine, the md5sum on Kororaa website and the md5sum on SourceForge page, so I'm guessing it's correct. It should be:
7a8429e4446b5ae1857bbc2a33fb06cc
I are also sha1sum and sha256sum results on the Kororaa website (but I think SourceForce only shows md5 and sha1).
It is possible that one of the SourceForce mirrors somehow became corrupt, in which case you could try choosing a different mirror at the time of download and see if it's still wrong.
Cheers,
Chris
106 • @103 (by mz on 2011-12-18 07:47:41 GMT from United States)
I think that entirely depends on your definition of 'outgrow'. Will Mint grow bigger than Ubuntu in total userbase a single year? Unlikely. Will Mint add more total users than Ubuntu in 2012? Possible, but a hard task. Will Mint, which is a smaller Distro by the numbers, grow at a faster percentage rate than Ubuntu? Very possible, not least of which because an equal or even smaller increase in total user base = a larger total % increase for the smaller project. Ubuntu played with fire with it's new interface and has seemingly lost a lot of momentum, while Mint has seemed to gain momentum by trying to give users what they want & tame Gnome 3, which is the only DE that is more whackey than Unity. Mint & Gnome 3 may not be perfect but they seem to be doing really well lately and have gained while Ubuntu has been shooting it's self in the foot. I'm sticking with Mint for the next little bit on the laptop I'm using and will probably even kick around Unity a little on it, and judging by the buzz Mint seems to have they may well get enough other users in 2012 to outgrow Ubuntu by at least one of the three definitions I mentioned.
107 • re 105 Kororaa download (by gnomic on 2011-12-18 13:23:47 GMT from New Zealand)
Thanks Chris for responding. Afraid I am getting md5sum e63a9f9abda53528dedbe975e6dc8197 here. Guess there is no point in wasting a DVD.
I see Sourceforge is said to offer 'Fast, secure and free downloads from the largest Open Source applications and software directory.'
Hmmm. Maybe so in parts of the world with real internets, Down here it appears to be slow as a wet week much of the time, and apparently also unreliable.
Any other mirrors? Bit grumpy about this in the land of data caps, and have just another iso from SF that also appears to be bad.
108 • Korora download (by Ralph on 2011-12-18 18:39:32 GMT from Canada)
@107 - gnomic: just to be sure, are you consistently getting e63a9f9abda53528dedbe975e6dc8197, i.e. you've tried downloading 3 or 4 times and its the same checksum everytime?
Also, if you don't know already, Sourceforge has several mirrors you can choose from.
109 • re 108 bad downloads (by gnomic on 2011-12-18 20:25:24 GMT from New Zealand)
'you've tried downloading 3 or 4 times and its the same checksum everytime?'
Are you mad? We don't do that kind of thing round here. Er, just joshing :-)
But seriously I'm afraid we're in data cap land here, the internet overlords have us on tight rations. The account I'm using has a daily limit of 1.2 gigs for example. In order to get any larger size iso I have to try and time the d/l to run through the time early in the morning when the limit is refreshed, and hope the provider's throttling software allows the d/l to continue. So this sort of thing is a dashed nuisance.
Haven't really examined Sourceforge carefully but the d/l process seems pretty opaque. Don't seem to recall ever seeing a list of mirrors to choose from as is often the case elsewhere. By preference the best option here is a server in Australia as they are usually faster than more distant ones. Have I missed something here around using Sf?
110 • Sourceforge downloads (by Ralph on 2011-12-18 22:19:33 GMT from Canada)
@109 - typically when you hookup to the Sourceforge site you will get a message telling you if you have problems downloading trying using another mirror, with 'mirror' being hyperlinked to a menu where you can choose among umpteen different mirrors.
111 • re 110 Sourceforge d/ls (by gnomic on 2011-12-19 04:37:07 GMT from New Zealand)
OK I see what you mean, when one goes behind the curtain there is a listing of mirrors including a couple of my Ozzie favourites :-) Not quite sure why this just doesn't appear first thing, and the clicking finger has to be pretty quick to head off the auto-select first option. With any luck I'll be able to take back all those nasty things I said about Sourceforge.
Number of Comments: 111
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