| DistroWatch Weekly
1 • Funtoo (by megadriver on 2011-06-20 08:53:58 GMT from Spain) |
Funtoo is, indeed, awesome. It's the only distro that still manages to (temporarily) lure me away from Arch every now and then. It has made quite a lot of progress recently, specially in the documentation front.
I think my "ideal distro" would be a source-based Arch (ABS, AUR and PKGBUILDs FTW!) with USE flags... One can dream, right?
2 • Firewall tools: Shorewall (by evdvelde on 2011-06-20 09:11:37 GMT from Belgium)
My preferred firewall tool is shorewall. I have an IPv4/IPv6 firewall with two default gateways, NATing and such and all works perfectly. Easy to maintain as well!
3 • Funtoo (by Dr.Saleem Khan on 2011-06-20 09:25:20 GMT from Pakistan)
Funtoo sounds exciting and challanging . Arch has apparently no match regarding the simplicity of its whole concept but anyone who is ready for something more than Arch Funtoo is definetly best alternate.
An interesting and "loaded" Distro Weekly after many weeks .
4 • Annual package database update (by Alexandru Popa on 2011-06-20 09:35:13 GMT from Germany)
I suggest to include Gnome3 or replace libgnome with it.
5 • Curious (by macias on 2011-06-20 09:37:26 GMT from Poland)
@megadriver, your opinion is not rare of course, but since I get really curious because of today DW and your comment...
Let's say you would have such ideal distro -- what would you with it? What would you get with it?
I am asking because "dream" is a big word, and I am wondering what I am missing here. What is impossible in any other Linux distro (or is really painful). AFAIK Linux distros have much in common, and they differ very little, and they are all based on the same set of software. So why "a dream"? LibreOffice would get "reveal codes" feature?
6 • package database update (by Patrick on 2011-06-20 09:46:00 GMT from France)
I would suggest to add OpenShot (http://www.openshotvideo.com/) to the database.
7 • @5 (by megadriver on 2011-06-20 10:04:54 GMT from Spain)
The Funtoo part: Compiling from source, with USE flags, I can build a lean, customized system in which only the stuff I want/need is installed, without "forced" dependencies (which I hate with a passion).
The Arch part: The Arch Build System allows me to easily (PKGBUILDs are simple bash scripts) create, install and manage my own (or others', via the AUR) handmade packages. In comparison, ebuilds are a huge headache.
A combination of the best of both approaches (USE flags+ABS) would be true "heaven on earth" for me, but, of course, your mileage may vary!
8 • Still curious (by macias on 2011-06-20 10:16:57 GMT from Poland)
@megadriver, Yes, I have a quite different experience, but I am still curious -- writting entire system from scratch would allow you to build completely customized system, without any forced lines of codes. You could write your own, custom features, not even spotted in any other Linux distro.
What you wrote so far, is not impossible in (for example) openSUSE and what worse you get eventually the same quality of software, the same features, the same bugs. On one hand I see an effort without real difference in results, on the other limiting yourself to obtained source codes.
IOW: why it is so important to do something in different way, spending more time, to get the same results? Oh well, more like rhetorical question now :-)
9 • Firewall configuration ... (by Coffee on 2011-06-20 10:55:18 GMT from France)
> Do you have a preferred firewall configuration tool? Let us know in the comments.
... I don't use a firewall configuration tool but I have IPtables installed and configured with a handful of rules (/etc/firewall.conf) that seem to work well. All ports are closed and my PC (SliTaz Live session) passes the Shields UP stealth test without any complaints (everything's green). But I'm no specialist. Maybe someone has wants to comment or has some ideas for improvement? Here's my firewall.conf file ...
# Network interface.
# Enable/disable kernel security.
# Enable/disable iptables rules (iptables package must be installed).
# Netfilter/iptables rules. This shell function is included in
# /etc/init.d/firewall.sh to start iptables rules ...
# Drop all input connections.
iptables -P INPUT DROP
# Drop all output connections.
iptables -P OUTPUT DROP
# Drop all forward connections.
iptables -P FORWARD DROP
# Accept input on localhost (127.0.0.1).
iptables -A INPUT -i lo -j ACCEPT
# Accept input on the local network (192.168.0.0/24).
iptables -A INPUT -s 192.168.0.0/24 -j ACCEPT
# Accept near all output traffic.
iptables -A OUTPUT -m state --state NEW,ESTABLISHED,RELATED -j ACCEPT
# Accept input trafic only for connections initialized by user.
iptables -A INPUT -m state --state RELATED,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT
10 • Desktop OS for old computer: Connochaet OS (by Magic Banana on 2011-06-20 11:04:07 GMT from Brazil)
What about testing the upcoming Connochaet OS ( http://www.connochaetos.org/wiki/ )? This RC release, which is by the way not listed on http://distrowatch.com/connochaet yet, is lighter than SliTaz GNU/Linux (like in Pentium I with 64 MB RAM), it is full-featured and it aims to be 100% Free (as in Freedom).
11 • Tracked packages (by rich52 on 2011-06-20 11:35:04 GMT from United States)
I agree with the comments above. Some of the packages above should be tracked for updates. Gnome 3 is an important one because of the video problems many of us are experiencing with HD radeon ATI and Nvidia video free and non-free drivers. I for one am unimpressed with the development of both Gnome 3 and UNITY. Maybe articles on these problems would be good to address.
12 • Scientific Linux experience (by Dimitri on 2011-06-20 12:41:31 GMT from United States)
We've used CentOS in our facility since we opened our doors more than seven years ago. It's been solid and reliable throughout. Unfortunately, as we all know, no one save the maintainers know when version 6.x will appear. Now, we're in the midst of a server refresh, and would really like to install 6.x so that we not only get the benefits of development in that version, but also an EOL that's further out.
Since we had to do something now, we thought we'd try Scientific Linux. Alas, for us alt least, it wasn't a good experience. First, there was a kernel bug having to do with our AMD processors. Also, there was an issue with the Broadcom NICs. No fixes could be suggested. Finally, there were enough differences from the upstream version (e.g.RPMS created with rpmbuild would be deposited in /root/build, or somesuch, rather than /usr/src/redhat/RPMS. OK, that's somewhat minor, but there are others.).
The upshot is that we couldn't trust a buggy installation in our production environment. So, we rolled back to CentOS 5.x. I guess that gives us about three years to catch up to the latest and greatest (7.x ?) before 5.x EOLs. Very disappointing.
13 • @8 (by megadriver on 2011-06-20 13:39:06 GMT from Spain)
Writing an entire system from scratch would give me 100% control, indeed, but I lack the time, talent and dedication required to even think about trying something like that.
Sure, what I propose can be done with any distro, but the ABS happens to be the easiest, fastest way I know to create customized packages, and USE flags happen to be the easiest, fastest way I know to get rid of unwanted stuff when building them. For me, It's a matter of striking a balance between "control" (which I crave) and "convenience" (I'm a bit lazy and impatient, too).
I know that, in this age of multi-core processors, terabyte drives and multi-gigabyte memory, most people don't care at all about (what I consider) "bloat" and unwanted dependencies, but this happens to be a pet peeve of mine (if not a "compulsion", heh). I derive a certain degree of satisfaction and "pride" from having a small system with minimal dependencies (maybe I'm like one of those "car tuning" enthusiasts or something... I'll readily admit it's not an entirely "rational" thing), but, on the other hand, I don't want this to consume so much time and effort that it stops being fun and starts feeling like a chore.
I regularly scrutinize the list of packages installed as dependencies in my system ("pacman -Qe", in Arch), and, for each of them, ask myself "Do I really use, need or want this one? If I don't, what caused it to be installed? Can I get rid of it?". With the ABS, it's ridiculously easy to create a customized package for any software you want, with just the functionality you want. With Gentoo/Funtoo's USE flags, it's ridiculously easy to apply those customizations globally. If only they could be combined...
Maybe (just maybe) one day I'll tire of all this tinkering, install LMDE or Pardus, stop caring about all those pulseaudios, *kits and gconfs lurking in my hard drive doing nothing, and be done with it, but, as of now, this is still why I use Linux:
Phew! That was probably way too long, and I'm not even sure if I did get my point across... If not, the short answer probably is "because I can" :)
14 • @13, errata (by megadriver on 2011-06-20 14:59:52 GMT from Spain)
I meant "pacman -Qd", of course. Silly me.
15 • Linux Firewalls (by Sitwon on 2011-06-20 15:03:38 GMT from United States)
I think it's important to point out that every Linux system has (at a minimum) the Netfilter firewall and the iptables command-line utility for configuring it. The vast majority of firewall tools you'll see are just graphical front-ends for iptables.
So if you happen to be a professional sysadmin it might be worth your time to learn iptables directly and get cozy with it's man pages. However iptables is not the easiest tool in the world so if you're not getting paid to know the graphical frontends to the same job with a lot less pain.
16 • @ 12 | Scientific - CentOS - Oracle? (by Jozsef on 2011-06-20 16:18:21 GMT from United Arab Emirates)
What about Oracle Linux? http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=oracle
When I read your post, the first thing came to my mind is: if there is any other alternative to Red Hat than CentOS and Scientific. And the only one I can remember right now is Oracle Linux. I haven't tried to use it. But maybe you can do some test and see if it works good enough for you.
17 • rpmbuild issue isn't a Scientific Linux problem, AFAIK (by J. J. Ramsey on 2011-06-20 16:29:37 GMT from United States)
Dimitri: "RPMS created with rpmbuild would be deposited in /root/build, or somesuch, rather than /usr/src/redhat/RPMS"
It used to be that the RPM build tree had things under /usr/src/redhat, but now rpmbuild is designed so that ordinary users can build RPMs, and the build tree is in a subdirectory of $HOME. As a result, running rpmbuild as root is much like running rpmbuild as any other user, so things end up in the root user's $HOME.
18 • About Frugalware (by NikNak on 2011-06-20 16:36:08 GMT from Austria)
It is actually not THE pacman anymore. It has been an own, different (so I don't say better ;) ) implementation of Archlinux's package manager for a while now.
19 • @ 12 @17 Scientific rpmbuild (by Dimitri on 2011-06-20 17:12:16 GMT from United States)
Of course, it's my opinion, but I don't trust Oracle to not change the game, the GPL notwithstanding. I am keeping my eye on ClearOS (formerly ClarkConnect), which is looking to faithfully clone the "major north american vendor's" 6.x version.
As to rpmbuild, I wasn't aware of the change. So, in RHEL 6.x for example, RPMs are built in the home directories of the builder? Interesting.
20 • @ 12 + 19 (by Anonymous on 2011-06-20 18:23:48 GMT from United States)
I too prefer CentOS, the lack of security updates between releases is just not important. The fact that many web sites ran on CentOS are being cracked is clearly a coincidence.
BTW: Scientific Linux doesn't change the kernel, so your issue would happen on RHEL, CentOS, and the compatibility kernel that Oracle provides. Oh, and rpmbuild worked just fine when called by a user in 5.x., stfw to find how.
21 • CentOS 6 (by Derek on 2011-06-20 18:30:06 GMT from India)
CentOS should be released by the end of the month: http://qaweb.dev.centos.org/qa/
22 • Why CentOS and not Debian? (by DSA on 2011-06-20 18:44:00 GMT from Denmark)
I'm a die-hard Debian user for CLI-based servers (i.e., remote administration). CentOS RPM repositories lack many basic CLI applications that are readily available to Debian users. As a result, I've found CentOS difficult to deploy and use as a CLI-only server. I also like the support of Debian's large and well-established community, and its regular security updates.
Why others are so fond of CentOS? Is CentOS better used as a GUI-based server? What advantages does CentOS have over Debian and other distributions? Thanks!
23 • Debian vs CentOS (by Jesse on 2011-06-20 19:00:41 GMT from Canada)
Off the top of my head I like RHEL (and related) servers for their performance, easy-to-use configuration tools, documentation, SELinux support, and ISV compatibility. I also like the installer in RHEL/CentOS and recent versions of YUM I find to be really pleasant to use.
You didn't mention which command line tools you miss when using CentOS, but I've never had a problem in that area. I also like that, since Red Hat and CentOS are so widely used, it's easy to find community support for most issues.
24 • CentOS (by Dimitri on 2011-06-20 20:03:51 GMT from United States)
I didn't want to start a whole distro comparison thing here. It comes down to what works best for you (part of the beauty of having so many distros to choose from, eh?). I cut my teeth on Redhat 4.x (really), so Redhat-based distros are what I know well. It doesn't mean that I haven't tried and/or use others. It's just a matter of my personal preference.
25 • RHEL respins (by Dave Postles on 2011-06-20 20:16:29 GMT from United Kingdom)
Please allow me to mention the continuing development of PU_IAS 6.x (Princeton University/Institute for Advanced Studies). It's worth a look.
26 • Thank you (by Dimitri on 2011-06-20 20:24:31 GMT from United States)
Thanks you all. Learned a lot here today. I fully subscribe to the motto of Faber College - "Learning is Good." :-)
27 • Funtoo vs. Gentoo (by M. Edward (Ed) Borasky on 2011-06-20 21:22:37 GMT from United States)
I tried Funtoo when I was still using Gentoo and didn't see any advantage of Funtoo over Gentoo. Did I miss something?
28 • Package database (by Russ Parman on 2011-06-20 21:35:11 GMT from United States)
I started using Synapse semantic launcher ( https://launchpad.net/synapse-project ) about 6 months ago and now consider it a must have.
29 • Firewall config tools (by WalterMedak on 2011-06-20 22:01:23 GMT from Canada)
Firestarter is my firewall config tool of choice for configuring iptables. It's easy to use and gives real-time info about what's going on. But, from what I read, it's no longer maintained.
30 • Firewall Gui - Vuurmuur (by Morgan on 2011-06-20 22:07:34 GMT from United Kingdom)
I like to use the iptables gui - Vuurmuur
- Has real time monitoring - better than any other Firewall gui in existence
- Also being ncurses means you can use it on a server also...
For a non real time monitoring solution I would use fwbuilder - this can be used on any desktop to create iptables rules
-Uses a licensing model - Free on Linux - Pay for on Windows/Mac !
31 • Funtoo vs. Gentoo (by khelix on 2011-06-21 00:02:33 GMT from United States)
Ed, you are correct that Funtoo is not much different than Gentoo. The main difference that I notice is the use of git over rsync for maintaining the portage tree. I am a long time Gentoo user (since 2000) and still use it as my server. A few months ago I switched my workstation from Gentoo to Funtoo and notice very little difference. As I saved all of my custom configs and home directory from Gentoo it took only a few hours to get up and running again.
32 • Changes in package database (by Thomas Mueller on 2011-06-21 01:03:28 GMT from United States)
While OpenOffice.org is to be replaced by LibreOffice due to Oracle's policies, another big package that is affected is MySQL which is being forked into an Oracle-free version, MariaDB. So for the same reasons that LibreOffice is taking OpenOffice's position, MariaDB ought to be included as an alternative or replacement for MySQL.
33 • re 27: Funtoo vs. Gentoo (by djhyland on 2011-06-21 01:18:32 GMT from United States)
If you're missing something, then so am I. I looked at Funtoo a year or so back, and unless it's changed a great deal, it didn't offer much that would make me switch from Gentoo. Yeah, some of their ideas are cool, like the git-based portage and such, but for what I would notice in normal use, I don't think there's enough reason for me to switch. Perhaps if I wanted to do a fresh install on a new computer, I'd give it a try, but otherwise...
34 • PCLOS's version of Shorewall firewall (by elcaset on 2011-06-21 01:38:09 GMT from United States)
I've tried a few GNU/Linux firewalls, & PCLOS's version of Shorewall firewall is my favourite. However, what I would like even better, is something that works like ZoneAlarm. (Permissioning, or blocking each application orservice through the firewall.)
35 • Mint Updates (by Sly on 2011-06-21 03:41:31 GMT from United States)
Did DW beat Linux Mint to the punchs I see nothing on Mint"s website about the release of updates.
36 • Funtoo vs. Gentoo (by nCdy on 2011-06-21 07:27:33 GMT from Russia)
I think you are trying to compare different things here. But saying that funtoo have nothing new except git portage is completely wrong. There are a lot of different things, I just want to provide one example to clear this mess : Gentoo included baselayout2 in 8 May 2011 and after that gentoo is providing broken stage3, 4 June 2011 they provide (on forum thread) some hack to manual repair broken stage3 as far as I know the trouble is still being not solved. Funtoo got working baselayout2 sins September 2008. But for sure Funtoo is using lot of the Gentoo work, based on it and respect it, so it's incorrect comparison.
37 • Funtoo vs. Gentoo (no bashing, just some expressed feelings) (by disi on 2011-06-21 11:51:10 GMT from Germany)
I chose Funtoo for my new laptop over Gentoo, because of Grub2 and gpt boot support. gptfdisk automatically provides alignment for SSDs and I didn't want to use some old MBR layout anymore.
Other than that, I didn't notice much difference, except: older compiler, older Python etc. but that's part of the statement for Funtoo, that they do not want to upgrade those as often as Gentoo does. The problem that arises, since Funtoo uses Gentoo ebuilds for most packages beyond the core system, that packages need e.g. python 2.7 or even 3.2 to run and you have to unmask those in Funtoo. This breaks you depclean etc.
What I also miss is, the support. If you have a problem in Gentoo, you file a bug report and/or go to the forum. If you have to problem in Funtoo, you really have to check if it is Gentoo or Funtoo related before you can ask at Gentoo ressources for support (similiar to Sabayon). But it was said that bugs are reported back and not just posted in the Funtoo forum and or the Funtoo mailing list... I haven't really figured that out yet.
This is no Funtoo bashing, just some observations.
What is a little upsetting to me is, that Daniel never intended to compete with Gentoo and here it is on Distrowatch as it's own distribution.
38 • Funtoo vs. Gentoo (by Sylvain Alain on 2011-06-21 12:05:24 GMT from Canada)
I think the main diff between Gentoo and Funtoo is really the configuration part. In fact, with Funtoo, configuring your wireless or your wired connection is really easy if you compare with Gentoo.
Configuring a WPA2 wifi connection is really painless with Funtoo.
Also, I use Grub2 and with the boot-update project, it's really easy to add or remove a kernel from the grub.cfg.
All the stuff is done automagically.
When I compile a new kernel I run this and I can get the job done :
# make && make modules_install && make install && boot-update -V && module-rebuild rebuild && reboot
39 • @20 Scientific Linux doesn't change the kernel (by Dimitri on 2011-06-21 13:05:36 GMT from United States)
A very good point. So, theoretically, I should see the same issues with, say, PU_IAS (which I didn't even know existed; thanks for the information). Has anyone else encountered kernel bug issues with AMD processors and 6.x kernels? I don't mean to turn the Comments section here into a troubleshooting forum, so please feel free to contact me off-list, so-to-speak, if you have (and how you may have dealt with them).
40 • Firewall Opinions.. (by Senssah on 2011-06-21 13:08:28 GMT from United States)
It's important to know there are 2 approaches to firewalls;
1. Stand alone computer/device
2. Workstation firewall
1. Beginners: Gufw/Ufw
2. Intermediate: Gufw/Ufw, use the commandline to create the rules. Study the
default After and Before rules, they will trip you up if you ignore them: /etc/ufw/
3. Intermediate/Advanced: Firewall Builder
Stand alone computer;
41 • Source-based Arch (by chemicalfan on 2011-06-21 13:19:05 GMT from United Kingdom)
@megadriver: You've described my exact set up on my netbook. My Arch system was built exclusively using the ABS & AUR. The key isn't USE flags, it's the modification of /etc/makepkg.conf ;)
The only problem is the convoluted way of checking for updates - pacman isn't smart, and will replace your lovely optimised packages with stock binaries from the repos. No biggie though - use a bash script to interrogate pacman, then manually use the ABS to update (it could even be automated if you're brave!)
42 • RHEL 6 Clone (by Mike on 2011-06-21 13:41:21 GMT from United States)
I believe I came across the first clone on your site of RHEL 6 and it was not Scientific Linux as stated recently. But when I look for the distro in the distrowatch list it is not there. The distro is Frame OS. The site for it is still up but may not be active. It is not an easy to use distro. The url is http://frameos.org/FrameOS/Home.html.
43 • firewall configuration tool (by adam on 2011-06-21 13:44:05 GMT from United States)
although not gui, i really liked firehol. project seems to be very stale though.
44 • RHEL derivatives (by Casimir on 2011-06-21 15:53:07 GMT from United States)
It's a shame that PUIAS Linux scarcely gets any notice. I moved to it in February and have been quite satisfied.
Also, I will be interested to see how ClearOS Core turns out.
45 • Firewall & Funtoo (by PerfMonk on 2011-06-21 18:26:55 GMT from Canada)
I have use firehol too. It really a nice project. But once you know how to set up your own firewall with iptables, you don't need it anymore. iptables is quite simple to learn and the resulting rules are simpler and cleaner.
See this howto (in french) :
I like very much Funtoo. I use the testing distro and it is very stable. The packages used are very recent. All the network stuff (wifi or not) is very simple to setup. The best advantage of Funto is that it is a smaller organisation and it's lean and mean. There is less conflicts between members. They will take a new stance and do it asap. No years waiting for a useless concil to take a decision. Daniel Robbins is doing a great job.
The support is very good too and the organisation is friendlier.
It's my 0,02$ and my own point of view. I have nothing against other distro, but the best is simply Funtoo!
46 • Funtoo vs Gentoo (by disi on 2011-06-21 19:04:18 GMT from United Kingdom)
on my Funtoo system...
I just exchanged /usr/share/portage and /usr/portage + /sbin/MAKEDEV (which was a blocker) with the files from a current Gentoo stage3 and now rebuilding my world (had to unmask grub-1.98 and now it's rolling an emerge -e world to revert back to Gentoo...
47 • @41 (by megadriver on 2011-06-21 22:15:58 GMT from Spain)
Well, I don't care about speed optimization that much (if that's what you're talking about). I've never felt any noticeable speed difference between Arch's i686 optimized binary packages and my Funtoo's core2 optimized hand-compiled packages.
What I really care about is easily getting rid of unwanted dependencies. I want to be able to tell the ABS, for example, "all my packages shall be built without pulseaudio support, always", instead of having to edit each and every affected PKGBUILD to manually add "--disable-pulse" (or whatever they do to disable Pulseaudio at compile time, which I'm sure varies), and having to do it again every time any of those PKGBUILDs gets updated.
That's why I think Gentoo/Funtoo's global USE flags are so great. I just have to add "-pulse" to the USE option in make.conf, and the system takes care of the rest for me. Is there a way to make the ABS do something similar via an option in Arch's makepkg.conf that I'm not aware of?
48 • Slitaz "Control Box"? (by RO on 2011-06-22 02:30:41 GMT from United States)
I just installed Slitaz (on a Fujitsu P1120 - wimpy Transmeta Crusoe needs all the lightening up it can get ;-), and it does ok (took some effort to get wifi working - had to use a Cisco Aironet 350 PC Card which worked with the Airo driver when the Orinoco module would not work with the Prism2 builtin wifi - Bodhi picked it up in a few seconds automatically). However, I cannot find (yet) anything like the "Control Box" your review spent some time on - any clues? I am using a newer Cooker version from May 31 if that matters.
49 • Gnome 3 problems (by Deemon on 2011-06-22 03:22:03 GMT from Germany)
I found that suspend doesn't work with Gnome 3 in Ubuntu. Does suspend works with Fedora's Gnome 3?
50 • #49 suspend in Fedora Gnome 3 (by gnomic on 2011-06-22 04:29:46 GMT from New Zealand)
'Does suspend works with Fedora's Gnome 3?'
Well there's a question. I fear it probably has a number of answers, depending on what kind of machine you have, whether you have been very very good, and so on.
In my experience, the answer is probably not. You probably should consult some forum specifically dealing with Fedora.
I seem to recall that paldo's Gnome 3 did manage to suspend on a ThinkPad in a live CD session and resume in a usable state.
51 • Gnome 3 suspend (by dc on 2011-06-22 05:51:02 GMT from United States)
It very much depends on your hardware, but I had no problems suspending with one or two Gnome 3 shell sessions going under Fedora 15. When I logged in a third user, suspend stopped working with my hardware.
52 • Gnome 3 problems (by Deemon on 2011-06-22 07:46:54 GMT from Germany)
My laptop is Acer Aspire with Intel i3 330M. Maybe the suspend doesn't work as Gnome 3 is not an Ubuntu release, but installed additionally. With Fedora, Gnome 3 comes together, so maybe it works better in Fedora.
53 • Control Box (by Jesse on 2011-06-22 12:27:35 GMT from Canada)
From the SliTaz desktop, go to the Application menu. Go down to the System category and select Control Box. The wireless and network options are at the bottom of the window.
54 • Ladislav - openSUSE release (by Landor on 2011-06-22 15:47:59 GMT from Canada)
I thought I should let you know that all of the torrents are coming up with the error 'unregistered torrent'.
Keep your stick on the ice...
55 • LiveCDs with some alternative Window Managers? (by Pearson on 2011-06-22 17:25:29 GMT from United States)
I'm interested in playing with some of the alternative WMs, like awsome and the like. However, I don't really want to change my configuration (actually, my Linux box is dead and I only have WIndows for now). My computers don't have enough memory for a VM, so I figure a liveCD might be the best option.
56 • re:58 - building custom LiveCDs (by Pearson on 2011-06-22 17:27:31 GMT from United States)
On a related note (I hit Sumit too soon), is there a website for buildig a LiveCD that has a lot of options for window managers? I looked at "Custom NimbleX" and Slax Builder, but neither gave me (obvious) choices of a window manager. It may not be feasible, but I thought I'd ask.
57 • LiveCDs with some alternative Window Managers (by anticapitalista on 2011-06-22 21:05:07 GMT from Greece)
antiX-full version comes with fluxbox, icewm, dwm and wmii, the base version with fluxbox, dwm and wmii. Both run as live cd.
58 • @49 (by Adam Williamson on 2011-06-22 22:02:35 GMT from Canada)
There's nothing particularly desktop-specific about suspend. GNOME 3 might be a bit different from desktops that don't use acceleration, but that's not much. In general suspend working or not depends on the kernel and video driver, not much to do with the desktop. Are you saying suspend works in GNOME 2 / Unity but fails in GNOME 3 on Ubuntu? If so I'd say that has to be some kind of packaging bug, most likely.
As others replied, whether suspend works or not in general depends a lot on hardware and driver factors, but I have two systems here that suspend successfully with GNOME 3 on F15.
59 • Mint Debian (by Darkman on 2011-06-22 23:07:00 GMT from United States)
Have used Mint Debian since its release. Great distro and great experience. Would prefer a KDE version, but GNOME is fine. (My only complaint is the "jumpy mouse" but I suspect that's a kernel problem.)
60 • xubuntu - screensaver crashes (by gnomic on 2011-06-22 23:58:09 GMT from New Zealand)
Some weeks ago I mentioned a problem I encountered with xubuntu 11.04 and gui freezes, blank screen requiring power cycling to restart the machine. Landor subsequently had a look and found that a particular screensaver was crashing on his system with xubuntu. I tried again lately on a different machine in a live session over 24 hours or so and found that gltext was shown as crashing repeatedly. At least it didn't make X Window completely unresponsive as seen previously. I have had trouble with this screensaver before, I think with Mint Linux. Suppose the workaround must be to disable gltext when commencing a session.
61 • Ultimate Edition (by WyldAir on 2011-06-23 00:01:53 GMT from United States)
I noticed the last comment from last weeks DW that it was mentioned about the Ultimate site.
I too have a problem there. Anyone have any insight as to what's going on?
62 • @ 58 Gnome 3 suspend problems (by Deemon on 2011-06-23 02:53:15 GMT from Germany)
Actually, I have not tried to suspend in Unity, but the suspend works quite well in Gnome 2. The thing is since I got Gnome 3, I simply don't want to use other DEs. Gnome 3 became pretty easy to work with, not making my fingers hurt. Very little mouse movements to get into anywhere I want.
I'd like to use Ubuntu, rather than Fedora.
Whatever distro I try, I always come back to Ubuntu. Maybe this is a Gnome 3 problem as it is still new. Not been able to suspend doesn't trouble much, because all the programs open, and then closed will start at the closing point.
63 • Package database (by Mark on 2011-06-23 03:00:36 GMT from United States)
On the Gnome distros, the Transmission BitTorrent app ought to be tracked in the package database.
64 • Suggested packages (again) (by Anonymous on 2011-06-23 11:45:23 GMT from United States)
I am going to offer mostly the same list I offered last year (and the year before that, and the year before that). At least you have picked up xz. :)
I must admit I don't understand your rationale for leaving out so many important base packages. The exact version of lm_sensors (especially on newer hardware) is going to have a far greater effect on user experience than packages like less or sed.
Is there some constraint on the number of packages? I assume that most of your information gathering is automated.
Of the list, I would rate cmake, lm_sensors, and wpa_supplicant as the most important, with dvd+rw-tools not far behind (maybe you will give me one of those just for persistance :) ).
65 • RE: 64 Suggested packages (by ladislav on 2011-06-23 11:52:27 GMT from Taiwan)
I am going to offer mostly the same list I offered last year (and the year before that, and the year before that)
Unfortunately like last year (and the year before that, and the year before that) you are the only person who finds those packages important enough to track. So, like last year (and the year before that, and the year before that) they once again won't make the list. Sorry :-(
66 • Re 48: Slitaz "Control Box"? (by Coffee on 2011-06-23 14:12:18 GMT from France)
> However, I cannot find (yet) anything like the "Control Box"
> your review spent some time on - any clues?
I think, Jesse didn't use the latest official Cooking version (2011-05-31) for his review. SliTaz 4 no longer has any of the configuration boxes of previous versions. All the functions (Control, TazPkg, TazLito etc.) are now integrated in one box called TazPanel.
67 • @56 (by rastercaster1 on 2011-06-23 14:21:56 GMT from United States)
Try Hybride! Gnome, KDE, E17, Lxde, Lfce, Openbox any one chooseable upon boot.
68 • re #67 or perhaps Hybryde? (by gnomic on 2011-06-23 15:27:14 GMT from New Zealand)
It will probably be helpful if you can read French. A quick glance seems to indicate a spin of Ubuntu 10.10 in 32 bit and 64 bit versions. DVD size isos.
69 • re68 and also Sabayon 6 (by rastercaster1 on 2011-06-24 17:02:48 GMT from United States)
Chromium Translate will get around that problem and you can set English as default for Hybryde when you get it. Having used it for a month now and running the 2.39.1 Candela kernel made with KernelCheck, I have to say it`s the fastest and prettiest OS I`ve ever used. About Sabayon 6: IT WORKS! Having tried Sabayon before, (or tried to), it either wouldn`t install or if it did it destroyed all my other partitions, then wouldn`t boot. Not the case here, at least with the KDE version. Kudos!
70 • You know what I meant, lol. (by rastercaster1 on 2011-06-24 17:05:32 GMT from United States)
"2.39.1", lol. Moar coffee, please!
71 • Hybryde ... (by jb on 2011-06-25 01:19:21 GMT from United States)
I like the hybryde.org concept - demonstrate a bunch of different ubuntu desktop options in one ISO.
Reminds me of the distros (zorin? chameleonOS?) that provide a choice between an accurate imitation of Mac OSX, and accurate imitation of Windows, or a typical Linux desktop.
72 • re #71 (by rastercaster1 on 2011-06-25 03:53:35 GMT from United States)
Exactly, with beautiful individual themes and BGs for each. Hey, I like to look at nice things when I work.
73 • May want to hold off on Mint KDE..... (by FreeMintKDE on 2011-06-25 21:24:23 GMT from United States)
No... acutally it might be the time to re think Linux Mint KDE..... and if your a KDE user re-evaluate your options...
Take a gander here:
scroll down to to he post about software selection and look at the total gutting of KDE!
If your a KDE user... like me then your probably not going to find these changes positive.
74 • Constant updating IS a pain (by RollMeAway on 2011-06-26 00:34:29 GMT from United States)
"Firefox 4 was only released in March. Now, three months later Firefox 5.0 is out in stable release. Hence, Mozilla has ceased supporting Firefox 4."
While the link above is from a business perspective, I feel just as frustrated.
I use multiple computers at multiple locations. Keeping them all in sync and up-to-date is a full time job.
I've recently got firefox-4 installed and synced on most of my machines, now 5.0 is being pushed, which breaks plugin/addons I've come to depend upon.
May be time to switch browsers.
75 • Re: # 73 KDE (by rastercaster1 on 2011-06-26 01:41:15 GMT from United States)
Actually, they are right. Why have Konqueror, Rekonq, etc.? Gwenview? Most of those are redundant and I would dare to say that a lot of KDE users, myself included, never use the apps in question.
76 • KDE on Mint (by Jesse on 2011-06-26 13:50:21 GMT from Canada)
I read the list of changes and I think it makes good sense. I use Mint's KDE edition and I think they're making a good move to unclutter things. All the stuff they're talking about taking out can be re-added to the system in a minute or two using the package manager anyway. It's not like they're forcing you not to use those apps. This isn't "gutting KDE", it's making it more accessible to the general public.
77 • KDE on Mint (by Stan on 2011-06-26 16:15:29 GMT from United States)
Some of the choices are downright bizarre, though. His rationale is that there should be only one application per task, and it should be the most popular one. There is simply no way that Picasa, a Windows program run in WINE, is more popular (on *Linux*) and better suited to its tasks than Digikam, which is IMHO the best photo organizer on Linux for any DE; I use it even when in XFCE or GNOME.
And switching out software-properties-kde for software-properties-gtk just because the former's tabs are confusing for the quote-average-user-unquote? (Newsflash: Average users are plenty accustomed to tabs these days thanks to web browsers.)
Finally, the removal of hplip-gui is stupid given that one of the major reasons people flock to Mint is its out-of-the-box hardware support. I'd also think that Gwenview is much better than the bare-bones built-in KDE picture viewer, but that is a minor quibble compared to the others. Hopefully they'll revise the list somewhat before Mint 11 KDE's release.
78 • Re: # 77 KDE (by r on 2011-06-26 18:33:17 GMT from United States)
There is a Picasa for Linux, I use it all the time without Wine. It`s available at their website.
79 • Re: #78 (by Stan on 2011-06-26 20:29:52 GMT from United States)
You don't understand; WINE is used under-the-covers as a library in the Linux version of Picasa, even if you don't have to literally run it as "wine picasa". It is still a Windows program at heart, and uses its own embedded WINE.
"Picasa for Linux isn’t open source; it uses a carefully tested version of Wine to run the current Windows version of Picasa. Wine itself is an open-source implementation of the Windows API. It runs on top of the X Window System and Linux or Unix."
Google deserves some praise by also releasing their patches to WINE, but I still would not use a Windows program as a default photo organizer in Linux.
80 • Re: 79 Picasa (by rastercaster1 on 2011-06-26 20:44:48 GMT from United States)
I honestly don`t care who makes it. It works for me, uploads my photos to my web albums easily and I`m used to it. What you choose to use is your own affair, of course.
81 • #80, Picasa (by Stan on 2011-06-26 22:16:06 GMT from United States)
You must care somewhat, or else you would not have felt the need to comment at all. How well Picasa works for you does not say what should or should not be the default in Linux Mint 11 KDE. Keep in mind that, even if it's not the default, you may still download it from the repositories. I use programs that are not default in distributions too, yet do not feel the need to petition them to be default.
So, do you have any argument besides "works for me!" why Picasa is better than Digikam as a default photo-managing application in Linux Mint 11 KDE? I would argue that Digikam is better as a default as it is a native application that fits much better into KDE, and it still has all the functionality most people will need from a photo organizing program. Being a native application, it also will pull in fewer libraries, thus freeing up space for other programs on the disc (or lowering the download size in the case of the DVD version).
82 • Mint 11 KDE (by fernbap on 2011-06-26 23:00:55 GMT from Portugal)
According to what is said in mint's site, all community based versions of Mint will no longer be Ubuntu based but Debian based. LMDE will be called Mint Gnome.
That means that Mint 11 KDE will be also a rolling release based on Debian Testing, such as LMDE.
So, if you are a KDE fan, which i'm not, be prepared for a treat from Mint's team. That may mean, however, that it will take a while for both KDE and LXDE versions to come out.
83 • Re: 79 Picasa (by rastercaster1 on 2011-06-27 00:50:15 GMT from United States)
I was correcting what I thought was a wrong statement about Picasa, that`s all. I`m not petitioning for Picasa to be default in anything, if you had read my comment carefully you would have seen that. My opinion is that Picasa is better for me, (and many other Linux users),and of course my opinion has as much weight as yours or anyone else`s. Quit trying to start an argument.
84 • RE: 80, etc (by Landor on 2011-06-27 02:32:17 GMT from Canada)
I agree with Stan on this one, it's more than obvious you do care, and jumped on it fast. You also want your opinion to be heard but others are starting an argument voicing theirs.
No matter, let's discuss Konqueror and Rekonq. I know tons of KDE users that love Konqueror, and a lot of people that have enjoyed Rekonq. I'd love to see your links to actual proven stats that can be verified, and the process duplicated that show that 'many other Linux users' don't want those two just like you do. I'm guessing your opinion is pretty well the only stat you have on this topic, as I've never see any kind of survey taken, much less one with legitimate methodology behind it.
The same goes for Digikam and Picasa, you might feel that Picasa, a proprietary, closed source application, that's centric to another operating system is 'better for you', but I'm quite sure that a program like Digikam that is native, far more feature rich, and highly integrated (let's not even touch go on about completely open, and protecting people's freedoms) would be a better applicatoin for 'many other Linux users' who actually have a choice. But again, I believe you're just stating opinion only here and have absolutely noting to back up this statement.
I put things like that in line with people using Chromium in our community. Oh sure, they can say, 'Hey Landor, it's open source, it's Chrome that's the bad one'. Yes, they can say that. But sadly, like many others in this community, like yourself, they don't see the whole picture (think Picasa-WINE-another OS). Google Chrome is proprietary. It's a horrible browser that takes away so much of people's freedoms and their privacy. Most of them uninformed, so unaware of the dangers. Sadly, our community for the majority is aware, and those within it, using Chromium, are literally helping Google develop Chrome. Thus by helping them develop Chrome they're helping Google exploit people and their personal, and private information, and usually the ones that know the least about what's going on, so are the most vulnerable. What a shameful thing members of this community are doinig with little, to no thought.
Yes, 'better for many other Linux user'.
Keep your stick on the ice...
85 • Ultimate Edition MIA (by RollMeAway on 2011-06-27 02:46:18 GMT from United States)
Several recent posts have questioned the Ultimate Edition website being down.
I stumbled upon this explanation:
86 • re: #82 Mint 11 KDE (by tdockery97 on 2011-06-27 07:55:08 GMT from United States)
Actually both KDE and LXDE will be Ubuntu-based for the Mint 11 cycle.
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