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1 • First look at openSUSE 11.1 (by Dorin on 2008-12-22 10:56:22 GMT from Romania) |
Great release! Except the Fn + function keys (F1-F10, with F2, F3 exceptions) my laptop works 100% out-of-the-box. Extra installation of ATI proprietary drivers and wpa_supplicant and my Toshiba Satellite Pro A300 is up and running at full capacity. No other Linux distro has done this so far for me.
2 • 4 year study is 4 years old! (by Felix on 2008-12-22 11:06:56 GMT from United Kingdom)
The article you link to was published on the 14th December 2004 !
3 • openSUSE (by Oscar on 2008-12-22 11:14:55 GMT from United States)
Nice release from Microvelle.
4 • proprietary codecs in openSUSE (by greenpossum on 2008-12-22 11:25:58 GMT from Australia)
The reason openSUSE cannot provide even links to proprietary codecs on the install media is because of patents. The project cannot be put in a situation where there is even a suggestion that the project might condone patent infringement (whatever your views on software patents may be). However the links to the required one-click install links at third-party sites are not hard to find with a little searching.
5 • Codecs in SUSE (by blutkehlchen on 2008-12-22 11:32:40 GMT from Germany)
You dont have to look for the repos who are containing non free codecs.
You can chose the Pacman repo fromm within Yast to install almost everything codec related
6 • Boycott the Boycott Novell Trolls (by colinp on 2008-12-22 11:53:15 GMT from United Kingdom)
Clearly, all the anti-Novell trolls will be out in force for this DWW. Don't feed them!
OpenSUSE is a great distrobution, and 11.1 improves on the great work done by the community. It's easily the best KDE4 distro, and the team gives far more back to the overall Linux community than many other distros, including the one sitting above it in the DW rankings!
7 • Nice to see that Sabayon is completely ignored (by Michele on 2008-12-22 11:57:29 GMT from Italy)
Nice to see that DistroWatch decided to completely ignore Sabayon. Clap clap clap!
8 • Old link!!!!! (by ceti on 2008-12-22 12:16:51 GMT from Brazil)
"The article you link to was published on the 14th December 2004 !"
9 • Resizing panel in KDE 4 is part of KDE 4.1 ... (by makosol on 2008-12-22 12:20:39 GMT from France)
it is not a backported feature from 4.2
10 • backporte feature from KDE 4.2 in Opensuse 11.1 are... (by makosol on 2008-12-22 12:23:18 GMT from France)
some kwin effects, panel autohide et notifications i beliveve
11 • @7 (by drizake on 2008-12-22 12:25:31 GMT from United States)
I followed your link and it says Sabayawn will be ready at Christmas time. I also skimmed through the youtube video linked on the main page. Wow. A cheesy slogan on the desktop, a useless desktop sphere, and a bunch of games that you can easily play on any Linux distro including Debian. (saba)YAWN!
12 • First look at openSUSE 11.1 (by zaine_ridling on 2008-12-22 12:26:19 GMT from United States)
I've been working with openSUSE all weekend and I was impressed with every part of it. Like Fedora 10, I'm happy to see that openSUSE took chances and got it right. (Wake up Canonical, you're falling behind fast!) Even Novell's flavor of OpenOffice 3 is far better than their 2.4 version. Being Microsoft-free, I don't need their proprietary formats built in. openSUSE's stability and noticeable improvement on speed are welcome. My ATI 4850 radeonHD drivers were installed at setup. By the way, who authored the review? There's no byline.
However, here are the caveats: (1) Fedora 10 seems to have done a better job with KDE 4, if for no other reason, more of the desktop's features are available; (2) Fonts were terrible on my 1900x1200 display, but that was easily corrected; (3) There's no Krusader (file manager) in YaST? I missed it if so. (4) Customizing software package installation at setup was tedious, and like the partition view, did not give you a single view of what you were installing; (5) Loved the partition screen, but there really should be a simpler version. You either had to go with their auto-selected choices (which were not previewed), or pick what looked like an expert mode. I was left confused, but somehow I got it right.
As the author states, you really won't go wrong with 11.1, and it's a solid major version you can sit on for as long as you want.
13 • OpenSUSE review (by Carl on 2008-12-22 12:44:52 GMT from Spain)
While I respect that people like Open SUSE, I just do not understand how the reviewer can give such a positive opinion. Let's see:
- camera doesn't work in Gnome
- searching for apps in the Gnome menu doesn't work
- iPod integration is broken both in KDE and Gnome
- OOo crashes when hovering over a menu item
This is definitely not good. I wonder if any other distro would get the same level of recommendation with that amount of obvious and non-trivial bugs.
14 • @11 (by Michele on 2008-12-22 12:50:35 GMT from Italy)
go back using your dusted package manager, yawn...
15 • @11 (by Michele on 2008-12-22 12:52:37 GMT from Italy)
You don't even know what Entropy is. So, next time, RTFM and avoid talking knowing nothing > http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20080707&mode=67
16 • openSUSE 11.1 (by Charlie on 2008-12-22 12:55:30 GMT from Hong Kong)
A great release but with one and the most annoying bug:
boot hangs while starting the "jexec service" in the runlevel
and it seems also affecting Dolphin and Konqueror from displaying files in the home directory normally
the only solution to solve the problem now is to stop the jexec in runlevel,but is there any perfect solutions?
17 • OpenSUSE11.1 (by TiPaul on 2008-12-22 12:57:44 GMT from Canada)
I was really happy to get my hands on openSUSE as i'm a long time distro tester (since 1997).
But I realized that for simple desktop usage at home, openSUSE is much more complex than Ubuntu for everybody/everyday usage.
Like the reviewer said, having to wait for a window to open and having to search for the application you want to open isn't a good thing. That's not the "KISS" way to do things.
I know, openSUSE is very SECURITY oriented, but that made it a little bit tougher to use.
Easy sharing of files to Windows and MAC computers will overcome simple "home-desktopers"... ;)
Had to read more to get everything's working (nVidia 3D drivers)...
ONE thing that i was VERY PLEASED with: Installation for my Broadcomm 4306 wirelless card was the best I experienced since!
18 • @15 (by drizake on 2008-12-22 13:20:53 GMT from United States)
Wow. I don't remember attacking Entropy in particular, but I do remember Portage (or portato) not working when I wanted to see what packages were available. I also wouldn't say someone knows nothing (especially a complete stranger). I was merely noting that Sabayon 4 isn't even available yet and that to me it's just eye candy. That might be why it's not in distrowatch this week.
19 • Missing.., presumed on school holiday (by Norbert Blenkinsop on 2008-12-22 13:24:09 GMT from United Kingdom)
So, seeing as there's little or no Ubuntu talk around DW this week, where are the hoards of people who were foaming at the mouth last week insisting that DW is now an 'Ubuntu only' forum?
School broke up maybe?
20 • @19 (by drizake on 2008-12-22 13:26:12 GMT from United States)
Any why isn't anybody talking about MY favorite distro? It's the best distro around and I'll be really upset if no one talks about how awesome it is this week. :)
21 • Gentoo, and much of its' derviatives .. doing the dying fly (by Norbert Blenkinsop on 2008-12-22 13:30:09 GMT from United Kingdom)
Lets be honest, suitable now, only for (mainly) adolescents that don't get out enough.
The rest of the World did not have time, or reached the end of their teens , and moved on.
It will be gone in a year or two.
22 • OpenSuse (by Tony on 2008-12-22 14:07:49 GMT from United States)
Good review - Thank You! When I get my (new to me) test box scrounged together, I'll be giving OpenSuse 11.1 and Kiwi 8.12 a run. Again - Thanks for this weeks DWW!
Merry Christmas to everybody!!!
23 • RE: 20, Ok, What is it? (by Eddie Wilson on 2008-12-22 14:19:25 GMT from United States)
What is YOUR favorite distro?
24 • @21 (by Michele on 2008-12-22 14:20:55 GMT from Italy)
Sabayon uses Entropy as default Package Manager beside Portage. If you don't have time and you're not an adolescent (like me), go use it! "equo" from command line, "spritz" if you want the GUI. Many of you talk without even knowing what they're talking about :)
25 • @23 (by drizake on 2008-12-22 14:22:12 GMT from United States)
I don't really have one, but I'm running Debian Testing right now. I usually have the latest Ubuntu or Mint installed, but I finally got around to installing Debian so I can feel like a real geek. :) I like to read about the various distros, but I don't get upset if the ones I use don't make the news.
26 • @24 (by drizake on 2008-12-22 14:29:16 GMT from United States)
OK. You convinced me. When I see the announcement for Sabayon 4, I'll seed the torrent and give Entropy a fair shot.
27 • Nice overview of 11.1, and wtf are Mandriva doing? (by Miq on 2008-12-22 14:34:32 GMT from Sweden)
I found this DWW to be quite good. The in-depth look at suse11.1 was informative, accessible and well written. Though it initially seemed rather heavy on or leaning toward some aspects (installation and GNOME), on the second reading I saw that it was well justified and a balanced and fair coverage. I am quite interested in trying out 11.1 and this hands-on look made me even more so. I did become a bit worried with the cautions regarding 3D though... I hope it will work because I enjoy the benefits 3D brings to the desktop experience.
Then I must say that the new Mandriva CEO seems to love his bizspeek, such clichés I last saw in Dilbert... Hevré, that "business jargon generator" app was meant as a JOKE! :rolleyes: Well, from a community perspective, the new community effort seems to quite a bad start, few Linuxians I know have much patience for empty corporate bullshit.
28 • Performance & Upgradability of OpenSuse (by Anonymous on 2008-12-22 14:42:28 GMT from United States)
What about the performance of OpenSuse? It always felt sluggish and the guys at phoronix did a comparison of it regarding java and it always came last, compared to ubuntu and fedora.
And is opensuse considered a good distro regarding upgradability? Is it a one time install, and upgrade afterwards or more or less a re-install every now and then?
The reason I'm asking, I have this amd64 machine @home which needs to become my workstation and I want to install it and forget it as much as possible (just security updates & if possible new version upgrades)
29 • OpenSuse (by Nick on 2008-12-22 14:48:37 GMT from United States)
Great review of OpenSuse 11.1 - Thank you!
30 • OpenSUSE 11.1 partitioner & bootloader installation (by David Smith on 2008-12-22 15:12:35 GMT from Canada)
I agree the installer interface for partition and bootloader setup need a major overhaul in the wording, sequence and presentation of the various options.
I suspect the intention is to cater to the 'average' user, who will just go with the defaults, and perhaps that will turn out fine for most people who have either a blank hdd, or perhaps want to dual boot openSUSE with xp or vista.
Me, I have two hdds (one sata, one pata) with 5 (now 6) other linux distros, xp and w2k coexisting comfortably, with grub as the bootloader. For my needs, openSUSE consistently has the most poorly designed and risky installer of all the distros I've installed, hands down.
I've had problems with openSUSE's installer partition setup in the past (wiping out another installed distro), so I took extra care. It still took me several tries and a 'hail mary' pass with the highly ambigous (to say the least) bootloader options, to arrive at the desired result.
It is difficult to say if there has been any improvement to these critical features since version 10x, it all looked pretty much the same; poorly thought through and implemented.
One other gripe is that neither my Wacom tablet, nor CUPS printer discovery worked 'out of the box' and both took some research and additional software installations to get going. Unlike, for example, Fedora 9 and Kubuntu Intrepid (both also installed to the same pc as openSUSE).
31 • Re:Performance & Upgradability of OpenSuse (by Anonymous on 2008-12-22 15:14:23 GMT from Germany)
Please read http://lizards.opensuse.org/2008/12/16/comments-on-phoronix-benchmarking-opensuse-111/
32 • Re: backporte feature from KDE 4.2 in Opensuse 11.1 are... (by Anonymous on 2008-12-22 15:16:38 GMT from Germany)
For a more complete list see http://en.opensuse.org/Sneak_Peeks/KDE_Draft
33 • SUSE, Sabayon, and Ubuntu... (by davemc on 2008-12-22 15:17:35 GMT from United States)
Your SUSE11.1 review is really a conandrum of mixed messages. You point out all the myriad of bugs with the release (and there are MANY!), yet in conclusion you say its the "best so far". I take it that your opinion then of SUSE is pretty low on the bar, because 11.1 leaves alot to be desired, and it most certainly is the weakest release of the big three - Ubuntu, Fedora, SUSE. Perhaps the KDE4.1.3 version is what you refer to, but you cant really credit SUSE for what the KDE project does, now can you? That would be really unethical, even if some of the contributions to it came from Novell.
Not really sure what the anti-Ubuntu comments are about above, because there is nothing here to warrant comments about that distro in this weeks DW. Please take your seething envy elsewhere, for now.
What the heck got the Sabayon rants going here Michele? drizake is entitled to his opinions, as are you. Anyway, it is true that by just looking at a youtube video of Sabayon, all you see is what can be done on any distro. Perhaps video's need to be posted displaying some unique attributes (like Entropy) and what advantages it gives over others. Sabayon is about as bleeding edge as it comes though, and not much quality support was built into releases so I moved on to bigger and better - Fedora and Ubuntu - but I really do hope Fabio can turn things around in the quality and stability department.
34 • Re: First look at openSUSE 11.1 (by Anonymous on 2008-12-22 15:31:42 GMT from Germany)
> (1) Fedora 10 seems to have done a better job with KDE 4, if for no other reason, more of the desktop's features are available
What desktop features are you talking about? openSUSE has more patches and backports than Fedora.
> (3) There's no Krusader (file manager) in YaST? I missed it if so.
Krusader is available in the repositories: http://software.opensuse.org/search?baseproject=openSUSE%3A11.1&p=1&q=krusader
> (4) Customizing software package installation at setup was tedious, and like the partition view, did not give you a single view of what you were installing
"Installation summary" view?
35 • @ 28 phoronix testing / performance (by Norbert Blenkinsop on 2008-12-22 15:38:02 GMT from United Kingdom)
I've been surprised at some of the benchmarks at Phoronix.
Their Bench Suite seems to suggest that Ubuntu (oops I said the U word) is quite a nippy distro (though they also note that is seems to have got slower of late), and some of the tests seem to indicate its nippier than Mandriva in some areas which surprised me.
Doesnt feel that way in general use.
My impression of OpenSuse has always been that it feels a bit laggy - in general use, and on the relatively limited experience I have of OpenSuse testing, I never seemed to achieve good network throughput, and there was always some DNS lag - both of which which I never truly figured out.
Certainly updating sofware through Yast (not cli zypper) seemed slow, but still not so painful as Fedora's package manager (not cli Yum).
Much is made of this
But really, how often do (should) a user realistically be installing software, in real day to day productive usage? Once the setup is done surely, its pretty much done - bar occasional update, and occasional interest in trying some new app?
Anyhoo, interesting review, enough to persuade me to give it another shot when I have some spare drive space.
36 • @33 (by Anonymous on 2008-12-22 15:42:43 GMT from United Kingdom)
"Not really sure what the anti-Ubuntu comments are about above,"
I cant see _ any _?!
37 • LOL @ "seething envy" (by Serpent on 2008-12-22 15:43:15 GMT from United States)
Yeah you wish it was envy. Having used that not worthy-to be named bloated, slow and dysfunctional distro since '04 and having used most everything on the top 50 here I only have pity for it and the good distros it could drag down when it finally plummets into the sink hole of incompetence and hypocrisy it's created for itself.
Don't want to hear it criticized? Don't bring it up.
38 • suse 11.1 (by jack on 2008-12-22 15:51:28 GMT from Canada)
Fantastic review and also fantastically depressing to this member of the "great unwashed"
39 • RE: 37, Yes, you are full of laughs. (by Eddie Wilson on 2008-12-22 16:06:15 GMT from United States)
From reading the comments it looks you are just wanting to troll about something you don't really know about. Or something you can't prove you know anything about. Why do you want to pick fights for? Your opinion is just that, your own opinion. I've tried several top distros that I felt were a lot worst, but I can't prove it. So opinions are really worthless, just like yours.
40 • Comments balancing the review (by Miq on 2008-12-22 16:16:52 GMT from Sweden)
Anywho, thanks you guys who have brought up some issues with suse not mentioned in the article. Suse 11.1 is one of the Ds I'm going to try in my next round of installations and I since I appreciate as much information in advance as possible I have enjoyed the comments. There's some good info going on here.
That said, in a league of their own: Davemc (#33), Serpent (37) and Eddie Wilson (39) O.o "Birds of a feather"...
41 • #38 (by jack on 2008-12-22 16:24:59 GMT from Canada)
I accidently hit the wrong key and cut myself off!
It is depressing because Chris Smart knows a lot more about Linux than I do; and even he admitted to being confused a number of times.
It has been said on many forums and many times that the way to evaluate "user friendly" is to sit a group of inexperienced people in front of computers and not only log their keystrokes but also observe their behavior.
It is even more depressing to realize that the Linux companies aiming at the commercial market will never do this as it is not necessary . Their customers will have "maintenance" contracts to take care of all the esoteric aspects; like installation,'Directory Index Feature'.'Ordered journaling, etc.
42 • openSUSE 11.1 (by capricornus on 2008-12-22 16:27:05 GMT from Belgium)
I read the above comments very well and still dared to start with it. I gave up. The green monster does recognize Win and Mint, but does not recognize PCLOS. And the whole boot and grub thing could be very well very "gründlich" but that's it for me, I like my Drake's to be recognized, just as I like the TinyMeDrake to recognize all the others. Neither the green nor the tiny drake will find a place in my pc-garden.
43 • #42: TinyMe (by KDulcimer on 2008-12-22 16:47:06 GMT from United States)
Just so you know, TinyMe 2009.0 should have the ability to auto-detect other Linux distributions installed to your hard drive.
44 • Still as Enlightening as Ever Chis (by burdicda on 2008-12-22 16:47:52 GMT from United States)
The rainbow of loyalties and lightning flashes in defense of different distros is what makes DW so exciting....
I've run as my main distro at times Redhat, Mandrake, Mint, all the *buntu's, Mepis, and at times have been a fanboy to all working out bugs and rescuing
my share of lost children, I currently run Lenny/testing as it is very exciting while
not endangering as it has been in the past. Along with Slashdot, it would not be
a day in the life without frequenting Distrowatch several times a day. Thank you
to the editors and contributer's that make it what it is...and Hope to see everyone
after the holidays...
45 • Bloated mess (by Todd R. at 2008-12-22 16:56:01 GMT from United States)
Sabayon (or "Sabayawn" LOL) is going the wrong direction, imo. Less functionality and more bloat.
Real pretty though.
46 • Getting excited about three distros who aren't in the news very much (by Brian Masinick on 2008-12-22 17:13:42 GMT from United States)
There are three Debian based distributions that have become my favorites: sidux, antiX, and SimplyMEPIS. I've enjoyed MEPIS since May 2003, and I've used every release since then, and nearly every test release in between. It is consistently a reliable, easy to use, yet easily extended desktop system. I find it to be very stable, but what particularly impresses me is the product quality of even the test builds. Though not everything works in the very first test release for a version, the installation is always sold and a lot of stuff does work perfectly. By the end of the testing cycle, everything is so stable that I've found it usable, even as an every day desktop system. SimplyMEPIS 8.0 is awesome, even before it has been released. I am using Beta 6 and it is just as stable for me, even more so, than 95% of other systems, regardless of their type or version. I highly recommend it. Check http://www.mepis.org/node/1462 for locations where you can grab a copy.
Another MEPIS community developed distribution, antiX, is nearly as stable as MEPIS, but it does go for more current software and replaces KDE on the desk with a choice of IceWM or Fluxbox, both window managers instead of a desktop manager. antiX also replaces a number of heavy applications with smaller, faster equivalents and this works out very well. The antiX M8.0 community test release 1 was released today, and I recommend that people take a look at it, You can find it at http://antix.freeforums.org/antix-m8-public-test1-iso-available-t1299.html if you are interested in trying it out.
Finally, my cutting edge system of choice on the desktop is sidux, and this project is also evaluating their final release of the year - sidux 2998-04 Preview 1. You can read about it at http://www.sidux.com/module-News.html
and download it at http://www.sidux.com/Article303.html.
47 • disappointed again (by Janttu on 2008-12-22 17:23:14 GMT from Finland)
Thanks for great DWW again. I was eager to see this review of Opensuse. I have mixed feelings about this review and this release too. Quick note - Please check XFCE desktop too.
I installed KDE4, and it is still pretty awfull. Not ready, and perhaps, not much use even after it finally is. I saved my installation by installing XFCE-desktop on top of it, and this I like very much. Quick, responsive, logical, and pretty too... nice. Check it! Suse team has done great job here.
48 • Re #40 Miq (by Glenn on 2008-12-22 17:23:50 GMT from Canada)
Dave mentioned above in comment #30 to be careful of the Installer wiping out another installed Distro..
I agree with Daves comment that Opensuse has a very sloppy installer/partitioner. It wiped one of my Linux partitions out.
It seems Dave was lucky this time but I was not.
(I have a Thinkpad T60 with several partitions).
I had to use Supergrub to fix my MBR and so I gave up on Opensuse 11.1 for now because I have to time to play with it.
To be fair, I also had LinuxMint give me similar problems on my thinkpad with installation. It did not install grub in the root partition and it totally blew up the MBR when I directed it to install there.
I suggest you keep your SystemRescue and SuperGrub CD's handy.
I had no problems with Fedora, Mandriva or Mepis. They all loaded and ran with no apparent problems.
Good luck and have fun
49 • @21: Gentoo is already dead. (by jasd on 2008-12-22 18:17:02 GMT from France)
It is always "funny" to see people telling that distros they dislike are going to die. Is Debian dying because Lenny is not ready? I'm sure you can use what is going to be Squeeze already. Gentoo is dying because 2007.1 was aborted and 2008.0 was too late or maybe the lack of a "nice/modern" installer like Sabayon's Red Hat's Anaconda. You can install Gentoo with almost any kind of live-CD that have networking built-in (you install today: you'll have your own pre-2009.0 Gentoo-based distribution release). Are *BSD, Arch or Slackware easier or harder to install... because they also lack a GUI intaller (like many others OSes) are they dying too?. "Portage takes time to compile"... why do source-based (Sorcery-based, CRUX also) distro exist? because some mature people want programs that follow their needs and there are many ways to reduce compilation time. Nobody complains about ports in FreeBSD!? When people want software built with no time, they install a BINARY distro (there are some). All my machines are "Vista-INcapable" and are fully usable under Gentoo even with video playback and an emerge world launched in the background... strange?. BTW thank you... now I know that's Gentoo that makes me feel 20 years younger :D
50 • Re #48 (by Miq on 2008-12-22 18:39:35 GMT from Sweden)
I have much experience with Mandriva, but it is time to evaluate if other Ds won't be better for me. Fedora 10 is definitely on the try list, together with Sidux and Mint6 when the KDE version is released. I've also slated Pardus, MEPIS, PCLOS and Sabayon for testing. All these have developed quite far and it is time to re-evaluate them. Last time I tried 20 distros and Mandriva struck the all-round best balance between up-to-date and stability, but it feels like Suse 11.1 might have found the sweet spot this time (unless it is too laggy and if the 3D will work, that is)
I appreciate your suggestions, and will keep a systemrescue close by - always good advice :)
51 • Beware Gentoo Users of Pending openrc update (by Anonymous on 2008-12-22 19:37:45 GMT from United States)
They've updated openrc again and things are not going well. Don't automatically allow updates this holiday season or you may FUBAR that wonderful workstation you've been wanting to show off to the relatives.
This is a political move initiated by parties close to the project. This is an application that will tie you to Gentoo unless you do a format and go. The application change is not necessary and many people are complaining about longer boot times and applications hung starting, waiting for the timeout if your drives mount at all.
IF YOU ALLOW THIS TO HAPPEN YOU WILL HAVE TO CHANGE YOUR NETWORK SETTINGS.
52 • Zenwalk & Wolfix (by Verndog on 2008-12-22 19:43:23 GMT from United States)
Last week someone mentioned both Zenwalk and Wolfix. I download and tried to install both.
Zenwalk was successful, Wolfix was not. It booted up fine in livecd. Interesing is that Zenwalk uses the same boot info, namely:
I'm quite impressed with Zenwalk, except the area of networking. I can't get it to find my nic card. I've tried all the know commands:
lspci -v, to find the hardware, ifconfig whatever to get it started. Nothing works.
NOW, with that in mind, it work on the orginal install.I used partedmagic to image the partition. When I brought it over to another computer, I got a kernel panic. That was fixed with "root=", also fstab and map to point to new and different partition. So I know network can work. Some config, ini file somewhere, I suppose.
53 • #52: Suggestions (by Caitlyn Martin on 2008-12-22 20:00:40 GMT from United States)
Regarding Zenwalk, you can try using netconfig from the command line for configuring your NIC. You have to run it as root. That should work.
What error did you receive with the Wolvix installer? Perhaps I can help with that as well.
BTW, Linux doesn't generally have .ini files. That's a Windows thing.
54 • Christmas Presents!! (by JAG on 2008-12-22 20:55:39 GMT from United States)
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to everyone!!
Here are some Puppy links:
Here is the forum
For those who enjoy traditional Christmas music
55 • Christmas Presents!! (by JAG on 2008-12-22 20:57:16 GMT from United States)
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to everyone!!
!! Proceed with caution... you may not like what follows.!!
Some more for you!!
Bonus audio links!!
If you can handle being challenged; I recommend the Open Forum link.
56 • Boycott yourself (by Anonymous hater at 2008-12-22 20:58:03 GMT from Canada)
>Clearly, all the anti-Novell trolls will be out in force for this DWW. Don't feed them!
This won't happen. The guys who dared to speak against Novell have been banned from entering this website. However the hate still exists and for good reason.
57 • Christmas came a week early for openSUSE users! (by Objective Review on 2008-12-22 21:06:47 GMT from Australia)
24 Hours with openSUSE 11.1
Christmas came a week early for openSUSE users!
Back in June I blogged about my first experiences with openSUSE 11.0. Although there were some groundbreaking improvements, the general tenor of my experience was negative. I did eventually move to 11.0, as I saw improvements appear from the community (such as a recipe for making Firefox3 use the system's Cairo library, thus enabling subpixel hinting.) I also suggested that 11.1 would fix all major issues introduced in 11.0, but not add any substantially new features. I stand corrected: 11.1 does fix the issues I whined about, but does also, amazingly, incorporate quite a bit of 'newness'.
58 • One Linux to Rule Them All? (by Only The Deserving! on 2008-12-22 21:18:04 GMT from Australia)
One Linux to Rule Them All? - techradar.com has an interesting interview with Jeremy Allison, leader of the Samba project. Of interest is Allison’s assertion that Ubuntu, thanks to its unparalleled popularity and huge user base, has the strongest chance to take Linux mainstream. Author Christopher Tozzi, agrees. Ubuntu is making significant progress where other distributions have failed for ten years: namely, consolidating the resources of the free-software community into a single Linux distribution that has enough users and developers to present itself to those outside the IT world as the pre-eminent representative of the Linux community. Ubuntu has managed to make itself almost synonymous with Linux, at least for non-techies. Simplification, is what Linux needs if it aspires to take over the desktops of the world. Ubuntu’s dominance doesn’t mean that other distributions can’t exist or should become irrelevant, but there needs to be one distribution that mainstream users can directly and easily associate with Linux. Ubuntu may well prove to be that distribution. http://www.WorksWithU.com/2008/12/15/one-linux-to-rule-them-all/
Food for thought: What exactly do Ubuntu developers do in Linux development that makes them "pre-emeinent"???
59 • @ Michele from Italy (by Anonymous Penguin on 2008-12-22 21:31:53 GMT from Italy)
Michele, stop insulting you fellow Linux users, you make me feel ashamed that we are fellow Italians (although I feel more British than Italian).
I don't even know why your posts don't get deleted. You don't tell people to RTFM (and nobody believes it is meant like "read the fine manual"). And you can't tell people that they don't know what they are talking about, just because they happen to disagree with you.
Besides I tend to agree with them: Gentoo is a dying distro: who wants to compile from source nowadays? Virtually all the Linux users I know here used Gentoo 4 years ago, but now they have moved to Ubuntu. Not that I agree with their choice, but that is another matter.
60 • @ Michele from Italy (by Anonymous Penguin on 2008-12-22 21:31:53 GMT from Italy (by FreeBSD User on 2008-12-22 21:43:10 GMT from United States)
Reply to "59"
>Besides I tend to agree with them: Gentoo is a dying distro: who >wants to compile from source nowadays?
I don't know about Gentoo but I know something about compiling from source. Why not?? I don't install OS everyday and I dont compail each "new" version everyday. I didn't touch my FreeBSD more than year (just security update) and I am working on te computer eveeryday...
61 • OpenSUSE 11.1 (by Ray on 2008-12-22 22:07:19 GMT from United States)
OpenSUSE is not ready for a Stable Release it is not ready for a usable system. If it were Debian it would be SID (Still In development). That's why Debian is so stable.
62 • #53 - thanks - Suse Xmas (by Verndog on 2008-12-22 22:11:19 GMT from United States)
Thanks. that's one command I haven't used, oddly enough. Wolfix had some FS issue. It's also Slack based and with the same type /boot files. Zenwalk booted find. Yes, I know about the ini files, I was just throwing in every thing I could think of. Another thing is googling around I found only wireless config for Zenwalk. I tried several different working for google nothing showed up. I'll try "netconfig". But ifconfig eth0 up failed and even ifconfig only showed the loop.
I don't or haven't used Suse in years but this weeks DWW was a fine read. Thanks for the varied and mix reviews. It's nice to read a broad range of topics.
63 • @52 Verndog / Wolvix (by DeniZen on 2008-12-22 22:16:31 GMT from United Kingdom)
Verndog, shame Wolvix didnt work out for you - I'm sure if you like Zenwalk, you would love Wolvix, though, as Caitlyn already pointed out last week, its overdue for an update (but still nowhere near 'out-of-date')
Worth pursuing, I'd take up that offer of assistance.
In the meantime, and if yo uhave not given up on it -
Well, OK the Wolvix installer -is- a little different.
(Originally based on the Morphix installer I'd wager)
If you have not already set up your Linux partition(s) and swap, then you will almost certainly have to click the button to run the Gparted util on the installer screen. You may well have done so!, but its not that obvious, and so I thought I'd mention.
You will also need to know that the root password on the Live CD is ' toor ' in order to install.
After HD install, you can change root passwd in the Wolvix Control centre (and add yourself as an user).
My apols to all if this post not best suited to a general discussion forum!
64 • @58 One to rule them all (by DeniZen on 2008-12-22 22:42:45 GMT from United Kingdom)
I'd guess, for 'domestic' use, then if there was 'one Distro' that could challenge for the 'breakthrough' it would likely be Ubuntu.
All the thrashing about and frothing with rage that _may_ accompany such an 'heretic, outrageous proposition' ( :) ) would/will not change that strong possibility.
Personally, though not an Ubuntu user (though I like it), I dont think its a bad thing, though clearly for some, the ubiquity (pun intended) and popularity of Ubuntu is already becoming something to spit at.
Of late, 'comparisons' with Microsoft's offerings even.
it seems to me, in my (perhaps) simplistic view that many 'Linux' users want the impossible.
i.e. For greater recognition of 'Linux'.
For 'Linux' to remain a dark, clever, edgy, left-field, eternally alternative choice.
It sometimes seems that no 'populist' Distro's could actually be tolerated!?
'Popular Distro'... is that almost an oxymoron I wonder.
Best flatten our HD's and start burning disks from the offerings at the bottom of the DW rankings list eh? ;) Actually, i see theres a few perfectly good flavours hanging about down there .. :)
65 • #62 Verndog: If ifconfig is only showing loopback.... (by Caitlyn Martin on 2008-12-22 22:43:38 GMT from United States)
Verndog: If ifconfig is only showing loopback that means the kernel module for your NIC isn't being loaded. No configuration program will work. Do you know what type of NIC you have? If this was a help forum I'd be asking for lspci output as well. If you don't know what sort of NIC you have I'd suggest taking this over to the Zenwalk forum. They will help you there.
Did the filesystem issue with Wolvix happen after installing Zenwalk? If so I have a very large clue about what happened.
#63: The Wolvix installer is based on the Damn Small Linux installer, actually.
66 • No subject (by Chris on 2008-12-22 22:56:28 GMT from Australia)
Hi everyone, thanks for your patience with my new role as editor. It's a lot of work to put DWW together and also write a review! I can't cover every thing, but I try to make it well rounded :-)
Hi Carl, it's positive because the overall experience with this version was solid. The issues I did face I did not consider major - I did not expect the webcam to work because it uses an external driver (spca) and I don't ever remember it working out of the box on any other distro. The hovering issue in OpenOffice.org seemed to correct itself after a few tries, but the rest of the office suite was very stable and performed very well. It crashed when throwing up an error about Java, but if you did what the error said (set a jvm in settings) then the problem shouldn't exist anymore. Not great that it crashed, I admit, but not a show stopper in my opinion. As for the iPod, I did expect this to work (especially as openSUSE were touting support for it in banshee). This morning I zero'd my whole iPod and re-created a partition on it but now I can't mount it. Sometimes when I plug it in it doesn't seem to be detected, so it might just be that it's on the blink. Perhaps another user with an iPod could test it and report back? Still, it didn't work when first plugged in and that's a shame. Even so, to me it's not a showstopper.
@28 Dear Anonymous, this version of openSUSE did feel faster than previous releases. Of course I have no figures to back this up, just my general perception of the system's responsiveness. There are many things you can do to increase performance - turn OFF beagle for example, mount your partitions with the 'noatime' option, etc. I do think 11.1 is worth the upgrade, especially if you use KDE 4.
Dear everyone else,
The comments left have given me an idea for an article in the future, comparing how different distributions handle all these things that people talk about.
So, I want to ask you all:
What do you expect a Linux distribution to be able to do out of the box?
67 • @65 (by Anonymous on 2008-12-22 23:14:20 GMT from United Kingdom)
"The Wolvix installer is based on the Damn Small Linux installer, actually."
Aha Ok, I guess I remembered the old Morphix installer for (a plethora of ) Morphix/Slack derivatives looking/feeling similar!
From my one and only foray into DSL, I thought I recall the installer being a command line script 'Y / N' affair. So I guess Wolvix's installer is a front-end for all that.
Damn Good Job in that case.
68 • ^^ Doh! - that was me^^ (by DeniZen again on 2008-12-22 23:16:29 GMT from United Kingdom)
It's late ;)
69 • @66 Chris (by KaffeineAddict on 2008-12-22 23:19:41 GMT from Australia)
Chris wrote: "So, I want to ask you all:
What do you expect a Linux distribution to be able to do out of the box?"
A decent short black while I'm up late at night just messing with the Linux box!
70 • 58 "One Linux to Rule Them All" (by Miq on 2008-12-22 23:24:18 GMT from Sweden)
That article was not exactly the finest piece of journalism ever written. It was discussed iat /. as well for those interested.
Anyway, If Linux was consolidated into a single distro that would be a very, very bad thing. Linux thrives on multiplicity, it is was generates such a plenitude of solutions, ideas and alternatives. Have one single distro and you'll introduce politics, agendas and all the bad things about MacOS and Windows.
Again, the equating of Linux with Ubuntu is to the detriment of all of Linuxdom, for many reasons.
71 • @ 66 / Chris (by Anonymous on 2008-12-22 23:24:57 GMT from United Kingdom)
"What do you expect a Linux distribution to be able to do out of the box"
Everything Ubuntu does, err.. without being .. Ubuntu ;)
More seriously, for me, just run swiftly and be very very stable, with the option to make it an all-singing-all dancing Multimedia extravaganza - IF required- without pulling hair out, and without having to spend days fiddling / compiling.
Debian in other words (for me).
Mint seems a damn good benchmark for out of the box experience from what I have seen (one of the guys at work has it running) All easy - everything seems to work from the outset with no sweat. Impressive!
72 • @65.. and Caitlyn in general (by KaffeineAddict on 2008-12-22 23:34:52 GMT from Australia)
1. Is there location on the VectorLinux website that displays the available applications? I've followed the repository link but then one has to wade through the directory structures to find anything. I'm thinking of something like Zenwalk and Debian (and others) have.
2. Regarding VectorLinux and the applications that are offered - can the builds/scripts at SlackBuild.org be used? Can one add Slacky.eu repo to the slaptget in Vector to pull in some of those apps?
I do like Vector (have tried VL 6 Beta 2 it in a VM) but just wondering if any apps I need (like d4x) can be pulled in from other slacwarek-derivative sites?
73 • @66 (by Vukota on 2008-12-22 23:38:50 GMT from United States)
"What do you expect a Linux distribution to be able to do out of the box"
It is not a problem what would you expect it to do OOTB, but how fast and easy you can get it to the "expected" state.
There are lot of similar distributions with similar OOTB features, but they are different in
2) Number of additional packages
5) Easy of use
6) Speed/easy of getting updates
74 • @73 (by Vukota on 2008-12-22 23:50:12 GMT from United States)
Just to add one more point to the list (should be first)
8) Supported hardware
75 • openSUSE 11.1 review (by Fox on 2008-12-22 23:53:03 GMT from Canada)
Thanks for the interesting review of openSUSE 11.1. I've been sitting on the fence about whether I should install it on my PowerBook G4, but your note about changing the shade of the desktop picture with the time of day is pushing me towards doing this. I noticed this in 11.0 on my PowerBook, but not on my Intel mini run with VirtualBox. I think this is very classy, but assumed it was a laptop-specific feature that may or may not be in the next version. Although I tend to like Debian-based distros best, openSUSE is much more professional looking, and I've taken to copying some of its elements onto Ubuntu and Debian Lenny to improve their appearance.
My one big gripe about openSUSE - I can't get my favourite music player (Rhythmbox) to play mp4's no matter what codecs I install. Same with Banshee, but Amorok does it with no problem, even in Gnome.
76 • @ 70 (by DeniZen again, again on 2008-12-22 23:59:19 GMT from United Kingdom)
"Have one single distro and you'll introduce politics, agendas and.."
Imagine that. Politics. Agenda's ..
Good job we have so much choice and thus so little of all that ..
Miq - you dont have an agenda - or agenda(s) then?
77 • How many Ubuntu derivitives are there? (by Chris on 2008-12-23 00:11:51 GMT from United States)
It seems like every day a new Ubuntu based distribution pops up. Most of the time, these seem to offer little more than an alternative theme or desktop environment; relying on Ubuntu's own packages and repositories. Sure some Ubuntu based distribution have actually forked and offer substantial advantages over the parent (i.e., Linux Mint.) At some point people need to realize that all the purely copycat "distributions" are just that and little more than Ubuntu wearing new clothes. I wish Distrowatch would group all of these types of releases under Ubuntu's umbrella rather than giving them the distinction of being recognized as a true distribution. Heck, anyone remaster Ubuntu; redesign its icons and theming and call it a new OS. Would that really be considered a new distribution? I think not. It takes a lot of hard work, blood sweat and tears to create a viable distribution. While many may consider imitation to be the sincerest form of flattery I think it detracts from Ubuntu that so many opportunists get a free ride on its coat tails.
78 • openSUSE 11.1 (by Bill on 2008-12-23 00:36:07 GMT from Canada)
I was excited to try the new openSUSE but it failed me. This is the last distro of all the majors that still doesn't reconize that I don't have raid enabled even though my board (ASUS P5B-E) supports it. So I unplugged all my drives except the one to install on.The dvd and live cd both gave me partitioning error -3030. Tried all the nodmraid and all-generic kernel commands at boot but nothing helped.
Maybe the next series from them
79 • Ubuntu=Big Ego with small development infrastructure (by Mr X on 2008-12-23 00:56:24 GMT from Australia)
....and on my hardware 8.10 (live-cd) is the first edition in a long time that works with the Intel 915GM graphics card, thanks to upstream Xorg finally fixing up all the regressions they introduced with their 'intel' driver. Fedora (Gnome) and openSUSE have always worked because their developers had fixes for this problem and for this reason will always have more respect from me than Ubuntu.
When one wants/needs to use inode 128 size, for various reasons, in my case because Acronis True Image 11 (or prior versions) has issues with the new default inode 256 size and backups become problematic, it becomes tricky to achieve in Ubuntu but is relatively simple with openSUSE, Fedora and Mandriva. Ubuntu desktop live-cds/dvds do not allow installs without formatting, and you don't get the option to choose an inode size prior the partition formatting, whereas Fedora, Mandriva and Suse allow the option to install on pre-formatted partitions. The Yast partitioner in Suse also allows the option to choose inode size prior to formatting, and this scores big points in my book! The Ubuntu workaround is to know that the "alternate" cds allow an install on pre-formatted partitions and to use those instead of the desktop isos.
Lastly, IMHO, Ubuntu lacks a decent gui services and firewall control application in comparison to Fedora, Suse (Yast) and Mandriva (MCC).
80 • No subject (by Anonymous on 2008-12-23 01:07:13 GMT from Greece)
Acronis True Image 11?
Is that available in linux?
81 • Zenwalk & WhereWolf :) (by Verndog on 2008-12-23 01:10:07 GMT from United States)
I fixed Zenwalk with one command, if you can believe that!
The command: "xnetconf" , so stupidly simple.
Regarding Wolfix. It installed ok. Everything appears in its place. It fails upon boot. Something to do with the FS. Since both are Slackware based, my thinking is if I can get Zenwalk to work why not Wolf. Grub doesn't like the files in the /boot directory. The install finished to completion, but that obviously doesn't mean it works, which it doesn't. I found an esoteric post somewhere from the guy who create the Wolfix hard drive installer and followed his recommendation to the letter. Still a no-go.
I'll have to reboot Wolf again to refresh my memory on the exact failure.
Many thanks to Caitlyn and DeniZen for your help. I think it was DenniZen that gave a fine review of his old laptop and the Linux pursuit.
82 • RE: 56 Boycott yourself (by ladislav on 2008-12-23 01:20:39 GMT from Taiwan)
You were not banned because you spoke against Novell, you were banned because you repeated the same thing week after week after week, sometimes several times a week. For the record, I agree with you - Novell was wrong to sign the patent protection deal with Microsoft. But I find your way of attacking Novell and openSUSE at every opportunity in this forum annoying.
83 • The funny thing, despite so many "buntus" (by sertse on 2008-12-23 01:31:20 GMT from Australia)
See http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1017837 . He's lookingfor a debian based kde 4 distro, other than kubuntu.
Despite our comments about having 10000000000 "buntu's" etc, we can't even satisfy such a simple question. You'll thought they'll be aleast one, other than Kubuntu, but nope. It made be chuckle.
84 • #81 Wolfix or Wolvix? (by anticapitalista on 2008-12-23 01:31:35 GMT from Greece)
Verndog, enjoy WolVVVVVVVVVVVVV (not FFFFFF) ix. It is a fine distro.
Wolvix is great, Wolfix is s@#$
85 • #83 (by anticapitalista on 2008-12-23 01:40:03 GMT from Greece)
... and the correct answer is a MEPIS remaster!
86 • @66 "out-of-box" (by digger on 2008-12-23 02:03:24 GMT from United States)
Want, in order of importance:
1) connect to internet (absolute minimum)
2) good cli package tools (apt-get, je t'aime!)
3) sound doesn't need twiddling
Don't wan, in order of importancet:
87 • Re 80 (by Mr X on 2008-12-23 02:21:55 GMT from Australia)
Is that available in linux?
I am not sure, but it uses a Linux environment in the rescue cd mode and works great in backing up and restoring Linux (inode 128) partitions.
I dual boot with XP and Linux and have never installed Acronis but have used the rescue cd mode for over 3yrs with great ease and satisfaction. Another good thing about Acronis is that it allows restoration to a different size partition (i.e. allows partition resizing at same time as restoration).
NB: Acronis will backup inode 256 size partitions, but only in sector by sector mode, i.e. the backup image will equal the size of your Linux partition being backed up.
88 • Gentoo (by Oscar on 2008-12-23 02:52:30 GMT from United States)
Forget Gentoo you people. They are toast. If you don't change with the times, you get left behind.
89 • Acronis Ref#87 (by Verndog on 2008-12-23 03:03:01 GMT from United States)
That's why I gave up Acronis and started using Parted Magic / or Clonezilla, which uses partimage. Acronis doesn't support 256 byte inodes, and almost all newer distros use that method. The sector by sector cloning takes way to much time.
I miss Acronis and the way you can auto resize the destination partition.
Using partimage, if I want to install to a smaller partition I have to either gparted the partition before imaging or increase the partition I want to use.
90 • No subject (by Anonymous on 2008-12-23 03:20:27 GMT from Canada)
Ladislav, you have been very patient with me. I can't complain. But it's simply not true that I attacked Novell and Suse week after week lately. I did attack them repeatedly in the beginning. But after the first warning I took it easy. For example when you banned me from entering distrowatch I hadn't attacked Suse for two months if I remember well. As for attacking Novell at every opportunity, well, the opportunities are provided by Novell itself. It is not true that I repeated the same thing week after week at the time when you banned me. I spoke about a new thing for the first time then. If I am not mistaken, when you banned me I spoke about how Novell attacked RedHat by offering discounts to RedHat users who switched to Suse. I know business is business but it never happened before that a Linux distro attacked another Linux distro like this. Before, Linux distros tried to lure Windows or Unix customers with discounts and other incentives. But Novell directly attacked their Linux brother. This is a new low, this is something unheard of before. To me Novell's business practices seem to get closer and closer to Microsoft's practices. I know you don't like the patents deal and I understand your decision to not take sides even if I wish were on a certain side :)
91 • Ubuntu earned the #1 (by Duhnonymous on 2008-12-23 03:54:37 GMT from United States)
People really have to bend over backwards to find things to dislike about Ubuntu. No "decent" services or firewall GUI app? First of all, who really needs a GUI? Secondly, just how much do you need before you call the app "decent"? The apps they do have are plenty for my purposes, and who cares if it doesn't have all the features of Fedora or Suse's apps?
Like it or not, Ubuntu delivers and updates on a regular basis in the most reasonable way possible for most people's desktop needs.
92 • openSUSE 11.1 (by DistroMon on 2008-12-23 03:56:00 GMT from United States)
Check your user permissions. None of them are set up in new OS 11.1
I had problems when it did not detect my CD/DVD drives.
93 • Re Acronis does not support inode 256 size (by Mr X on 2008-12-23 03:59:05 GMT from Australia)
>>>89 • Acronis (by Verndog)<<<
I just checked out the Acronis website and they have a TI 2009 version out (plus there is a July 2008 update for TI 11). I would be surprised if TI 2009, at minimum, did not support inode 256 size. I will at some stage try the update (or find out) and see if it supports inode 256, but for now I will sticks with what works for me.
I have had some bad experiences using/mixing different partitioning tools on the same hdd and am reluctant to try it again. I have several times wiped out my extended partitions that were partitioned with one software (e.g. Partition Magic) and resized by another (Paragon PM or Ubuntu/GParted PM). I have a new HDD on my laptop and it was fully partitioned with Acronis Disk Director Suite 10, I will not be risking wiping out my data by using different partition tools.
94 • Re: # 90 (by johncoom on 2008-12-23 04:25:55 GMT from Australia)
Things like one distro attacking another etc. Plus what one may consider as unscrupulous behavior ?
Expect it to get WORSE not better, because the world, especially the western world is a "rat race" :-(
This sort of behavior fuels even worse behavior in the name of Money rules, and "I can out do you".
What can you or I can do about it ? Nothing it seems ? so there is no point in letting it "wind you up" !
95 • openSUSE 11.1 Sound Issue (by Gary on 2008-12-23 05:23:02 GMT from United States)
I'm not sure if it's PulseAudio, but when I installed 11.1 the sound was weak and crackling. My sound card is supported in every distribution I've tried (Envy24 engine), so I was surprised. And to almost think 11.1 might have made me switch from my old faithful distro Linux Mint (which is top notch anyway). Oh well, maybe 11.2 with KDE 4.2 will do the trick.
96 • nixos (by techqc on 2008-12-23 05:38:58 GMT from Indonesia)
Just noticed this NIXOS thing, sounds like it needs investigation.
The crux of the issue is ending the rpm-vs-apt noise and putting all the evangelistas that participate in that particular sideshow out of a job.
Perhaps someone here has used this?
97 • #72: Vector Linux packages, repos, etc... (by Caitlyn Martin on 2008-12-23 06:05:38 GMT from United States)
Vector Linux is Slackware compatible. It does use a different package format (lzma compressed) and different pkgtools (from the Tukaani project) but it can accept vanilla Slack .tgz packages as well. Can you use Slackbuilds? Sure, but the result won't be the same as a Vector package in that the minimum architecture will be 486 rather than 586, it won't do dependency checking, etc... Vector Linux has a graphical tool to make building genuine Vector packages from source pretty darned easy. It's called vpackager. I'd try that before resorting to Slackbuilds. It also can use CRUX ports, BTW, and turn them into Vector Packages, which is another excellent solution.
D4X should be in the Vector Linux repository. It was for 5.9. If it's missing for 6.0 drop a note in the Package Requests forum. You may be surprised how quickly a genuine VL package appears :)
Regarding slacky.eu, yes, you can add it, but that will create a lot of duplication, some conflicts, and is about guaranteed to break your dependency checking. It will also create false alerts for gslapt-notifier. So... I don't recommend adding it to your repo list. Downloading and installing the odd package from slacky is one thing and it's a reasonable thing to do. Fouling up all the automated package handling by adding external repos isn't.
Sadly Vector Linux does NOT have a package browser. There is a packages.txt file in the repo just like Slackware but no GUI tool for that. My usual way around that is to launch gslapt (the GUI package manager) and either do sorts or searches. I do my package management at the command line with slapt-get so pretty much all I use gslapt for is browsing the repos :)
Please remember that 6.0 hasn't released yet and the repo is still being built. It's probably the biggest pre-elease repo VL has ever had but it's nothing compared to what the repo should look like in a month or two.
I hope this helps. BTW, I think you'll find that rc1 is a lot nicer than beta2, both in terms of additional features and bugs fixed.
98 • Derivatives (Ubuntu and other...) (by Caitlyn Martin on 2008-12-23 06:23:45 GMT from United States)
With very few notable exceptions every distro started out as an offshoot of one of three major distros: Debian, Red Hat, or Slackware. The most popular distros I can think of that were truly from scratch are Puppy Linux and Pardus. Everything else traces back to one of the three. For those of you who haven't been around Linux for 15 years or so here are some of the derivations...
SUSE was originally a Slackware derivative. It's nothing like Slackware nowadays but that it how it started off.
Mandriva was formed by the merger of Mandrake and Connectiva, both of which were originally Red Hat derivatives. Yes, that means PCLinuxOS traces it's roots back to Red Hat as well.
Mint is an Ubuntu derivative. Ubuntu is a Debian derivative. So is Knoppix and so are all the live CD distros which derived from Knoppix, including Damn Small Linux.
Slackware is the one and only surviving derivative of SLS, which is long dead.
Slackware is probably second to Debian in number of derivatives even though none are in the DW top 10. Slackware derivatives from A (Austrumi) to Z (Zenwalk) include SaxenOS, g: (formerly GoblinX), Wolvix, Absolute Linux, Vector Linux, Nonux, Slax, Ultima Linux, NimbleX, and Easys. Slax and Vector have spawned their own derivatives (AliXe is a derivative of Slax and Supergamer is a derivative of Vector). Wolvix started out as a Slax derivative but now uses Slackware as it's code base. This is a VERY incomplete list of Slackware offshoots.
Why do I post this? Just because a distro is an Ubuntu derivative or a Red Hat derivative or whatever doesn't mean it doesn't have value. Certainly SUSE and Mandriva started off as derivatives but they have added to the Linux community as a whole. Ubuntu has too. How many distros use Network Manager? They aren't all Ubuntu derivatives, are they? wicd is becoming a popular alternative and it was developed by the Zenwalk folks.
OK, some derivatives contribute a lot and some contribute nothing. There is a huge spectrum in between. Some derivatives truly branch off so far from the original that they end up being something completely different. SUSE and Mandriva are the most popular examples of that.
I am really tried of the Ubuntu derivative bashing. Yes, some of them are just Ubuntu with new themes and a different package list. If that's all they ever are and never evolve beyond that they are of dubious value. They also probably won't survive long term. Others may develop into something special. Only time will tell.
99 • From Gentoo to openSUSE 11.1 (by Ed Borasky on 2008-12-23 06:57:58 GMT from United States)
I have migrated from Gentoo to openSUSE 11.1. The "last straw" for Gentoo was when they cancelled the 2008.1 release. The thing is -- not only do I personally use Linux, I also like to burn media and give copies to my friends. The last Gentoo LiveCD that actually worked on both of my machines was 2007.0. And their installer is just way too confusing for my friends, and slow on top of that.
100 • RE: # 99 (by Anonymous Penguin on 2008-12-23 07:20:11 GMT from Italy)
I liked your article, especially the final words:
"In short: for my usage, it's better than Fedora 10, Ubuntu Hardy Heron and Debian Lenny, mostly because of the newer kernel and the easy accessibility of non-OSS packages when I need them. And it's better than Gentoo because Gentoo no longer seems to have a functioning release engineering process. So ... color me green and call me a lizard. :) "
Personally I am not sure that I like openSUSE better than Debian, but that is a matter of personal taste.
101 • Re: Debian Drama? (by Anonymous on 2008-12-23 07:46:59 GMT from United States)
There was no "descent" within Debian, there was some dissent but I am fairly certain that no one sank any lower than any other time that individuals disagreed over something on the internets.
Also, you could at least have told us what the "dissent" was about, namely the vote wasn't closed at its scheduled time (the Secretary's job). Give people all of the facts so they can make an informed opinion rather than just imply that things are not right in Debian-ville d-;
102 • sidux (by Sertse on 2008-12-23 07:52:49 GMT from Australia)
Just saw on the main page.. I seee the kde full dvd, and the xfce editions.
How about the single cd kde-lite? (Which I think, is the "main" edition..)
103 • RE: 102 sidux (by ladislav on 2008-12-23 07:59:10 GMT from Taiwan)
You can get the kde-lite CDs from the download page. Just click on the word "Download" and visit some of the mirrors. Most of them don't have the new ISOs as yet, but you'll find one or two which are up-to-date.
104 • 98 - Inheritence graph and when is a remix a distro (by Miq on 2008-12-23 09:27:16 GMT from Sweden)
Caitlyn, that was a damn fine post. There are many things you've said here on DWW I don't agree with, but that post I could sign.
However, with "I am really tried of the Ubuntu derivative bashing. Yes, some of them are just Ubuntu with new themes and a different package list. If that's all they ever are and never evolve beyond that they are of dubious value", do you mean you want to see those obvious rethemes listed as full distros? Because I sure don't. All the remixes should be sorted under Ubuntu until they've evolved into something obviously viable as a real distro in their own. Easy rule-of-thumb: if it fits "([XK]*[Uu]).*buntu." it shouldn't be listed as a distro of its own.
105 • @72 + Caitlyn (by KaffeineAddict on 2008-12-23 09:43:56 GMT from Australia)
Awesome! Thanks for the information, very much appreciated. Looks like I'll be downloading and trying RC1 as I liked the Beta2. Great news regarding d4x, I overlooked that still not 6 not out so the repo may not be up to scratch.
Oh and this week's DWW piqued my curiosity so I tried OS 11.1 KDE4... Nice desktop and what not but errr mmmm not my cup o' tea! Bit sluggish... Might try Xfce on it and compare to VL 6 (yes I know RC1 so not final but I liked beta2 as I said). Yes obviously OS would have more packages available but the few that I use should be available as you've said. I checked for some others in the repo already hence my initial question re d4x.
I also test drove the latest Mandriva (KDE4) and thought it was actually better than OS, definitely felt snappier.
Once again thanks!
106 • Wolfix (by oithona on 2008-12-23 10:01:43 GMT from United Kingdom)
"Wolvix is great, Wolfix is s@#$"
Damn, there goes my new derivative distro!!
107 • @72 + Caitlyn (by KaffeineAddict on 2008-12-23 10:41:12 GMT from Australia)
Well I dl'ed and tried to install VL 6 RC1... Got to the 2nd step where the "Installation Media" is being detected... and couldn't find my CD/DVD drive. The very same drive that it booted off... ??? Am now trying in VirtualBox and it successfully finds the "Installation Media".
Any ideas? Might head off to the forums and see if anyone else has reported it.
108 • @ 106 - oithona (by DeniZen on 2008-12-23 10:55:08 GMT from United Kingdom)
aha! I thought the handle rang a bell ;) - would you be 'oithona ' as in Wolvix Dev? :)
Assuming so, firstly Kudos to you and Wolven, and .. well .. lets shoot for a scoop here then! - any news on the next version of Wolvix? ;) Theres not much recent news on the official forum, but I read its planned.
Good to see Wolvix getting some deserved discussion on here.
109 • @ 104 (by Anonymous on 2008-12-23 11:18:22 GMT from United Kingdom)
"if it fits "([XK]*[Uu]).*buntu." it shouldn't be listed as a distro of its own."
Agree with that. No other Dists that offer different DE's appear to get listed seperately (i.e. OS, Fedora, Mandriva etc do not), so cant really see why the official *buntu's are treated as seperate.
The Canonical endorsed official buntus should be listed as a single entity.
Just think how much 'everyones favourite' / the 'popular nemesis' formerly known as *buntu would become on sites such as DW ;)
Ideally, any new *buntu 3rd party spin offs (that may just be a paint job) ought to state just how they differ from 'the Mothership' (apart from err.. 'awesome' icons and a 'cool' Usplash ;) ) - when they first apply for inclusion on the DW list.
There really is enough *buntu respins already.
Aside from Mint (and to some smaller extent Ultimate, the 'specialist' Editions and that E17 version) I havent seen any spin-off bring anything much new to the party other than what one could easily sort out oneself with a standard Ubuntu install with 'restricted-extras' installed & a quick trip to the candy store and 30 mins of your own time.
110 • Capabilities out of the box (by anon on 2008-12-23 12:07:09 GMT from Norway)
Chris (#66) wrote:
"So, I want to ask you all:
What do you expect a Linux distribution to be able to do out of the box?"
I would like a Linux distribution to be able to play f.inst. this link:
Not necessarily out of the box, but at least after the needed codecs are in place. Now - hands up everybody who can stream this link under Linux... Anyone? :(
111 • @Chris #66 - Linux Out of the Box (by Miq on 2008-12-23 12:28:25 GMT from Sweden)
"What do you expect a Linux distribution to be able to do out of the box?"
One of my big Linux gripes have always been media playback. Only relatively recently did it become more of less effortless to play most if not all of my music. Exotic formats like Monkey Audio (.APE) was for a long time unplayable.
However, my current problem is rather with video playback. I have if not a high-end system then at least a reasonable one (Core-2 Duo @ 2.4 ghz and 2 GB RAM). However, almost all video playback range from unsmooth via stuttering to slideshow. On WinXP I playback h.264-encoded video in 1080p resolution with ASS/SSA-formatted softsubs without any problems. However, on Linux even with proprietary codecs as said I generally get a mediocre movie experience. Add to that that the recent audio layers (PulseAudio?) have a tendency to stutter periodically, halting the entire system for a half a second.
So I'd like a good movie experience out of the box.
112 • Ubuntu Derivatives (by drizake on 2008-12-23 13:39:21 GMT from United States)
I still think that there are two types of Ubuntu derivatives that are worth while. The first type adds enough features beyond what is in Ubuntu to actually make it worth me downloading (example: Mint). The second type is a version targeted towards a specific nation or language (example: Rubuntu). These distros created by universities and governments add to a nation's sense of pride in the Linux community and expose new users in those countries to Linux.
113 • Windows Domain (by Jesse on 2008-12-23 15:03:27 GMT from Canada)
It's nice to see openSuse making it so easily to login against a Windows domain. While I think most distros offer this ability, I find it's a bit round-about. Being able to join and login to a Windows domain on Linux as easily as one can on Windows XP would be a great advantage.
114 • the kitchen sink (by john frey on 2008-12-23 15:28:21 GMT from Canada)
Merry Christmas everyone! Welcome Chris to DWW, great to see you have taken up the mantel (or the gauntlet, whatever). Congrats Ladislav on all your fine work on DWW over the last 5 or so years. Has it only been 5 years? 5 Years already!??
What I want from Linux OOTB
1. run on my game console
2. a large package repository
3. run fast and stable on older hardware
4. installation option for an absolute minimal install
5. installation options for a complete desktop solution
6. installation options for server install (http, pop3, DNS, NTP, LDAP, NFS, Samba, ftp, VNC, VPN, LTSP... etc.
7. automatic hardware detection
8. complete control over what does and does nto get installed
9. Simple one click installation
10. complete instructions to compile the system from source
11. fast and stable package manager
12. specifically engineered for sff and netbooks
13. optimized for i386
14. optimized for i686
15. optimized for x86_64
16. runs on any architecture
17. a Windows killer
18. a Palm killer
19. a Blackberry killer
20. completely free
You get the idea. There's many uses for Linux and even if you limit it to desktop users there are major differences. Maybe the question should be "what do you want to work OOTB for your grandma on her 5 year old PC?" Of course then again, one persons grandma just uses it for email and another one wants to sniff tcp/ip packets where she's hacked into the ISP's local router trying find out what everyone in the neighborhood is up to.
115 • Opensuse 11.1 = Awesome (by Dimble on 2008-12-23 16:31:39 GMT from United Kingdom)
Kongrats to the suse team, this is an amazing release as evidenced by the KDE4 install on my netbook.
And a hefty rectal sjambok'ing to the anti-Novell trolls.
116 • Mepis 7.9.94 RC 1 - SimplyMEPIS 8.0 RC 1 (by Brian Masinick on 2008-12-23 17:02:45 GMT from United States)
The first release candidate of SimplyMEPIS 8.0 has reached the Ibiblio mirror site and seems to be in the process of being sent to additional mirror sites. SimplyMEPIS 8.0 has successfully completed six beta test cycles, is in very good shape, and the final details are being put together for the release.
Since MEPIS is upgradable using synaptic or apt-get to the final release, for those of you who like to get a jump on it, this might be a good time. I suspect that there will be some torrent sites available, though I do not have any information on them yet.
http://www.mepis.org/node/1462 has the standard mirror sites; so far, I have only confirmed that ftp://ftp.ibiblio.org/pub/linux/distributions/mepis/testing/ has build 94 populated.
I have tested all six beta releases and this software is in very good shape. Give it a try.
117 • #116 - MEPIS (by Verndog on 2008-12-23 17:11:19 GMT from United States)
Thanks for the early release info of MEPIS RC1. I haven't used MEPIS in years and will have to try this new version. I think it was version 5 that I last used MEPIS.
I noticed it got a lot of notice when DW decided to remove MEPIS from their Major Distributions list.
118 • Re #116 #117. Mepis (by Glenn on 2008-12-23 19:42:38 GMT from Canada)
I am running Mepis Beta 6 and to tell you the truth I prefer it to the other distros I have tried. So does my son.
This is a good release. On my laptop however when I boot from the CD the sceen resolution comes up as 640x480. What I do is to use KATE and edit /etc/x11/xorg.conf , change all occurrences of 640x480 to 1024x768, save it, restart the session and thats it.
I think I'll wait for the final release and skip the RC1. Beta 6 is nice and stable .
Have fun, good luck, Happy Holidays .....installing distros (GRIN)
119 • How a distribution should be (by someone on 2008-12-23 19:58:00 GMT from India)
A distribution should be like a wheel!
It should be as stable and hardware compliant in the center/core like the hub of a wheel. I mean the kernel should be rock solid like debian/slackware and should have support for all latest hardwares as modules or built with kernel like ubuntu .
It should have as much flexibility in putting as much different versions of the same software as well different software (see nix article http://www.linux.com/feature/155922) like spokes to the hub. It should support as much software like debian and allow mixing different versions of same software (like debian allows mixing stable/unstable/testing)
It should be as fast like a rotating wheel, may be completely O3 optimized (like slax (slax is O3 optimized) or puppy (puppy runs from RAM and is superfast))
It should be as much resilient to shock like a wheel bumping into problems and be easily fixable (like debian)
It should not fail the whole experience of OS when a software crashes and allow rollbacking (like conary package manager of foresight providing rollbacks)
It should finally be like completely alterable piece by piece (hub or spokes or tyres ...) (like how old cars are pimped or old bike wheels are beautified and made different) (may be it should support as much power user stuff like gentoo!)
If all these combine and give a linux user a ride in multi core processors (exploiting the power of multi core processors) and he can do whatever he wants (from just using like end user, or use it to build s/w, or use it to do day to day business, or build multimedia, or use it to build another OS or tweak everything to his tastes) then it will be an ultimate linux
120 • @ 66: Linux Out of the Box (by Kurt on 2008-12-23 20:10:31 GMT from United States)
I used to always think that you had to have everything working out of the box until I started using Arch and learned that having everything working out of the box requires you to severely bloat your system in order to handle all the different setups.
My current belief follows the Arch KISS philosophy of give me a network connection and a package manager and I'll go ahead and install the rest myself.
121 • @120: Linux Out of the Box (by drizake on 2008-12-23 20:22:21 GMT from United States)
I'm in agreement to a point. I like to think that the system is lean and doesn't include a large amount of special use packages. At the same time, I like to see a large amount of software available via the repos and common codecs (DVD, MP3, etc.) already installed or at least readily accessible via the package manager. A decent release can still fit on a CD and doesn't require scouring the web in search of specific packages like lame, libdvdcss, etc.
122 • Suggested Distro with Lao support? (by Rich on 2008-12-23 21:29:05 GMT from United States)
Late to the blog this week, but It just struck me as I was talking to a buddy on the phone. He has an old laptop He wants to give his daughter. It's too old to run Windows except maybe 98, I think it's a 300Mhz Pentium with a neomagic video card and maybe 128 Megs of ram and a Prism or Proxima Harmony 802.11b PCMCIA card. I'm thinking if I could find a new user friendly distro that supports Lao(his native tongue) it'd push him over to our(Floss) side. He is trying for his Daughter to be bilingual as she grows up so English(or at least American ;) would need to be supported as well). I haven't found any that support a Lao localisation. Closest so far have been Thai, which he says is not really the same.
Any ways merry Holidays all I'll check back as time permits to see if y'all have some better ideas Than I.
123 • @122 - distro with Lao support (by Pearson on 2008-12-23 21:55:18 GMT from United States)
You might as over at the Thai Linux page, http://linux.thai.net/. They might know of a Lao language distro. I suggest them because I saw that Lao is *very* similar to Isan, which is spoken in parts of Thailand.
124 • #107 - no clue; Out of the box (by Caitlyn Martin on 2008-12-23 22:21:40 GMT from United States)
#107: I'm sorry but I have no clue what would cause the newest build of VL6 to not recognize the media. Going to the forums and posting on the bug report thread is exactly the right answer.
Out of box: I guess I'm having the ultimate out of box experience right now. My new Sylvania g netbook arrived yesterday and yes, everything just works right out of the box :) OK, I'm not a fan of gOS (yet another Ubuntu derivative) and I will almost undoubtedly change which distro(s) this thing runs. Hardware wise, though, it's a five out of five and my software niggles are more personal preferences than anything else.
I also have to remember that I am probably not the typical netbook user. There was no entry for a terminal emulator in the menu or on the desktop!! Linux without the command line? Not for me. Anyway, I created a desktop launcher for gnome-terminal and all was well with the world again.
To answer the question the way Chris asked it to me the single most important thing is excellent hardware support. If all the hardware on systems, old and new, big and small, portable and desktop and server, is correctly detected and configured then everything else is a piece of cake. I also think a distro should have an easy vanilla install for those who need that (especially newcomers) and yet have the ability for a seasoned user to heavily customize the build up front. I hate distros that force me to install mountains of cruft just to then spend time figuring out what I can safely remove to clean up the mess.
Oh, and when I made my post about derivative distros and roots I probably should have included Gentoo as from scratch and reasonably popular. It's even spawned a few derivatives of it's own.
OK, I'm blathering on again...
125 • @124 - Caitlyn re: VL (by KaffeineAddict on 2008-12-23 23:32:12 GMT from Australia)
Thanks. Yep, someone else had reported the issue with the GUI installer and some SATA drives in the release announcement thread. Text installer had no such issue so went with that.
There are other issues with RC1 that I have reported in the feedback thread for RC1. Some of these are show-stoppers (for me anyway) and I hope they get fixed.
VL 6 does feel quite snappy. Haven't tried OpenSUSE Xfce edition yet so I make a direct comparison.
126 • Merry Christmas! (by Miq on 2008-12-23 23:55:14 GMT from Sweden)
It is Christmas Eve in Sweden now, and here we celebrate the 24:th rather than Christmas Day, so
127 • OOTB (by paul on 2008-12-24 01:20:20 GMT from United States)
I have probably said it before, but it could be repeated.
Out of the Box a distro should:
1. Display. If proprietary drivers are needed, the display should revert to whatever was used during the install. Generic ATI/nVidia drivers do not always work! There should be a simple fallback.
2. Mouse. There should be a minimum of three buttons and a scroll wheel supported, and functional. Extra buttons are a bonus.
3. Ethernet/Wireless. These things have to work. If the install ISO needs to be 50% drivers, OK. You can't update for fix anything if you can't connect.
Nice to have:
1. Printer support. Drivers, and something that installs them without heroics.
2. Samba setup. It should be comprehendible by mere mortals.
3. Grub. Recognition of other installed systems, and the provision for starting them.
4. Sound. A system that "just works" and doesn't have all sounds muted/minimized as the initial condition.
5. File systems. I want to read and write not only Microsoft stuff but Unix as well.
6. Multimedia. When something is missing, state what it is. Saying where to get it would be a bonus, but I can't even look for it, if I don't know what the program is looking for.
128 • MEPIS (by Verndog on 2008-12-24 01:27:26 GMT from United States)
Ok, I now typing this post on my newly installed Mepis RC1. I have a few issues.
(1) After burning the DVD, and booting the live system, and logging as "demo". The first message I encountered was a dialog and apparently some service crashed. I looked around for the install gui. Nothing. So later I rebooted as "root", still nothing on the desktop. Going to Mepis and reading the install manual, it mentioned about a install button on the desktop! What the hey. I had nothing. As I was already logged in as "root" , and the manual said to log in as "demo". When I did that I had a desktop full of icons. Apparently, booting up using "demo" login the crash ended the desktop completing.
Just in case someone else sees the crash and doesn't have icons on the desktop.
(2) Open Office doesn't have spreadsheet installed! It's grayed out for some reason. I'm assuming to save space. I need that installed because I have many Excel files to run.
Outside of those two issues, this was a very fast and easy install. For a GUI installer it was quite responsive. And did I say fast! I been using Gnome for what seems like forever. This KDE 3.5 is very nice. The desktop is also very appealing.
Mepis has come along way since I last installed it, years ago. Thanks!
129 • antiX-M8-public-test1 available. (by anticapitalista on 2008-12-24 13:03:42 GMT from Greece)
For some reason antiX has not been announced (but is in the latest distros part)
Here is the announcement from MEPIS:
Morgantown, WV, US and Thessaloniki, Greece, December 22, 2008 -- Now available, in the MEPIS testing mirror, antiX-M8-public-test1.iso is the first public test release of antiX-M8, a fast and light complete desktop and livecd based on SimplyMEPIS and Debian Lenny, with a little bit of sidux.
This release defaults to a fully customised icewm desktop (fluxbox is also installed) In addition to the SimplyMEPIS 8.0 foundation with its kernel and Assistants, antiX has an improved antiX-Control Centre, new scripts for screenshots, and phonebook. There are improved and extended themes and artwork for icewm and fluxbox.
Anti has also added the sidux meta-installer, updated ceni and wicd for wired/wireless connections, UMTSmon - a simple connect program for users using 3g usb modems, firehol firewall, gnomebaker replaces brasero, urxvt replaces wterm. 8.0 has X.org 7.3, auto-login with latest SLiM, smxi, inxi, svmi scripts from h2, and Dillo 2. New apps included: zim (wiki), Gjots (notes), Grsync, and parted.
AntiX is designed to work on computers with as little as 64 MB RAM and Pentium II or equivalent AMD processors, but not K5/K6 processors. 128 MB RAM is recommended.
and link to release notes on antiX site:
130 • Quick AntiX Q (by Sertse on 2008-12-24 14:10:56 GMT from Australia)
I know, this isn't a support forum etc etc
If I d/l now would I be able to upgrade to final through apt upgrading or some easy method like that? I'm been holding out right out cause of that
131 • Opensuse (by Dick Cheney on 2008-12-24 14:11:49 GMT from United States)
Tried the new Opensuse live CD. I thought the Fedora 10 live CD was slow, but this one definitely takes the cake. It took about 15 minutes to get to a desktop on my dual core Athlon X2 5200+ with 4 GB of RAM.
Everything is very slow the first time it is opened. It only takes about 3 seconds to open OOo writer the second time.
No other live CD is anywhere near to this slow. I was going to try a dual-boot by replacing my Ubuntu install (just can't get used to the bugs in Ubuntu - please don't respond that it works for you so that's proof that it just works). My previous opensuse experiences were bad, so given the performance of the live CD, I think I'll just make this one into another coaster.
132 • Fedora 10 (by Joey on 2008-12-24 15:02:45 GMT from United States)
We found F-10 to be fast and reliable once the updates were yum installed. Before that the internet connection would drop once in a while on this laptop. Also the desktop settings would not stick.
All is well now the only exception being a few websites not loading normally. Will seek help in the Fedora forums.
Toshiba Satellite A205 with the Intell 965 graphics and the core duo cpu.
133 • VectorLinux 6 RC1 (by capricornus on 2008-12-24 15:19:54 GMT from Belgium)
After giving up on Pontos because of it's continued rigidity (watermark of Sidux?), I gave Vector a new try. Nice going, the graphical installer. A minor problem with sound was quickly solved. But CrossOver is not to be installed, and I can not find ia32-libs in the reps. I find this a major drawback. Another painfull spot is grub: it recognizes Win and Debian Mint, but nOt the PCLOS that does everything OOTB. Vector 6 is not yet my favorite...
134 • Adam Williamson has announced the availability of .... (by Jose Antonio on 2008-12-24 15:31:12 GMT from United States)
Adam Williamson has announced the availability of the first alpha release of Mandriva Linux 2009.1, now shipping with KDE 4.2 beta 2:
Wasn't he fired? What the hell is going on, if he was fired and he still works for them, does that make any sense. I would not have gone back to such a$$holes lilke that.
Otherwise Happy Holidays to all linux users from around the world.
135 • re 134 (by Anonymous on 2008-12-24 15:43:21 GMT from United States)
His employment ends at the end of the year, I think.
136 • #130Quick AntiX Q (by Sertse (by anticapitalista on 2008-12-24 16:22:05 GMT from Greece)
Yes you can.
137 • Hi Brian Masinick (by Anonymous Penguin on 2008-12-24 16:29:57 GMT from Italy)
I suppose you still don't know who I really am (hint: the nick you know starts with an "s" and ends with a "4")
Just wanted to wish you Merry Christmas and say something: of all available Debian derivatives I have come to the conclusion that the best is.....Debian itself!
Long gone are the times of Libranet 2.7 when installing and configuring Debian Proper was a daunting and tedious task. Not any longer, and Debian is more flexible than its derivatives, IMO :)
138 • Websites (by Nobody important on 2008-12-24 16:40:19 GMT from United States)
I took a look at Simplis (formally Vixta). While the thing looks a little dubious to me thanks to the use of Microsoft names in the programs, I have to say the website sure looks nice. Why can't more distros make their websites look that clean and refreshing?
139 • 83 KDE for Debian Distros (by Dick Cheney on 2008-12-24 16:45:15 GMT from United States)
One thing that worked well for me to test KDE 4 was to install AntiX and then install the Debian Lenny KDE 4 packages.
I ran AntiX for a couple of months as if it were Debian Lenny and it worked great. As a matter of fact, I view AntiX as more a way to get a nice-looking minimal Debian installation quickly, than as a lightweight Mepis. I add whatever I want from the Debian repos and have never had problems.
YMMV of course.
140 • ZevenOS (by Full Tank on 2008-12-24 17:26:54 GMT from United States)
I downloaded this disto and installed on my laptop and it is so beautiful in it's own simplistic way. It does remind me a lot of BeOS which has one of the best UI's ever made. It is seems to be as rock solid as the 8.04 Ubuntu it was built on. Need to see where these guys take this. Good Job and I would support them if I could read their website. Mostly in German
141 • @134 (by Adam Williamson on 2008-12-24 17:53:16 GMT from Canada)
My contract ends on December 31st.
142 • Polishlinux (by Fabio on 2008-12-24 17:55:35 GMT from United States)
Hello, I am in the process of installing Ubuntu 8.10 and another Linux OS on a dedicated system, so that I can get used to the Linux software, while still using Vista, and Xp. Two weeks ago my XP Pro got a bad virus and nearly wiped out all my data, but was able to recover all data, but the HD went south. I have had it with windows!!! So the reason for this e-mail is to know if DistroWatch has a similar program as Polishlinux, so that when a newby looks for various versions of Linux software they can compare them against each other, with rating numbers, pros and cons, but with an updated time frame lets say of a month. I have been looking at Polishlinux but it seamed to me that some of the software OS are almost a year behind. I though that your company has a great deal of info on this web site in which I check frequently, and it would be great for beginners like me to do some research all on one site, to determine which system a person would like to compare and make a purchase from that selection. It is just a thought. I am a novice but have been working with PC and various versions of OS, mostly MS since the first version came out.
I am just tired of of MS,and all their bugs and brake downs.
I would also like to know if there are any version of Linux OS's with a full complimentary applications in one CD that has al the applications to get up and transfer window files to let say Ubuntu, Suse, or the likes without having to install each individual program to the OS one would purchase. Some people just are not that good at having to install apps, and one OS with most needed options to convert from MS to Linux would be wonderful.
Thank you for what your organization is doing in the software world to provide so many choices with free stable OS and programs to.
Presently I am retired and working with Veterans, and active military members. I belong to a Non-profit organization which are located in 39 States and 8 countries, and operate as Outposts, 144 of them and 40 HomeFronts. I am going to set up a system that will be running a Linux OS, but it will have to be a very user friendly with quick install and with what I had mentioned earlier. This organization has been around for 24 years.
Again thank you for your dedicated information and any answer you might be able to provide me.
143 • SimplyMEPIS 8.0 RC1 has been released ! (by Jimmy Johnson on 2008-12-24 18:05:20 GMT from United States)
I have done two 32-bit installs one Intel Desktop and one Intel Laptop - Default install, no problems found.
One 64-bit Intel Desktop - Default install, no problems found.
I have never seen easer installs, looking REAL good!
Merry Christmas DistroWatch !
144 • 142 (by Dick Cheney on 2008-12-24 19:39:46 GMT from United States)
About the software, best thing is just to ask. Ask here or linuxquestions.org or the Ubuntu forums. It changes pretty quickly. If you click on the distro website, such as
you will get detailed package information.
"I would also like to know if there are any version of Linux OS's with a full complimentary applications in one CD that has al the applications to get up and transfer window files to let say Ubuntu, Suse, or the likes without having to install each individual program to the OS one would purchase. Some people just are not that good at having to install apps, and one OS with most needed options to convert from MS to Linux would be wonderful."
I'm not entirely clear what you are requesting here. Basically, when you install Ubuntu, you can find the Synaptic package manager and install from there. You don't have to pay for it, and when security/version updates come out, you can have the package manager install them automatically. There is no skill required. There is also an Add/Remove programs on Ubuntu that is more newbie-oriented, with more information, but it doesn't include all the programs available through Synaptic.
About the only problem is installing non-open source software. That can sometimes be a pain, but there's not really much that can be done: it's up to the software producers whether or not they want to support a given Linux distribution, or Linux at all.
Best advice is just to ask. First thing to learn about Linux is that you better be prepared to post questions online. You're unlikely to ask too many or inappropriate questions in the Ubuntu forums or on linuxquestions.org.
Good newbie distros are Ubuntu, Mepis, and Mint. If one of them doesn't work for some reason, try another. Let us know what apps you need and we can point you in the right direction.
145 • Ref#143 - Mepis 8.0 (by Verndog on 2008-12-24 21:12:42 GMT from United States)
You mentioned that you have installed 8.0 rc1. Where do I find it?
I guess this post confused me:
"116 • Mepis 7.9.94 RC 1 - SimplyMEPIS 8.0 RC 1"
Is SimplyMEPIS & Mepis the same thing?
If so where do I get 8.0 RC 1 ? Thanks.
146 • Suze review (by Landor on 2008-12-24 22:10:52 GMT from Canada)
I was glad to see an indepth review regarding the current point release. I liked how Ladislav and some of his guest contributors laid out their information for us and I have to say this was refreshing to see return compared to the last couple of weeks prior to Chirs Smart taking over the reins for here.
One thing that I couldn't help but shake was in such a detailed review (and also last week as well) hardware was not listed, which is odd for most reviews and especially one as detailed as this.. I didn't see mention of the graphic card was (other than ATI) that wouldn't work, nor mention of wireless. I assumed networking worked fine, but again no mention of what networking.
I have to wonder if it was intentionally left out due to the comments derived here the last time Chris did back to back reviews on Mac related equipment and didn't want the same outlash that happened before.
For me I personally don't care if that is the case. I would like to see the hardware/system listed in the review(s). Then I can properly base my opinion on the distro(s) being reviewed and the "snappiness" of them knowing the cpu, ram, video, and in some instances, lan/wan.
Keep your candycane on the ice.
147 • Adam Williamson has announced the availability of .... (by Jose Antonio on 2008-12-24 23:43:18 GMT from United States)
Adam Williamson has announced the availability of the first alpha release of Mandriva Linux 2009.1, now shipping with KDE 4.2 beta 2:
Wasn't he fired? What the hell is going on, if he was fired and he still works for them, does that make any sense. I would not have gone back to such a$$holes lilke that.
Otherwise Happy Holidays to all linux users from around the world.
148 • No subject (by Jose Antonio on 2008-12-24 23:46:33 GMT from United States)
Sorry about the double post, I clicked refresh on konqueror and the post appeared again :(, I had already read Adam's response. They(Mandriva) still have a chance to fix the stuff and they should apologize to Adam. Despite not using Mandriva I can see that he is/was the face of a distro that does not value people that do more than anybody else.
149 • #145 Mepis (by anticapitalista at 2008-12-25 00:04:07 GMT from Greece)
The version you downloaded in the latest Mepis 8 rc1.
150 • Thanks for your input (by Chris on 2008-12-25 00:59:56 GMT from Australia)
Thanks to everyone who has posted what they expect a distro to do out of the box. I'll keep those suggestions floating around by head :)
Hi Landor, I totally forgot to mention what hardware it was. I used two:
a standard AMD Athlon XP machine, 1 GB RAM, 300GB SATA drive, NVIDIA nForce2 chipset, ATI 9600 AGP video card; and,
Intel Core 2 Duo, 4GB RAM, Intel chipset, NVIDIA 8800GT PCI-Express graphics card.
On-board sound in both cases.
I'm sure that if 11.1 had the ATI repository like they did in 11.0, then the ATI graphics would have worked 'out of the box' (like NVIDIA drivers). I guess there's a reason why the ATI 11.1 repository doesn't exist yet.
I didn't test wireless, which was probably an oversight on my part. I'll make sure to include the specs and a wider range of hardware next time. Thanks for the reminder.
151 • OOTB (by Lee on 2008-12-25 01:25:37 GMT from United States)
If a distro ISO fills a CD I think it is reasonable to expect:
Your monitor will be detected and the Window Manager will
open using ALL of the pixels.
Your NIC will be configured and you will see other machines
on the LAN & have internet access.
Sound works and volume can be changed.
Suspend & Hibernate work.
152 • Let's step outside the box for a minute (by Anonymous on 2008-12-25 06:09:49 GMT from United States)
So many conflicting viewpoints on what the "out of the box" experience should be. First we must remember not everything is free in linux. You want a Linux that's truly free, then check out the ones that the FSF has approved/certified. Many of your favorite distros have illegal software modules and use names such as "restricted drivers" or "W32 Codecs" which are illegal and infringes on the owner's intellectual property and/or patents. OpenSUSE may have a pretty good out of the box experience but someone argued that they hate the massive 4GB CD of bloatware. Yet another said Arch is and has the best, but you got to do a bit of work which defeats the "out of the box" deal in the first place.
Conclusion: The out of the box is a pipe dream. Either you are going to have to swallow a big 4GB pill of bloatware or use a FSF approved GNU/Linux system that has been certified and examined to have nothing but truly pure and free software by the legal definition along with paid or legal drivers. There are some distros out there that have everything most people use and requires no additional effort by you the user, but what they have done is either accepted third party licenses for you in the ISO file or they have included things like the "restricted drivers" pack, the "W32 Codecs" and/or other non-free modules which the FSF rejects.
153 • #152: FSF, Happy Holidays to everyone (by Caitlyn Martin on 2008-12-25 06:57:06 GMT from United States)
#152: I'm not an FSF purist and I really don't care what they reject. I want my hardware to work. If I have to use proprietary bits then I will. If I don't then I prefer not to. One of the reasons Linux finally is achieving mainstream acceptance (besides the preloaded netbooks and nettops) is the fact that hardware support is very good at this point. Not perfect, mind you, but better than anything else out there.
On my netbook there are three video drivers available:
1. openchrome -- looks good at first, 3D acceleration works, but weird refresh issues and blank spots at times.
2. proprietary Via -- what shipped with the netbook, looks good for 2D but 3D acceleration doesn't work properly
3. new Via open source -- this is the one that really works.
Great! The problem was that until recently it was proprietary or the highway. Now at least I have a choice and FOSS turns out to be the best choice.
I'd like to wish everyone a Merry Christmas, a Happy Hanukkah, and a happy holiday season for those who celebrate something else or none of the above :)
154 • @153 (by Adam Williamson on 2008-12-25 07:37:20 GMT from Canada)
The problem with certain bits is that they're not just legal proprietary software, like the NVIDIA driver, but flat out illegal. It is simply not legal in the U.S. to redistribute all sorts of stuff that infringes on patents, like AAC decoding, to give one simple example. It is illegal both under patent law and under copyright law - the DMCA in the U.S., EUCD in Europe, and similar laws in a few other territories - to distribute or even use dvdcss to watch encrypted DVDs. The law may be an ass, but it's still the law.
It's not an issue of being FSF pure, it's a simple issue of being legal or not.
155 • ATI driver working (by Chris on 2008-12-25 08:05:22 GMT from Australia)
I had another go at the ATI driver and it works now. This is what I did:
sudo zypper in gcc kernel-source libstdc++33
sudo /sbin/init 3
Told it to "Generate Distribution Specific Driver Package", selected "SuSE Packages", then checked "SuSE/SUSE111-IA32".
sudo cp /etc/X11/xorg.conf.install /etc/X11/xorg.conf
sudo aticonfig --initial
sudo /sbin/depmod -ae
sudo /sbin/modprobe fglrx
sudo /sbin/init 5
Log in and glxinfo shows support via fglrx, but no direct rendering. Likewise glxgears throws up a permissions error:
libGL error: open DRM failed (Operation not permitted)
libGL error: reverting to (slow) indirect rendering
This is a permissions problem because /dev/dri/card0 is owned by root:root and so changing this to root:users works. Usually you can change this in your xorg.conf tell this to be set when starting X, but this didn't seem to work.
Next, I tried it with sax2 (which didn't work for me the first time). But this time it did.
sudo /sbin/init 3
sudo cp /etc/X11/xorg.conf.install /etc/X11/xorg.conf
sax2 -r -m 0=fglrx
sudo /sbin/init 5
I'm not sure why it didn't work the first time I tried it, but seems OK now.
156 • new sidux "pontos" release needs more bugs :) (by arno911 on 2008-12-25 13:57:09 GMT from Germany)
the latest sidux needs testing, it seems. its working flawlessly, except for single individuals, and this cant be the end of the story!
ok, its holiday season and ppl have better things to do, but please check it out.
oh, and i have to mention: the artwork is not a bug, but its a feature, that it can be changed.
merry christmas, inshallah and my best regards
157 • @Verndog - SimplyMEPIS 8.0 RC1 (by Jimmy Johson on 2008-12-25 15:41:36 GMT from United States)
Sorry about the mix-up, the official names are:
And can be found here: ftp://ftp.ibiblio.org/pub/linux/distributions/mepis/testing/
158 • "The Law," etc.. (by Jerry B. on 2008-12-26 12:16:06 GMT from United States)
Adam, your clear reminder of the laws regarding patent and copywrite cannot penetrate Caitlyn Martin's "I really don't care what they reject. I want my hardware to work. If I have to use proprietary bits then I will."
"I don't care..." A formidable shield indeed.
159 • Re.: #158, The Law and so forth... (by anon on 2008-12-26 14:49:41 GMT from Norway)
I am definitely with Caitlyn on this one.
If too many people are breaking a law, it's the law which needs to be studied, and probably amended/changed. How about some laws to protect and further consumers' interests? I mean, for a change?
Billy got too easily off the hook and his company is free to continue more or less the same practices it's been criticized for since 'day one'. This is a shame, period.
Another problem is that too many Linux developers appear to be asleep at the wheel. A lot of things which would have smoothed the overall Linux experience are not being done, or done late or implemented poorly. Embarrassing.
If I had had a decisive say, it would be mandatory for all developers of commercial software to offer their products for at least 5 different platforms, MS counting as one. That would be a start.
160 • RE: 150, 159 (by Landor on 2008-12-26 15:18:45 GMT from Canada)
Thank you Chris and glad to see you got the card working in the end.
I also hope you didn't take any offense to my comment. I personally didn't have a problem with your previous articles at all.
So let's say if someone is selling you something online, you pay them, and they don't send you the item should the law be changed due to the fact that a lot of "cough" people do this? Would you condone and support said person's right to such an act?
Yes, a bit off the point the above was. You might not like certain laws but the world is full of choices and these laws are there to protect choices. Let's use the licensing as a choice. Choice A) closed license software. B) Open License Software. As long as the consumer wants (let's define consumer too, willfully obtainging/using a product not of their own design either purchased or given out freely) to use something, should the one's wishes be outweighed by the many? Seriously?
Let's say you work for an egg producer and your company is now told they have to give out all their eggs for free, at a loss. Would you be happy over the consumer getting such a boon while you most likely end up jobless and out of money in very short order?
Rights are Rights and the minute you start poking around at the law and saying this law is wrong, but this law is right, you start defining who should and shouldn't have rights, and that's what the law is all about, equal rights to protect everyone even though that may be against your own personal view of said law(s).
Keep your stick on the ice..
161 • #152 (by jack at 2008-12-26 15:58:13 GMT from Canada)
... Either you are going to have to swallow a big 4GB pill of bloatware or...
I don't understand why any particular number should be considered as "bloatware".
Possibly just my lack of knowledge.
If I have some large aplications on my computer; say "gimp", or "open office"; why should that slow down my use of other aplications that are separate from them; e.g. firefox or digicam?
Aren't these stored someplace where, unless I access them, they remain "out of sight and out of my mind"?
162 • RE: # 161 (by Anonymous Penguin on 2008-12-26 16:16:47 GMT from Italy)
Indeed. It seems that some people get mixed up between bloat and choice.
Debian Lenny should be released on 5 DVDs! (Yes, that is right, 5 DVDs):
And yet I can't imagine that Debian is bloated by any stretch of the imagination.
163 • Ref#162 5 DVD's (by Verndog on 2008-12-26 17:00:04 GMT from United States)
The problem with that idea, is that in a month those 5 DVD's would be outdated.
I still prefer to use the net-install, and choose what and when I install applications.
Regarding free vs illegal. I can go out and rent a DVD movie, and put it in one appliance - DVD player, and that's considered legal.
If I put that same DVD movie in another appliance - namely my computer and play it, that's illegal!
164 • Hello Penguins! (by guru on 2008-12-26 17:31:34 GMT from Finland)
My point is that all kernels under the 2.6.28 kernel are outdated.
165 • 158, 159 and 164 (by Miq on 2008-12-26 17:41:39 GMT from Sweden)
Laws are for people, to ensure and promote a fair and just world. It It is the duty of citizens to protest unfair, outdated or unethical laws. The laws discussed here are all of the above.
166 • ^ That should have been 163, not 164 (by Miq on 2008-12-26 17:43:23 GMT from Sweden)
167 • Re: 163 (by Anonymous on 2008-12-26 18:00:45 GMT from Germany)
"The problem with that idea, is that in a month those 5 DVD's would be outdated."
Right you are, sir! Debian-installer Lenny rc2 should be out soon and, with a bit of luck, the actual Lenny release will follow in a couple of weeks.
But, of course, Debian's stable releases never really get outdated until the next stable Debian release comes available. People who choose to download the stable Debian DVDs only need to additionally download the security updates in the next two years. Those smart individuals can say goodbye to their old distro-hopping days and just concentrate on getting some actual work done on their super-secure and rock-solid Debian GNU/Linux system. :-)
168 • "Study the Law.." etc.. (by Jerry B. on 2008-12-26 18:20:17 GMT from United States)
"If too many people are breaking a law, it's the law which needs to be studied, and probably amended/changed."
And until then we should "not care" and break those laws we don't like.
169 • MEPIS names, antiX, and sidux "pontos" (by Brian Masinick on 2008-12-26 19:59:20 GMT from United States)
The current builds of MEPIS labelled "SimplyMEPIS-CD_7.9.94-rc1*" are really SimplyMEPIS 8.0 Release Candidate 1.
These are EXCELLENT versions and are extremely close to being released. I rate them NOW as superior in many ways to already released software!
antiX M8.0 is also in the midst of a pubic testing cycle. There have already been three successful internal tests, and even the first one cleanly installed. These are the habits and practices of the MEPIS project. RARELY is there ever a build released to the public, or even a semi private team, that doesn't already build and install cleanly. If there happens to be a bad build for any reason, that build is taken back to development and issues resolved before anything is introduced on the Internet, even to a small, close nit group. The result is that even software that may need work is at least usable, and the number of defects in such efforts is modest. The problems can be quickly identified, fixed, and then attention can be applied to making further improvements. I know of no effort that does a better job than the MEPIS project.
Another project that has very similar practices and produces consistently high quality efforts is the sidux project. Somebody kidded about creating some issues with the "pontos" project because everything was just right and it worked! Well, that is no mistake. Like the MEPIS projects, the sidux developers also have quality, best practices, and functionality in mind. Rarely does anything get past them that has grave defects. The kind of defects typically found in sidux are application defects requiring a new package from the maintainer.
All three of these projects can credit much of their success to the choice of Debian packaging as their underlying source. SimplyMEPIS relies on the stable release of Debian, antiX relies on Debian Testing, and sidux relies upon Debian Sid. All of these sources are high quality efforts, as evident in the outstanding functionality of all of these systems.
170 • #158, 159, 160: Putting words in my mouth. I don't advocate breaking any laws (by Caitlyn Martin on 2008-12-26 21:37:16 GMT from United States)
Some folks love putting words in my mouth. One in particular here always loves putting me in the worst possible light.
Let me make this clear: I did not advocate breaking any laws. It doesn't matter if I agree with a law or disagree with one (i.e.: the DMCA). Those of you who have read my writing for O'Reilly know I have taken a lot of heat for pointing out which distros violate U.S. law, which ones offer licensed codecs (free or paid), and advocating for the idea that the law be followed until it can be changed.
What I was arguing in my "Out of the box" post was that the FSF ideal of only free software makes a lot of hardware unusable. I wasn't arguing for libdvdcss or win32codecs out of the box. I was arguing for the drivers necessary for hardware to be supported, the so-called "binary blobs". By extension I still install the Flash plugin (decidedly not free) rather than gnash because gnash doesn't work as it should yet.
What I was arguing was the pragmatist point of view. I prefer open source or free software. I, however, do not share the view that proprietary software is somehow illegal or immoral. I use Linux because it does the best job for me. I do not condone breaking the law in the U.S. or in the E.U. or anywhere else.
171 • Test out other distros (by anticapitalista on 2008-12-26 22:01:46 GMT from Greece)
I have read a few posts of yours here over the last 8 months or so, and I think you really need to test out other lite-distros (apart from Slackware-based ones that is).
Like you, I really appreciate slack-lite distros such as Wolvix and Vector. Both are excellent and I am unpatientally waiting for the next release of Wolvix.
Why not give other lite distros a try? I know you don't really like Puppy, but there are a lot of distros in the Wolvix, Vector, zenwalk category that you reallly should give a spin as well.
Hope to see a review of low/mid range distros soon.
172 • "..not advocating breaking laws.." (by Jerry B. on 2008-12-27 00:19:42 GMT from United States)
Yes you are. You are advocating breaking copywrite and patent laws.
Your spin in #170 does not even segue well with your "I don't care" post way up there.
But you're in the majority.
Hang in there; not many care about those particular laws in the Linux community.
Lucky this is not the Music Industry community or just about any other copywrite, patent protected venue.
173 • Re: 168 and others (by anon on 2008-12-27 01:40:27 GMT from Norway)
I wrote, as cited by Jerry B.:
"If too many people are breaking a law, it's the law which needs to be studied, and probably amended/changed."
If you care to look, this is what is happening all the time, even in the U.S. One may argue about how many is "too many". The politicians do that every single day.
Jerry B. went on:
And until then we should "not care" and break those laws we don't like.
Wrong. I don't advocate breaking the law. I have not seen anyone else here doing it either. Use of e.g. the libdvdcss is legal where I live and I don't give a flying fig about whether or not Americans find such use to be to their taste or not. You figure it out, and while you're at it, you might find it worthwhile to study the patents history of the music industry, but only if you're not afraid of surprises. BTW: the guy who gave us libdvdcss won all the cases against him and is today living and working in Silicon Valley. Strange that.
174 • #172--I am NOT advocating breaking any laws and I never have done (by Caitlyn Martin on 2008-12-27 02:22:10 GMT from United States)
Jerry B.: Let me state this perfectly clearly. I do NOT advocate violating patents or copyright laws. I have NEVER done so. No matter what you may try to read into my writing I have not and I will not do so. You saying "yes you do" doesn't make it so.
The "I don't care" post #153 clearly says that I don't care about meeting Free Software Foundation's definition of free software. I don't agree wih their definition of freedom. I don't have a problem with proprietary software per se. That is all I said. FSF rejects all proprietary software and firmware and what I don't care about is meeting their level of free software purity I have been consistent in that position in my writing for over a decade. You honed in on three words and attributed meaning to them that isn't there. Read what I wrote again and it should become clear that you are still putting words into my mouth.
175 • AntiX 8: congratulations, anticapitalista ! (by capricornus on 2008-12-27 09:43:59 GMT from Belgium)
Anti, - in my opinion and field of experience - you finally did it ! Congrats ! The CD loads quickly, the install is swift, grub works completely (it includes both the debians and PCLOS), the menu is not that hard. And nice graphics. The combination of speed and ease do make me think of a mix of Mint and Sidux.
CrossOver installs, but 7.10-pro halts, and the previous 6.20-standard does it the usual way, without hesitation. The CrossOver and Office menus are immediately inserted in the basic menu, not like in many Slacks...and XFCE's.
It takes some experience to install VLC through synaptic, nobody tells me to first update the system and then install VLC, but it runs fine now. But it is nowhere to be found in the menu, good thing I can get it started through /usr/bin. These are details a newbee has trouble with.
But again: I like this even better than the original. Thank you ! 1000x
176 • iMAGIC os .. (by cdac on 2008-12-27 10:25:37 GMT from Netherlands)
Is it rightful to include iMagic OS on distrowatch site? This is another distribution based on linux and its not FREE. So why put it here? arethrer any distrowatch users using this distro?
177 • Ref#176 (by Pirate on 2008-12-27 14:56:40 GMT from United States)
Did you notice that this is about Linux distribution and NOT FSF forum. Yes it is right and the majority of us USE non-free apps. Regardless what this latest trend of comments are trying to say.
If I want to use non-free, and I most certainly do, then I will and that.is.the.end.of.it.period!
I don't give a rats axx what the FSF thinks!
178 • "clarifications" etc.. (by Jerry B. on 2008-12-27 15:10:20 GMT from United States)
We see this a lot after a person is challenged on having expressed themselves spontaneously; the politician who makes a sexist or racist based remark, the athlete who says what he really feels about a teammate or opponent, etc.
Once they are taken to task for it we begin to see "let me clarify for you what I meant," or "you're taking my comments out of context," etc.
"I don't care" and the words that followed it in that post was the truth. The explanations later in response to it are spin: you either advocate breaking patent and copywrite laws or you do not.
If it's a case of a sort of civil disobedience because you feel the laws are not fair or whatever, then say so, you already said you don't care and all you want is your hardware to work.
179 • New years resolution (by Jack on 2008-12-27 15:56:43 GMT from Canada)
Try out every linux distribution on my pc this year.
180 • AntiX 8: energy saving ! (by capricornus on 2008-12-27 17:59:10 GMT from Belgium)
I'm running AntiX 8 for 8 hours now, sitting near the warm open fire downstairs, and this we, my wife and I, remarked already: the cpu (Athlon 2000) needs less cooling, in other words, we didn't notice the cooler fan running, except when surfing. We think this is an advantage: a few Watts per hour could mean a lot of energy globalwize. My green tumb: up!
anti: anXti could be a wrong logo: it makes us think of anXiety.
181 • re #178 (by Bill on 2008-12-27 18:39:46 GMT from United States)
What is Caitlyn saying that is wrong or illegal? What does using LEGAL proprietary software to make hardware work have to do with breaking patent laws? The FSF says to use non proprietary software (last I checked). Some people don't want to, because there aren't always good, hardware doesn't always work right or as well. So again, what does stating that a person doesn't agree with that goal, have to do with anything about breaking laws? I don't care what the FSF does either. As long as there is something out there, that works, and is legal, I'll use it. NOTHING wrong with that. Caitlyn seems to be well explaining the point, you are taking it out of context and spinning it around.
182 • re 181 legal...illegal (by glyj on 2008-12-27 22:26:12 GMT from France)
adding to that : there are software that are *free* and *illegal* illegal in some countries.
183 • @181 re Jerry B. (by greenLegs on 2008-12-28 00:39:09 GMT from France)
It's just one of those late-in-the-week DWW trolls, Bill, forget it
184 • #175/180 antiX-M8 (by anticapitalista on 2008-12-28 01:41:40 GMT from Greece)
thanks very much for the comments. I hope antiX continues to work well for you.
185 • Unintentional Humour Dept. (by DanceMan on 2008-12-28 04:24:41 GMT from Canada)
"antiX M8.0 is also in the midst of a pubic testing cycle."
Sounds like fun. I'd join if if it weren't primarily male geeks.
186 • "trolls" remark (by Jerry B. on 2008-12-28 17:26:19 GMT from United States)
'Scuze me, "greenlegs," I've been a regular participator here for years.
Your post #183 seems to be classic trolling, on the other hand.
187 • Illegal Stuff (by Dick Cheney on 2008-12-29 13:21:41 GMT from United States)
About Adam's comment: I think the point he was making is that Mandriva does include all the proprietary stuff that it is legal to include. To criticize Mandriva for not including more is to criticize them for breaking the law.
About the legality of playing DVDs on Linux: That is a common interpretation, but ultimately the question is whether you would be convicted. Nobody knows the answer. If you purchase a DVD and play it on your home computer, what are the odds that a jury will throw you in jail? We simply don't know. The same goes for w32codecs and all that.
It might be problematic, but there is no reason to think that is the case. We need to see cases actually go to trial in order to find out. The RIAA cases would appear to be more cut and dried, but we can see how that is turning out.
188 • suggestion re "commercial" linux distros... (by jan coeli on 2008-12-29 16:40:11 GMT from United States)
Not sure how alone I might be with this peeve but never liked Apple's high-jacking of BSD to create NextOs & X, and although seeing the niche filled by "professional" editions of Fedora, SUSE and such, I wonder about the need for distributions like iMAGIC or Yellow Dog.
Would the editors of the distrowatch.com site consider doing a color bar of side-stripe to indicate those distributions that demand a payment for use as opposed to those that are free or ask for contributions?
189 • where is my distro watch weekly (by divadgnol on 2008-12-29 18:57:46 GMT from United States)
is it me or has dww not been published for the week of 12/29/08. did i miss a comment stating that one would not be published and if so i apologize for my incessant nagging.
190 • i'm with stupid (by divadgnol on 2008-12-29 19:00:45 GMT from United States)
yeah, thats me. i went back and read the the article and there it is in plain english ( the language i speak). forgive me....
191 • jack and his new years resolution (by divadgnol on 2008-12-29 19:05:14 GMT from United States)
that is a tall order seeing DW has over 100 distros listed and at least that many in waiting. i think you will have fun, and probably learn something along the way.
192 • Encrypted software and the law (by Gene Venable on 2008-12-29 19:11:55 GMT from United States)
One of the things that made America great for a long time is that it was a long way away from the King, so objectionable laws could be ignored. That is one of the main reasons freedom of religion was so marked in the early US, not that the Pilgrims were extremely tolerant -- they weren't. America in many ways has been a nation of law-evaders. Likewise, the Internet is a place where many laws don't apply very well, and they are often rightly ignored.
An acceptable Linux distro should make it dead easy to play encrypted DVDs. This does not mean a distro has to be 100% ready to play them, but it should be no more than a few keypresses or checkboxes away. Just telling someone to Google for how to play them is not acceptable.
193 • The Language of a King (by divadgnol on 2008-12-29 19:43:30 GMT from United States)
if we disect your sentence, the one which i have quoted below.
"An acceptable Linux distro should make it dead easy to play encrypted DVDs"
one would think that you are dictating how a distro should be constructed. Sounds like the language of a monarchy to me. all hail to King Venable!!!! That rolls off the tounge rather nicely.
what makes linux so great is its' diversity.
**no disrespect intended**
194 • @192 (by Adam Williamson on 2008-12-29 20:00:01 GMT from Canada)
So, you'll have no problem with paying the lawyer fees when the DVD Forum sues the first distribution to do that under the DMCA, then?
Good, we'll send the bill on to you.
195 • Ultima Linux (by Wolvrik on 2008-12-30 02:28:20 GMT from United States)
Where did the Ultima Linux website go?
196 • Wolvix - New Release??? (by Wolvrik on 2008-12-30 02:40:55 GMT from United States)
Oithona - I saw your comment above but you didn't answer the question about a new Wolvix release...anything to say about that? I am eagerly waiting for a new release so hopefully it will be soon. Wolvix (IMHO) is probably the best distro out there and relatively small too.
197 • darwin & huxley, any1? (by jan coeli on 2008-12-30 03:42:57 GMT from United States)
am not sure -- but -- has any1 @ this site follwed recent demise of open darwin & ressurection as "pure" darwin?
realise there are so many "flavour-of-the-month" distros -- but -- be os & darwin BOTH have seeds of greatness as relevant os's...
198 • darwin & huxley... (by jan coeli on 2008-12-30 03:46:30 GMT from United States)
199 • openSUSE has an default idle 600 (10min) timeout for ppp connections (by Stumped on 2008-12-30 08:01:04 GMT from Australia)
....and it had me stumped for a few weeks since I installed Suse 11 and used it with 3G mobile broadband connection for Internet access. It might be good security practice to have such a setting but it can be bloody frustrating if it is not documented how to easily modify same. I also tried Ubuntu 8.10 and Fedora 10 live-cds and they both don't use this setting.
Poking around the /etc/ppp/ folder and the config files found in there, today I STUMBLED upon the MAGIC SOLUTION - 'idle 600' option in the 'options' config file (/etc/ppp/options). Changing the idle option to 1800 or 3600 will give one 30min or 60min idle timeout. Though I have not tried it, I think 'idle 0' option is supposed to turn off the idle timeout completely.
I hope this tip helps some other frustrated suse user venturing into the linux world.
200 • Wolvix (by capricornus on 2008-12-30 08:02:30 GMT from Netherlands)
I just read this on wolvix.org:
"Due to the fact that I've been unable to pay my internet bill which was due about one month ago, my internet connection will be shut off for a while, unless I manage to conjure up the money (which I don't have) by Wednesday 31.12.2008. Since I'm hosting wolvix.org from my home this website and the forums will be unavailable until I get this fixed. The ISO files and the repository will be available as normal, since this hosted by our sponsors.
I'm sorry it had to come to this, but I'll try to get it sorted as soon as possible. If you're reading this, please help me spread the word, so people will know that Wolvix is still alive and that I'll try to get things up and running again."
I would deplore the going away of this excellent but underrated distro.
201 • WOLVIX (by Wolvrik on 2008-12-30 10:28:03 GMT from United States)
I have been through hundreds of poorly designed, half-finished, lacking this or that, throw away distros (as have many of us I'm sure). Wolvix is one of the real gems of the Linux world. It isn't shiny or flashy but it looks real good. You won't see a new release rolled out every two weeks but that is because it was built with a plan and built well. Some of the software is slightly dated but you won't really notice it much rather, you will be amazed at the ease of operability. You might be stunned at how it all just melds together in a seamless functional design that captures the power and gracefulness of what a Linux distribution should be. I hope more people will give it a try. It would be real sad to see it go away.
202 • wolvix (by oithona on 2008-12-30 17:20:15 GMT from United Kingdom)
Wolvix is not going anywhere. Wolven has stated that he has some personal difficulties, but provision is currently being made to ensure that the site does not disappear. It is also no secret that version 2.0 is currently under development, and a first release is expected quite soon. Rejoice.
203 • Rejoice (by capricornus on 2008-12-30 20:45:26 GMT from Belgium)
I will rejoice, Oithona, because you told me so. I'm writing this on Antix, of which I truly believe it could be a nefew of Wolvix: fit to serve older pc's, of which there are many. Would you believe that 1 out of 4 Dutch pc' s are thrown away because they are virus ridden? All these machines could become Wolven. Or Antics. Because they are fit to do the right job: not to serve the botnets, but their owner.
204 • Wolvix (by Wolvrik on 2008-12-31 00:11:43 GMT from United States)
Ok, good. Sorry if that was a little "alarmist" but I REALLY like Wolvix. It may be no "secret" that 2.0 is under development but I didn't know it so thanks for the good news.
I agree Capricornus, we don't need more perfectly usable computers sitting in landfills polluting the earth.
205 • @ 194 + 187 (by Pseudonym on 2008-12-31 01:49:11 GMT from United States)
Actually 192 makes a good point, it should be easier to purchase PowerDVD for Linux so that we can watch encrypted DVD movies (and give RMS heartburn).
Same goes with any of the patented codecs, distributions _should_ provide a link to where they can be purchased, hopefully with an explanation as to why they can't be distributed legally.
but ultimately the question is whether you would be convicted. Nobody knows the answer. If you purchase a DVD and play it on your home computer, what are the odds that a jury will throw you in jail? We simply don't know. The same goes for w32codecs and all that.
You won't end up in Jail. It is a civil infraction, not a criminal one so you'll just end up with a $$multi-million fine that forces you into bankruptcy.
Maybe if the FSF wouldn't waste its time trying to get us to waste Apple Store employees time they could effectively lobby against the idiotic patent laws...
206 • #205 Who you going to tell... (by From the desk of The Bailiff on 2008-12-31 03:08:43 GMT from United States)
How are they going to throw anyone in jail or even fine them.
First they have to know who's watching DVD movies "illegally" on their computer. How are they going to do that. Some sort of magic.
I image there are millions of "illegal" movie watching on pc's as I speak.
The real crime is in the law!
207 • A Good Year (by Jim Hayes on 2008-12-31 08:38:14 GMT from United States)
Your publication is the best (IMHO) linux news/distro site on the web. I look about once a week and distro-hop about once a month just to see what is out there.
Getting the new Sabayon-64 right now, gonna let it download all nite.
Thanks and a Merry Christmas and a Happy New year to all the staff and their families.
Jim in Texas
208 • @ 152 (by Blue Knight on 2008-12-31 19:30:39 GMT from France)
> "The out of the box is a pipe dream. Either you are going to have to swallow a big 4GB pill of bloatware"
Some distros like Mint for example you give an "out of the box" experience without "4GB pill of bloatware" in a Live CD!
209 • "Out of the box experience" (by Arsenio Corridor on 2008-12-31 20:16:06 GMT from United States)
Yam Linux is the best as far as I can tell: any bloat is from over eating. Great for the whole family, especially around the holidays. Comes in a speciall "candied" version for you who love to grit your teeth and get a sugar high while eating.
Yam Linux, at your local produce department, now (you mus build from scratch, but still).
210 • Time to Reconsolidate Our Efforts (by Anonymous on 2008-12-31 23:15:45 GMT from United States)
As the world economy heads toward it's eventual bottom. People are spending far too many resources trying to keep the flavor of the day alive.
There was a time when it was nice to boast of over 180 distros alive and viable in the world but this is just plain waste. The amount of individual effort and the bandwidth, not to mention the mixed signals being sent into the world.
The CPU and bandwidth intensive distros like Gentoo have got to go they are bad business for everyone. There is just too many resources being applied in areas that are having diminishing returns.
I certainly would not advocate rallying around a commercial distro unless it was one of the open ones. You know who they are. Furthermore the efforts would be best spent on those distros that would give the greater return with respect to the societal issues at hand. Yes, that would mean favoring one of the global distros with your time and resources.
People we are all in this together and it is heart rendering for me to hear about all the sites that have gone off line and EVEN THE POSSIBILITY that the fruits of someone's efforts do not make it into the light.
Hack it up, mark it up. Take a stance, often we give nothing because either we don't believe in or don't abide by certain stances and policies of the distro or the admins.
I'm not saying get religion, I'm saying find a communal watering whole that is going to feed the needs of the greater and focus your intent there and not on how independent and frivolous we can be with our coding talent.
All Are One,
Happy New Year!
211 • #210 (by anticapitalista on 2009-01-01 00:20:58 GMT from Greece)
I'd just like to say that I couldn't disagree more.
Happy New Year.
212 • Mepis Antix (by Glenn on 2009-01-01 02:47:13 GMT from Canada)
As I wrote earlier i was favourably impressed with Mepis Beta6 (and RC1) so I decided to also try Antix.
Nice piece of work.
Then I removed it to put on an updated versopn of one of my favourite distros that I use in my daily personal and professional life.
I then removed that distro and put Antix back on, loaded my VPN stuff, my work apps (Lotus Notes etc.) and thats what I'm using.
A test version for production use?
I must be sick... (GRIN)
Happy New year Anticapitalista.
Happy new year to all the rest of the gang also.
213 • Dick Cheney (by 210 on 2009-01-01 11:30:09 GMT from United States)
I'm guessing you are attempting humor, but if not, let me point out just one of the many flaws in your reasoning.
You want to (a) somehow force the elimination of distros so that (b) we can save on resources. So if you have to download a completely different set of packages from the default, and then spend all of your time figuring out how to configure things the way you like, then actually doing the configuring, how is that better than just distributing a bunch of different distros?
214 • RE 210 (by Landor on 2009-01-01 16:30:49 GMT from Canada)
As 213 said this has to be some kind of humourous post.
Gentoo a CPU and Bandwidth intensive distro? You're kidding right? Diminishing returns? lmao!
But as 213 said, let's say you're not joking.
I find it amusing you said distros like Gentoo but only picked Gentoo. Your post is filled with such vague assumptions/comments it's quite funny. Gentoo "may" need a bit more of resources from the cpu/ram on first building it but after tweaking I would guess it uses far less than one of these "Global" distros you forgot to mention by name. I won't even touch the ludicrous "bandwidth" comment.
What else I found amusing is Gentoo was the only distro you mentioned. Are you the Weekly/Bi-Weekly Gentoo hater that still uses it?
Keep your stick on the ice... Something tells me you need to.
215 • @ 206 (by Anonymous on 2009-01-01 19:33:26 GMT from United States)
How are they going to throw anyone in jail or even fine them.
First they have to know who's watching DVD movies "illegally" on their computer. How are they going to do that. Some sort of magic
The same way they find out about piracy, etc. Besides if your ethics are so high (or low depending on how you look at it) why don't you turn yourself in and take it to court. If you are right then the FOSS community benefits from legal, free DVD decryption. You obviously believe that you are right, so do us all a favor and make your civil disobedience meaningful by proving your point in court. :)
Or do you only follow laws when it is convenient for your personal choices?
216 • 216 - I DO NOT CARE (by John Wayne Casey on 2009-01-02 05:34:27 GMT from United States)
Your trying to make a moral issue out of this. So with that in mine, please read my lips - I do not care! I/we will FOREVER copy anything we can. You FOSS ( isn't that what you do with your teeth), or anyone else can't stop it. Period! Threaten, make more "laws", etc. Nothing will stop it.
So you should take FOSS as meaningless nonsense. Just look at all the distro's that ALLOW copying protected DVD's, or at least make it easy to do so.
And besides, I don't care. Excuse me while I go and finish ripping another DVD...
217 • Linpus-STAY AWAY (by che on 2009-01-02 06:55:09 GMT from United States)
I think you need to delete Linpus from your site.Nothing works on their website after you download for support. Their repositories are closed and adding to them is a pain. Also, their website has no way of contacting them, not even by buying an item-I tried to, just to see if I could email them to tell them how crappy they are.
218 • available Mandriva 2009 spring specs!! (by killer1987 on 2009-01-02 10:11:59 GMT from Italy)
there is a post that talks about mandriva 2009 specs, read it!!
219 • About me - @148 and others (by Adam Williamson on 2009-01-02 11:42:24 GMT from Canada)
Since a few people have asked what I'd be doing next after leaving Mandriva when it came up in the comments, I thought I'd just quickly mention my current plans:
220 • RMS on watching and copying DVDs (by Anonymous on 2009-01-02 11:44:09 GMT from Finland)
Some people here seem to think that it's FSF who wouldn't allow you to watch and copy your DVDs. But that is incorrect. You shouldn't blame FSF -- instead, you should blame the unjust patent laws and people who support DRM. I've just read a transcript of a Radio New Zealand interview with Richard Stallman where he comments on DRM encryption that restricts the watching and copying of DVDs.
"One of the big obstacles to Free Software today is the adoption of laws that prohibit Free Software. In the US there are two of them, one of them is patent law, of course that's not limited to Free Software, any program can be the target of that sort of prohibition in the US, but it's particularly bad for us, because our goal is to supply all of people's software needs, so if there's one thing we're not allowed to do, that is a serious problem.
But the other prohibition has to do with Digital Restrictions Management, and that -- which is also called DRM for short -- means publishing things in encrypted secret formats to stop people, to control how users use their copies. For instance DVDs are designed this way, and the format of a DVD was originally secret, and the companies that set up this conspiracy required everyone making a DVD player to sign a contract with them promising that those DVD players would restrict the users just like all the other DVD players, which by the way is why there's no innovation or progress in DVD players.
But someone figured out the secret and wrote a free program that you could put in your computer and use it to watch a DVD. You could also use it to copy a DVD, which I don't see any reason why you shouldn't be able to do."
The full transcript and the podcast (in MP3 and OGG) are available here:
221 • post#219 of Adam's (by Joey on 2009-01-02 12:47:58 GMT from United States)
Thanks for the update, Adam.
But the 2nd paragraph on that page begging for money betrays your reason for posting your "current plans."
222 • oy vey (by Oiving S. on 2009-01-02 18:00:11 GMT from United States)
(from Adams page link): "...you’ll notice the site also now has a donate button (and page). I figured some of you guys might be nice enough to just give me some money for being so generally damn handsome and marginally useful. If you like me working on Mandriva and on this site and you’d like me to be able to carry on devoting all of my working hours to it in future - please consider making a donation."
223 • 210 - Simply o.O (by Miq on 2009-01-02 20:03:13 GMT from Sweden)
Sorry to tell you this but poor punctuation sort of spoils the effect of inflammatory rhetoric in writing...
Also, what are you on? Yes, the planet and humanity are in poor shape from over-consumption, but you know, Linux development isn't one of those aspects that contributes to that, you should rather attack the US citizens that ranks a second TV set "essential for living" (apparently 78% or all respondents in a recent survey). Secondly, Linux is where it is at from the decentralised development that characterises its history. You already have centralised development where it is currently relevant: KDE and GNOME for high-end GUIs; Debian and Red Hat for DEB/ATP and RPM software repos; and of course the Kernel. Linux would NOT be served by gathering all resources behind one to-be-monolithic distro to rule them all.
Still, thanks for the new years wishes! As we say in Sweden, I wish you all a Good Continuation!
224 • Distro package management (by Anonymous on 2009-01-02 20:35:06 GMT from Spain)
Is that package management pdf cheatsheet ready?
Will it ever be?
Is the link already somewhere and I can't see it?
225 • ERRATA CORRIGE: correct link to mandriva 2009.1 specs (by killer1987 on 2009-01-02 22:08:49 GMT from Italy)
due to a problem of layout the text about the mandriva 2009.1 specs has been moved to another post, here is the link:
226 • Open Source Software (by Anonymous on 2009-01-03 04:04:18 GMT from United States)
Microsoft I.E. has dipped to an estimated 69% Market share while Firefox which came out of the ashes of Netscape and release to Open Source has captured a more than 20% Market share. Open Source can work if we all would work together.
227 • @221 @222 (by Adam Williamson on 2009-01-03 06:22:44 GMT from Canada)
Well, yes, that's it. But it's not spam. Spam is mass, cross-posted, untargeted purely commercial advertising. I'm trying to figure out a way to keep doing what I do (and what a lot of people commented here and in other places that they valued), full-time. This is the best I can come up with. I'm posting here strictly because in this and previous DWW threads, people have told me they valued the work I do and asked what I plan to do in future, and that's the answer. That's all.
228 • @226 • Open Source Software (by Anonymous on 2009-01-03 06:49:42 GMT from United States)
Man I'm telling you that just about took my breath away when I saw that in the news. I remember back about 1997 when IE came back strong and walked away with the the browser 'standard' . Then I've been watching all the talking heads and the 'key' indicators as they put it. On it has gone over the last decade. We're here, the theoretical tipping point where M$ looses control of the internet, media, the whole thing.
Those were the statistics they've been pointing at for the last 11 years. When any single browser takes more than 20% of the market share that would put IE at about 70% and the end would follow.
It could take 5 years, but I can wait. By the time they plant Bill at the Gates of Hell, Microsoft will be used for nothing but kitchen appliances.
I still remember the email he sent be back in the early 1990s, the arrogant little schmuck. He couldn't understand why people would not accept his dream for the future. I think he should still be tried for crimes against humanity, but that just shows the difference between us.
Good news indeed. Geeze Bill with all your Billions you ought to do something about that slouch, you and all your billions..
229 • No subject (by Anonymous on 2009-01-03 10:01:43 GMT from United States)
Why don't you try to do what Mandriva can't? You should try to make money from desktop Linux. You can sell Linux on USB, help newbies and all that. Consider doing something while you still have your connection with Mandriva. It will help get your job back if nothing else.
230 • Adam (by Jerry B. on 2009-01-03 13:10:30 GMT from United States)
Adam's too helpful and productive in the Linux community to get mad at.
But the link is spam (in a rather benign way) because spam is not just mass emailings, etc, it is also a sort of deception of what is at the provided link. If Adam's link said "donation requests at the following link," it would not be spam.
231 • Starting the New Year With A Bang (by Landor on 2009-01-03 15:43:10 GMT from Canada)
I can't believe it Ladislav (if you're still moderating this area), you actually deleted my porst for the first time here in all the time I've been commenting (that I recall).
I don't believe it was harsh given the fact that the link was posted here and that was my honest view of Adam trolling for donations for what? Writing a blog? Assisting in questions regarding Mandriva?
Maybe I'm wrong but there's a lot of people who do that with "no expectations" of any monetary compensation at all.
Keep your stick on the delete key...
232 • FreeBSD 7.1 i386 Final (by Verndog on 2009-01-03 15:44:43 GMT from United States)
Without ANY fanfare, it looks like they released FreeBSD 7.1 Final!
You can get it here:
233 • BSD dual boot (by Anonymous on 2009-01-03 16:17:03 GMT from United States)
Is it possible to setup a dual boot (xp/bsd) boot? I tried once before and bsd overtook my bootsector where as Ubuntu was a bit more friendlier and accommodating a dual boot scenario. I AM NOT saying Ubuntu is better, I am just saying Ubuntu simply makes the dual boot process a whole lot easier.
234 • Re: 216 (by Anonymous on 2009-01-03 23:50:13 GMT from United States)
I do not care! I/we will FOREVER copy anything we can. You, FOSS, or anyone else can't stop it. Period! Threaten, make more "laws", etc. Nothing will stop it.
How do you expect the laws to change if you do nothing?
235 • @234 (by Miq on 2009-01-04 11:28:21 GMT from Sweden)
When a law principally makes the entire population criminals it is more akin to the notion of Ancestral Sin, and is meaningless and has to be changed or struck. Or you can just call the entire country a prison and claim success (hello John Carpenter).
236 • @235 (by Todd R. on 2009-01-04 18:43:39 GMT from United States)
Silly. Sad too. If it were making "the entire population" criminals, there would be nobody arguing to obey those laws.
But there is a substantial portion of the computing community, Linux included, which adheres to those laws.
Your hyperbole is absurd.
Number of Comments: 236
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|• Issue 989 (2022-10-10): Ubuntu Unity, kernel bug causes issues with Intel cards, Canonical offers free Ubuntu Pro subscriptions, customizing the command line prompt|
|• Issue 988 (2022-10-03): SpiralLinux 11.220628, finding distros for older equipment and other purposes, SUSE begins releasing ALP prototypes, Debian votes on non-free firmware in installer|
|• Issue 987 (2022-09-26): openSUSE's MicroOS, converting people to using Linux, pfSense updates base system and PHP, Python 2 dropped from Arch|
|• Issue 986 (2022-09-19): Porteus 5.0, remotely wiping a hard drive, a new software centre for Ubuntu, Proxmox offers offline updates|
|• Full list of all issues|
Star Labs - Laptops built for Linux.
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|Random Distribution |
Conectiva Inc. was a Brazilian company which used to develop a Linux distribution for the Brazilian and South American markets. It merged with MandrakeSoft in February 2005 to form Mandriva S.A., with headquarters in Paris, France.
TUXEDO Computers - Linux Hardware in a tailor made suite
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Learn more about our full service package and all benefits from buying at TUXEDO.
Star Labs - Laptops built for Linux.
View our range including the highly anticipated StarFighter. Available with coreboot open-source firmware and a choice of Ubuntu, elementary, Manjaro and more. Visit Star Labs for information, to buy and get support.