 DistroWatch Weekly |
| DistroWatch Weekly, Issue 85, 31 January 2005 |
Welcome to this year's 5th issue of DistroWatch Weekly! In this issue we will bring you a couple of resources that can help with building a custom live CD, introduce the Debian Volatile project, and present Xandros Desktop OS 3 as our featured distribution of the week. Happy reading!
Content:
Build your own live CD
If you've ever thought of building your own Linux live CD and customising it exactly to your requirements, you might be interested in one of the two links that follow. The first one is a link to iBuild, a set of scripts that allow you to create a live CD from an existing Debian installation with incredible ease. The second link at BabyTUX.org is centred around Mandrakelinux (although it can be applied to other mainstream distributions) and provides a complete set of instructions to build a custom live CD. In both cases, you will end up with a ready-to-burn bootable ISO image, just waiting for your computer to reboot and start enjoying your very own live CD.
Here is how the maintainers of iBuild describe the project: "Intellibuild (iBuild) is a program that allows you to quickly and easily create your own custom GNU/Linux live CD distribution (like Knoppix and Morphix). A live CD allows you to run Linux from the CD-ROM without having to install it on the computer's hard drive. You simply open up a template, select which programs you want to be included, click on the 'Build' button and wait. When iBuild is done, your custom .iso awaits you. All you have to do is burn and go." The web site provides a comprehensive HOWTO with troubleshooting notes, as well as a mailing list where you can report your experiences and exchange ideas.
The second link is entitled How to create a live boot CD containing your favorite Linux distro: "Wouldn't it be cool to have a bootable version of Linux running totally off a CD, no hard disk required? You could probably pack your collection of mp3s along with a small Linux desktop containing XMMS. Perhaps load a couple of games like TuxRacer, TuxPuck or Frozen Bubble to play at a friend's house who doesn't have Linux. Maybe your friend's hard disk is running that 'no good OS', crashed with a blue screen and won't boot, and needs to be rescued. Better yet, you want to introduce your friends to the wonderful world of Linux." The main advantage of this page is that you are not limited to a Debian-based live CD, but can apply it to other distributions. The author also provides a downloadable set of scripts that can save you much time. However, the web site doesn't offer any mailing list or user forums to discuss the topic.
Now that you know about these two links, you can start building your custom live CDs. Just don't forget to share your experiences with the rest of us in the forums below!
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Debian goes Volatile
 Debian has launched an unofficial archive of packages for the stable branch that some users would consider highly important and essential to keep in synch with upstream releases. Called "volatile", this repository should please system administrators who need newer version of virus scanners, spam filters and other important applications that are updated frequently, but are reluctant to use packages built for the testing or unstable branches: "This unofficial archive aims at supporting fast moving packages for the stable Debian release like spam filter, virus scanner and the like. A first package, whois, has been accepted for debian-volatile's section of woody." More information about this project is available on this page.
* * * * *
On future of Slackware
 Our feature last week suggesting that the future of Slackware Linux is assured brought in mixed reaction. Some readers did not agree with our conclusions and maintained that Slackware Linux is a one-man dictatorship which is unlikely to survive in case the "dictator" is no longer able to work on the project. Others were critical of the direction Slackware is currently taking, notably the neglect of GNOME, Java SDK, and other packages. Here is an email of one of the readers:
"Perhaps you might want to write a few words about Patrick Volkerding's decision to drop the Java SDK from future releases of Slackware. (From the changelog of 1/27/2005: The full J2SDK is not needed by most people, and is making the first Slackware test ISO too large, so an updated version of the JRE will replace it.) I think it's a bad policy to manage a distribution based upon what fits on a CD, or by what is perceived that people use. I bet more Slackware users have a need for the Java SDK than they do for Emacs or Netscape. First GNOME, now Java. What's next? CUPS?"
As always, it is impossible to make everybody happy and some will inevitably complain about certain decisions. But those readers who have expressed the sentiment that Slackware is managed in a "dictatorial" manner might be right, after all. The decisions to drop certain packages seem to be made arbitrarily, without any democratic mechanisms that would be more acceptable to users.
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| Featured distribution of the week: Xandros Desktop OS |
Xandros Desktop OS
When Xandros Corporation was launched in June 2001 in Ottawa, Canada, some observers expressed doubt about the company's business model. A truly innovative Linux distribution? Even with many user-friendly enhancements that the developers were busy implementing to make Linux more palatable to the masses, many believed it unlikely that the product would result in a large-scale migration from Windows to Linux. Nevertheless, most Linux enthusiasts were curious about the product Xandros was about to put on the market. "How will it fare compared to the more established Linux distributions?" they asked.
Xandros Desktop 1.0, launched in October 2002, was a big success. Not really from the point of view of Xandros' shareholders, but rather from the point of view of users and reviewers who were pleasantly surprised by the quality of the product. Xandros Desktop 1.0 was not only more user-friendly than any other distribution on the market, it also had many unique and innovative features that made its desktop such a pleasure to use. Did you know that you could replace a piece of hardware (e.g. a graphics card) in your computer and Xandros would still work without as much as a prompt to install new drivers or reconfigure the existing settings? Try that with another Linux distribution or with Windows!
More new features were added in later versions. Xandros Desktop OS 2.0 brought a drag-and-drop CD-burning utility and continued improving its two star applications - Xandros File Manager and Xandros Networks. Xandros Desktop OS 3, released just before Christmas last year, added DVD burning, file system encryption, and an easy-to-configure firewall, which, together with the distribution's move to the new kernel 2.6 and KDE desktop 3.3, were the most significant new features. Yet, the price remained unchanged - US$90 for the edition that includes CrossOver Office, a commercial application that is able to run Microsoft Office, Adobe Photoshop and other Windows applications under Linux, while the low-end edition without CrossOver and printed documentation sells for US$50. (DistroWatch readers can take advantage of the current special offer to buy Xandros Desktop OS 3 Deluxe edition at a 33% discount by visiting this page; the discount will be credited in the final stage of the online payment process.)
If we had to find a fault with the distribution, it would do more with the product's philosophy, rather than its quality or features. Great as Xandros Desktop is, we still don't like the fact that the Debian-based Xandros is happy to make use of the many open source applications that are available on the Internet for free, yet it refuses to release its own code under GPL (or a GPL-compatible licence), and keeps all its applications developed in-house under a lock. As an example, the Xandros installer is one of the best of any Linux distribution and it would be nice if its code was made available under more liberal licencing terms. Unfortunately, this is not the case.
Nevertheless, if you don't care about the philosophy of Free Software and are only interested in a quality product that will make you productive in Linux without a steep learning curve, then Xandros Desktop OS is head and shoulders above the competition.
(Disclaimer: Xandros Corporations is one of the sponsors of DistroWatch.com.)
Xandros Desktop OS 3.0 - an easy-to-use desktop Linux distribution that won't disappoint.
(full image size: 603kB)
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| Released Last Week |
Arch Linux 0.7
Arch Linux 0.7, code name "Wombat", has been released: "Well, the release that never comes has finally arrived. Arch Linux 0.7 is now available in ISO form, ready for public consumption. You can find fresh torrents and many-a-mirror on our download page. Install docs are here. Many thanks to all the users and developers who toil on this project day in and day out. I think we should be proud." Here is the full release announcement.
Peanut Linux 12.0
Here comes a new release of Peanut Linux, as announced informally on the distribution's forums: "OK, guys and gals... Jay PMed me, and it's out! Peanut 12.0 (BIG jump from 9.6). It's a live CD - SquashFS based with install to hard disk option. Kernel 2.6.10 with USB and other enhancements, KDE 3.3.1 modified and lots more! ISO is hot and fresh from the oven, packages to come after. Get it, try it, and thank Jay!" Read the release announcement here and visit the distribution's home page for further details.
FreeBSD 4.11
FreeBSD 4.11 has been released: "The Release Engineering Team is happy to announce the availability of FreeBSD 4.11-RELEASE, the latest release of the FreeBSD Legacy development branch. Since FreeBSD 4.10-RELEASE in May 2004 we have made conservative updates to a number of software programs in the base system, dealt with known security issues, and made many bugfixes. FreeBSD 4.11 will become an 'Errata Branch'. In addition to security fixes, other well-tested fixes to basic functionality will be committed to the RELENG_4_11 branch after the release." The announcement, release notes.
Burapha Linux 5.5
Burapha Linux 5.5 has been released, but with a somewhat unconventional announcement: "Ajan Tawatchai ordered an unconditional release for tomorrow morning. Testing showed a few files missing from the jedit help system, and the mail icon on the KDE task bar goes to KMail instead of Thunderbird as intended. I will not be able to fix that by morning, so we ship with those bugs. I have had zero testers, so I suspect another release with many undiscovered bugs. If you can email me the repeatable test case, I will do my best to fix things for the next release. I had budgeted one week for testing. I got one day instead. I protested and was overruled. Since nobody uses this distribution anyway, it doesn't really matter I guess. So here you go, this is the BLCD 5.5 Release." See the full changelog for further details.
tinysofa classic server 1.1-U3
The developers of tinysofa classic server have released an updated version of their distribution - version 1.1 Update 3: "tinysofa classic server 1.1 Update 3 (Rio) is now generally available. This maintenance release introduces upstream updates specifically targeting development tools, in addition to the usual fixes and improvements. The Cyrus IMAP server package has undergone a major cleanup and feature enhancement, elinks has replaced the links package, the bridge-utils package has been added to the core distribution, and Postfix now integrates the virtual delivery agent patchset." Read the announcement and changelog for additional information.
TupiServer Linux 2.0
TupiServer Linux is a Brazilian server-oriented distribution and live CD based on Kurumin Linux. New features in TupiServer 2.0 include the option to install extra packages from the CD and the inclusion of the TupiAdmin tool, which consists of TupiFirewall (web-based firewall administration), TupiUsers (proxy authentication), and TupiSites (web site filtering). Here is the complete release announcement (in Portuguese).
CentOS 3.4 (x86_64)
The x86_64 edition of CentOS 3.4 has been released: "The CentOS Team is pleased to announce the official release of CentOS 3.4 for x86_64 and EM64T. This release includes all Red Hat Enterprise Linux 3 updates (for U4) and errata up to January 19th, 2005. New ISO images are available as well as an installable DVD edition. In addition, this release is available via BitTorrent." Here is the full release announcement, inclusive of release notes, upgrade instructions, and download links.
BeatrIX Linux 2005.1
The developers of the BeatrIX live CD have released the final version of BeatrIX Linux 2005.1: "BeatrIX Linux 2005.1 Final represents more than 19 months' work by three programmers, and input from hundreds of users. It is a Debian/Ubuntu derivative, and tracks the Ubuntu repository. It was designed from the ground-up with the end user in mind. What's included: kernel 2.6.7 - this is a modified version of our pre-release kernel; GNOME 2.8.1 - it is eminently different than older versions of GNOME; Firefox 1.0 with AdBlock; Evolution 2.0.1; OpenOffice.org 1.1.2; apt; newdial-up modem support; GAIM." More details in the release announcement.
Haansoft Linux 2005 Server (x86_64)
Haansoft has announced a release of Haansoft Linux 2005 Server for 64-bit processors: "Haansoft announced the sale of Haansoft Linux 2005 Server 64bit which is based on Linux kernel 2.6. It can handle massive data processing much faster and more efficiently than 32-bit systems, and is designed to be able to use the 32-bit applications without special modifications. Kim Jin-Kwang, the chief of Linux OS team at Haansoft, said: 'The release of Haansoft Linux 2005 Server 64bit is a strategy to lead the 64-bit server market in the future. Our product is the first 64-bit Linux OS in Korea'." Read the release announcement and product specifications (both links in Korean) for further information.
Feather Linux 0.7.2
Feather Linux 0.7.2 has been released. From the changelog: "Added mtools, emelfm2, vncdec, elhttp, quagga, and Captive NTFS; updated aircrack; added ion2 - boot with 'knoppix ion2' to use it; fixed IceWM; fixed wman; added script to download the Distributed.net client; DMA can now be activated with the 'dma' cheatcode; added 'custom-noram' boot option so that custom packages can be loaded without significant RAM usage; Feather now includes the 'readahead' cheatcode to load files into the disk cache at boot - this speeds up general operation when the user has 384MB of RAM or more; made some small changes to the USB boot process; added script to download practically everything needed for web development."
Development and unannounced releases
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| Upcoming Releases and Announcements |
Updated release schedule for Mandrakelinux 10.2
The estimated release schedule of Mandrakelinux 10.2 has been updated to reflect the delay of the first beta release. However, even the updated schedule is now out of synch with reality, as the second beta release, expected on January 30th, has yet to appear on public mirrors. The updated schedule for Mandrakelinux 10.2 is available here.
* * * * *
Summary of expected upcoming releases
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| Web Site News |
New distributions addition
- Dizinha Linux. Dizinha Linux is a Brazilian Linux live CD based on Debian GNU/Linux and Kurumin Linux.
- Flash Linux. Flash Linux is a customised Linux distribution designed to be run directly off a USB key or other (similar) forms of bootable flash memory. It should work within the constraints of 256MB of (flash) memory although larger devices may also be used. Flash Linux is based on Gentoo Linux and new versions and bugfixes should track the stable Gentoo tree. Whereas Gentoo is a source distribution, Flash Linux is a binary-only distribution.
- IndLinux. The goal of the IndLinux project is to create a Linux distribution that supports Indian languages at all levels. This "Indianisation" project will strive to bring the benefits of Information Technology down to the Indian masses. We want to make technology accessible to the majority of India that does not speak English. The task of localisation has several pieces that need domain expertise. Some examples are I/O modules, development of fonts, kernel enhancements, word translation etc. The project is looking for experts and volunteers to champion the cause of Indian language computing. You may volunteer and participate here. The Indian Linux project is open source and completely free. It is licensed under the GNU General Public License.
IndLinux Live CD - Hindi speakers can now enjoy a complete Linux desktop with KDE
(full image size: 737kB)
New on the waiting list
- EzPlanet One Enterprise Linux. EzPlanet One Enterprise Linux, based on Red Hat Enterprise Linux, is a Linux distribution tuned for the enterprise and the professional. EzPlanet One integrates advanced technologies, flexibility, high availability, security, quality. Built with the enterprise in mind, it features also several tools for the professionals and individual users, that make its use more fun. Most of the latest advances in technologies available for Linux have been included in the EzPlanet One distribution. For example it supports most wireless network adapters, including those that do not have specific Linux drivers. EzPlanet One is ready to be used for your server infrastructure and your desktop clients.
- FCCU GNU/Linux Forensic Boot CD. FCCU GNU/Linux Forensic Boot CD is a Linux live CD based on Knoppix, designed for use in computer forensics.
- Mutagenix. Mutagenix is a dynamic and mutable Linux distribution, any one of several live CDs based on Slackware Linux and Linux-Live. Versions available include KDE and Dropline-Gnome. Slapt-get is the foundation for the Mutagenix build system.
DistroWatch database summary
- Number of Linux distributions in the database: 380
- Number of BSD distributions in the database: 9
- Number of discontinued distributions: 47
- Number of distributions on the waiting list: 85
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| DistroWatch in the News |
DistroWatch rising in popularity
We are pleased to report that your favourite Linux and BSD news site has been rising in popularity quite nicely in the last few months. That's according to Alexa, a search engine that ranks web sites based on the amount of traffic they generate.
On Alexa, DistroWatch.com is currently ranked at 50,151st position and rising. In fact, we have just overtaken a certain "Linux" web site that enjoys displaying anti-Linux messages on its main page ;-) For those who are interested, here is a selective list of some of the open source news sites and their current traffic rank on Alexa:
• 245 - SourceForge.net
• 1,339 - Slashdot.org
• 6,676 - Freshmeat.net
• 20,384 - Linux.org
• 23,755 - Linux.com
• 31,841 - NewsForge.com
• 32,629 - OSNews.com
• 50,151 - DistroWatch.com
• 50,635 - Kernel.org
• 53,087 - LinuxJournal.com
• 54,122 - LinuxToday.com
• 55,667 - LinuxISO.org
• 57,760 - LWN.net
• 117,610 - LinuxWorld.com
• 140,996 - LinuxPlanet.com
For comparison, the current ranking of some of the popular distributions' web sites:
• 3,708 - RedHat.com
• 5,794 - Novell.com
• 6,551 - Debian.org
• 12,330 - Gentoo.org
• 12,984 - FreeBSD.org
• 37,445 - Linspire.com
• 49,718 - Mandrakelinux.com
• 57,606 - UbuntuLinux.org
• 63,990 - Turbolinux.co.jp
• 89,886 - Slackware.com
• 111,780 - Xandros.com
• 113,031 - MEPIS.org
• 185,501 - Knoppix.org
• 425,613 - Yoper.com
• 526,387 - Lycoris.org
Many thanks to all our visitors, especially those who recommend DistroWatch to others and who link to DistroWatch on their web sites!
That's all for today, see you all next week!
Ladislav Bodnar
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| Reader Comments • Jump to last comment |
1 • Another Great week (by Nix_User on 2005-01-31 11:33:03 GMT from United States)
Always a quality issue. Thanks for the Links to building your own live boot cd.
Have a great week all.
2 • Xandros Security (by Anonymous on 2005-01-31 11:53:56 GMT from Germany)
I never would use a distribution which issues no security updates at all.
3 • The release of Debian Sarge (by Charlie on 2005-01-31 12:05:08 GMT from Hong Kong)
It has been delayed for a month.It will be the first and the biggest change of Debian since I began to use Debian.Also,I want to try the new testing branch.
Hope Debian will really release Sarge in February,I can't wait it anymore! :)
4 • Xandros Security (by Shawn on 2005-01-31 12:13:20 GMT from Canada)
I'm running Xandros 2.0 and I've got gotten security updates through the Xandros Networks utility.
5 • Xandros Security (by Fizzol on 2005-01-31 12:41:08 GMT from United States)
>I never would use a distribution which issues no security updates at all.
You are missinformed. Xandros offers security updates through Xandros Networks, I just installed a couple of new ones the other day.
6 • Has anybody done a Latin distro or language pack yet? (by just john on 2005-01-31 12:50:10 GMT from United States)
(By "Latin," I mean what they spoke in ancient Rome.)
And don't laugh too hard -- I met a guy who went on to be part of the project that translated -The-Wizard-of-Oz- into Latin.
I was inspired to ask 'cuz the desktop pic on that IndLinux blurb made me momentarily think you were talking about Native American languages.
7 • Latin (by SFN on 2005-01-31 13:25:08 GMT from United States)
"And don't laugh too hard -- I met a guy who went on to be part of the project that translated -The-Wizard-of-Oz- into Latin."
That actually makes me laugh harder. ;-)
The idea of a Latin language pack does sound cool though. They have Esperanto, after all.
8 • Slackware changes (by joe f. on 2005-01-31 13:37:07 GMT from United States)
It's just silly to take Pat Volkerding to task for how he runs his distro. It's how he makes his living, it's his baby, and he has an excellent -- and long -- track record. In a community that values choice people have the choice to use a distro that's strictly commercial, one that has a high-minded philosophy or they can be happy to use a distro run by one guy who really knows what he's doing. I saw the transcript of a chat session he was in, and when the Gnome faithful put in their bid to keep Gnome he asked if they'd heard of Ubuntu. It was the perfect answer. He's not Microsoft spreading FUD, he's not Apple telling users to learn to love the new way because it's really better. He's a Linux maintainer saying hey, if it's Gnome you're after, use a distro known for Gnome. If it's Slackware you're interested in, then you've still got KDE, XFCE, Fluxbox, etc., or a third-party Gnome such as Dropline. And remember, Slackware users aren't likely to balk at having to download a few extra packages, such as Java. If you're a Slackware user, you know it's worth it. If you're not, well, enjoy Ubuntu.
9 • Build your own live CD (by ShakaZ on 2005-01-31 13:37:45 GMT from Belgium)
You'll find scripts to make a livecd from any distro at http://www.linux-live.org/
10 • What about Fedora ? (by Marc on 2005-01-31 13:43:14 GMT from Canada)
What is the Alexa's rank of Fedora Core ?
And which site is the most popular of all ?
I would like to know !!!
( i Bet it must be Google )
11 • LATIN (by Agricola on 2005-01-31 14:38:22 GMT from Japan)
OK Folks, here is a start...
Latin computer vocabulary: http://www.obta.uw.edu.pl/~draco/docs/voccomp.html (sample: FAQ = Frequenter Allatae Quaestiones)
Perl in Latin: http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/~damian/papers/HTML/Perligata.html
12 • Slackware (by chucky on 2005-01-31 15:48:55 GMT from Luxembourg)
Well, as software gets bigger and CDs stay in size, we will end up with a CD just containing the kernel and a few goodies that are absolutely necessary.
Gee, they told me Slack was best because it was managed only on technical decisions. Is the size of a CD a technical decision, when, as you say, "Slackware users don't mind downloading a few extra packages"?
What kind of upgrade path does he provide when you chose Gnome (which was supported by Slack on 10.0) and now he just tells you "go and move to Ubunto"? How much more disrespect could he show towards his paying users?
Is this a commercial distro? Maybe, but not one I would use in a professional environment.
13 • Build Your Own LiveCD (by anon on 2005-01-31 15:52:40 GMT from Netherlands)
How to build your own Live CD based on Mandrakelinux 10.1, 10.0 or 9.2, using the mklivecd scripts:
http://home.tiscali.nl/berenstraat/howto_en.htm
And the website of the mklivecd scripts:
http://livecd.berlios.de
14 • Re: Slackware (by Andreas Steffen on 2005-01-31 16:52:15 GMT from Germany)
"Is the size of a CD a technical decision?" No, but it is a technical fact. Whether to ship n or n+1 CDs is a judgement call, but not one that can be made while satisfying everyone.
Try to think from Mr.Volkerding's point of view on the two issues you mentioned:
1.) GNOME
According to Mr.Volkerding, the GNOME build process is so shoddy that it requires a huge part of his time and substantial modifications in the base system to actually get it running. Also, recent GNOME _requires_ kernel 2.6 because of udev. Considering that one can only do so much, I can understand his decision to drop GNOME. I perceive it not as a snub to users, but as a rather vexed "sorry, it's not gonna work."
2.) Java SDK
This is a bit more problematic, because the main reason is appearantly the decision to cut Slack down to one disc. While I cannot perceive what software people employ, I feel little pity for a Java developer who does not have a J2SDK lying around regardless of distro. Admittedly, getting it on your own is an inconvenience, but for most people, downloading a second ISO-image is much more of one. I am not enthusiastic about this, either (I have the bandwidth to download two ISOs, and I do dabble in Java programming), but I believe that the large majority of slackers will be happier for it.
Regardless of the above, it _would_ be nice if he was actually asking opinions of his users. I guess their opinion of the recent changes will soon show.
Andreas
15 • Slackware (by Jurje Adrian on 2005-01-31 17:01:08 GMT from Romania)
I don't mind downloading extra packages i need for my Slackware machines... In fact i ocasionally build my own version of minimalistic CD (no X, no KDE, no XAP) from Slackware packages (current tree), with orher goodies i prefer to have on my CD, and packages compiled for my own use and by my own settings.
And yes, i use them to into production environments, without any kind of problems.
I've tryed many flavours of Linux, but i chose to use Slackware, not because of "shiny look", not even because of "powerful tools", but because of simplicity and stability.
If something doesn't work in Suse (or other "easy" distro), it's because you didn' run the wizard, if something doesn't work in Slackware, well, you may need to study to make it work.
Patrick put the 2.6 kernel in testing, as he should. I am using 2.6, and it is quite stable, but i made a Slack-based live cd and i've had issues with it. It works now, but i had to work quite much to do that. What would happed if somebody had same trouble in a production environment using the "updated" kernel??
Patrick does what he does, and i respect his decisions!
16 • Re: Slackware (by EdCrypt on 2005-01-31 17:16:39 GMT from Brazil)
"""
1.) GNOME
According to Mr.Volkerding, the GNOME build process is so shoddy that it requires a huge part of his time and substantial modifications in the base system to actually get it running. Also, recent GNOME _requires_ kernel 2.6 because of udev. Considering that one can only do so much, I can understand his decision to drop GNOME. I perceive it not as a snub to users, but as a rather vexed "sorry, it's not gonna work."
"""
Why can't Mr. Volkerding call some people to haelp on GNOME? There are people who help him when he needs, I think that this people whould love to help know.
And about Linux 2.6, it come on slack /extra or something like that.
It's a to big project and used by to many people to keep being a "personal Pat project"
17 • impartial news (by Andrea on 2005-01-31 17:38:51 GMT from Italy)
I understand and accept advertising on distrowatch, i like the policy of giving 10% as a donation to various project, but i really don't want to have advertising mixed with information. I am referring to the xandros review, which to me sounds too partial. It really seems part of the xandros advertising campaign.
distrowatch should always be distribution independent...
Let's see if this post is censored... Bye
18 • RE: impartial news (by SFN on 2005-01-31 17:49:45 GMT from United States)
"I am referring to the xandros review, which to me sounds too partial."
I'm pretty sure that Xandros would have preferred to not see this:
"Great as Xandros Desktop is, we still don't like the fact that the Debian-based Xandros is happy to make use of the many open source applications that are available on the Internet for free, yet it refuses to release its own code under GPL (or a GPL-compatible licence), and keeps all its applications developed in-house under a lock."
I'd hardly say the review is part advertising any more so than any other positive review.
And I would be STUNNED if Ladislav were to censor your post. I've never seen things work that way around here.
19 • Censorship.... (by Donavan Nelson on 2005-01-31 18:17:10 GMT from United States)
Never would you find your post here censored for offering valid or critical commentary. If Ladislav censored you, I'd ask to have my distro removed from his tracking system.
20 • Re: What about Fedora? (by grnchile on 2005-01-31 18:26:01 GMT from United States)
The Fedora project page is lumped in with redhat.com by Alexis and shows the same ranking (3,708).
I'd have thought that google.com was at the top of the list as well. We're both wrong. For English language sites, it's yahoo.com, msn.com, and then Google. It's a little disconcerting to see that passport.net and microsoft.com round out the top five.
MSN Hotmail (hotmail.com) is at the top of the Alexis worldwide list.
21 • Alexa data ... cum grano salis (by A.B.Leal on 2005-01-31 18:58:29 GMT from Portugal)
If I may apply to the the website ranking item a Latin tag (with a grain of salt ;-)
"Alexa computes traffic rankings by analyzing the Web usage of millions of Alexa Toolbar users"
(in pages.alexa.com/prod_serv/traffic_learn_more.html)
Hardly an unbiased sample, then. No surprise it correlates better with Yahoo than Google ...
22 • wow (by typhen on 2005-01-31 19:15:50 GMT from United States)
This is the last site I thought I'd see people bash Slackware. That guy Pat works hard to make a very stable distro and this is what he get for it? Thats not right. Did you all forget that Pat sells Slackware? Maybe his decision to keep it only one cd is a buisness decision. CD's cost money, and the more CDs he makes Slackware the more he could have to charge for his product to make up for the cost of the CDs. As for GNOME, it may look nice, but it is a pain to build lets face it. Did anyone think that once GNOME starts getting easier to build that Pat might put it back in Slackware? If you really want more CDs maybe some of you should go try Fedora or Mandrake. They are both 4 CDs, and they have GNOME. As for the Java SDK, I find it hard to believe that all you people that really need it haven't downloaded it already and put on a CD so you always have it. Thats what I've done with software I must have. I think you just wanted something to bit** about.
23 • No subject (by just john on 2005-01-31 20:42:15 GMT from United States)
I wonder which language pack will be completed first, Latin or Klingon ...
24 • Slackware (by Ariszló on 2005-01-31 21:16:07 GMT from Hungary)
AFAIK, Slackware is a stability-concerned vanilla distro. If Gnome does not build well without personal hacking then there is no such thing as vanilla Gnome.
25 • Slackware - Debian the old fellows (by Sam on 2005-01-31 22:33:37 GMT from United States)
Well I do use Gnome and used it on Slackware 9.0, 9.1, 10.0, and 'current'. I played with Dropline and it was cool, but I prefer the pure release.
KDE never worked on Slackware for me, I always got an error message. I never tried to fix it, since I found it amusing that it was yorked and a great source of humor. I'm sure it was some small change in a conf file. But to hear the only working out of the box DE is dropped I have to wonder. Perhaps it's culture-ware and it's not cool to work out of the box.
I did purchase 9.0 and 9.1. I'm sad to hear about Slackware dude's uhem Patrick's health, but it shows a weak link in the chain that is Slackware.
I'm as poor if not poorer than Patrick, so I couldn't pay his bills or purchase anymore releases. I didn't know if the Slackware vessel would sink, so I jumped ship.
I switched to an old favorite Debian. And yes I've heard of Ubuntu, of course it's built on Debian. Ubuntu is not quite what I'm looking for in a distro, but Gnoppix/Ubuntu is a great live CD to take around with a key chain drive to do whatever. The latest beta, 0.9.90b1 has Gnome 2.9.2 and works great. I'm looking forward to the finished product and future releases. Also Debian's going stable, but it's so darn stable in testing to me that I don't have an issue on the desktop. For pro-server volatile.debian.net looks interesting over the regular stable release. I mean my firewall/gateway/router doesn't need to be software released yesterday.
I often saw Debian and Slackware as the old guys on the block and tended to recommend one or the other.
Get well Patrick and find some mates to help you.
Sam
26 • RE: impartial news (by ladislav on 2005-01-31 22:48:44 GMT from Taiwan)
Yes, it is always a dilemma - should I ever write anything about a distribution that sponsors DistroWatch? Or should I just ignore it as if didn't exist? If I do decide to write, can I possibly be objective?
The main reason I chose to write about Xandros was that I really like their products. I don't use them because I prefer a distribution which is free in both senses of the word and which offers more choice (like Debian). But I like what Xandros has done in terms of bringing more users to Linux by offering a product that doesn't need excessive tweaking to get it work to your taste.
As for the link to the Xandros store, I thought of this as a service to readers - as far as I know, you can't get a 33% discount on Xandros products anywhere else; this is a unique offer for DistroWatch visitors only. Yes, it does sound like an advertisement, but if I was interested in buying a certain product, but was hesitating because of its price, I would certainly be happy if somebody told me about a place which sells it at two thirds of the original price.
Anyway, sorry if the Xandros feature sounded like an advertisement. It wasn't meant that way.
27 • Slack "dictator?" (by Matt on 2005-01-31 23:17:12 GMT from United States)
While I disagree with Volkerding's decision to stop building the latest GNOME (for now? forever?) a lot of the criticisms of the project on this board are way out of line.
One concern has been the "one-man" distribution model. But experience has shown that a corporate or community model is not necessarily longer-lived. There are market problems, personality problems, groupthink, coordination of development problems and sometimes all of these at once. if Pat died tomorrow, nobody using Slackware would be stuck with an inoperable or unstable system. They would however have a system that would remain quite up-to-date compared to others for at least a couple of months. Since Pat has said that there is a line of succession in place, maybe someone would care to dispute this as a matter of fact before offering conjectures. As for this model being "dictatorial," the fact that Debian (my other favorite) refuses to release x.org packages until--at least--when sarge goes gold (might as well wait on the messiah), shows that a community can also get stuck in its ways even when it inconveniences users.
As for how Pat runs the distribution, I think that it would be pretty safe now to make 2.6 the default, but there are systems that still run better on 2.4. Given limited space on the #1 install CD, and assuming that I couldn't fit both on the CD, I can't tell you for sure which way I would go, unless you told me something about the typical user of the system. Although Pat should probably give the choice of kernel some more thought, it's GNOME that abandoned the 2.4 kernel, not Pat who abandoned GNOME. And you know what? If he just shipped the same version of GNOME that was in 10.0, he'd still be running neck and neck with SUSE in product version.
Pat has not always been "dictatorial" in his decisions, either. He made the switch to XORG 6.7 against what appeared to be his own preference at the time for XFREE86 4.4, after an informal poll showed Slack customers leaned about 3 to 1 in favor of XORG. In all the strength of the distro has been that he's made very few changes in the package assortment over the years. That's also a liability for some users. If you like GNOME 2.8, wouldn't you also rather use Mozilla Firefox and Evolution anyway? Ubuntu or Fedora have a very polished GNOME desktop, and if they don't run on your hardware, it's doubtful that a 2.6 kernel GNOME 2.8 Slack would do it either.
28 • slackware and the changes (by SoliTear on 2005-01-31 23:37:21 GMT from United States)
I am a Slackware user that is jumping ship. I am a Gnome user and I don't feel it is too much to ask of a distribution to carry the 2 most important desktop environments. I chose Slackware because it gave you the user the choices and didn't restrict you. I figure that if today Gnome is dropped, then later other things will be dropped for other reasons. I am not confident of Slackware being managed by a group. I am betting that Pat has some "legal" stuff to make sure no one can take the Slack name. I am skeptical of Slackware "passing" into another person(s) hands.
I understand that Pat has the right to make choices, well, we, the users also have the right to make choices by starting to use another distribution.
Time to install Debian.
29 • Featured Distro: Xandros Desktop OS (by Bill on 2005-02-01 00:55:28 GMT from United States)
Your article is misleading in regards to Xandros history. The question was not, "How will it fare compared to the more established Linux distributions?" Rather the question was, "How will Xandros improve upon Corel Linux, already rated a top distro for ease of use, which Xandros is based on."
30 • RE: Featured Distro: Xandros Desktop OS (by ladislav on 2005-02-01 01:33:26 GMT from Taiwan)
Rather the question was, "How will Xandros improve upon Corel Linux...
I am not sure that I agree with you. If you look at release dates, Corel Linux 1.0 came out in November 1999 and Xandros 1.0 in October 2002. That's almost 3 years! (Yes, there was Corel 1.2, but it was just a minor upgrade to 1.0). Three years is a long time in a fast moving Linux development world and I think the priority for Xandros was to catch up with the existing Linux distributions. Try installing those two distributions today - they are like day and night! Sure, Xandros reused some code from the old Corel distro - I think the boot manager and the Corel file manager, perhaps some other ideas. But I believe that Xandros was almost certainly looking at other distributions, learning from their mistakes, rather than attempting to improve or revive a long dead horse that nobody was using any more.
31 • Dictatorship (by fiksve on 2005-02-01 01:38:36 GMT from Norway)
We all love the democratic model, but lets face it: Dictatorship is far more effictive in many ways. When we speak in terms of goverments it certainly has its flaws, but were not. Were talking about a piece of software! If you love GNOME you can easily install dropline or build it on your own, same for whatever else you might be missing, and if you think this is too inconvenient you simply change distro!
I dont know why people hassle up on Java SDK tough, Java development doesnt seem to be very popular in the Linux community, nor has it ever been. And conserning the liability of a oneman distro, we have a shiny tower to prove doubters wrong: The oldest surviving distro, Slackware Linux.
32 • Pretty shock about the drop of J2SDK(in Slackware) but... (by koyi on 2005-02-01 02:43:11 GMT from Japan)
I am using linux, windows, mac os x at the time and if I would like to develope a software I will surely do it in java. That's why I felt a little shocked by Pat's decision to drop it. But I think a developer should be able to install a J2SDK with no problems so it doesn't matter much for me either.
In fact, I think no matter what is dropped from the distro, if there are good documentations that show you how to add them back, nothing is actually a problem. I am expecting the new project by MadPenguin(http://www.slackersbible.org/) can fit in this place :) Its aim is to create a book like the FreeBSD handbook and I like the FreeBSD handbook.
33 • RE: Slackware (by Lawman153 on 2005-02-01 02:53:44 GMT from United States)
People need to remember that most people use Slackware for it's lack of "bloat", and tend to be experienced users. Everything has always worked for me "right out of the box", and I have never encountered any problems. I would bet money that this is because of the amount of work that Patrick does to ensure a working distribution. If there is something that he feels is not up to snuff, or is too much hassle for him to put in to the distribution, I am fine with that.
In my opinion, Slackware is the finest Linux distribution. No, it does not have everything that I want either, but I can add those packages myself. If you want to download six CD's full of crap, half of which you will never use, then download Fedora or Suse. Besides, if you aren't smart enough to install Java, you probably don't need Java. I prefer a lightweight distribution that I can tailor to my needs. I would never dream of whining that "Fedora should have this, or Suse should have that," and I would appreciate the same consideration from everyone else. If you don't like Slackware, use something else, or better yet, make your own distribution the way you see fit. If you do it well enough, someday you may be in charge of one of the oldest Linux distributions, and may even make a couple of dollars doing it.
I think that Patrick has done a wonderful job, and I appreciate everything he has done for the Linux community. Not because he had to, or could get rich doing it, but because he wanted to.
34 • Slackware dictatorship (by wouter on 2005-02-01 03:15:27 GMT from Belgium)
That Slackware is a dictatorship, and one of the oldest and most used distributions, is a testament to Patrick Volkerding's vision and capability. A dictator model can create a system that easily compares those born of group efforts; and I don't think users' input is less appreciated in these distributions than in some community or especially corporate-backed distributions. At least with Slackwares way of doing things, you know the system is as consistent and secure as Patrick Volkerding makes it, and you don't have to cross your fingers hoping some rather newbie developer didn't scew up something important. I'm happy there are also distro's that are made in this way, and I believe that in some cases, a wise dictatorship can have better results than the rule of mob which can drag things down to the rule of averageness and mediocrity.
It really is quite simple. If you like it, use it. If you don't like it, find something that you do.
35 • LiveCD creation using Gentoo: (by Vishruth on 2005-02-01 03:35:44 GMT from India)
Here are some links:
http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/releng/catalyst/ (catalyst - gentoo's liveCD creation tool).
http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic.php?t=119669 (official catalyst thread in the gentoo forums)
http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic.php?t=244837 (a more manual approach to livecd creation in gentoo... also from the gentoo forums).
36 • Slackware & Gnome (by Ariszló on 2005-02-01 07:40:22 GMT from Hungary)
In fact, one of the best built Gnome distributions is only available for Slackware. Dropline Gnome is mainly refused to be included in Slacware official because it uses PAM and FAM but many other Gnome distributions that some Slackers consider to switch to also use them:
http://www.dropline.net/gnome/
There is also a solution for Slackers who prefer a non-intrusive Gnome install. Follow the link posted by Ap0 last week's DistroWatch Weekly:
http://antesis.freecontrib.org/mirrors/slack-fr.org/packages/slackware-10.0/gnome/
37 • On future of Slackware (by Chris on 2005-02-01 09:13:57 GMT from Australia)
1. Slackware is the oldest surviving Linux distro for good reason. If that is the fault of a dictator then Pat should be praised rather than flamed.
2. How many of the 'others' who 'were critical' actually use Slackware.
3. Here is an email from no one:
"Perhaps you might consider subscribing to Slackware and support someone who has dedicated a large part of their life to promoting the Linux/GNU operating system - and in the process produced one of the best Linux distros out there."
4. Having used Gnome for the last three years I recently tried KDE and was pleasantly surprised. It was good enough for me to switch desktop manager. PS. What has happened to file-roller (rhetorical question, no need to respond - I have a nose)
5. Windows users could download and install Java - and do if they want to use it. Get Real!
6. What's wrong with JRE instead of Java SDK? Java SDK probably isn't needed by most people.
7. Again with the "dictatorial". Isn't it interesting that when someone gets something to work really well everyone else starts trying to tell them how they should do it.
8. Decisions "made arbitrarily"? That is just an outright abuse of your column inches! It is clear that a reasoned decision was made concerning all changes to Slack - you just cannot please everyone.
9. The beauty of Linux is choice. If you don't like Slackware you can choose Unbutu; you can even choose Ubunto (no I don't think you can). I choose to use and subscribe to (support) Slackware because I have found it to be the best Linux distro for me. I don't go 'round spitting on other Linux distros because I don't like them and their decisions.
38 • Another way to build your own live-CD (by Barry on 2005-02-01 09:41:04 GMT from Australia)
Puppy Unleashed Beta2 is out. I have kept a low profile on it so far ...to keep the traffic on the Puppy Forum manageable!
What this does is it is a collection of packages and a build script, to create a custom live-CD. The script is very sophisticated, with dependency checking and automatic menu generation and help index.
You need a working Puppy Linux, or any distro running the same kernel as Puppy. Then download the Unleashed tarball, expand it in a ext2/3 or reiserfs partition with 500M free space, open a terminal in it, then run the "createpuppy" script. Of course, do read the README.txt file first.
I have only uploaded it about an hour ago, so no feedback yet ...hopefully I didn't do anything wrong... it should just work!
Note, this is beta2, intended for experimenting, it's not yet an "official" release, as there is still more stuff to do.
Puppy home page:
http://www.goosee.com/puppy/
There's a link to the Forum (see the Cutting Edge section of the Forum for discussion on Unleashed).
Regards,
Barry
39 • Slackware - Debian the old fellows (by Sam on 2005-02-01 17:35:02 GMT from United States)
Well I do use Gnome and used it on Slackware 9.0, 9.1, 10.0, and 'current'. I played with Dropline and it was cool, but I prefer the pure release.
KDE never worked on Slackware for me, I always got an error message. I never tried to fix it, since I found it amusing that it was yorked and a great source of humor. I'm sure it was some small change in a conf file. But to hear the only working out of the box DE is dropped I have to wonder. Perhaps it's culture-ware and it's not cool to work out of the box.
I did purchase 9.0 and 9.1. I'm sad to hear about Slackware dude's uhem Patrick's health, but it shows a weak link in the chain that is Slackware.
I'm as poor if not poorer than Patrick, so I couldn't pay his bills or purchase anymore releases. I didn't know if the Slackware vessel would sink, so I jumped ship.
I switched to an old favorite Debian. And yes I've heard of Ubuntu, of course it's built on Debian. Ubuntu is not quite what I'm looking for in a distro, but Gnoppix/Ubuntu is a great live CD to take around with a key chain drive to do whatever. The latest beta, 0.9.90b1 has Gnome 2.9.2 and works great. I'm looking forward to the finished product and future releases. Also Debian's going stable, but it's so darn stable in testing to me that I don't have an issue on the desktop. For pro-server volatile.debian.net looks interesting over the regular stable release. I mean my firewall/gateway/router doesn't need to be software released yesterday.
I often saw Debian and Slackware as the old guys on the block and tended to recommend one or the other.
Get well Patrick and find some mates to help you.
Sam
40 • Live Puppy (by rage on 2005-02-01 18:53:13 GMT from United States)
I suggest everybody try out Live Puppy. It really does kick some serious butt. Sorry Barry if this puts a strain on your servers.
41 • Ladislav mixing of comment and usual Slack bulshit (by Realistic Bastards on 2005-02-01 18:59:38 GMT from Canada)
Ladislav ,
I dont really like your mixing of comments. Personnaly when I whant to offer a counter opinion I take the people entire comment as to not put them out of perspective. Your mixing make me look like I said Slackware is dead when I said its dying.
Slackware is not a thriving distribution its even dying , it as less users , its as less software and it as become an appliance ( offering one WM make you an appliance and not a real distribution in my book , both WM are free as in cost and freedom if your too lazy to include both you dont offer a real distribution in my book ). and it as less developper as before and even is supported by less and less GNU/Linux support company. The worst part is its sold by even less people then before removing visibility from it.
In short Slackware is not great anymore and its mostly due to the bad decision the dictator is making.This distribution users are not even supporting there distribution of choice so where not going to ask them to contribute to anything else.
------
I had a really great laugh reading the same idiocy and insanity from the Slackware users :
- Its great because its the oldest ...
- Its alive because of the great decision Pat made ...
- Your not happy you can leave ...
- he is all alone cut him some slack ..
- He whas sick you cant discuss is work for the past 12 years
- Slackware is stable and simple ...
- The cost of a 1/2 a cent CD is why he dont include gnome anymore he would have to charge 30$ more for another CD ...
- No , no , your not discussing Slackware your bashing it
- It would survive because Pat said so ...
- The system is up to date.
- People use Slackware for is lack of bloat ( learn what bloat mean first )
- Slackware work "right out of the Box" for me
- I prefer a lightweight distribution that I can tailor to my needs , even if it does not have everything that I want either.
- Patrick Volkerding's as vision and capability
- Slackwares way of doing things, you know the system is as consistent and secure.
- It really is quite simple. If you like it, use it. If you don't like it, find something that you do.
- Slackware is not a commercial distribution ...
-----
Note : BTW before some idiot start bashing me , I sale , Buy and use Slackware and most of the profit go back into the project. And I have been doing so for a very long time , I could do more but no thanks.
Did you know that at one time in 1993 -1994 Slackware add 10 million user worldwide ? ( because thats pretty much what whas availaible to everyone), down to what ? 300 thousand worldwide ?
Did you know that most people working on SuSe at Novell , for Red Hat , Mandrake , Debian and all the others they all started on Slackware ?
Did you know that over the 12 years of it existence Slackware whas bought/promoted by at least 3 different company ? who all failed.
That over the same 12 years Slackware as add more then 50 million invested in them by many people ? ( 50 million is the same money Dell made on its IPO ). all that money is gone.
Did you know that at one time Slackware ad more then 50 Paid developper on many platform , down now to 1 for only one platform and more then 20 thousand community contributor now down to not even a thousand.
Did you know that at one time Debian add less platform then Slackware add ?
Did you know that many big commercial server all used to run Slackware but since it became so insecure they all dropped it ? To this day there is even a login that as existed in many version of Slackware that enable you to take over remotely as root.
Did you know that the robotic field use to only use slackware for teaching and programming due to its stability but dropped it recently because its too old and unstable in the newer versions?
Did you know that Slack Marketing used to be the most prominent and visible Gnu/Linux promoter ?
Slackware is where its at today because of the dictator, nobody else is to blame for its dying form.
Slackware can be helped to get back to where it whas before , you just have to do the job and help ...
42 • Re: Ladislav mixing of comment ... (by Rob Morehouse on 2005-02-01 20:42:14 GMT from United States)
wow what a jerk, This guy left out the Realism in Realistic Bastard.
Commenters seem to be attacking Landislav for this issue. Personally I think the articles were excellent. There was a very clear disclaimer at the bottom of the Xandros article which should have avoided such excessive commentary.
43 • Slackware's future and development decisions (by Ezra on 2005-02-01 22:27:53 GMT from United States)
Slackware is a one-man-show, it always has been and will continue to be until Patrick Volkerding stops working on it and passes the project to someone else. However, if Slackware changes ownership, it will cease to be Slackware and become what the future developers decide.
Slackware has become what it's user's know and love it to be because of Patrick and the decisions he has made over the years. Slackware philosophy has always been KISS, along with stability and adaptability. The user has always been in control of a Slackware box. Whether Patrick includes the full J2SDK or just the JRE should be irrelevant to users since they are capable of adding components as needed.
Slackware makes it reletively easy for the user to adapt and adjust the system to his/her exact needs. The installation CD is just a starting point. Users who demand that a Linux distribution's installation routine include every possible preference (scenario, option, etc.) under the sun is not someone who should be using Slackware in the first place.
Patrick has given the Linux using community a wonderful distribution that provides a rock solid base upon which the user then decides how to adapt this system to the task at hand. All the tools and documentation is in place for adding, removing, customizing, and building software packages. The user has access to the source code and the ability to make their Slackware box into what they need.
Patrick has done his job well, and for a very long time. He deserves credit, respect, and gratitude for his contributions to the Linux community. If Patrick decides to take Slackware in a direction that any one user does not agree with, then that user has the ability to adapt Slackware to their needs.
Judging from past performance, as long as Patrick is in charge of Slackware, users can trust the system to be stable, responsive, current, and adaptable.
44 • slackware (by Matt on 2005-02-02 07:45:01 GMT from United States)
I question the expertise of the anti-Slack evangelist above, "realistic." Here in the real world, it is doubtful he's edited a single config file. How could he, when he types like a three year old? It must have been frustrating trying to 'cddd' or use 'jfoe' to edit 'XFConig8 6!"
45 • Ladislav bashing Slack (by Linux Fan on 2005-02-02 09:00:03 GMT from United States)
"Dictator." Apparently Ladislav knows better than anyone else what Slackware *OUGHT* to be. Ladislav, lay off and realize that it is CHOICE. *You* may not like it, but guess what? Patrick chooses to do what *he* wants. That is the beauty of choice in Linux and Open Source.
Ladislav often is very objective, unless he doesn't like something, in which case he voices personal opinion as fact. Sure, he might like Xandros, and gives pros and cons. He doesn't like the direction that Slackware takes, so Patrick is immediately villified as a "dictator" (by others, Ladislav notes, but then agrees with them).
Democratic decisions would be more, well, democratic, not more acceptable. Patrick chooses to run *HIS* company *HIS* way. Apparently that's not the democratic thing to do, since Ladislav obviously disagrees. Now Ladislav isn't out there in the trenches making his own version of Linux, he's busily commenting people into oblivion. He takes potshots at other Linux companies (who are ALSO churning out their versions of Linux and Ladislav isn't!) by pointing out how miserable their rankings are, and that Distrowatch gets more traffic. Wonder why he chose the bottom three? Just curious.
He doesn't censor, at least that's in his favor.
Grow up, Ladislav. Your voice is one opinion, hardly fact whatsoever. If you can do better, do so. If you can't, then stop your sniveling. Show neutrality rather than going with sensationalism. You used to be a lot more neutral.
46 • Re: Ladislav bashing Slack (by Lanx on 2005-02-02 09:06:22 GMT from Germany)
Sorry, this is nonsense. It was not Ladislav who was calling Patrick "dictator", this was the wording of "Realistic Bastard", which Ladislav was quoting was quoting in his article.
47 • No subject (by Anonymous on 2005-02-02 09:40:07 GMT from Hungary)
This is what Ladislav wrote:
But those readers who have expressed the sentiment that Slackware is managed in a "dictatorial" manner might be right, after all.
And this is what Linux Fan wrote:
so Patrick is immediately villified as a "dictator" (by others, Ladislav notes, but then agrees with them).
Lanx's conclusion is wrong.
48 • Re: Ladislav bashing Slack (by Lanx on 2005-02-02 09:46:30 GMT from Germany)
Please note the use of "might" and "seem", not "are" and "is".
49 • Xandros (by Ariszló on 2005-02-02 10:10:07 GMT from Hungary)
Ladislav is not partial toward the sponsors of DistroWatch. Judge it yourself in DistroWatch Weekly 12:
http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20030825
PS. The previous comment was mine, too.
50 • Slackware, lies and videotapes (by ladislav on 2005-02-02 13:27:21 GMT from Taiwan)
Strange how the world has turned around in one week....
In the previous DWW, I commented on how superb Slackware Linux is and why it will survive no matter what happens to its maintainer. In response, many readers came out complaining about various aspects of Slackware and calling Patrick a dictator.
So this week I decided to give the critics a bit of space and let their opinions be heard. What do I get now? "Ladislav, lay off, grow up, stop vilifying the greatest distro on earth." Great.
I am forced to conclude that no matter what I say, I am always wrong.
Maybe I should stop writing and stick to dry facts - continue providing nothing but version numbers of packages and links to reviews of those writers who have much more insight that I do.
51 • Re: Realistic Bastard (by ladislav on 2005-02-02 14:09:52 GMT from Taiwan)
I've just checked Realistic Bastard's browser string and guess what - not only he cannot type, he is, in fact, a Windows/MSIE user:
Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1; SV1; .NET CLR 1.1.4322)
Now we know where Realistic Bastard's superior Linux expertise come from....
52 • Re: Realistic Bastard (by Lanx on 2005-02-02 14:39:04 GMT from Germany)
Which is very strange given his often articulated preference for Mandrake Linux. But today is a sad day for him since Ubuntu for the first time has outnumbered Mandrake Linux in the PHD-Ranking and is the new #1 Distro ... ;-)
53 • Realistic Bastard is an Ewok (by Realistic Bastards on 2005-02-02 17:39:47 GMT from Canada)
Oh no ! I have been found ! I am in fact Steve Balmer ( developper , DEVElopper , DEVELOPPER ! ) I got fed up of the futility of spending my billions on exotics and expensive OS made by the compnay I run and wanted to see for real what this Linux whas about ,then seeing it whas so superior from coming to Distrowatch and learning from Ladislav, I add to start and make FUD about it ... or am I ?
-----
If I cant type why are your replying to me ? how can you read me ? How do you even begin to understand me ? I am the first to admit I dont have your talent for writting Ladislav , writting is actually one of my flaw , I am bad at it , not extremely bad , but bad , but then I have a diagnosed problem explaining part of it. I am told it doesn't show.
Some people wrongly assume that Microsoft people dont know about Unix or about Gnu/linux or about Mac OSX.
Some People wrongly assume that Mandrakians are inferior but when put to the task of prooving this very point no other group come even close to what the Mandrake community put out.
Some People assume that Because one use or promote Mandrake he cant use any other GNU/Linux Distribution or appliance or even be a Guru or former Guru for those other Gnu/Linux based product or even worst they cant see the fact that this person can be selling and supporting the others with funds and contributions.
But then again I cant type and I cant use Gnu/Linux right , and off course I am no expert at anything because I cant type at Ladislav level of satisfaction ?
------
- Linux IP Masquerade :
http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/IP-Masquerade-HOWTO/
http://www.e-infomax.com/ipmasq/
http://membres.lycos.fr/raguet/mandrakeuser/connect/cipc_fr.html
http://www.computerbits.com/archive/2004/0400/schroder0404.html
http://www.opera.com/features/index.dml
http://www.pgts.com.au/pgtsj/pgtsj0208c.html
http://www.macosxhints.com/article.php?story=20031205072548753
http://www.ericgiguere.com/articles/masquerading-your-browser.html
There whas a time when Gnu/linux whas considered nothing where you add the choice between crying for something which whas not availaible or not working and move back to Windows or Mac OS 9 or working around it or building what whas missing. In those days I worked around will I built the solutions.
To this days most financial site do not support Gnu/linux , some even block some earlier windows version wich they consider flawed or a security risk.
Now I must bow my head in shame and go shoot my self in the backyard because some Unbuntu users came here and rigued the PHD-Ranking for the last 1 month and claim to be the #1 distribution of Distrowatch.
http://www.google.com/search?...Ubuntu+distrowatch
- I am an Ewok I defeat the empire in battles where all the republic , rebels , Jedi , Jedi Master have all failed before.
54 • SymphonyOS Alpha (by Dark Leth at 2005-02-02 22:32:40 GMT from United States)
Hello, all.
I've been a requent reader for some time now, and have made a few random posts here and there. Now, I would ask for your help in a project.
A few weeks ago, SymphonyOS was shown on here as on the waiting list. We know have an alpha going on at the moment. If you would like to participate, please go to www.symphonyos.com/atest.html and fill out the specified areas. We really need your help!
-Alex
55 • Mr Mandrake(aka Realistic Bastards) (by EEDOK on 2005-02-03 05:49:58 GMT from Canada)
Please excuse me if I'm underinformed or anything like that, so correct me if I'm mistaken. Would the first and foremost step towards showing your support and promoting a project be actually using it?
To get my stance put out on this distribution issue, I'm 100% for distro surfing, but against sticking to a single distribution, in favor of everyone having their own custom distribution build(in what suits them).
56 • What's all the bickering about? (by Robert Lindsay on 2005-02-03 05:56:27 GMT from Australia)
And what's with all "the glass is half-empty" type of comments lately?
Also the Dictator/Democratic labels don't make any sense when applied to distros.
What kind of dictator does all (or most) of the work himself (often at their own expense) and then gives the product of their labours away?
What kind of democracy is it when someone (or more) does all the work and then others want to determine how it should be done and what it should consist of?
Sounds like many people don't want a distro maintainer(s) but a personal (unpaid?) IT servant. Do this! Do that! Just do it to suit me! etc. Blah!
The first distro I used was Slackware, later I tried others before settling on Debian. My point is - all distro no matter how big or small is a potential pathway for someone into Linux. At any stage of using/exploring linux you can look for something else which suits you better or you can make a distro of your own. This is a good thing!!
Lastly - remember why you came here in the first place. Put the fun back into computing! :)
Cheers
rob
57 • Never Quit (by Layne on 2005-02-03 06:19:29 GMT from United States)
Ladislav,
I hope your last comment about not writing was just from frustration. I've enjoyed your writings for many years and would hate for you to stop expressing your opinions. My daughters stopped writing because they hated the insanely rude posts. Now they do absolutely nothing with Linux. Worse, this sort of nonsense here reinforces their opinion that the Linux community is just filled with losers who whine. Personally, their decision to not write reviews any longer was a great loss. While the site laid dormant this past year until destroyed by a worm variant they'd have prefered it all be wiped and removed from their memories too. Just ignore the storm and enjoy Linux.
Layne
www.tuxreports.com
still PR 6 ;)
58 • distrowatch generel comment (by Klavs Klavsen on 2005-02-03 14:35:43 GMT from Denmark)
Hi guys,
I'd just like to voice my opinion of a severe need, that no one fills (and for which distrowatch would be perfect ;)
I have an USB cdrom drive (as I own several servers and laptops such as the IBM X-series without builtin cdrom), and I have found that MANY live cd's and distro-installers do NOT work with an usb cdrom drive :(
It has taken me great pains (and wasted cd's :) to find some that do.
Mandrake 10.0 and 10.1(I suppose only tested 10.0) supports booting from USB drive. SimplyMepis 2004.6 does not (it appereantly did one time in 2003- but I have not confirmed this). Many livecd's using GRUB fails utterly, when booted from an USB cdrom. Some Knoppix versions did too.
I was bitten by this today, wanting to install a new distro on my wife's computer (was using Gentoo - but I haven't got the time to install new things -and as it's a P3-600mhz it simply takes too long to compile KDE :( )
It would be very nice, if one could select to list distro's/livecd's that fullfill this or that requirement (one being "Boot from USB cdrom"). I hope you like the idea :)
59 • alt tags in distrowatch and webpages generally (by Nitroushhh on 2005-02-03 15:46:39 GMT from United Kingdom)
Hi Ladislav,
I've been doing some web development recently and came across the discussion regarding alt= and title= to display a yellow box with text in a web browser.
Mozilla doesn't display 'alt's as this is not a w3c standard. but does display 'title'. Which is a w3c standard.
I see quite a mix of title and alt in distrowatch but mostly alt tags. This means that people using standards based web browsers don't see all the work you've put in.
Do we think that we should all use 'title' for our webpages ???
As alts seem only to display in Internet Explorer I had considered changing all my alts to 'Have you considered using a standards based browser like Firefox?' :-) But i thought that was a bit mean.
Nitroushhh.
60 • @Layne (by Realistic Bastards on 2005-02-03 15:54:28 GMT from Canada)
Sorry to see that the comment I made make you relive again the pain of loosing your great website.
"their decision to not write reviews any longer was a great loss. "
It whas also a great Loss to the entire GNU/Linux community , but life goes on as they say , people have a tendancy to focus only on the bad thing and forget that the majority of people are silent and just appreciate your great work without commenting.
Say hello to Lizzy and Birdie ( hope I got there nickname right ) from a former admirer of there great work , tell them that to this day some people still remember there great work and miss it a lot.
Its always fun to be judged by the minority , people forget that the majority of Gnu/Linux users are the ones who contribute help , how-to , review , code and funds.
61 • Re:distrowatch generel comment (by EEDOK on 2005-02-03 17:49:30 GMT from Canada)
I remember being able to do this with DSL, I just got the bootusb.img floppy and it worked like that. The other way was in some mobo's it lets you boot from external zip disk, choose that option and see how it goes.
62 • User agent switcher (by Distrowatch reader on 2005-02-04 00:04:26 GMT from United States)
The browser user agent string "Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1...." looked familiar so I checked mine for IE Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1) or for Netscape Mozilla/4.8 [en] (Windows NT 5.1; U)or even Opera/7.54 (Windows NT 5.1; U) [en] the Default choices Of User Agent Switcher 6.1 for Mozilla and Firefox
63 • The Alexa Stats/Slackware (by Arron Downunder on 2005-02-04 15:35:24 GMT from Australia)
Hi Guys
On the Slackware issue - I have used a no of linux distros since 1996. If it is stable and configurable and has the ability to download/install whatever you want, what is the problem?
Ladislav: I greatly respect and enjoy your views, but people can misread anything. BTW, what happened to the "original" girl logo for Distrowatch that Microsoft seemed to pinch? Just curious.
Now, the Alexa Stats. For a lot of techheads, you all seemed to miss the two points.
1) Ladislav commented that he had passed ratings of the Linux site which had anti linux advertising from Microsoft. Congratulations Ladislav! I am glad sanity is glacially working. Selling out principles is never a good move.
2) Anyone using anti spyware/trojan (Spybot S & D in my case) on Windows will remove Alexa on installation. Any Sys Admin without anti spyware should be fired for incompetence. I have never detected Alexa on any linux distro (mind you, behind my minimalist firewalls with maximum protection/detection, how would it get in?). In other words, any reasonably secure system (and almost all corporate networks) will not register at all in the Alexa stats. Google does not use Alexa, Yahoo and MSNxxxxx does. For Google to appear, these must be insecure machines with alexa installed - and it comes third! For Hotmail to top the worldwide list is showing how trustworthy computing has helped MS's level of security.
Greetings from Downunder. Now if Patrick can get better and DebIan can actually release 3.1.... that will be a great week. In the meantime, I can smile at hotmail. No 1 on insecure machines - go MS what a stat, what an achievement.
64 • What happened to BeatrIX (by Distrowatch Reader on 2005-02-04 20:23:46 GMT from United States)
What happened to BeatrIX? It looks like a real nice Distro to try. Parts of the site seem to work. I am posting this in the hope that the operators read this post and re enable the site, Just a thought after the christmas defacement Did the defacers do more than just deface your site. You are using a security poor php engine just ask pclinux os about getting hacked
Resolving download.watsky.net... 217.31.49.244
Connecting to download.watsky.net[217.31.49.244]:80... connected.
HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 200 OK
Length: 191,264,768 [application/octet-stream]
~: Permission denied~/BeatrIX_2005.1F.iso: No such file or directory
I tried every thing I could think of posting email no response.
65 • Slackware's future and development decisions (by Adrian Bob on 2005-02-04 23:47:03 GMT from Romania)
I've tryed many flavours of Linux, but i chose to use Slackware, not because of shiny look, not even because of powerful tools, but because of simplicity and stability.
I don't mind downloading extra packages i need for my Slackware machines
As for GNOME: GNOME build process is so shoddy that it requires a huge part of his time and substantial modifications in the base system to actually get it running.
Also, recent GNOME _requires_ kernel 2.6 because of udev. Considering that one can only do so much, I can understand his decision to drop GNOME.
In my opinion, Slackware is the finest Linux distribution.
No, it does not have everything that I want either, but I can add those packages myself.
If you want to download X CD's full of crap, half of which you will never use, then download other distributions.
Besides, if you aren't smart enough to install Java, you probably don't need Java.
I prefer a lightweight distribution that I can tailor to my needs.
If you don't like Slackware, use something else, or better yet, make your own distribution the way you see fit.
I appreciate everything that Pat has done for the Linux community.
Not because he had to, but because he coud.
Pat it`s your way i will go`
Best regards
sorry for my bad english i`m from romania ...
Number of Comments: 65
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Voltalinux
Voltalinux was a GNU/Linux distribution based on Slackware Linux and the pkgsrc package system from NetBSD. The project offers a pre-built distribution where the user can enjoy the clean design of Slackware Linux with the availability of over 5,000 NetBSD ports ready to be installed.
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