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1 • PC-BSD (by Andrew at 2008-03-17 10:50:40 GMT from Australia)
Nice review - I've got to try out PC-BSD or DesktopBSD for myself sometime soon...though I can't see myself using it fulltime
2 • comments (by mklinuxos.blogspot.com on 2008-03-17 11:05:52 GMT from Macedonia)
I'm glad to see PC-BSD is packed with KDE, I never tryed BSDs but I'll give this one a try.
Also, I'm glad to see that Solaris moves on with little surprises like this one with pkg-get. Hoping that pkg-get will get it's way to Project Indiana.
3 • PC-BSD (by G, on 2008-03-17 11:23:42 GMT from United Kingdom)
Yep, you are right, Susan. Even my humble SiS190 network chip wasn't detected in 1.5. I reported it and the best (only!) response I got was to install another NIC! That really will not do. And, presently, the old BSD keyboard non-functionality 'feature' has been reintroduced. Had to revert to 1.4 as this is a show stopper. Nil response on their forum. Amazing that the developers hadn't jumped on this issue immediately it was reported years ago. Reminiscent of the uncaring attitude of you-know-who.
Apart from those two, I tend to like it!!!
4 • PCLinuxOS (by qzxwQlxtgq on 2008-03-17 11:35:45 GMT from Finland)
I still think there icould be something odd in PCLinuxOS Page Hit Ranking figures. That distribution is popular - but it is not so popular as the PHR seems to show. All other indicators, from other websites show prove it. PCLInuxOS is popular but not the most popular distro out there. I don't know if there is something fishy, however, or if people interested in PCLinuxOS just visit DistroWatch frequently?
I have a couple of explanations, however. Of the major distributions introduced on the major distro page at DW, PCLinuxOS may be the least known. That might bring it some extra hits as curious visitors are just interested in seeing what that distro is about. Also when many other big distros use GNOME desktop nowdays, many KDE fans might be interested in checking PCLinuxOS as a major KDE-based alternative.
5 • Gentoo Updates (by phi on 2008-03-17 11:36:36 GMT from Romania)
"Gentoo Monthly Newsletter: 17 March 2008" ; see http://www.gentoo.org/
6 • PC-BSD and BSD's in general (by JustInterested at 2008-03-17 11:46:26 GMT from Australia)
Hmmm. Flaky support for NVIDIA based boards... Damn most of my PCs are of those types so looks like I'll be waiting for PC-BSD when based on freeBSD which I see support more NVIDIA based boards.
I did install freeBSD 7.0 (what a pain having to swap the various install CDs so many times after selecting various packages... something needs to be done about that!) on a test PC at work that had XP. I added an old hard-drive so as not to have to worry about the current hard disk in there. Ehhhh, nice. Everything l tried seemed to work OK so no problems there.
Had it installed for a few days but then for some reason when I booted an wanted to use XP it would always boot to freeBSD... strange.
cheers
7 • @6 (by JustInterested at 2008-03-17 11:49:37 GMT from Australia)
I meant to say "...I'll be waiting for PC-BSD when based on freeBSD 7.0..."
8 • Gentoo (by Matias on 2008-03-17 12:08:33 GMT from Norway)
It saddens me that gentoo is beguinning to stagnate again. But it is good to see that users are stepping up. I switched to arch a while ago and i dont regret it. Its fast and if you want to compile from source, you can with its abs system.
9 • PC-BSD and DesktopBSD (by Steve on 2008-03-17 12:15:59 GMT from United Kingdom)
I'm currently running PC-BSD on an nforce4 MSI K8 Neo4 Platinum system. Generally everything works well, with the exception of the usb ports. Apparently BSD has a problem with nforce4 usb 2 controllers. I recently swapped over to DesktopBSD and had exactly the same issue. I tried recompiling the kernel with the new USB4BSD driver stack and the ports were at least recognised. However, the system locked solid everytime I inserted a usb flash drive (I tried four different types). The conclusion I've come to is that freebsd support for nforce4 boards is still flaky, but hopefully it should be sorted out in the near future. Lets face it, nforce4 is hardly cutting edge hardware, and there's a lot of it about!
10 • fishy pclos (by Chon on 2008-03-17 12:17:51 GMT from Thailand)
4 • PCLinuxOS (by qzxwQlxtgq on 2008-03-17 11:35:45 GMT from Finland)
I still think there icould be something odd in PCLinuxOS Page Hit Ranking figures.
Pleeeeease, get a life
Chon
11 • RE 10 Tolerance and serious arguments (by dbrion on 2008-03-17 12:31:15 GMT from France)
Are the deep originality of PCLOL
12 • No subject (by Landon on 2008-03-17 12:33:23 GMT from United States)
I think the bot died...
Data span: 3 months
Rank Distribution H.P.D*
1 Ubuntu 1952
2 PCLinuxOS 1442
13 • RE 12 Looks like it.... (by Soloact on 2008-03-17 12:54:16 GMT from United States)
You're right, looks like a drop off there:<
p>30 day rating:
1. Ubuntu 2338
2. Mint 1596
3. openSUSE 1403
4. PCLinuxOS 1392
14 • Sad for Gentoo (by Kensai on 2008-03-17 13:06:02 GMT from Puerto Rico)
Well, I thought Gentoo was going to deliver this time, sadly it seems not, Gentoo will not change its ways so easily, a ship so big takes a lot of effort to manage. Is no secret that I am/was a Gentoo enthusiast, but the fact that it is in a state of pity saddens me, they released the newsletter, big deal, it seems the newsletter team has no connection with whats happening. The newsletter does not cover anything related to the projects stalled state.
Still, I have hope that one day, a captain will manage the ship, they refused the help of a captain already drobbins, in an ego boost, to say "Hey, we need no help", such a pity they in fact needed the help.
15 • @14 (by Matias on 2008-03-17 13:12:47 GMT from Norway)
/agree
Daniel Robbins come back
16 • PCLinuxOS (by Texas Tea on 2008-03-17 13:39:17 GMT from United States)
Having a life, i could care less what the page rankings of PCLinuxOS are.
All i know is i'm in love with the "radically simple" concept.
Have fun with whatever other distro you use, but you will only take PCLinuxOS
away from my cold dead hands.
17 • RE: 8 Arch & ABS (by Anonymous on 2008-03-17 13:44:18 GMT from United States)
I thought ABS was designed for compiling individual packages only. Can you actually use ABS to replace pacman altogether, and to maintain your Arch system via ABS alone? How does ABS compare to the advanced source-based package managers like portage in Gentoo and sorcery in SourceMage?
18 • RE 12, 13 Non,non,non, non le robot n'est pas mort.... (by Lazare on 2008-03-17 13:48:06 GMT from France)
"I think the bot died..."
Your data spans are too short: you could wait till a 6 month PHR is achieved , at least (this dampens the "popularity" peaks linked to frequent /*and relevant!!!*/ releases.)
BTW, I do not think there was/is a bot, but looo*ve, it its most irrational, out of subject (one can love ones parents/ children/ wife/God but an OS??? that is perverse or simply ridiculous) sense....
19 • BSD Desktop (PC-BSD) y Debian Desktop (Ubuntu Mepis) (by Marcelo on 2008-03-17 14:00:15 GMT from Dominican Republic)
Actual I see more move on FreeBSD y Debian Linux based systems tahn on another distros. PC-BSD do her job excelent for one FreeBSD based system, Ubuntu or Mepis for one Debian Linux based distribution.
Why do the another distros sleeping or dont have creative persons to do real open (free) innovations?
20 • @17 Arch and abs (by Bestiapeluda on 2008-03-17 14:31:11 GMT from Argentina)
I dont know if you can replace pacman totally with abs. You need pacnan to install the compiled packages so it handles dependencies. On the other hand i compile a lot of packages with abs. And i think there are some wrappers who have that kind of functionality.
@8 I myself used Gentoo and switched to arch
21 • Re: 4,10,11,12,13 (by one_beerhunter on 2008-03-17 14:37:07 GMT from United States)
I don't understand the Ford vs Chevy hostilities, we all know that the PHR's are less than scientific and should only be considered a general indicator of interest. The suggestion that whoever holds the top spot is somehow cheating or using bots is the true example of intolerance. From my own experience, I can see the PHR on a smaller scale... My local Linux Users Group... 3 years ago I ran Mandrake/Mandriva but always had an obscure Livecd called PCLOS, I was surrounded by Debian based distro's, some Redhat and SUSE users. Skip to present day and I'm running PCLOS 2007, as are several other members making it one of the most used distro's within our small group (20-25 users?) Even #12's comment makes perfect sense as PCLOS has yet to release a 2008 version, other newer released distro's like Ubuntu will move up the list. When PCLOS releases it's 2008 version it will rise or fall in the PHR based upon the generated interest. I don't see any problem with the PHR, I suspect the problem lies with those who cannot tolerate their personal choice of distro being listed as less than #1.... Just my 2 cents worth...
22 • Re: 21, 4, 10, 11, 12, 13 (by Sam on 2008-03-17 15:13:27 GMT from United States)
Over the last year I've probably tested out every distro/BSD flavor in the top 40 rankings on this site. I have no particular problem with any of them -- well, except for Elive and its "we're going to call this open source, GPL, freely-distributable, but prevent you from installing the betas to your hard drive and generally run this like a closed source for-profit system" behavior.
That said, I'm running a diversity of distros right now including Fedora, openSUSE, Mandriva (wife's laptop) and eeedora (but might try out the new Sabyon on the Asus once it goes to a release candidate).
So, my curiosity (I don't dwell on it) over why PCLOS is #1 on Distrowatch is not based out of distro fanboyism or dislike for PCLOS. I've tried PCLOS, both on a testing laptop and in VMware. I just don't get it. Nothing seems particularly special or "oooh wow" interesting about the system. Seems to be just another run-of-the-mill linux distro. Why it isn't floating around the #10 to #15 slots is curious to me.
23 • PCLOS & Ubuntu... (by Farhan Ahmad on 2008-03-17 15:17:15 GMT from United Kingdom)
My comments on the soft-war going on between Ubuntu & PCLOS. First thing, I am a Software Developer using Windows for over 12 years. First taste of Linux was about 7 years ago when I found it very hard and complicated (lack of tools!), then tried it again and Ubuntu (6.x) was "The Next Big Thing" - it saved my life a few times when I recovered my Windows disks using Ubuntu, so I have my respect for Ubuntu. I played with it a lot and have to say it got me going with Linux again. Then got busy and started again end of last year. I feel I am an intermediate sort of user and know where to go and what to do even with Linux. This is where I find Ubuntu too restrictive in many ways for someone who has been on computers for a long time. Many of these restrictions I find are to do with GNOME which I believe has less tools & utilities then KDE.
Tried to PCLinuxOS and have always felt at home with it. No restrictions, and then KDE has a lot of good tools. Already have two machines at home setup with PCLinuxOS and I couldn't agree more with "21" that we don't even have the 2008 released. Can't wait for both PCLinuxOS and KDE4 (well, I don't want to install it as an add-on). They are both good - Ubuntu was my "1st crush", but it is to provide an "idiot" proof system that you won't easily break while trying to learn Linux, PCLinuxOS - I believe - takes you a step further and gives you full power with a VERY GOOD Package Manager. This by the way, makes a BIIIIIG difference! Even if I could get Fedora to work on one of my machines again (7 installations failed due to updates of large number packages) I would still not go with it because its default Package Manager is... Rubbish!
The main difference is between the Desktops (GNOME & KDE), which is where (I think) KDE wins. The Package Manager is also better in PCLinuxOS - you only ever work with Synaptic, where as Ubuntu uses Synaptic & Apt-Get (I think) - waiting for you to take a wrong step and 'khaboooom' :-(. The 3D-Desktop works better with KDE (as I have experienced). Base system is the Linux Kernal in both, which one could say wipes out any differences, but even there Ubuntu restricts many commands that PCLinuxOS doesn't. You can get around that, but why re-invent the wheel!
In short, Ubuntu is one I would recommend to a newbie (my Second Choice), but my Favorite is PCLinuxOS!
24 • RE 23 There is something which makes PCLOL rank unlikely (by dbrion on 2008-03-17 15:29:56 GMT from France)
C'est qu'elle est monolingue.... et tellement originale...
Take at random ,among the 200 first distributions, one (not the worst, not the best) of them; tell some people they must cli-cli on it, every day, in DW HPDs:
it will likely have a very interesting rising rate in the HPD ratings, and other people will be interested/curious about the huge specificities of this rising distribution.... and feel cheated (but their hits will remain!!).
There is no need for a bot, nor for interest( PCLOL had trouble with her downloads servers, last year, which increase the interest in DW).
As for traditionnal recommandations to newbies, I have but one : if you have not a friend who installs his favorite distro (or a PC seller), just read Linux Identity Kit -based in Newark, USA, but is written in French, too) or a similar cellulotic paper and you will find almost all the elements you need to decide, not by a rat-vote, but rationnally, what one should install.
25 • #16 (by Rad at 2008-03-17 15:32:55 GMT from United Kingdom)
in about 5 years of my using different linux distros I think I really stopped distro-hopping thanks to PCLOS - on my main computer almost non-stop for about a year and a half now!
26 • Reverting (by Anonymous on 2008-03-17 16:16:34 GMT from United States)
I use PCLOS and I'm reverting back to 2007. The black theme is too dark for one thing. And the old intel8x0/Soundpro bug is crashing Kmix again. Also the USB write isn't working either it hangs at 50% after doing a cancel when it can't find the iso. I can't even get this one to share the NTFS partion on the same machine let alone the other drives on the network, and yes I tried the harddrake and utilities wizzards.
About the hit rankings, it is all about who is new or in beta, more than who is hot/not. Get over it.
27 • Re:23 (by Dante on 2008-03-17 16:21:33 GMT from Netherlands)
you could have given Kubuntu a try, solves the KDE problem between Ubuntu and PCLinuxOS. :)
Personally, PCLinuxOS has failed to install on several of my machines. Always graphical problems. So I never actually had a good spin with it.
I like distro`s with character and good performance; Ubuntu, Fedora, Mint, Sabayon, Mandriva, Suse, Debian, slackware and many more.
One of the major distro`s with character and performance is/was Gentoo. I cry day and night to slowly see this great distro go down the drain by a the incompetence of their maintainers. Work as a team!!! I would love to see Gentoo back in the top 5, were it belongs.
Cheers!
28 • PCLinuxOS (by Farhan Ahmad on 2008-03-17 16:46:55 GMT from United Kingdom)
Yea, me again.
1 - Rad: Agree with you. I think that is Linux power, not so much a trick of PCLOS, but it does mean PCLOS doesn't abuse the resources of Linux
2 - Guy with NTFS issues, I got my 1 External USB NTFS drive, and 1 Internal NTFS drive working on SAMBA share in PCLinuxOS with Read/Write. Just had to install NTFS-3G package and its supporting GUI tool from package manager (hope this helps)
3 - Dante: Funny you mentioned Kubuntu. I was playing with the three Distros last Saturday on my most recently converted laptop to Linux. Kubuntu LiveCD didn't want to boot-up. When it eventually did, I did the install but it couldn't find the boot partition on restart (and I was not being dumb). Tried the install three times in total and same thing. Then tried Ubuntu, and given the Laptop is quite old, it had problems configuring all the devices, which is where I was again hit with the restrictions. Then I came back to PCLinuxOS (strange that I actually tried my most favorite as the last option!).
My first experience with Kubuntu (v6.x) wasn't too good either, but I thought things would have changed with time. The Laptop that Kubuntu didn't want to work on (and by the way, this is from the guy who has already done Configurations of Software/Hardware RAID, Multi-Disks, Dual-Boots, USB Disk installs and all the other stuff with the disks), Ubuntu was being difficult with, in the end PCLinuxOS works on it, and now runs SAMBA, FTP Server, and Media Server.
29 • #21 and #22 (by Rad on 2008-03-17 17:18:00 GMT from United Kingdom)
I cannot understand anyone saying PCLinuxOS is simply like the rest of those 'out-of-the-box' distros. I simply cannot. I have been using a number of 'user-friendly' distros for about half a decade and in my opinion PCLOS is simply... either the best or in the first 2-3 of the best GNU/Linux distributions.
30 • RE 25,29 PCLOL grand professionalism (by dbrion on 2008-03-17 17:26:11 GMT from France)
" have been using a number of 'user-friendly' distros for about half a decade"
What a huge waste of time. Does years lasting failure entitle anyone to decide about a distro's abilities?
In the real world, it would rather be a
fire
war case
(not mild flame war)
Quelle nullité, satisfaite de lui-même!!! Voilà l'audience de la huitième merveille du monde!!!!!
31 • #28 (by Rad on 2008-03-17 17:27:13 GMT from United Kingdom)
cheers, mate! :-)
now, let me add to more things: the number of PCLOS-derived distros is a good proof it's a part of the First League; my TV card (USB) works fine with PCLOS and so does my HP all-in-one scanner/printer/copier. I wonder how many other linux distros can actually achieve that.
32 • Sidux (by jeffcustom on 2008-03-17 17:34:37 GMT from United States)
Sidux 2008-1 preview 2 is out. Everyone take the time to look at this great distro that is fast and gives you the latest packages with stability if you are willing to learn just a little.
33 • My FreeBSD DVD (by Eric on 2008-03-17 17:55:09 GMT from Canada)
"I did install FreeBSD 7.0 (what a pain having to swap the various install CD's so many times after selecting various packages... something needs to be done about that!)"
Well interestingly enough I was so pissed at the matter that I hopped onto the IRC and everywhere to find a solution for this matter as well, it took about an hour of swapping the CD's to get a final installed FreeBSD 7.0-RELEASE system. So I just modified all the important installation CD's (1,2,3&docs) and compiled them into one DVD to install from. The release team for some odd reason doesn't like the DVDs, but I happen to have had an article about me and Dru Lavigne on this subject at
http://www.freebsdos.com/news/2008/02/28/freebsd-70-DVDs/
There you can snag my DVD from a very active and healthy torrent, I was surprised as it was very well adopted and clearly was a niche needed filling. Funny thing though, in IRC I conversed with Dru Lavigne(and two other people regarding a wiki entry) and gave her the idea of the DVD making method on IRC via pastebin, but the site clearly thinks we were separate on the matter. But I only wanted to provide a DVD and she wanted to share the process of creation, so that's how that went down.
I hope it will be as useful for you as it has been for me since OMG I hated swapping them freaking CD's as well, your not alone, actually a couple thousand that used my torrent think the same :)
The different torrent sites I put the DVD on show my same release notes,
Enjoy the fruits of my labour!! :D
34 • No subject (by Anonymous on 2008-03-17 17:57:22 GMT from United States)
> I wonder how many other linux distros can actually achieve that.
Huh? I have those working easily in other distros. If PCLinuxOS has some kind of special sauce to make it work better than others, it won't last long, because it's GPL'd!
35 • 31 Intellectual and financial value meet and make PCLOL a wreckt. (by dbrion on 2008-03-17 18:05:09 GMT from France)
"First League; my TV card (USB) works fine with PCLOS and so does my HP all-in-one scanner/printer/copier. I wonder how many other linux distros can actually achieve that.
"
And I wonder what the price of such Holy Hardware will be in two years: ask a pawnbroker and you will get First League derision laughter....
BTW, the Titanic, too, had nice hardware ... her captain has been a *real* hero... and she was popular...
36 • My latest tests (by MacLone on 2008-03-17 18:12:57 GMT from Mexico)
Well, i have been testing a lot o distros this past months, maybe 30-40.
I really liked PCLinuxOS but the latest kernel update brought too many problems to my laptop i simply had to wipe it off my hard drive. Blank screens, scsi recog (noscsi) problem at boot, none of the many configs i did solved the video problem...really pitiful for the otherwise great distro pclos 2007 was. I have to accept my Dell Ispiron 1100 has the worst intel chipset ever made and i have suffered a lot with 90% of all distros tested here. My Atlon 1700+ PC is not that problematic but i use it only for testing not my regular as my lap.
Right now i'm testing Dreamlinux and i must say the latest RC3 is impressive, and i think the final can go easily to the most popular linux distros.
I'm really excited with the perspective of o seeing Linux as a windows replacements once for all. I love my mac and use windows as my daily work but i don't like the way microspot do business.
If you don't like the way rankings are done why not implement a "one vote per month" only? Just make a poll with the 100 best known and you can vote once a month if you're a registered user at distrowath. It might work.
37 • PCLOS phr slide (by surf21 on 2008-03-17 18:31:12 GMT from United States)
Unfortunately, I'm not surprised. I have been using PCLos since 0.92a, and have noticed an accelerating slide in forum support and aknowledgement of PCLos's responsibility for several serious regressions after new releases.
For example, many things that worked fine in 0.93a failed to after upgrading to 0.94. Likewise their support for SATA drives (at least on NVidia boards) has been abysmal. One moderator complained to users to stop posting on this issue, without offering ANY help, other than to use APPROVED h/w. In my search for clues to this problem, I was struck by this individuals frequent replies to users posts without offering any worthwhile comments, which to me seemed more to drive up his posting rating rather than to offer any genuine help :(
Meanwhile, my trusty old SLAX 5.1.4 and Simply Mepis live cd's from about 2004 would boot and display or mount my SATA drive fine. :)
Texstar, if you're listening, I suggest that you check on the performance of your moderators to ensure that they are genuinely trying to help your users more than themselves, and perhaps find someone to monitor the number of posts regarding issues for trends that indicate where improvement may be desired. You have a good distro, but it currently has some problems, which if addressed promptly and well, will most likely turn this slide around :)
38 • Theyre done (by Anthony on 2008-03-17 19:20:02 GMT from United States)
Stick a fork in gentoo, its done.
39 • Eee PC edition of Xandros Desktop (by Alter Ekko on 2008-03-17 19:29:49 GMT from Norway)
I've seen webpages claiming that an Asus Eee PC is sold
every two seconds. Impressive.
Does this make Xandros one of the best
selling distros in the world I wonder.
And many of those users perhaps don't even know
that they are using linux!
40 • Vanilla Fudge Forever! (by Andy Axnot on 2008-03-17 19:30:26 GMT from United States)
I don't understand all this PCLOS bashing. It's an excellent distro, period.
Trying to decide which is the "best" distro is silly. It's like trying to decide the best flavor of ice cream. You might not like what I do. Big deal.
I love vanilla fudge (and most flavors, but not Rocky Road), and I love PCLOS.
Be forewarned: if any of you Rocky Road fanboys try pushing your obviously second rate flavor you're just inviting a flame war.
Andy
41 • RE 40 Encore un exemple de la valeur intellectuelle du clone... (by dbrion on 2008-03-17 19:36:58 GMT from France)
"I love vanilla fudge (and most flavors, but not Rocky Road), and I love PCLOS"
Qu'est ce que je m'en moque...
"Be forewarned: if any of you Rocky Road fanboys try pushing your obviously second rate flavor you're just inviting a flame war.""
Ah, tiens, je croyais qu'il y avait des nouvelles intéressantes cette semaine, telle que l'arrive des SD et leur croissance lente (et PCBSD est multilingue); Ceci est logique, devant les temps de non-detection des pannes de Linux(plis d'un an pour un noyau 2.6.17... PCLOL a eu un rôle glorieux là dedans).
Au fait, vous ne saurez jama
42 • suite 40 (by Anonymous on 2008-03-17 19:38:48 GMT from France)
Au fait, vous ne saurez jamais (question de pudeur, terme intraduisible) quelle est ma distribution favor.ite.
43 • End of Day, What matters most... (by Farhan Ahmad on 2008-03-17 19:39:17 GMT from United Kingdom)
is What best serves your need...
Thought I will add a final point in this - I think all the distro's are great! They are all backed by Linux - the "grand-daddy". Some use Linux well, others mess it up. Some care about now, others case about future, and the great ones care about the old machines as well, which is where my interest in Linux started from - how you can run Linux well on a machine that Windows would just reject!
Take the one that has the tools and looks you need. No single distro is going to have everything you need. As I am a developer, end of the day I will be putting Slackware/FreeBSD (etc) on a server, not PCLinuxOS/Ubuntu/SUSE/Fedora. All the fancy Graphics and NVIDIA (etc) don't matter on the server!!! Hope we all agree on that. Lets celebrate Linux, and variety we get from all the distros of it!
44 • Sidux (by RuralRob on 2008-03-17 19:48:16 GMT from United States)
I second #32's recommendation to try Sidux. I used to use PCLinuxOS, but wanted to try something more "cutting edge". I gave Sidux a try, and haven't looked back since. Just installed Sidux 2008 Preview 1 on my new Dell Vostro laptop, and it runs beautifully "out of the box". Sidux's hardware-detection abilities are second to none, in my opinion (it was the only distro of a half dozen I tried on the laptop that recognized the touchpad as a *touchpad* instead of a generic mouse).
45 • @37 - there was no PCLOS 0.94 (by alanbcohen on 2008-03-17 19:59:38 GMT from United States)
Sorry Surf,
There was no version 0.94 for PCLOS, just early betas before 2007 was released. Good luck in your future use of Linux. Other than some initial issues getting PCLOS 2007 working with my laptop video (Intel 945), PCLOS has been working for me fine since early last year.
46 • #39 (by wazza on 2008-03-17 20:39:15 GMT from Australia)
I've seen webpages claiming that an Asus Eee PC is sold
every two seconds. Impressive.
Does this make Xandros one of the best
selling distros in the world I wonder.
And many of those users perhaps don't even know
that they are using linux!
Good point. Xandros was the very first linux distro I tried and it sold me on linux. It made me realise how crappy Windows was. I have tried many distro's and am now a confirmed pure debian user. It is my experience that all linux distro's have their good points and bad points. Nothing is 100%perfect.
We are all human beings with emotions and passions and various linux distro's seem to stir up those emotions and passions. Ah! the power of linux. Most of us are here because our passions are not with Windows, so let's just enjoy the ride. If we all shared the same interest then things would get boring very fast.
Let us all celebrate this wonderful gift called "linux" and enjoy it.
47 • Joint effort to make distros better (by Saul on 2008-03-17 20:52:29 GMT from United States)
It seems as though 99% of the declarations on what is the "superior" distribution have to do with someone's experience that this or that distribution worked on a given piece of hardware while some other distro didn't. Seeing as we're all pro-free software, it seems as though we should have some kind of public effort to figure out exactly why some distros work and others don't on a particular piece of hardware. There are particular bits of successful code that need to discovered and shared. There's no need for one-upsmanship here--it's pointless and counterproductive. We should be aiming toward the goal of making all distros work on all software, right?
I know that linuxquestions has a hardware compatibility list, but it seems unwieldy and it doesn't seem to get used that much. It seems as though there should be some simpler way to gather information for the purposes of sharing. Maybe distro leaders or kernel hackers or someone else could come up with some website that people could go to to report success or failure in various areas. It could have some quick and simple interface in which you could input your hardware (maybe with a dropdown list or successive dropdown lists as you see on some sites that sell memory) and your distro, and then a set of questions--did this work, did that work, etc. The site could be refined as needed to help narrow problems down. If enough people used it, it should be possible to isolate what distros fail where, and then figure out what code other distros use to succeed in those areas. This might be something like an uber-comparative bugzilla, but maybe it could be simpler than a bugzilla, so that more people would be encouraged to use it. Such a site should also be completely public and open, so that anyone could participate at any level.
Maybe such a system already exists and I just haven't heard about it. If it does exist, it needs to be made more well known. If it doesn't already exist, does anyone else think this is a good idea? Any other suggestions? Anyone know who could implement it?
48 • Linux Microkernel/Exokernel (by technosaurus on 2008-03-17 21:08:30 GMT from United States)
It appears that the time has come to rethink the UltraMegaMonolithicLinuxKernel. Sure many apps would have to be retooled to use asynchronous calls, but it would allow faster, easier inclusion of hardware support and functionality across distros. Less patches, better reliability, increased security, better configurability... Too bad Linus doesn't like the idea.
49 • Trend micro ads!!! (by Andrea on 2008-03-17 21:09:01 GMT from Italy)
get those trend micro ads away!
check out http://www.gnu.org/
and see why we should boycott trend micro.
distrowatch, this hurt from you.
50 • Rankings (by shrek on 2008-03-17 22:00:57 GMT from United States)
You know, Redhat is never ranked very high. But I bet it is on more systems and servers than PCLinuxOS, and Ubuntu.
Those rankings are quaint, but the people complaining about them every stinking week are getting annoying.
Shrek
51 • gentoo releng (by anonymous on 2008-03-17 22:47:22 GMT from Austria)
i don't know where you see a problem
the releng team is working hard though facing some dificulties
and i would rather see them work than doing time consuming pr-work
#gentoo-releng @ irc.freenode.net
[16:03] yngwin: yes, we know we're behind schedule. however, we still don't know *when* we're going to hit certain events
[16:03] it also doesn't help that our lead is currently out of town dealing with family stuff
for more information read the gentoo forums or join the irc chan
these guys do great things in their spare time and they do them for free
i think some people have to accept that gentoo is a community-driven project and the developers have a real live too
and in fact: gentoo is rolling-release -> no difference between installing from 2007.0 or 2008.0 after emerge --sync && emerge -DuN world
if your hardware is not supported by 2007.0 use systemrescuecd (livecd based on gentoo) to chroot and install
i would recommend to use the stages from http://funtoo.org/linux/ instead the offical ones
and: gentoo works perfectly behind the scenes; i have tried serveral distros but no other linux distro has such a great package manager and maintaining is not only easier but also more flawless
have a nice day
a passionate gentoo user
52 • Arch (8 & others) (by MB on 2008-03-17 23:09:11 GMT from Australia)
Installing Arch was my Xmas project.
It took a day or so to get everything right but so far it is the most solid and fastest distro I have used to date.
I still have a partition that boots 64Studio. An excellent distro for multimedia but Arch is more reliable for work.
I tried Mint on my laptop and hated it - almost as bloated as Windows.
However I have put Ubuntu on my kids' computers.
Easy to maintain and easy to use.
I am trialling FreeBSD 7.
Unlike any Linux I have tried ACPI actually works properly on my Acer laptop.
It might be a keeper.
53 • @50 ranking (by jeje on 2008-03-17 23:23:13 GMT from France)
Yes, it seems that thoses rankings are something like "newbies" rankings !!!! And sometimes newbies are annoying ! ;-)
Hey, you, kiddies, go, put your bedrooms in order and wash your teeth, it's time to go to bed, now... An if you are quiet, I will tell you the story of Tux before you sleep ...
54 • .94=2007 (by Warp0 on 2008-03-17 23:30:13 GMT from United States)
"There was no version 0.94 for PCLOS, just early betas before 2007 was released."
What is now called 2007 was often called .94, even on the PCLOS web site. Go there and search for .94 ... you'll find lots of threads discussing .94/2007.
55 • @33 (freeBDS 7.0 DVD) (by JustInterested at 2008-03-17 23:30:24 GMT from Australia)
Great! Thanks for that - I did some see on another forum here in Oz that someone else had talked about "getting RSI with freeBSD 7.0"... After I read that post I figured out what he/she meant!
I'll have to get your remastered DVD - nice job!
cheers.
56 • No subject (by Landon on 2008-03-18 00:18:45 GMT from United States)
I posted comment 12 and in all fairness to PCLOS, I used it for a year and loved it. I paid numerous times for a PASS account and have the utmost respect for texstar. The reason I quite PCLOS was due to the moderators, specifically 1 with an out of control attitude. That's no secret and anyone who spends time with PCLOS knows that.
Regardless, it's a fine distro. The community however wasn't for me. Sorry for the sophomoric bashing.
57 • Starting to get sick of PCLOS... (by Desmond on 2008-03-18 00:35:56 GMT from Canada)
My God, is that all you people ever talk about anymore? For the last three months (probably longer) on the DWW comments, about 50% of the postings were about PCLOS. The last two weeks it was hardly mentioned. Thank goodness, I thought! But I guess I spoke too soon... Now it's back!
No, I've got nothing against PCLOS--I'm just SICK of reading 40 comments of pointless "PCLOS sucks"; "No way! PCLOS rules!"; "PCLOS is cheating on the PHR!" remarks. Give it a rest, please. All distributions have their strengths and weaknesses.
Now I feel sick because I've gotten pulled into this garbage and ranting about PCLOS myself!
Ugh... I may have to stop reading DWW comments.
58 • RE: #41's "Ah, tiens, je croyais.... " (by EisBlade at 2008-03-18 02:49:16 GMT from United States)
"41 • RE 40 Encore un exemple de la valeur intellectuelle du clone... (by dbrion on 2008-03-17 19:36:58 GMT from France)
"I love vanilla fudge (and most flavors, but not Rocky Road), and I love PCLOS"
Qu'est ce que je m'en moque...
"Be forewarned: if any of you Rocky Road fanboys try pushing your obviously second rate flavor you're just inviting a flame war.""
Ah, tiens, je croyais qu'il y avait des nouvelles intéressantes cette semaine, telle que l'arrive des SD et leur croissance lente (et PCBSD est multilingue); Ceci est logique, devant les temps de non-detection des pannes de Linux(plis d'un an pour un noyau 2.6.17... PCLOL a eu un rôle glorieux là dedans).
Au fait, vous ne saurez jama
"
** Something intelligible (read: english) would have made more impact. Until then, most garbage garbage written in french gets as much consideration as the lumps I flush daily.
59 • IMPORTANT MESSAGE FOR ALL DISTROWATCH READERS (by Andrew on 2008-03-18 02:51:24 GMT from Australia)
From next week, unless it's related to the distrowatch weekly do not:
1. Post rants in support of PCLOS
2. Post rants against PCLOS
This is getting beyond a joke. No other distro has their fanboys on here talking it up weekly in such numbers. A few comments here and there regarding obscure distros are fine - it's good to know that these less popular distros are suiting some people and are of a certain quality. Posting about PCLOS is like saying "Hey guys, have you heard about 'Ubuntu'? It's really cool!! EVERYONE CONVERT".
We've all heard of PCLOS. We've read enough comments to know that fanboyism is alive and well with it. Just stop posting about how wonderful it is.
60 • PCLOS is good; GRANULAR shines!! (by Anon on 2008-03-18 02:55:46 GMT from Norway)
Anyone tried the GRANULAR Preview?
I just did and it is the best GUI experience I've had with any distro or OS ever! Try it for a spin and wave goodbye to debianistas and likeminded tinkering purists forever ;-)
Myself, I'm staying with Bluewhite64. Nothing like trying to square the circle.
61 • @60 (by JustInterested at 2008-03-18 03:14:09 GMT from Australia)
+1 for BlueWhite64... Nice Slack distro with a really friendly atmosphere in the forums, and an especially helpful guy arny, the "head admin"!
Nice one Anon!
62 • Ulteo (by Anonymous on 2008-03-18 03:49:44 GMT from United States)
Anyone tried the new beta Ulteo release from the former Mandriva founder Gaël Duval?
63 • RE 58: you PCLOL tolerance and this week topic : Gentoo delays (by dbrion on 2008-03-18 07:02:49 GMT from France)
"Something intelligible (read: english) would have made more impact. Until then, most garbage garbage written in french gets as much consideration as the lumps I flush daily.
"
What about PCLOL multilingualism? You know, something useeful a Parasitically Crappy Liar Oriented "System" user claimed it existed?
OTOH, Gentoo is neither a
European train, nor a
plane
and releasing when there are not (too many) bugs is not a bad strategy (that makes Debian respected), unless Linux is but pure PR, without bug detection (this is however an ongoing trend, which makes some originality ....refreshing...). As Gentoo supports more architectures than the {Holy PC, x86, x86 again, oh! I forgot AMD}, and has much less maintainers/developpers than Debian, that makes her job difficult; however, their monthly newsletter is getting better and better, and taught me; as did nice articles written in GNU/linux Magazine in February 2008, explaining their source+bin package management... Even if they are a week/a month/a year late, they are not slaves, and if their work is good, users will end up/go on being satisfied.
64 • PCLINUXOS, Mint and ARCH (by Lycan on 2008-03-18 07:09:17 GMT from United States)
PCLINUXOS
MINT
UBUNTU
ARCH
Forever they go !!!
I wish the world would have less distros and just have these 4 + 6 more enterprise and stuff..
65 • Multilingual (by Anonymous on 2008-03-18 07:14:20 GMT from United States)
PCLinuxOS is multilingual. Just install your locale and change it in the Control Center. Wow another awesomely bad post by dbrion. Please find something more useful with your time than to slam.
66 • 62 Ulteo (by Anonymous on 2008-03-18 07:23:56 GMT from United States)
I loaded Ulteo in Virtual Box where it ran fairly well. It doens't seem to want to install on the virtual drive. I'm glad to see an Ulteo release. I was beginning to wonder if they were still developing the distribution.
67 • RE 65 Un autre mensonge (by dbrion on 2008-03-18 07:24:49 GMT from France)
AS PCLOL translation is a work in progress, perhaps it will be somehow multilingual in a year/a century: having a button in a control centre (oh, that is original, too!) does not mean anything about the quality (typos? exhaustiveness?) of a future mulltilingualism.
BTW "Just install " I do notlike being ordered... to install junk distributions (and KDE translations are far below minimal standards)...
Demain, on rasera gratis...
68 • No subject (by Anonymous on 2008-03-18 07:39:23 GMT from United States)
PCLinuxOs is multilingual. Is there some part of that you did not understand dbrion? Perhaps someday you can actually comprehend what you read.
69 • RE 68 Repetez votre mensonge 100 fois (by dbrion on 2008-03-18 07:52:46 GMT from France)
ou precisez :
a) s'il s'agit d'un bouton aboutissant dans le vide ou le déchet
b) si la traduction est exhaustive
c) et exempte de fôtes de frappe.
Dans les cas b) et c) qu'est ce qui vous donne la competence de pretendre juger de la qualite de la traduction?. (ne me dites surtout pas qu'il s'agit de KDE...)
70 • No subject (by Anonymous on 2008-03-18 08:14:58 GMT from United States)
"Something intelligible (read: english) would have made more impact. Until then, most garbage garbage written in french gets as much consideration as the lumps I flush daily."
71 • RE 65,68,70 Congratulations (by Anonymous on 2008-03-18 08:27:05 GMT from France)
You are beginning to prove that PCLOL is not multilingual, but liar - oriented.... and *that* tolerant.
How can PCLOL find any use /interest in a non-usEnglish speaking country?
Il n'est pas de problème auquel une réponse inadéquate n'apporte de solution.
72 • Bashing (by Vinze on 2008-03-18 08:49:21 GMT from Netherlands)
I'm getting tired of those bashing this or that distro. It doesn't help. We are all using Linux and what distro u use doesn't matter. Stop waisting time arguing about wich distro is better.
73 • gentoo (by anonymous on 2008-03-18 09:42:28 GMT from France)
Maybe Gentoo could use a little help on PR. But isn't that the job of distrowatch indeed? Maybe you could help conveying informations that nobody is interested in conveying?
For me, gentoo release is a non-event. I emerge word every week, so there is a new release every week for me. I have several other distros installed and I am annoyed by releases. Why can't I just upgrade?
74 • Linux Mint (by Texas_Mike on 2008-03-18 10:31:08 GMT from United States)
I just installed Linux Mint 4.0 a few weeks back. What a great distro! I didn't have to hunt around to get anything to work. Video works, plugins are install, audio works, etc...
First I installed the Main Edition ( Gnome ) but ended up installing the KDE CE edition. I just prefer KDE to Gnome is all. Now I understand why Mint has such a big following. A BIG thank you to all the folks involved in this distribution!
75 • QU 73 about the deadline disreprecting distro, Gentoo(like many others) (by dbrion on 2008-03-18 11:34:52 GMT from France)
" I emerge word every week"
What does it mean?
How much time and how many resources does it need?
Did you meet regressions?
Did you do something to avoid regressions?
FYI I am not a Gentoo fanboi, if such a variety of parasits exists. I just want to know.
Ne pensez pas que c'est un blasphème de s'interesser à une (meta) distribution réellement originale
76 • Re: 23 • PCLOS & Ubuntu (by With-held on 2008-03-18 12:13:48 GMT from Australia)
Farhan Ahmad - package managers
Apt-get and Synaptic the front end graphical user interface for Apt-get
First created for Debian (hence Ubuntu can use it with .deb's)
Then also there is Apt-get (RPM's) and Synaptic the GUI front end.
So 'can' use from the command line, JUST Apt-get on almost any .DEB or .RPM system
(NOTE: not recommended by PCLOS team, can be done by REAL Advance users - not wanna-bies)
Or one can use apt-get by the "Synaptic Package Manager" (ie. the correct name)
Recommended by PCLOS team + Ubuntu + many many other distros
Please don't argue about this, Apt-get + Synaptic GUI front end can be installed on many distros - and basically these work EXACTLY the same on and .DEB or .RPM system - NOTE: these are not longer to exclusive to Debian/Ubuntu/etc.
Notice I write "basically these work EXACTLY the same" - this does not mean they will be the same on different Distros > as the pros & cons are, only as good as those people have made the individual packages from the Source code and check the packages for Bugs before they publish them.
NOTE: Some distro packagers do a better job than other distros packagers :-(
OK - now go and do your own home work and find out the REAL FACTS
And to help people verify what I weite ? Here is just one place to start.
See here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Packaging_Tool
77 • Re: Distro bashing (by Anon on 2008-03-18 12:24:59 GMT from Norway)
From post 72:
"I'm getting tired of those bashing this or that distro. It doesn't help. We are all using Linux and what distro u use doesn't matter. Stop waisting time arguing about wich distro is better."
Distro bashing is one thing. Discussions and arguments about which distro is *better* is quite another. I see nothing wrong in criticizing solutions I consider to be sub par. On the contrary, such criticism is informative and therefore helpful for users and developers alike. It is actually the very core value of big words like "transparency", "open", "free", "market", "democracy" etc.
In short: don't bash distros, but DO bash counter-productive solutions!
78 • Frugalware (by Anonymous on 2008-03-18 12:34:16 GMT from United States)
My, what a friendly comments section this week!
I wanted to post that yesterday I upgraded my Frugalware installation to Kalgan and am very impressed. Mostly with the upgrade process, as it was the first I've done with Frugalware, and it was the smoothest and fastest of any distro I've used.
They do good work. If there were just more documentation and more active forums (mostly they consist of one guy who may or may not be in a good mood that day), I'd consider switching from Arch.
It's the fastest distro I've used, looks nice out of the box, and has a large selection of binary packages. Impressive.
79 • @ debrain (by Warp0 on 2008-03-18 15:46:55 GMT from United States)
"How can PCLOL find any use /interest in a non-usEnglish speaking country?"
You apparently have a lot of free time on your hands, why not volunteer to help with translations .. or is using your apparently voluminous free time constructively too much for you?
80 • pc-bsd (by postaldave on 2008-03-18 15:50:04 GMT from United States)
i keep checking on pc-bsd hoping that one day they will get their hardware working. it was by far the fastest and smoothest running OS i have ever ran but i never bothered to switch over due to the lack of hardware support. i would have to use my whole junk closet of parts to come up with something that would work.
i went through several mouses just to get one to work. crazy!
if they get that issue worked out i really do believe bsd would spread like wildfire across the desktop market.
81 • Rz 79 @Mr warff warff null; C'est une question d'efficacité et d'organisation (by dbrion (debrain, pour @79) on 2008-03-18 15:59:05 GMT from France)
Je ne perds pas mon temps à soigner des parasites, même s'ils le mendigotent, quand je peux gagner de bons euros (vous connaissez le change) avec des logiciels sérieux....
Re 72:
"We are all using Linux "
I use a serious Linux, not a parasitic, volunteer begging one!
and next year, it is likely to be BSD or O Solaris, if bugs and hype go on....
82 • Google Summer of Code 2008: Xfce? Njet! (by Coffee on 2008-03-18 16:57:39 GMT from France)
The list of the accepted organizations for the "Summer of Code 2008"
has been announced by Google ...
http://code.google.com/soc/2008/
Among the accepted "Mentoring Organizations" there are plenty of
well known projects, but unfortunately the application Xfce has
put forward ...
http://xubuntu.wordpress.com/2008/03/05/get-xfce-to-participate-in-googles-2008-summer-of-code/
... has again been turned down. I think this is a crying shame as
the handfull of committed Xfce developers could have done
with some sort of push from such a project. They're all
busy in their day jobs and simply can't spend more
time on enhancements for Xfce.
Xfce is the 3rd most popular desktop environment for Gnu/Linux.
Many people prefer it over Gnome and Kde for its performance
and its flexibility. But there are still plenty of things to improve.
Xfce has no built-in facility to edit the main menu, the Thunar
file manager urgently needs to be made 'network aware' and
Mousepad is a bit too simple in its current form. All these
long overdue improvements could have been addressed
in Google's "Summer of Code 2008" ...
... they accepted lots of games and some other silly projects.
I wonder why they have turned down Xfce for the 2nd time?
What are their criteria?
83 • @39 • Eee PC edition of Xandros Desktop (by Alter Ekko) (by songtsenkampo on 2008-03-18 17:15:11 GMT from Malaysia)
"I've seen webpages claiming that an Asus Eee PC is sold
every two seconds. Impressive. Does this make Xandros one of the best selling distros in the world I wonder. And many of those users perhaps don't even know that they are using linux!"
And I've seen a web page that makes me wonder whether Xandros will still be available on the Eee PC this time next year...
http://news.zdnet.co.uk/hardware/0,1000000091,39362122,00.htm
Another interesting link on a related subject:
http://blogs.techrepublic.com.com/opensource/?p=179
84 • apt-get rpm's (by brian on 2008-03-18 18:09:55 GMT from United States)
apt-get doesnt install rpms
85 • apt-get (by john frey on 2008-03-18 19:26:05 GMT from Canada)
I was about to start flaming but first I did a little googling and a urpmq, thank god.
It seems apt and synaptic are available in my distro of choice, Mandriva. I used apt4rpm during my brief fling with Suse but I had no idea other rpm distros used it as well.
I remember that the Suse apt used a separate repository for apt. I don't recall what the files in the repository were called but I see no reason why they could not have been called .rpm.
According to Wikipedia apt can be used to install from source as well as from binary.
The sources in the apt.sources for Mandriva begin with rpm.
ie: rpm ftp://distrib-coffee.ipsl.jussieu.fr/pub/linux/plf/mandriva/
So we learn something new every day. Apt can be used on much more than just Debian based distro's and it can indeed install rpm's in addition to deb's and source. Wow, eh?
86 • Distro hopping (by jollyx on 2008-03-18 19:43:22 GMT from Spain)
After almost 5 years of using Linux I am still a distro hopper. I have tried at least 50 and my favorites are Slackware (waiting for the next release), Ubuntu and Mandriva (now). At the moment I have Debian, PCLinuxOS and PCBSD installed on my hard drive but I am not satisfied. On a USB hard drive also I have a Mandriva install. Waiting for the spring wave of releases to install the next version of Mandriva and Fedora.
87 • No subject (by Anonymous on 2008-03-18 20:46:12 GMT from France)
oh no, distrowatchers are talking about pclos again, another wasted week...
88 • re: 86 distro hopping (by Dopher on 2008-03-18 21:35:26 GMT from Belgium)
jollyx, you need to seek help for that man. Over 5 years of your life wasted.. how long to go before you admit you're a distroholic.
Even in Spain they must have self-help-groups for all kinds of addictions.
I have to warn you. Distrohopping causes lack of real knowledge of a certain distro and linux in general, because you always keep busy with configure X and Y.. and mostly the same stuff. That way you will never get in-depth knowledge. Also, you won't get real forumfriends, because you're always on the move.
It also causes dataloss, loss of bookmarks, loss of certain files you forgot to store in a safe heaven, in your migrate rush.
Another problem is that you always feel in a hurry and never feel the sense of rest. Because.. you think you miss out something because you don't have distro X, the fear of not having the latest version of appplication Y, even though you hardly use it, because of the lack of time (since you always have to reconfigure stuff)
My advise is: seek help.. then settle for one distro and accepts it's cons... that the most important thing.. accept it's cons (if these are not real major issues). Because no operating system is perfect. The next train you'll jump on has other issues.. remember that.
Now.. go my friend.. go into the light.
89 • Opensuse and Mandriva (by trotter1985 on 2008-03-18 23:31:12 GMT from United States)
What happened to:
Opensuse 11.0 Alpha 3 and
Mandriva Linux 2008.1 RC2 ?
Both were scheduled to be released
today - March 18.
90 • @88 (by JustInterested at 2008-03-18 23:37:44 GMT from Australia)
"Now.. go my friend.. go into the light."
he he he... Funniest thing I've read all morning!
91 • RE: 90 (by Landor on 2008-03-19 01:02:03 GMT from Canada)
tongue in cheek of course. Maybe they're in dire straits. If a community distro like Gentoo has to have a release the exact time frame they say and if not, they're falling apart, a distro that's commercially backed must be done for!
I often wonder about the one distro that everyone is quick to normally fill this comment section with laurels for. One day maybe I'll check the forums and see if it's fueled by "did you see what they said over at DW", or, "Did you see my comment in reply to the one at DW". I wouldn't be suprised in the least that it's some concerted effort. Since what else could it be with a distro with limited language support, limited packages(compared to some others), rare releases. Personally I believe it's only a fanatical userbase struggling to keep it in the position it "only currently" holds.
Keep your stick on the ice...
Landor
92 • 91 (by Landor on 2008-03-19 01:02:49 GMT from Canada)
oops, should be: RE 89
93 • No subject (by Anonymous on 2008-03-19 01:11:45 GMT from United States)
> Since what else could it be with a distro with limited language support, limited packages(compared to some others), rare releases.
Oh boy, here come the flames. You've stated facts about that distro so you must be bashing it. Facts==bashing in that world.
94 • No subject (by Anonymous on 2008-03-19 02:23:59 GMT from Canada)
apt-get dosent work with rpm????
so if I open a console on my rpm based os (pclinuxos) and type
apt-get install firefox
and the firefox rpm is installed , is this some type of voodoo??
95 • pclos and dw (by ml on 2008-03-19 03:38:08 GMT from United States)
For those who lament about the pclos banter, aren't these comments way more fun to read than the "ladislav, thanks for the grep pointers" comments? I think so at least.
In defense of pclos, (I AM NOT A USER OF THIS OS) are their repos really lacking? I've gotten lost in ubu packages (so many and i've had experience where some don't work--been a while, but this problem was with _several_ mathematics packages). The only problem with a smaller repo is that pclos forum members seem adamant in baby-ing users and telling them not to install _anything_ outside the repos.
Does lack of language support make it a poor distribution? I understand that this limits its potential user pool but I can't see why that makes it somehow bad unless a person is bitter that they can't use the distro in their native tongue. (PS I myself do not know about language support, I've seen claims here that it does and does not have multi-lingual support--more of the latter)
Why is it so high on the PHR? I've read too many times someone describe the PHR as "voting." I am sure if a couple threads on ubuntuforums are posted to "vote" for ubu on dw with links things would change rapidly, but I'm not going to be the one to post. (I don't care about this, my dw experience is to click dww and to browse the comments).
I tried pclos for a short time a while ago and though I'm not an active poster on any forum, I am an active reader on some, and I found that some admin(s) on the pclos forum had major power trip issues.
In conclusion, I don't think there's anything wrong with pclos, I think it's as good (if not differnt) than any other distro. Still, I can understand if people have some issue with particular members of the community (and those users tend to be the loudest--with any distro, etc) but I don't see anything wrong with pclos itself. Further, these comments bring a lot of activity to dw which I think is a good thing, at least its entertaining. I just hope that people don't think that the childish debates here are a reflection of dw itself.
96 • That distro (by Anon on 2008-03-19 03:40:10 GMT from Norway)
#93 wrote: "Oh boy, here come the flames. You've stated facts about that distro so you must be bashing it. Facts==bashing in that world."
Which facts?? However, I, for one, don't rule out the possibility of that distro having a big following. Its community is certainly livelier than many others. Friendlier, too. It's easy to install and maintain and therefore perfect for a Linux newbie - just ask me ;-)
I have moved on to other distros, but still have it installed. It seems to be rock solid, but that might just be its Linux nature.
There. A flame.
97 • PCLinuxOS (by ALinuxUser on 2008-03-19 04:26:07 GMT from United States)
Hey, let's keep bashing/praising this distro every week. Everyone join in and let's just flood the entire forum with PCLinuxOS comments. Either way, that will result in MORE page hits and MORE users. Keep jabbering away. Maybe we can agree to meet somewhere at a certain date this summer and we can all put on boxing gloves and go at it. Better yet, let's have one of those "tug of wars"; with the haters on one side and the lovers on the other. The winner would get nothing. Same for the losers. This week we had another idiot (#4) start it again. I hope you got some joy out of posting something useless that has been discussed ad nauseam.
98 • RE #97 (by GLENN on 2008-03-19 05:01:44 GMT from Canada)
Well, you have to admit that is is not boring and in fact, if one remains out of it, very entertaining indeed.
The best comments were over the christmas period when therewas a lot of discussion about various things and distros and very little little flaming. One troll did try to start something up but disappeared when it got him nowhere. The rest of us were having too much fun.
I like your idea of the boxing gloves but if I may suggest, a paint ball range would be better. Very psychedelic results. Similar to the distro challenges/responses here. (insert wide grin).
glenn
99 • RE 95 : PClos language support and DW tables.... (by dbrion on 2008-03-19 08:29:47 GMT from France)
"
Does lack of language support make it a poor distribution? I understand that this limits its potential user pool but I can't see why that makes it somehow bad unless a person is bitter that they can't use the distro in their native tongue. (PS I myself do not know about language support, I've seen claims here that it does and does not have multi-lingual support--more of the latter)
"
One can also be surprised when, after copying -without any decency- a distribution who had a nice language support, this nice feature gets (in conscience, I suppose ... unless.... Rippers work) *destroyed* (as it is likely to have been an error, there are some ongoing translations : that is sooo self consistent... and sooo rational).
The result is, when one consults DWs well kept tables (I know, it gives HPDs) about PCLOL, that it has *no* language support. It is a ... radically simple way to get an realistic idea (cf posts 68, etc. here) about the way trutrh is respected in the zheroes world...
Luegen haben kuerze Beine....
FYI : I use English in the technical aspects of my work , but younger colleagues use French... thanks -in part- to the University of Montreal (Canada) who translated technical terms into French.....
100 • re 75 (by Anonymous on 2008-03-19 08:45:50 GMT from France)
By 'emerge world' I mean update (layman update, sync, emerge update world, depclean, revdep-rebuild and all).
I only had a problem, like many other people with expat 2 some months ago. A quick look at irc show me what is the problem in the banner and explain how to fix it.
I was happy to have this problem because I learned something.
Usually, it rolls. If you are in a conservative environement, just do a lvm snapshot and test before commit. I wouldn't put an update on any distro without testing if I was running a critical server.
Anyway, I meant to say that I don't see the release as an event. It's not like a Mandriva or a Ubuntu release, it's just a snapshot on an iso. Nobody using gentoo will care because the snapshot is already old the day after the release. It doesn't matter if you install from gentoo 2004 or 2007 or 2008, or from another host distro. The result is the same. Most people don't use the iso anyway. I installed gentoo from knoppix.
If you use the iso and use the graphical installer, you may learn one thing or two, but you won't get gentoo.
So what does the release bring? Newer hardware support for the installation disc? I don't care, I don't use the livecd everyday and actually I've never used it. If you need a good livecd with good hardware support, go knoppix, or systemrescuecd for a gentoo-based more or less up to date.
That said, it is true that a release from now and then can get you some attention from the media and attract new users. It would be nice though if diwtrowatch could stop axing gentoo on the back. So please dw, make it clear that gentoo is not a newbie distro and that it is not for everybody but stop axing it just because it is not ubuntu or mandriva. Talk about what is positive from times to times. You're not axing LFS because their iso doesn't understand your webcam!
101 • Gentoo's release cycle (by tangram on 2008-03-19 09:04:29 GMT from Portugal)
Like #100 said an install 4 years ago will output the same setup if I've install Gentoo yesterday so the point about release on Gentoo is somewhat not pressing.
I find it funny when I see people reformating and reinstalling their 6 month cycle release based distro... well better replace funny with painful.
Thank God for Gentoo and distro like it.
102 • No subject (by ? on 2008-03-19 10:03:01 GMT from United States)
It is funny, all the bashing that does go on here. Especially the name calling. I also find it interesting when I have seen on more than one occasion comments made about other distros, not as bad by far as some that are made about the distro everyone questions, and when I come back, those comments are modded out. Interesting indeed, when a person can bash one, but not another. Name calling is allowed, at least for one distro, so why not others too? I think name calling is something that should have been grown out of by the time a person reaches adulthood, but that's just me. Fair is fair though, there shouldn't be a double standard such as there is here.
103 • No subject (by Anonymous on 2008-03-19 11:20:34 GMT from United States)
> Friendlier, too.
Oh yeah, really friendly. With the exception of Puppy, I've never seen a group of fanbois with a greater obsession about any distro. I could write, "I use Ubuntu because the other distro doesn't boot on my machine" here and I'd have 10 fanbois calling me a troll (of course it boots, it's perfect, so I am lying). The closest thing I've seen is the North Korean government and Kim Jong Il.
Their forums are horrible and any statements elsewhere not worshipping that distro are responded to with abuse.
104 • No subject (by bill on 2008-03-19 12:13:48 GMT from United States)
"I use Ubuntu because the other distro doesn't boot on my machine" here and I'd have 10 fanbois calling me a troll (of course it boots, it's perfect, so I am lying)."
No, you wouldn't actually. If you say something nice about any other distro, usually, not always, people either agree, or ignore the comment. There seems to be only one that can have no praise, and no, I don't use that one, because it doesn't suit me. I base my statement on a couple years of reading these comments. If anyone says ANYTHING about that one distro, people always come in and bash it, and it keeps going and going. Or, it starts out with someone bashing it, but usually the bashing far out-weighs the praise. Any other distro, this is not the case, USUALLY. The smarter thing to do would be to ignore it, and moderate any non useful bashing, but this is not done for that one distro (although it is for others).
Saying a distro is good should not result in bashing. Also, just because a distro doesn't support your language is no reason to bash it at all like a child. With as many distributions as there are, certainly a person could ignore the ones that aren't designed specifically to be used by you. No distro can be everything, for every one, out of the box. Many distros have a handful of developers, if someone with the time and skills (someone that knows the language) isn't available to do it, how is it supposed to get done? Most distros are free, what difference does it make which one is "better", and what is there to gain by someone saying it is "good" or not, it's not like people are paid to say that. It's personal choice, bottom line. If I only speak english, I would only look for a distro that supports english. If I only spoke French, and english very poorly, why would I be looking at an English based distro, why would I even care what they do?? Makes no sense to me.
"Their forums are horrible and any statements elsewhere not worshipping that distro are responded to with abuse."
How is this, or many other forums, any different? Except for a couple weeks, there are always people attacking each other, or provoking something by making an intentionally hurtful and ignorant comment. I do know what you are talking about there, some things do get done that shouldn't, but that's far better than not doing enough.
105 • RE 100 Thanks for a very objective answ. about this weeeks topic (by dbrion on 2008-03-19 12:53:41 GMT from France)
There are two little points which are often forgotten:
" a release from now and then can get you some attention from the media and attract new users. "
It can help, too, people in Polynesia (transfer speeds are 100 or 1000 less than in Europe, I forgot the exact estimation which is horrrible) or in Africa (no idea about the state of the holy Internet). Thus, having some fresh sources may be a blessing.
The fact than Gentoo is not beginner-friendly may become less crucial in the following years, with Potemkining techniques (VMplayer or qemu) and teach one somethin without the risk of data loss.
I remainvery impressed by the increase in quality in Gentoo Monthly Letter (as nobody can be full time intelligent -it would be unhuman-, a monthly cycle gives time to verify/reread.)
Re 103
"Also, just because a distro doesn't support your language is no reason to bash it at all like a child. "
"
Le fait de ne pas supporter ma langue n'est pas un handicap (Solaris était purement anglais en 1994, et très satisfaisant), c'est le mensonge perpétuel (cf @68, ici seulement; je peux remonter cruellement) et la nullité satisfaite d'elle même et s'étalant obscènement....(cf @25, 29,31 : 5 ans pour apprendre à griller un CD!)
106 • http://distrowatch.com/ (by ladislav on 2008-03-19 13:47:34 GMT from Taiwan)
It would be nice though if distrowatch could stop axing gentoo on the back.
I keep saying the same thing every time people come here to defend Gentoo: please write an article explaining why Gentoo is the greatest thing since sliced pickles and I'll publish it in the next issue of DistroWatch Weekly. Or write a review. Write about your experiences running Gentoo as a desktop or server. Anything. I know it doesn't look like it, but I really am desperate for some positive coverage of Gentoo! Many of you obviously love Gentoo and have tons of great experiences with it, so why don't you share them?
So far, all such appeals have fallen on deaf ears, but I haven't given up hope yet....
107 • No subject (by Lulz on 2008-03-19 15:30:52 GMT from Canada)
Wow #103, your experiences are similar to mine. However, this not the fault of the distro, so I cannot say the distro is bad, as it is very well laid out, polished, and fast, but they need some of roadmap.
108 • Re: #106 (by DblMtn on 2008-03-19 15:53:03 GMT from United States)
I would also like a review of Gentoo. I tried it, and don't know enough about Linux to get it running.
To add my two cents on the PCLOS flamewar......I tried it, and liked it, but it fails to run on two of my machines. MEPIS however, runs on all four of my computers. I think enough of MEPIS, to donate to the author. I did have a printer problem with it, but the forums helped me solve it. I try a lot of other distros, but have stuck with MEPIS for over a year.
109 • @89 (by Adam Williamson on 2008-03-19 16:32:11 GMT from Canada)
2008 Spring RC2 will be coming in the next few hours.
110 • @106, 108 gentoo (by Anonymous on 2008-03-19 17:41:40 GMT from France)
If I have time, I will make a review of Gentoo. Maybe in 2 or 3 weeks.
Unfortunately, you can't review gentoo by just installing and running some apps. This will be a long article. It takes several months to get the power of gentoo and you've got to know what vi, bash and python are. I will try to make it interesting and easy to read if I can.
111 • @84 @85 (by Anonymous on 2008-03-19 18:01:21 GMT from Greece)
apt-get and synaptic for RPM`s were developed by Conectiva. (part of Mandriva now)
However Mandriva insists on using urpmi for package management.
(only the distro that shouldn`t be mentioned uses apt-get and synaptic for RPM`s by default)
112 • #110 (by tangram on 2008-03-19 18:16:01 GMT from Portugal)
Vi, bash, phyton to use Gentoo?? Come on... the only thing need is curiosity and will to learn. Simply read and use the Handbook alongside the distro excellent documentation.
113 • No subject (by Anonymous on 2008-03-19 19:48:10 GMT from Norway)
From #
"Oh yeah, really friendly."
Those are your words... Admittedly, and sadly, the community in question has 2-3 individuals who should not be allowed into any forum, but my experience has been that the other members of the community are very friendly and helpful. They've helped me on more than one occasion.
Contrast that to fora with very few and very tight-lipped members (none mentioned, none forgotten!). Hence why I said it is friendlier than many others. It's a fact, is all.
114 • Re: #113 (by Anon on 2008-03-19 19:51:00 GMT from Norway)
I posted to hastily and the comment is to post #103.
115 • No subject (by Anonymous on 2008-03-19 21:10:38 GMT from Canada)
Mandriva 2008.1 RC2 is available. Try it and be happy.
116 • 88 (by Ultra on 2008-03-19 23:25:43 GMT from Canada)
Hee hee, sounds like you've been there dopher. I know I have too - lost a few files in the process! It just isn't worth it to distro hopping. I think Linux brings too much choice to the table. There's not enough substantial difference between many of the distros, it's just so and so deciding they want to have the pride of building their own OS. Take an existing distro, add a fresh wallpaper and reorganize a few menus and voila, a new distro for Distrowatch to add to their list.
117 • re: 84 + 94 (by apt-rpm on 2008-03-20 00:08:50 GMT from Australia)
If in Debian or Ubuntu one try's to run 'apt-get' in a console as a USER it will NOT work either. Its usage the same for any rpm distro as it is for a deb distro, where apt-get may be installed.
So both of you are WRONG saying/implying that Apt-get (rpm) does not work (if it is installed). Apt-rpm works EXACTLY the same as for any Apt-deb system - IF you know how to use it.
ATTENTION:
If you now can work out how to use, and go and hose your system ?
It will be your own fault, please remember because it so easy to do :-(
They RECOMMEND that one uses the Synaptic Package Manager :-)
118 • SUSE Package Managment (by Metadata on 2008-03-20 02:58:38 GMT from Canada)
All you apt fans get ready for a surprise....
The new package management in opensuse is going to smoke apt.
119 • @ 118 (by nobody on 2008-03-20 03:37:30 GMT from Canada)
Yeah, Suse is going down in flames. There is a lot of smoke coming out.
120 • Mining logs (by star_knight on 2008-03-20 04:56:04 GMT from Canada)
nice work? yes.
did it bring anything constructive to linux or to this page? no.
(and sorry, i don't know why yemenians are so interested in movix)
121 • Question on wireless adapters. (by IMQ on 2008-03-20 05:58:54 GMT from United States)
Do Intel PRO/Wireless 3945ABG and Intel Wireless WiFi Link 4965AGN work in Linux? If so, how well do they work with WPA? Which of the two is better support in Linux?
Just want to know in case I need to buy a new laptop.
Thanks.
122 • Re 121....Try Google and .... (by Help Yourself first! on 2008-03-20 07:39:42 GMT from Australia)
http://www.google.com
Start with folling search term (and expand from there):
Linux support for Intel PRO/Wireless 3945ABG and Intel Wireless WiFi Link 4965AGN
123 • RE 120 Web_logs data-peeling (one of this weeks topics) (by dbrion on 2008-03-20 07:52:41 GMT from France)
"did it bring anything constructive to linux or to this page? no. "
I agree : it will be presented in a congress in Atlanta, linked with MachineLearning:and perhaps "statisticians" will hear about GNU/linux (it is unlikely they do not know already) and DW (this is more likely theywill know something new) and the strange GNUlinux users (or DW clickers) ways of 'life'
"(and sorry, i don't know why yemenians are so interested in movix)"
At the best, it is yemenians knowing DW and linux.....
It is likely a divide by near zero consequence : as each country is given the same weight by dividing her HPD by its maximum (their is little other choice, each alternative may have weird consequences, too) , and Yemen is a somewhat desertic country, I suppose linux lovers do, like the the others : they choose a linux their friend/neighbor uses (so, if there is a problem, they can get help very easily), and, if they are satisfied and know DW by friends/neigbor, they show their satisfaction (it is the opposite of curiosity, messeems) by rat-rat-voting, from their working new system, of course.
Est ce que movix est pire/mieux que le Sacré pClone? Je ne savais même pas qu'il existait.
124 • Data Peeling (by www.ucme.se on 2008-03-20 10:08:04 GMT from Sweden)
I think le pClone is ok but much more is to give more weight for all HPD independently of their Geographical locations: http://www.ucme.se/kartor/
125 • This is a nice Linux found on freshmeat.net (add it in?) (by Bill Savoie on 2008-03-20 13:01:08 GMT from United States)
Today on Freshmeat.net came this announcement:
Myrinix Debian LiveCD is a bootable Linux live CD remastered from SIDUX/FLL. It contains more multimedia programs such as Kaffiene and Mplayer and is modular, allowing you to build and include application modules.
It looks complete, and I am downloading it for a trial. It has good bandwidth. I also noticed that they applied to distrowatch (submitted on 2005-10-04). They seem very active. How do we move them up to the 'real'??
Yesterday I dressed in Black and protested the 5 year mark in our aggression. We had 35 people on a busy corner of town. "War is not the answer". Living in Alabama and working for the army, is a sad lot for a peace lover who likes to program.
Thanks for your work Ladislav, writing here from the plantation.
126 • re:116 distroHOPING (by Dopher on 2008-03-20 14:40:39 GMT from Belgium)
Yeah i've been there. That's why I know i wasted my time back then. Always reinstalling, yet again reconfiguring, and searching for something better, the perfect OS. And mostly waiting for the stuff to come, because the latest upcomming release should be it.. right?
But i learned that it isn't worth it. Learn to live (or solve) the cons, and actually work on your pc. What counts is what is there is now. I would only go for a distro decent release cycle which at least you can use for a while, like maintained > 2 years. Distro's like Mint promise a lot, but let's face it, and OS with a release cycle of about 4 months? how seriouse is that?
I settled for debian etch on my server, and debian lenny on my desktop. Both running just fine, all customized to my needs, and everything configured. If i wanna work on them, i can, and everything is working. If i had more time, i would have settled for slackware on the desktop.., because that's what i started with about 10 years ago. Debian is just much easier, because of the huge amount of software that can be found in the repositories, and good luks encryption and lvm support out-of-the-box.
I still try out new distro's though, but in vmware.
127 • removing posts (by ray at 2008-03-20 18:09:32 GMT from United States)
Ladislav - I notice that from time to time you remove posts for various reasons. I have no issue with that - mostly they are way off somewhere. I do wish you would consider leaving that post number in the list - possibly with a note that 'inappropriate content' was removed or something like that - it would make it a little easier for me to retain my sanity.
thanks
128 • Distro Addiction (by RollMeAway on 2008-03-20 18:13:02 GMT from United States)
I'm not a distro hopper, but I am very addicted to trying all the distros I can. I have two 200 GB HD, managed with bootitng. I use a common swap partition and a common /backup partition accessible from all others. I keep my email and firefox directories on /backup and link to them from each distro. Typical partition size is 7 or 8 GB per distro. The oldest I have
is a Gentoo installed in 2002. I keep all current.
I will 'live' in a distro for several days, sometimes weeks.
To change distro, I simply reboot.
All my personal files are on the common /backup partition, so I never
'loose' anything.
This is the 'ultimate game' for me.
129 • re #128 Distro Addiction (by illiterate on 2008-03-20 19:05:44 GMT from Greece)
I am trying to learn and use many distros, about 25, installed on my two machines, having a swap in each machine but most of the distros have also a separate /home partition.
I am a computer newbie.
Do you mean that I can have a common /home in each machine? What about 32bit and 64bit distros? Can I mix them or have a separate common 32bit /home and another 64bit common /home, as there are both 32bit and 64bit distros in the same machine.
How do I make a backup partition? It must be different to /home I suppose.
thanks
130 • Distro Addiction (by RollMeAway on 2008-03-20 19:32:51 GMT from United States)
Originally I created an extra ext3 partition of several GB size,
just to backup /boot, /etc/, /home and /root of each distro installed.
This was useful for reformatting and reinstalling a given dist.
Now, I have created a /backup/guest directory just for personal settings.
When I install a new distro, I start up thunderbird and firefox then
immeidately close them. Each has now created a directory in my /home
(of the current distro) e.g.: /home/guest/.mozilla. I delete that directory,
and create a link:
#ln -s /backup/guest/.mozilla /home/guest/.mozilla
Now when I start firefox it uses the directory on the backup partition.
You must be careful the versions of firefox don't differ too much.
131 • RE: 109 Mandriva 2008.1 RC2 (by IMQ on 2008-03-20 20:35:55 GMT from United States)
Hi Adam,
What happens to Mandriva One LiveCD, KDE or GNOME Edition?
132 • Gentoo review (by areuareu on 2008-03-20 20:39:39 GMT from France)
Ladislav,
I am ready to write a Gentoo review. Let's say "one hundred years with Gentoo without reinstalling", but wait, il will be ready in 2102 because I need 94 years more....
Jokes apart, every Gentoo user probably has a log of all the problems he has encountered, me included, but it would probably be boring for your readers.
About emerge: it needs between 10 minutes and 4 hours (if you recompile OpenOffice) every week, but it is completely done in background without slowing the machine, whatever the tasks you are doing on the foreground
.
133 • RE: 131 (by IMQ on 2008-03-20 20:41:20 GMT from United States)
Adam,
Please disregard my question in #131.
134 • #123 (by dooooo on 2008-03-20 22:07:45 GMT from Jordan)
"Yemen is a somewhat desertic country"
FYI Yemen is not a desertic country . Actually It's famous for its mountains .
By the way Nevada is desertic , how is that related to the number of Linux users or DW visitors .
I do agree though that Maybe a couple of guys had visited Movix in Distrowatch and now the study shows that
"Visitors from Yemen have always been paying much attention to MoviX since its first release ."
That's definitely a hilarious conclusion .
135 • Gentoo will be missed (by Dissing Gentoo Devs on 2008-03-21 03:28:37 GMT from United States)
The devs are up to their antics and bad mouthing users. True problem logs disappear. The forums are monitored by Gentoo zealots that monitor every word and inspect every inflection. (Help fixing something means turning it off and not using it.)
I for one appreciate the critical commentary by the various news outlets because that is the only way to goad anyone into doing anything. Alas the users have had to make their own release!
Beautiful architecture but a complete and total failure in politics. If it weren't for the mean cruel, rude, obnoxious and mean spirited devs.
I cannot for the life of me understand why they are so crude and mean toward people that 'they' personally have asked for help!
136 • @103 (by Anonymous on 2008-03-21 04:49:16 GMT from Malaysia)
"Their forums are horrible and any statements elsewhere not worshipping that distro are responded to with abuse."
As bad as the Ubuntu forums where the longest threads are either about PCLOS or some OS called "Windoze"?
137 • Two Year Old Gentoo Bug Has Birthday! (by Why Not on 2008-03-21 05:01:24 GMT from United States)
http://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=125728
Here we have a two year old bug at Gentoo that has been solved and resolved at least five different ways but nobody with enough brass to actually fix the problem.
GENTOO NEEDS YOU! IF YOU HAVE THE BRASS! and of course the ability to be rude to total strangers who are users that are trying to understand why you refuse do do your job at the same time asking for help (and of course b*ching why there isn't more help).
138 • Re 134 : I agree that Yemen is not desertic (perhaps 'somewhat') (by dbrion on 2008-03-21 10:17:05 GMT from France)
and that I should have reminded it was a prosperous part of Araby, due to its mountains (and its towns, with very high adobe buildings) but I remain telling that linux users (if any) are clustered in towns (it might be more complicated than in Nevada to have some mains supply and reliable IT connections -all this from one century old journeys....-) and that this clustering (as one friend/neighbor is happy and ready to help with one kind of linux, why choose another brand?) might lead to some standardised and local way of doing, which was made evident and pointed out by the Data-Peeler's author(s) -but perhaps it is linked with the way they normalize, to give each country an equal weight [Monaco has the same weight than the US : if at least US were cut into states like Califonia, Iowa -the proportion of students is not the same-].
139 • *BSD (by Steph on 2008-03-21 12:09:58 GMT from United Kingdom)
Les systèmes *BSD ne sont pas des "distributions". Ce sont des OS à noyau monolithiques, à l'inverse de Linux.
En ce sens, c'est un tort de les confondre dans la nébuleuse Linux et ses centaines de distributions....
Faisons la part des choses :!
140 • Granular 1.0 (by capricornus on 2008-03-21 13:05:34 GMT from Belgium)
I' ve really tried them all. On my MSI PM8PM-V motherboard + P4DC, with Nvidia FX5500 VC ,512 MBRAM and Samsung 160 MB SATA. For more than 6 hours I' ve tried again. SAM did the best but lost its sound. 3 times in a row, something with SALSA. PClinuxOS stalled and stalled again. Mandriva had problems with sound also. Zenwalk is more difficult to handle, and CrossOver doesn't like Zen's XFXE, I think.
But Granular 1.0 !
Believe me, this is the fastest I' ve seen and installed, both live and installed on HD, on my PC. CrossOver installed flawlessly, my OfficeXP runs as it should. Sound, no problem whatsoever. This is IT. Thank you, granular developers.
141 • Re 139 (as it is not linked with a monolingual stuff, I translate it) (by dbrion on 2008-03-21 16:12:52 GMT from France)
"* BSD systems are not "distributions". These are monolithic OS kernel, unlike Linux.
In this sense, it is a mistake to confuse them in the nebula of the hundreds Linux distributions ....
Let's analyse things seriously "
It is a matter of definition:
I agree, if "distributions == systems".
else
If distributions (as in 'grande distribution' == supermarkets) are a complex infrastructure shipping (that means servers or download procedures), in a coherent way , tons of applications (and a kernel is at most 10 % of a GNU/linux modern distribution, even if it is better maintained than other GNU applications, in terms of Mbytes), the way to keep them coherent if one is in an upgrading mood (package managers : they might work under Windows, too ; I am sure some do) and to debug them if there are flaws (which makes fora a very bad indicator of a distribution's quality), BSD's can be considered as distributions.
I exclude from this definition a roadmap (once it is perfect, why evolve? why have a time schedule?) and the "SOS amitié" aspect : if the way to debug is already in a handbook, or in a normal head, why should not this fact reminded? Normal people have friends in the real world... and go to GNUlinux or other free OSes for knowledge/use, not for affective puposes).... This latter point makes the Gentoo bashing the most meaningless (would everyone like to have prefilled Sudoku grids?)
If competition is a sound way of improving Free OSes, why should BSDs/OSolaris be omitted? Just give them more time (and give the users time to wait HW gets really cheap, as ...it is getting cheaper and cheaper , and uncareful users might sell it well below its price)
Have nice Easter...
142 • Oracle Unbreakable Linux (by Russell on 2008-03-21 17:54:39 GMT from United States)
I noticed on your Oracle page that you only have version 4.4 listed. Why is this so when Oracle currently has 4.4, 4.5, 4.6, 5.0, and 5.1 available from their download repositories. I think you should update the Oracle page to reflect current versions released and available for download.
143 • RE 131 - Mandriva 2008.1 RC2 (by Anonymous on 2008-03-21 18:19:46 GMT from Italy)
one editions will be released these days
bye
Marcello
144 • @140 (by Adam Williamson on 2008-03-21 23:21:30 GMT from Canada)
No distribution does anything particularly special for sound hardware support. All distributions use more or less the same thing: ALSA, with a few non-ALSA drivers for particular (usually old) bits of hardware. I suspect Granular works simply as it's newer than the other distributions you tried, so it has a more recent kernel, hence a more recent version of ALSA which happens to have a fix for your soundcard.
I wouldn't be at all surprised if every one of the upcoming round of 'major' distro releases (Ubuntu, SUSE, Mandriva, Fedora etc) all support your card.
145 • RE: 142 Oracle Unbreakable Linux (by ladislav on 2008-03-22 03:51:07 GMT from Taiwan)
Sorry about that - I completely missed this. I didn't see any announcements or press releases about the new versions. I will fix the Oracle page this weekend.
Happy Easter everybody :-)
146 • @ Adam Williamson (by capricornus on 2008-03-22 08:03:22 GMT from Belgium)
Adam, thank you. The problems I've had with the motherboard-cpu-videocard combination is much more complex than mentioned in 140 (there is a build-in sound- and video, the V points to VIA).
The main problem is stalling from the beginning, and believe me, I've tried all the possible permutations with screen resolution, ACPI=off, etcetera. All *buntu's stall, even the more recent ones. All Debian's stall, even the most recent ones. Slackware- and Mandrake-distro's (except Mandriva) seem to easily overcome some problem, I still don't know what, that's why I mention it with all details.
And there is the weird thing that you seem to understand and I don't: but the motherboard is not that eccentric or recent, the required audio-drivers are absolutely not that complex, even the older Zenwalk 4.8 has no problem with them, but SAM and PCLOS 2007/2008 did, and Granular didn't.
Off topic perhaps: I prefer the easy going, quite and not-so-dumb design of Granular too. I really don't like kindergarten drawings on my desktop, perhaps that's my age and culture? ;-)
147 • advertisers hype = misrepresentation ? (by Anonymous on 2008-03-22 16:11:19 GMT from Australia)
Dear Ladislav Bodnar
I see many of your advertisers 'claim' that they have PCLinuxOS 2008
BUT I do not think that any such (animal) distro has come out yet ?
Do correct me of I am wrong ?
There has been PCLinuxOS MiniMe 2008 come out,
which is a bit deferent from the full blown thing (if/when it comes out)
Should we consider this as misrepresentation ? should they be more explicate ?
What they going to do when the final PCLinuxOS 2008 (perhaps called bigdaddy)
comes out ? and will the end buyers know the difference.
Should you be more demanding on having EXACT descriptions ?
148 • why wait for a "new version" (by arno911 on 2008-03-22 16:52:32 GMT from Germany)
guys, there is no need to wait for a new version of a distribution, like its a new windows.
Never heard of a rolling release?
Install it once, upgrade it whenever you want.
some distributions offer this convenient and superior feature;
i'd like to name sidux here
149 • Re:48, rolling release... (by Caraibes on 2008-03-22 21:36:59 GMT from Dominican Republic)
I now have successfully installed Debian Testing on my main box, as my sole distro... Everything works... Have been using various others along the years... I wish to see it for an extensive period of time, to see if "testing" is "stable" enough ;)
This could be the "rolling release" concept made true... How refreshing for me, I am ued to the 6 months releases...
150 • Re 149 (by Archie on 2008-03-23 01:33:00 GMT from United States)
Arch
151 • For the adventurous, here are some openSUSE Backport repo links for the trying (by out new fast Package Managager on 2008-03-23 07:25:06 GMT from Australia)
Index of /repositories/zypp:/Backport
http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/zypp:/Backport/openSUSE_10.3/
http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/zypp:/Backport/openSUSE_10.2/
http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/YaST:/Backport/
http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/YaST:/Backport/openSUSE_10.3/
http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/YaST:/Backport/openSUSE_10.2/
Keep in mind that it is a development backport and backup your system (if you need to). Also, IMO, it would be wise to install (before making changes) the smart package manager.
FYI: I have done it and it seems very fast but the zypper data base is gone and thus less information available in Yast. There are no updates at present and I need to see how it behaves when there is.
Cheers
152 • @148 (by Adam Williamson on 2008-03-23 08:43:23 GMT from Canada)
It's not that simple. Being a rolling distribution is not a 'feature', it's an alternative approach. Both stable and rolling release models have advantages and disadvantages. The advantage of rolling releases is you tend to get new versions of things faster, and you don't have to worry about large upgrade 'events'. The disadvantage is that every day is, effectively, a little upgrade, and more likely to cause trouble than any given day on a stable release distro.
The advantage of a stable release distro is that it works on Tuesday the same way it does on Monday. The disadvantage is that it's trickier to get new versions of apps if you want them, and you do have to handle large upgrade 'events' somehow.
Two approaches, both with different advantages and disadvantages. It's simply not true to suggest that rolling release models are in all cases superior to stable.
153 • Re:152, rolling releases... (by Caraibes on 2008-03-23 12:53:16 GMT from Dominican Republic)
Indeed Adam, your analysis is right. My decision to run Debian Testing is a bit of a test, I want to see for myself if it is "as nice as" what some other readers are saying...
I enjoyed most "big distros", such as Fedora, Mandriva, *Buntu, Debian Stable...
For some reasons (tweaking the /etc/modprobe.d/options), I could never get my TV card to work with Debian on my main box (it always worked out of the box with Mandriva since I started using Linux)... Now I found the right tweak... This is the small detail that made me start the "rolling release" experiment... I want to push it to its limit... See if I can keep such a system on my main work-horse...
I chose Debian instead of Arch, because it seems the Debian system is the most widely used, thanks to *Buntu...
Anyway, I think you guys (the devs from my various favorite distros) are doing an outstanding job, and I take this opportunity to give you a big than you !
154 • RE 153 Messing PR and work is very (by dbrion on 2008-03-23 16:14:51 GMT from France)
"it seems the Debian system is the most widely used, thanks to *Buntu..."
It is rather the opposite way : UBU linux draw mainly advantages from Debian's work (not PR, just serious *work*, and was (keeps on, on the long term) rather a bad advertising for GNU/linux :
FYI, one of my colleagues tested ten distributions w/r to usability (just for work...., sorry). Two were outstanding (the other 8 "could work"):
* Debian, though it was difficult to install, but there were no mem leaks (in july 2006, mem leaks were *very* ennoyous) : the difficulty of installation was thought to be negligeable, if one installed it on many computers of the same type (once trained, this difficulty becomes a routine or ... written how-tos)
* UBU-linux had to be avoided at any price for any use (this was consistent /* though earlier : this gives somewhat of a cross-verification */ with the free arrival of Blue Screens of Hope (UBU linux is not the horrible , politically correctly linked with lethality, Window$) in august 2006, linked with automagic safety "up"grades.... Of course, their PR claims "they" did better since, but can they be trusted? can one trust any PR?...
155 • Re: 154, Deb & *Buntu (by Caraibes on 2008-03-23 20:22:46 GMT from Dominican Republic)
Ce que je voulais dire, c'est l'avantage d'utiliser la distro du "plus grand nombre"... Principalement parce que les forums sont pleins d'infos, et que les bugs ont déjà été vus, voire corrigés par d'autre...
Je suis bien entendu au courant de l'histoire respective de Debian et d'Ubuntu. Mais la campagne de relations publiques de Canonical a le mérite de rendre cette distro très populaire, ce qui n'est pas un désavantage pour l'utilisateur de Debian...
En effet, Debian est bien plusrapide qu'Ubuntu. Sur mon PC, avant mon installation de Debian Testing, j'avais Linux Mint 4 (=Ubuntu 7.10) pendant 2 mois... C'était une bonne expérience, mais j'ai voulu aller plus loin, poursuivre le chemin, continuer d'apprendre...
Tout l'intérêt de ma démarche est d'évaluer la branche "Testing" de Debian sur plusieurs mois, pour voir si je peux l'utiliser comme seule distro, comme une distro "stable" (quel paradoxe !!!)
156 • USB Wireless Success (by IMQ on 2008-03-23 23:50:23 GMT from United States)
Having seen posts of success with BELKIN F5D7050 Wireless 802.11g USB Network Adapter in various forum, I bought one on Friday to test out in one of my desktop upstairs, one floor away from the wireless router.
Well, I tried out a number of LiveCD to see which one pass the test: Ubuntu 8.04 Alpha 5, Parsix 1.0r1, Mandriva 2008.1 RC1, Linux Mint 4.0 KDE, Dreamlinux 3.0 RC3, Sidux 2008-01 Preview 2, etc. Sidux detected but was unable to make connection. I think Sidux needs to have the firmware installed for it to work.
Only one detected the USB wireless and was successfully configured and connected with WPA enabled: Dreamlinux 3.0 RC3!
I am a happy camper!
Now I can try to get the rest of the other distros to work because if it work for one, it can be made to work for others.
157 • @156 (by Adam Williamson on 2008-03-24 01:43:18 GMT from Canada)
If you provided some more information about what chipset was in the adapter and how it was actually configured to work in Dreamlinux, you might find people would actually be able to *help* you get it to work in other distributions :). A model number is basically useless when it comes to wireless. Multiple manufacturers have released two or more parts with the exact same model number but entirely different chipsets.
158 • RE: 157 (by IMQ on 2008-03-24 03:37:15 GMT from United States)
You are correct!
I completely forgot to mention the chipset. According to lsmod, it uses zd1221rw driver. The version is actually BELKIN F5D7050 v4000 series. There are 5 versions of the card with the same model number.
I did some googling and it seem that the kernel should have included the driver for this but I don't know why neither Ubuntu 8.04 Alpha 5 or Mandriva ONE 2008.1 RC1 did not detect the device. Many too many USB devices connected along with wireless one. I give it another shot when I get a chance.
As I mentioned in previous post, Sidux 2008-01 Preview 2 detected the USB wireless but I could get connected after configuration. I remember reading the manual saying something like "apt-get install zd1211rw" or something like that.
159 • RE: 157 (by IMQ on 2008-03-24 03:59:27 GMT from United States)
Adam,
I did a quick test drive of Mandriva One 2008.1 RC1 again with only USB Wireless connected, no other USB devices. This time the USB Wireless is detected. I was able to configure and make connection with WPA enabled.
I am a happier camper now. :)
FYI, for anyone interested in getting the USB Wireless device, the Belkin F5D7050 Version 4xxx with the FCCID: RAXWN4501H works under Linux.
Number of Comments: 159
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